[Closed] How come UN resolutions and the Geneva Convention don't apply to Israel?

I'd just like to ask those defending Israel:

Why, in your opinion, is Israel hated by so many people around the world?

Meanwhie:

http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jewish-world-news/1.604813

On July 8, the day that Israel launched Operation Protective Edge against Hamas in Gaza, a man described as having a Middle Eastern appearance assaulted a Jewish 17-year-old girl on a Paris street near the Gare du Nord train station by spraying pepper-spray on her face, BNVCA also reported.

The girl, identified by her initials, J.L., wrote in her complaint to police that the man, who was in his 20s, shouted: “Dirty Jewess, inshallah you will die.”

****ing disgusting. Utter scum. If I witnessed that cowardly attack, I'd do whatever I could to batter thhe ****. Xenophobia simply must never be tolerated.

I believe the 50 billion would have come with a lifting of the blockade, not only did Hamas reject this but by silencing dissent, Palestinians are being oppressed not only by Israel but by the very people who are supposedly fighting for their cause.

Why, in your opinion, is Israel hated by so many people around the world?

Israeli policy not being media friendly? Jews having plenty of enemies around the world anyway? Peoples lack of awareness as to what is actually going on and only basing their opinions on headlines?

Do you have a source for this belief? A quick google brings up nothing.

Interesting that Canada pops up again when you delve into far-right wing zionism:

[img] [/img]

And the Jewish Defence League seem just as lovely a bunch as our own English Defence League, although somewhat more extreme and active:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Defense_League

[img] [/img]

Despite being named by the FBI as a 'terrorist organisation', and baned in many countries including Israel, they are not outlawed in Canada and France.

Can't find anything mentioned about the blockade, but I would be very, very surprised if the Israelis did not lift it as:

1) Increasing levels of militarisation of the strip is why the blockade was setup in the first place

2) Theres no point in offering someone 50 billion if they can't spend it.

I can only find reference to the potential of a debate on the subject of offering $50bn aid/rebuilding.

On the face of it, it does seem like a good way to get a dialogue started though.

Israeli policy not being media friendly? Jews having plenty of enemies around the world anyway? Peoples lack of awareness as to what is actually going on and only basing their opinions on headlines?

Somabsolutel nothing to do with the fact, the inalienable fact, that Isreali armed forces are murdering innocent people, and that many Knesset members are far-right extremist zionists then? It's all down to ba PA and Israel being 'misunderstood'? Are you joking?

Peoples lack of awareness as to what is actually going on

Innocent people (on both sides) are being killed. We see the factual evidence on our tvs, in our newpapers, online. How are we 'lacking awareness' of that??

Maybe those Palestinians are just pretending to die? Maybe they get up later and wipe the ketchup off their faces? How else to explain the refusal of some posters to condemn the Israeli violence?

Innocent people (on both sides) are being killed. We see the factual evidence on our tvs, in our newpapers, online. How are we 'lacking awareness' of that??

If you want me to sum it up generally, a lack of awareness surrounding the goals and intentions of both sides and how that relates to reducing deaths in general.

Somabsolutel nothing to do with the fact, the inalienable fact, that Isreali armed forces are murdering innocent people, and that many Knesset members are far-right extremist zionists then? It's all down to ba PA and Israel being 'misunderstood'? Are you joking?

I won't defend Israeli's retaliation outright, I think it's a crying shame that so many are dying. I can just understand, psychologically speaking, why they are doing it and I disagree entirely with Ernie in regards to how you bring an end to the Israeli campaign. Backing a rabid dog into a corner isn't going to calm it down and Israel, like it or not, now exists and I think people need to come to terms with that.

Tom_W1987 - Member

I'll stand by my opinion that Ernie doesn't actually give two shits about the deaths in Gaza

That's quite a serious allegation and it betrays a sense of real desperation on your part.

Obviously you now want to tell us that your heart bleeds for the Palestinian people but throughout this thread you've provided very little evidence that you give "two shits".

In fact this is from one of your earlier posts on this thread :

Tom_W1987 - Member

I don't think I'd have an qualms being a Viper pilot and putting 500lb bombs through the roofs of houses in Gaza.

