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Can't help but think that this is somehow an engineered outcome - all hanging on the last race when it should have been done and dusted months, if not, races ago.
Going to need a bit more info on how this has been engineered. Was is Norris' engine blowing? The skid blocks thing being a fix? Norris dominating in Brazil? I'm intrigued
My maths says Max 1st Oscar 2nd, Lando needs 3rd, Oscar 1st Max 2nd, Lando needs 5th.
https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/f1-2025-abu-dhabi-how-norris-verstappen-piastri-can-win-title/
Do papaya rules allow Oscar to have an incident with Max?
Yes, but only if Lando has a similar one with Yuki.
I know he doesn't need to but I really hope Lando wins the race to take the WDC, if not there will be loads of "he doesn't deserve it as Max/Oscar have won more races...."
Oscar certainly isn't going to help him though so its every man for himself.
Going to need a bit more info on how this has been engineered. Was is Norris' engine blowing? The skid blocks thing being a fix? Norris dominating in Brazil? I'm intrigued
No idea. I know it's not rational and it's proper conspiracy theory bllx but it just feels too contrived for McLaren to have such a massive advantage and for them to **** it up so royally.
In the middle of this, I’m really happy for Williams! Great to see ,them back being competitive at the pointy end
In the middle of this, I’m really happy for Williams!
and Carlos!
(Two podiums more than he would have got at Ferrari!)
In the middle of this, I’m really happy for Williams! Great to see ,them back being competitive at the pointy end
Me too. I know it's extra-shiny for social media etc, but seems like a really good team atmosphere too compared to some others.
it just feels too contrived for McLaren to have such a massive advantage and for them to **** it up so royally.
Guessing you weren't watching in 2007 then? Raikkonen won by a point despite being back in 4th for most of the season and being over 2 race wins behind in the points (old scoring system, 10-8-6...)
Hamilton and Alonso were ahead but their relationship fell apart mid season (if not before) and the team were chucked out of the wcc because of the Ferrari photocopies.
In the middle of this, I’m really happy for Williams!
Me too.
and Carlos!
(Two podiums more than he would have got at Ferrari!)
Yes, delighted for Carlos too, I rate him very highly, especially how he can "coach" the team whilst racing. Though about those podiums - Charles has 7. Both Ferrari drivers have more points than the Williams pair (yes even Lewis). Alex (currently) has more points than Carlos despite not having any podiums. Both have had their ups and downs this year and I'm hoping for more consistent results next season.
What did Hadjar do to deserve that?
What did Hadjar do to deserve that?
Scored more points than Yuki and in the "junior" team?
I meant that in the other sense. He seems to not deserved career blight by MV.
Ah. Good point.
Also confirmed (or at least leaked by Ted Kravitz, not sure it's official yet) that it's Lawson and Lindblad at RB so Yuki is seamless. Doesn't seem to to have hurt Gasly and Albon but I can't see another team taking him? Aston would be aiming higher if they do replace Stroll surely?
Tsunoda will be reserve driver for both Red Bull teams. I would like him to go to Indycars to see how he compares with top drivers in spec cars. I think he's better than his critics say, but no other F1 team will want him.
What did Hadjar do to deserve that?
I agree. It’s probably the worst seat on the grid. A complete loose / loose situation. Short of coming a close second to max, he will never be allowed to beat him, is the best he can hope for
Short of coming a close second to max, he will never be allowed to beat him, is the best he can hope for
I don't think Red Bull works like that. Max is treated as number 1 because he's the fastest driver they have. Ricciardo showed he could beat Vettel and ended up as the new number 1. If Hadjar can outqualify and outrace Max, I'm pretty sure Red Bull will be thrilled.
If Hadjar can outqualify and outrace Max, I'm pretty sure Red Bull will be thrilled.
I'll bet you a whole pound that we never see the day when a new spec front wing is taken off Max's car to be fitted to Hadjar's. Anyhow (and straying into the F1 2026 thread's territory) I think they'll both be doing a fair bit of development work for Ford's new PU next year rather than fighting over poles and wins.
I'll bet you a whole pound that we never see the day when a new spec front wing is taken off Max's car to be fitted to Hadjar's.
Max will start the year with priority because he's earned it. If Hadjar can outqualify and outrace Max and is in contention for the title and Max isn't, Hadjar will get priority.
But he never will be able to with priority given to max.
If you are fast you get the team on side.
Just as Max did when he arrived at Red Bull and muscled Ricciardo out of the door.