But now it's you that cares about the Palestinian people, despite freely admitting that if you were an Israeli you would have no qualms about dropping 500lb bombs through the roofs of Palestinian houses in Gaza.

And anyone who speaks up for the Palestinian people, their right to elect their own representatives, and condemns Israel's brutal and murderous policies, apparently doesn't give two shits about Palestinians.

ffs

The last paragraph is particularly hilarious.

A young person wishing for a better life?. Aye, hilarious.

Still can't find any reference to the $50bn being offered...

[url= http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/07/16/dispatch-israeli-strike-kills-four-children-at-a-gaza-beach/?tid=sm_fb ]four more evil terrorists killed by israel?[/url]

kimbers - Member
four more evil terrorists killed by israel?

Hearts and minds

An interesting perspective from an Israeli Jew :

[url= http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.604653 ]Israel's real purpose in Gaza operation? To kill Arabs[/url]

[i]Since the first Lebanon war, more than 30 years ago, the killing of Arabs has become Israel’s primary strategic instrument. The IDF doesn’t wage war against armies, and its main target is civilian populations. Arabs are born only to kill and to be killed, as everyone knows. They have no other goal in life, and Israel kills them. [/i]

I guess that the chilling comments of Maj.Gen. Oren Shachor [i]"If we kill their families, that will frighten them"[/i] sums it all up. And it is of course the same philosophy that was behind the Nazi collective punishments in Occupied Europe when the Nazis were faced with resistance.

Then they're probably overjoyed that the pals are playing right into their hands by continuing to fire rockets during the ceasefire...

It's interesting Z-11 that as a pro-zionist supporter on this thread you make absolutely no attempt at all to refute the claims that Israeli policy for over 30 years has been to target civilian populations. The classic tactics of terrorists, as Maj.Gen. Oren Shachor helpfully points out.

Your only response is that they are "playing right into their hands".

It's all the more interesting as you have a long record of attempting to defend the indefensible. I guess even for you the behaviour of the Zionist state is sometimes too much of a challenge.

Care to point to any post where I've expressed myself as a "pro-zionist supporter" Ernie? I suggest you go and actually read my posts,

for example:

You see, to me this is the problem - its a cycle of violence - the simplification of painting one side as evil, and responsible for everything that is happening helps nobody.

Incomparably bigger scale? over 1000 rockets launched at Israel last week.

Both sides need to stop, Tit for Tat needs to stop, and people need to stop making excuses for Hamas continuing their violence too!

As for your comment that "Israeli policy for over 30 years has been to target civilian populations" - all I'd say is that if that was their policy, then they're not doing a very good job of it at all - remember that thing about anecdote not being data? Well, the [b]data[/b] seems to show that the civilian:combatant casualty ratio is overall similar to or better than other modern military campaigns.

The "both sides are behaving badly" argument is a classic pro-Zionist tactic.

It is used extensively by US and UK governments, and has been used recently with regards to the current situation.

And it is of course complete bollocks.

As my link to the Haaretz article points out.

And it is of course complete bollocks.

Oh, so the Pal's aren't targeting civilians with their rockets then?

classic pro-Zionist tactic.

Ah, The old trick, anyone who dares to disagree with you is a zionist! - About as morally corrupt as calling anyone who criticises them an anti-semite!

I don't know what everyones moaning about. The IDF have taken a break from shelling children, so the good folk of Gaza can go for stroll, take in the air, maybe nip to a cafe for a latte, call at the bakers and grocers as they fill up with fresh local produce. Then they can cook themselves a nice meal as a distraction for when the Russian Roulette of the air strikes starts again in a couple of hours

classic pro-Zionist tactic.

Ah, The old trick, anyone who dares to disagree with you is a zionist!

So the US and UK governments which extensively use the "both sides are behaving badly" tactic aren't pro-Zionist ? 😆

And btw the Palestinians aren't targeting anything other than "Israel", they don't have the capability to go beyond that. If they were provided with precision weapons, as Israel is, there is little doubt that they would target military sites which are attacking them.

Israel has the precision weapons and yet still target civilians. As my link to the Israeli newspaper says : [i]"A war with no goal is among the most despicable of wars; the deliberate targeting of civilians is among the most atrocious of means. "[/i]

It's not Russian roulette binners, They should know that if they've had any friends round who's second cousin knows somebody in Hamas then they're a house, family and children are fair targets.

They're raising a new generation of snakes and their blood should be spilled.

My brother is in the army, it worries me that in the IDFs eyes that makes me, my family and my home a legitimate military target?!

Given that Gaza is a relatively compact and dense target given that Israel claims to want to avoid civilian innocent causalities but says it cannot because of the intermingling of fighters and civilians , would not a simple solution be to allow the civilians to leave Gaza by raising the blockade and move away from the combat zone?

A much more media friendly and humane tactic than the meaningless propaganda shots of jets occasionally aborting an air strike to create a photo op. Such an idea would also minimise the chances of another children playing football look like fighters prepping weapons faux pas.

Ninfan are the British army really killing 1 child for every 3 adults in Afghanistan ?

Then they can cook themselves a nice meal as a distraction for when the Russian Roulette of the air strikes starts again in a couple of hours

they cant eat or drink....its Ramadan.....but then again with the Israelis constantly tormenting them by restricting the water and food supply to the area...i suppose this doesn't make any difference to them as every day must feel like Ramadan...

Given that Gaza is a relatively compact and dense target given that Israel claims to want to avoid civilian innocent causalities but says it cannot because of the intermingling of fighters and civilians , would not a simple solution be to allow the civilians to leave Gaza by raising the blockade and move away from the combat zone?

Depends whether you're serious about not killing civilians, or if you're just saying that, whereas in reality you couldn't actually give a toss

Depends whether you're serious about not killing civilians, or if you're just saying that, whereas in reality you couldn't actually give a toss

Presumably it's relatively easy to not murder children playing on the beach...

Anyone who runs...
Anyone who stands...

Due to your habit of editing your posts without providing any clue that you have, eg, adding "EDIT", I've only just seen this :

ninfan - Member

As for your comment that "Israeli policy for over 30 years has been to target civilian populations"

It's not my comment, it's the comment of a Jewish journalist in an article which he wrote for an Israeli newspaper.

But of course you knew that Z-11, you just like to personalise everything. I'm surprised you haven't used the "your mate Ken" tactic recently, are you keeping that trump card for later ?

So anyway, this is what a Jewish journalist in an article which he wrote for an Israeli newspaper has to say :

[b][i]Since the first Lebanon war, more than 30 years ago, the killing of Arabs has become Israel’s primary strategic instrument. The IDF doesn’t wage war against armies, and its main target is civilian populations. Arabs are born only to kill and to be killed, as everyone knows. They have no other goal in life, and Israel kills them. [/i][/b]

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to repeat it, and here's the full article :

[url= http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.604653 ] Israel's real purpose in Gaza operation? To kill Arabs
Since the first Lebanon war over 30 years ago, Israel's main strategy has been killing Arabs. The current atrocious war in Gaza is no different.[/url]

Wow, 'a Jewish journalist says'

Proof indeed, that clearly overturns the data that says otherwise

🙄

rolly eyes will not detract from the fact it is not his comment and you were WRONG. Your attempt to move the goalposts is rather pathetic [ literally]

Yes Junky

Just imagine, a free press, where journalists are allowed to voice an opinion that differs from the government line, a shocking concept

Now, care to tell me why the palestinians are still firing rockets at Jewish civilians?

BBC are reporting a ceasefire's been struck, incidentally. Between Israel and Palestine that is, not between Ernie and Ninfan, that'd be crazy

But, but, hang on, why on earth would Israel agree to a ceasefire if their primary objective is killing Arab civilians, very confusing 😕

ninfan your next attempt to move the goalposts rather than admit your error is even more desperate.
You were still wrong.

As you seem to be completely deficient in empathy, or any knowledge of humanity tends to function [url= http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jul/16/gaza-shameful-injustice-israel-attacks-occupied-people ]this may help you understand[/url]

[i]The idea that Israel is defending itself against unprovoked attacks from outside its borders is an absurdity. Despite Israel’s withdrawal of settlements and bases in 2005, Gaza remains occupied both in reality and international law, its border, coastal waters, resources, airspace and power supply controlled by Israel.[/i]

Given the conditions they're corralled into, I think anyone would be kicking off. Not that for one moment you'd be prepared to countenance that its Israel's continued inhumanity in keeping a civilian population living like dogs, that has brought about an inevitable backlash 🙄

why on earth would Israel agree to a ceasefire if their primary objective is killing Arab civilians, very confusing

they need to investigate why their bombs haven't killed more Arabs(!)

meanwhile here are the 4 arab terrorists they did manage to get yesterday...