Pretty sure Red Bull will happy with a second driver that can reliably finish in the top ten each race, something they've not had for a while now! Maybe Hadjar should just ask them to repaint his RB car in Redbull colours, rather than get whatever they've set up for Max 😂
Toyota slowly tip-toeing back to a full F1 return!...
https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/bigger-toyota-deal-prompts-haas-rebrand-for-f1-2026/
Toyota slowly tip-toeing back to a full F1 return!...
If you mean putting Toyota stickers on a car built by someone else, powered by an engine made by another manufacturer, then sure. If you mean owning their own team and building their own engine like Merc, Audi, and Ferrari, then very unlikely. If they start an engine program, I'll change my mind but I can't see that happening anytime soon.
...hence 'tip-toeing' comment! 🤷♂️
I can't see them back for this engine regs cycle - but I can see a return if F1 returns to less complicated V10s. Someone at Toyota really likes motorsport (and fast cars).
I know they have to run the young drivers in some of the free practice sessions, but awful timing for Oscar to give up his seat in FP1.
There was some mention of this in the Weekend Warmup - statistically drivers who don’t participate in FP1 are quicker come qualifying this season, slightly odd!
There was some mention of this in the Weekend Warmup - statistically drivers who don’t participate in FP1 are quicker come qualifying this season, slightly odd!
Generally FP2 is more representative of Quali because it’s at a similar time of day, so I guess there’s less chance of getting a bum steer from FP1 conditions, where—at some races more than others—conditions can be quite different.
I think I would be more worried about them breaking the car and your mechanics having to pull an all nighter to fix it for you
Any thoughts of how today's race is going to go?
Think McLaren will put both drivers on different strategies to ensure Verstappen wins the WDC.
To misquote Murray Walker, Anything could happen in T1 and it usually does.
Norris just has to finish third, Verstappen and Piastri need to win the race. Obvious thing is for Verstappen to try to back the McLarens up so the cars behind can attack. McLaren can split strategies, pit one car early to get undercut on Verstappen. That will force Verstappen to either cover the pitstop or up the pace to avoid getting undercut. McLaren seem to be worried about tyre graining, that might dictate strategy.
The circuit has changed a lot since Hamilton tried backing up Rosberg. Two DRS zones and changes to some of the corners mean that the only place to reduce pace is the section around the hotel/pits so Max will have to judge his speed perfectly on every lap to slow the field down. No doubt he has the skills, but the field spread is very low so if he slows down the leaders there will be plenty of midfield battles with opportunities for people to get it wrong and bring out a SC which, as we all know, can really have an impact at AD.
At least Norris being behind Verstappen on the grid means he shouldn't be in danger of any kamikaze driving coming from behind (I assume McLaren will tell Piastri in no uncertain terms not to crash into Norris)
The circuit has changed a lot since Hamilton tried backing up Rosberg. Two DRS zones and changes to some of the corners mean that the only place to reduce pace is the section around the hotel/pits so Max will have to judge his speed perfectly on every lap to slow the field down
Sure, but if Norris is in the top three after turn 1, Verstappen's only real hope is to back up the field. Giving Norris space to drive conservatively would basically concede the title.
Edit. And Norris can afford to let Piastri past to attack Norris. If Piastri wins, Verstappen can't win the title. Backing up the field and defending against Piastri will be tough.
just waiting to see what stunts get pulled so that Verstapphen wins?
just waiting to see what stunts get pulled so that Verstapphen wins?
I wonder how "careless" Tsunoda, Hadjar and Lawson will be today if they happen to find themselves near the McLarens... 😋
I just hope a mechanical failure doesn't settle it. Everything on those cars will be on it's last legs - and it would be a terrible way to lose a title.
And soooo glad to see the back of these barges - next years aren't going to be much smaller but at least it's a step in the right direction.
Renault's last race as an engine manufacturer. Sad how far they have fallen from their glory days.
Entertaining start. Can see Verstappen staying out front but currently the Norris position doesn’t look so clean cut at the moment
McClarens making it difficult for themselves again if Leclerc gets a decent DRS and passes Norris. Surely the sensible strategy would have been Piastri running in 3rd as a rear gunner for Norris to ensure he wins as his own chances are minimal, and after McClarens cockups of the last two races they need to ensure they get the World Champion rather than gift it to Verstappen
Shithousery from tsunoda there…
I know nothing about f1, but surely as Piastri cant win the championship or the race he's got to take one for the team and drop back a place
I know nothing about f1, but surely as Piastri cant win the championship or the race he's got to take one for the team and drop back a place
he can, if he finishes 1st or second, and max and lando don’t score more than a couple of points
but if lando needs another position on the last lap, and piastri isn’t leading, then yeah, he will.