[img] [/img]

Is ninfan the zoo fighter?

Here's another Jewish journalist for you Z-11, this time from a well-established American Jewish newspaper :

[url= http://forward.com/articles/201764/how-politics-and-lies-triggered-an-unintended-war/?p=all ]How Politics and Lies Triggered an Unintended War in Gaza[/url]

This bit is particularly interesting :

[i]Once the boys’ disappearance was known, troops began a massive, 18-day search-and-rescue operation, entering thousands of homes, arresting and interrogating hundreds of individuals, racing against the clock. Only on July 1, after the boys’ bodies were found, did the truth come out: The government had known almost from the beginning that the boys were dead. It maintained the fiction that it hoped to find them alive as a pretext to dismantle Hamas’ West Bank operations.[/i]

So the world was deliberately misinformed concerning the murder of the 3 teenagers as they wanted to use it as an excuse to round up hundreds of Palestinians.

The article also states :

[i]Nor was that the only fib. It was clear from the beginning that the kidnappers weren’t acting on orders from Hamas leadership in Gaza or Damascus.[/i]

So the whole tragic event has been manipulated by the Israeli government purely to attack Hamas. The reason for the Israeli government's interest in targeting Hamas appears to be its recent rapprochement with the Palestinian president Mahmoud Abbas, something which received a positive response from the US and the EU. All this is designed to isolate Hamas and make any peaceful progress impossible.

Of course while I choose to accept the accuracy of the facts in the article and the opinions expressed are those of a Jewish contributor in a Jewish newspaper, it does provide further proof, if any was needed, that the enemies of the Palestinian people are right-wing Zionists, not Jews.

Oh, look, binners edited his post without writing 'edit' - maybe I should have a man period about it like you did Ernie?

Israel's continued inhumanity in keeping a civilian population living like dogs, that has brought about an inevitable backlash

Maybe if they stopped trying to kill Israeli's, and their elected representatives weren't charter bound to the continuation of the Jihad ('There is no solution to the Palestinian problem except by Jihad' - oh, sorry, apparently thats piece of history and no longer relevant, but cannot be changed for internal reasons) Then things would get better for them?

I mean, after all, once upon a time Israel was at war with its neighbours, (eg. Egypt, Jordan) who were at committed to its destruction as a state, but somehow managed to come to peaceful agreements with them?

Edit:

Here's another Jewish journalist

You still don't get this 'freedom of the press' concept do you Ernie? Typical Leftie!

However, for what its worth his criticism seems to be that the Israeli's didn't accept that the victims were dead on the basis of a phone call (which could have been faked), but only after they had found the bodies, seems perfectly reasonable when you look at it that way, non?

maybe I should have a man period about it like you did Ernie?

You just can't help yourself can you.

.

Here's another Jewish journalist

You still don't get this 'freedom of the press' concept do you Ernie?

I'm sorry, you think I'm suggesting that the article in the Jewish newspaper is a bad thing ? ! 😆

Jordan and Egypt were and are really well armed nation states with superpower supporters and 1st world military tec . Perhaps if someone were to upgrade Hamas capabilities Israel would look harder to solve the problem.

Once the boys’ disappearance was known, troops began a massive, 18-day search-and-rescue operation, entering thousands of homes, arresting and interrogating hundreds of individuals, racing against the clock. Only on July 1, after the boys’ bodies were found, did the truth come out: The government had known almost from the beginning that the boys were dead. It maintained the fiction that it hoped to find them alive as a pretext to dismantle Hamas’ West Bank operations.

So the world was deliberately misinformed concerning the murder of the 3 teenagers as they wanted to use it as an excuse to round up hundreds of Palestinians.

The article also states :

Nor was that the only fib. It was clear from the beginning that the kidnappers weren’t acting on orders from Hamas leadership in Gaza or Damascus.

So the whole tragic event has been manipulated by the Israeli government purely to attack Hamas. The reason for the Israeli government's interest in targeting Hamas appears to be its recent rapprochement with the Palestinian president Mahmoud Abbas, something which received a positive response from the US and the EU. All this is designed to isolate Hamas and make any peaceful progress impossible.

i always believed that to be the case right from the beginning...hence what i said 1 week ago

i've always believed that this was a false flag right from the very beginning, and was designed by the israeli government as an excuse to attack the palestinian government.

i still stand by this claim that this all started from a deliberate false flag event...

Jordan and Egypt were and are really well armed nation states with superpower supporters and 1st world military tec . Perhaps if someone were to upgrade Hamas capabilities Israel would look harder to solve the problem.

Its an interesting point Crankboy - however has to be seen in the light of what happened when the Arab nations actually went down that road with the PLO/Fateh, resulting in the failed seven point agreement and ultimately leading into Black September.

Jordan and Egypt were and are really well armed nation states with superpower supporters and 1st world military tec . Perhaps if someone were to upgrade Hamas capabilities Israel would look harder to solve the problem.

i very much doubt you will see any help from any of the neighbouring arab countries...the Egyptian are weak as are the Jordanians.
the Zionist propaganda machine spreads beyond Palestine and is used very effectively to create problems in each of the neighbouring countries as a form of distraction.
as for those a bit further out i.e. the Saudis, they are even worse...they are drunk on power and riches and as a result are too busy living the good life like the blatant hypocrites that they are.

Perhaps if someone were to upgrade Hamas capabilities Israel would look harder to solve the problem.

I don't think there is much doubt that if Palestinians had the capability to kill hundreds of Israelis, as Israel periodically kills hundreds of Palestinians, Israel would be far more reluctant to carry out their regular turkey shoots in Gaza.

Everyone knows, but no one says it, that the Palestinians big problem is that they don't kill enough Israelis. Their inability to do so costs them dearly.

the Saudis, they are even worse...they are drunk on power and riches and as a result are too busy living the good life like the blatant hypocrites that they are.

My sister who once had extensive dealings with the Saudi royal family used the recall their deep hatred of Palestinians. I'm sure they they would much rather that the Palestinians just crawled away somewhere and quietly died rather than upset things in the Middle East with their demands for justice.

It was the US civil rights campaigner, Jesse Jackson, who once returning from Palestine famously described the Palestinians as "the ****s of the Middle-East".

Which reminds me of this :

[img] [/img]

the Saudis are a contemptible bunch. they look down their noses at most people and especially non-arab muslims.
this has got a lot to do with their control of the oil supplies giving them an elevated position on power and control. as the vast majority of the west relies on their oil supplies they are very much pandered to by the west which only further inflates their egos and feeling of self importance.
add this to the wealth they have accumulated over the years in trading oil they really do think they are a cut above the rest of the muslim and non-muslim world.
their arrogance is on a par with that of many zionist israelis

those israelis have managed to get another 3 evil palestinians

warning, very graphic
https://twitter.com/KhaledSafi/status/489790135459139586

And to lighten up the mood a little here is another one of my favourite American Jews, Jon Stewart, very forcefully driving home to people, quickly and easily, the plight of the Palestinians in the current situation using humour in a way that only he can.

You still don't get this 'freedom of the press' concept do you Ernie? Typical Leftie!

You managed it yesterday so why not today?

Is your hatred so strong you think this saves face?

footflaps - Member

A large number of US senate seats rest on the Jewish vote, hence Israel has carte blanche to do as it likes.....

This, basically.

Having just read this thread all the way through,I have to congratulate ninfan on his approach to the discussion.His ability to maintain a campaign of innuendo(Ken re ernie),changing the subject of the argument when it's not going his way(almost every post),and sheer petulance in the face of reason,defeats even my 11 year-old daughters best attempts.I have suggested to her that she reads the whole thread before starting the next argument,it may save us both a lot of time.

The role of the Jewish vote in US elections is greatly exaggerated imo.

Most American Jews are far more liberal and left-wing than the general population. I can't imagine that the US government giving a carte blanche to the very right-wing Zionists in Israel particularly appeals to them, or that they would necessarily back US politicians with that agenda.

[url= http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/oct/02/jewish-americans-vote-democratic ]Why Jewish Americans vote Democratic[/url]

[i] 49% of Jewish adults identify as liberal, compared with just 19% who say they are conservative. That's nearly a mirror-opposite of the general public

72% of Jews say Muslims in America are discriminated against, versus just 47% of the public at large who say that.

only 43% of Jews believe that caring about Israel is an essential part of being Jewish.[/i]

Furthermore the Jewish population in the US is actually quite small, about 98% of the Americans aren't Jewish, add to that the fact that there are 2.6 million Muslims in the US and you start getting the feeling that the Jewish vote doesn't quite swing elections in the way some think it does. It's just a small rather stable vote.

IMO US government support for Israel has more to do with geopolitics than the Jewish vote/lobby. People forget that the US hasn't always been Israel's closet ally, up until the late 1960's France was Israel's main arms supplier and had much closer political ties with it than the US.

In those days Texan oil provided much of the US's oil needs and the Middle East wasn't quite as important in that respect. The US actually sometimes took a pretty hostile attitude towards Israel as happened over Suez.

Things changed as France's ending of its colonial wars meant it shared less of a common enemy with Israel with regards to Arab nationalism, and Israel lurched more to the right with expansionist policies, and the US gradually saw its all important "vital US interests" develop in the region.

The US needs a strong dependable ally in a volatile region where God buried the United States's oil. It has that in the form of the world's fourth military power Israel. And that imo lies at the heart of the US's support for Israel, not the Jewish vote.

Although the heavy financial price that the US pays for its client state, and what it gets back in return, far from guarantees that benefits won't be reassessed and reevaluated in the future. As US global influence slowly wanes, as does its share of the world's wealth, I think that's more than likely.

Genuine question ninfan/Z-11, are you really that nasty or just an un-relenting internet troll?

And as predicted - whilst powers are distracted by the airline incident the ground offensive starts..

Sounds pretty empty but hoping that casualties and deaths on both sides are a minimum, and the people of Gaza are able to get supplies they need.

Wish in one hand, shit in the other.

[url= http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/international/israel-offers-eight-second-ceasefire-2014071888697 ]Tha Mash nails it[/url]

warning, very graphic

no Kimbers...this is what you call graphic

i'd like to see the pro-Zionists defend Israel on this...

gonzy - Member

i'd like to see the pro-Zionists defend Israel on this...

It is all Hamas's fault. And the victims, for being near to/related to/in the same postcode as someone who might be in Hamas. Dur.

i'd like to see the pro-Zionists defend Israel on this...

To be fair the pro-Zionists have pretty much given up trying to defend Israel. And you can't really blame them.

i'd like to see the pro-Zionists [s]defend[/s] [b][i]condemn[/i][/b] Israel on this...

FTFM...

Israel doesn't need defending. It's been doing a pretty good job defending itself for the past 60 years despite the entire Arab world want to destroy it.

Israel doesn't need defending. It's been doing a pretty good job defending itself for the past 60 years despite the entire Arab world want to destroy it.

It's hard to believe that anyone could be daft enough not to understand that gonzy was referring to defending Israel's behaviour.

But anyway, would you like to have a go at defending Israel's behaviour and attack on Gaza azku ? Do you think you could ?

And btw on the point you raised if that was true Israel wouldn't need US taxpayers to pay for 25% of its huge defence budget, that's over $3 billion in military each year. If they didn't really need any outside help then US taxpayers must be in for a really big rebate.

Azku - you must be either incredibly blind or stupid to believe that Israel is the victim in all of this...or you need to go sit under a bridge and wait for 3 goats to appear

I see not much has changed here in the past 20 pages, anyone posting an opinion or argument contrary to or trying to balance the debate is shouted down with abuse. Think about it, that's why there is no discussion or debate or balance.

I strongly believe STW should ban all these political threads.

I strongly believe STW should ban all [s]these[/s] political [s]threads[/s] comments that I don't agree with.

I said all, I meant all.

From the Guardian this morning. Israel may be hated by many but Hamas is unpopular and deeply mistrusted innthe Arab world. There is a reason why Egypt closed its border with Gaza.

[i]Harriet Sherwood in Jerusalem, and Patrick Kingsley in Cairo
The Guardian, Friday 18 July 2014 19.15 BST

The Arab League has backed Egypt's call for a quick ceasefire for several days, while Egypt's foreign minister issued an unusually harsh criticism of Hamas's stance, even as Israeli troops crossed the border into Gaza.

Sameh Shoukry told Egypt's state-run news agency: "If Hamas had accepted the Egyptian proposal, it could save the lives of at least 40 Palestinians" – a statement that reveals in stark terms how entrenched Egypt's opposition to Hamas has become.
[/i]

jambalaya - Member

From the Guardian this morning.

Why are you posting on a "political thread" one hour after saying :

[i]"I strongly believe STW should ban all these political threads."[/i]

It would appear that wanmankylung was spot on with his comment.

Some interesting stuff from Egyptian TV

I'm not sure why anything on Egyptian TV would be "interesting". The Egyptian leader seized power in a coup and oversaw the killings of thousands of the overthrown president's supporters, mass arrests, bizarre show trials in which literally hundreds have received the death sentence, the arrests and handing down of long prison sentences to foreign journalists for "reporting false news", and staged a sham election where the only other candidate apart from himself received 3% of the vote while he received a predictable 97% of the vote.

Egypt is under the control of a very nasty regime which rules through fear and repression of journalists. And which unsurprising Tony Blair fully supports and advises (Tony Blair's commitment to democracy in the Middle East doesn't go as far as letting people elect whoever they want) Egyptian TV operates under this climate of fear and repression.

The tyrannical Egyptian military has long appeased their Western backers by ruthless suppressing the Palestinians and helping to maintain the brutal blockade on Gaza by sealing the border with Egypt.

Anything on Egyptian TV should be seen in that context. Which makes it pretty worthless.

quite an interesting analysis of what Hamas' aims are:

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/07/understanding-what-hamas-wants/374656/

Understanding What Hamas Wants

Also another important consideration would be "Understanding What Jeffrey Goldberg Wants".

Jeffrey Goldberg, the author of the article, is a former Israeli soldier, a committed Zionist, and an outspoken American hawk. He has, among other things, argued in favour of attacking Iran and was extremely supportive of the disastrous Iraq War, repeating the absurd neo-con claim that Saddam Hussein had links with Al-Qaeda, when of course the two were sworn enemies and it was only after Saddam Hussein had been removed from power by the West that Al-Qaeda were able to move into Iraq.

It's always useful to research the background of the author when judging the likely bias and quality of an analysis. Poor previous analyses like the one he made concerning Iraq do Jeffrey Goldberg, a man with an obvious agenda, no favours.

This thread is spookily like the current conflict; anything thrown up by the pro-Isral/Zionists is immediately and effectively shot down by the 'Iron Dome' thrown up by Ernie Lynch and thers. I'm surprised, therefore, that those on the side taking such a battering, can't empathise with others, and think more deeply about their own voews.

Possibly Stoffel

Though I notice that in light of recent events in the Ukraine, Ernie seems to have gone quiet about his 'give the rebels better weapons' peace strategy...

Maybe he just can't be bothered getting into pointless arguments with you abbout totally unrelated and unconnected events. 🙄

To be fair the pro-Zionists have pretty much given up trying to defend Israel. And you can't really blame them.

[url= http://www.haaretz.com/news/national/.premium-1.541142 ]Maybe that is why they are doing this...[/url]

Kimbers with regards to your earlier post :

has this been done yet?

[img] [/img]

Allan Sørensen @allansorensen72

Sderot cinema. Israelis bringing chairs 2 hilltop in sderot 2 watch latest from Gaza. Clapping when blasts are heard.
8:26 PM - 9 Jul 2014

The disgust that this caused a CNN reporter resulted in her to being removed from reporting the conflict :

[url= http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/18/cnn-diana-magnay-israel-gaza_n_5598866.html ]CNN Removes Reporter Diana Magnay From Israel-Gaza After 'Scum' Tweet[/url]

[b][i]CNN has removed correspondent Diana Magnay from covering the Israeli-Palestinian conflict after she tweeted that Israelis who were cheering the bombing of Gaza, and who had allegedly threatened her, were “scum.” [/i][/b]