I know nothing about f1, but surely as Piastri cant win the championship or the race he's got to take one for the team and drop back a place
If he wins the race, he'll be ahead of Verstappen in the championship. If he wins the race and Norris is sixth, Piastri is champion. Best thing for McLaren is for Piastri to win.
Always funny to see how reluctant they are to hug MBS
good race and it turned out to be a great season
I was very happy to see a non eventful race! Well done Lando 👏🏻
good race and it turned out to be a great season
I thought the race was satisfactorily boring!
There was a good strategic battle going on with quite a few cars. Hamilton had a great race as well, almost got 7th at the end.
Max was also doing a brilliant job up front, I'm not a fan but that was brilliant driving.
Hamilton's overtake on sainz was chefskiss.jpg
https://twitter.com/simsgazette/status/1997654443769135236
Some musings now the season has drawn to a close:
Very poor season from my perspective, yes it went down to a 3 way battle, but the vast majority of the races have been poor. Very little on track action, especially at the front
Alot is made of McLaren's equal no 1 status and the risk that brings to winning the title. But what if Red Bulls refusal to sign a driver that can push Max? I have no doubt that Carlos Sainz in that RB would have taken more points out of Lando and Oscar when the RB was fast. Labndo only won the title by 2 points
Max's penalty in Spain did what it was supposed to do - cost him the title. Good. Disgusting driving
Lando is hard to support, for me. But I've supported him as a MClaren fan and an anti Max fan. But bloody hell Lando is so human and is not afraid to show that human side. For that he should be applauded.
Roll on 2026!
I wonder if Redbull were ever tempted to box MV for a second time after he passed OP for a new medium or with 10 to go for a soft to chase OP down for the win.
Both options would have taken McLaren by surprise and put MV right in amongst OP and LN to do his best to upset the apple cart 😈
it’s been a funny season, this ground effect formula promised so much but hasn’t really delivered. The cars are too big and too heavy. Fingers crossed 26 delivers some good racing and that the talents are in those good cars. No one really wants to see a second rate driver pull of a win because they’ve lucked into a good cars/engine package.
Avoided the result all afternoon due to being busy, then got sat down to watch the highlights and it was on Sky's bloody homepage 🙄
Anyhooo, chuffed for Lando!
No one really wants to see a second rate driver pull of a win because they’ve lucked into a good cars/engine package.
I don't think there are any really second rate drivers on the grid at the moment. Stroll and Tsunoda get a lot of criticism, but they are both decent drivers even if they aren't at the level of Alonso and Verstappen, who are both among the elite. The last truly crap driver I can recall off hand was Mazepin, he had no business being on the grid.
Lando is hard to support, for me. But I've supported him as a MClaren fan and an anti Max fan. But bloody hell Lando is so human and is not afraid to show that human side. For that he should be applauded.
I don't understand this - at all. Lando is fantastic, as is Max. They're both total characters without being whiny (George), emotionless (Piastri), emotional (Leclerc) and sulky (Hamilton). Max and Lando are both funny and emotional, but in different ways. They're also both proper racers who enjoy other racing activities. I like this a lot!
How can you be anti-Max. Sure he can be a tool, but by God he's excellent to watch and listen to - as is Lando. I'd also place Sainz into this group - intelligent racers who aren't afraid of who they are or how they're seen. Great!
Did anyone watch the highlights and see David Coulthard being drive round the circuit by Max in a Mustang? Max was super chilled and fun on the eve of a title challenge and scare the SH!T out of DC! AMAZING!
Congrats to Lando and McLaren !
How can you be anti-Max. Sure he can be a tool, but by God he's excellent to watch and listen to - as is Lando. I'd also place Sainz into this group - intelligent racers who aren't afraid of who they are or how they're seen. Great!
He comes across as a prize tool at times. Being in the Red Bull/Horner/Marko crew didn't help, with Horner refusing to accept that Max is ever at fault. When things don't go his way, he's often petulant and childish. I thought he'd matured, but then he pulled that stupid stunt on Russell in Spain. All that nonsense with the clash with Hamilton at Silverstone a few years back didn't help either, that was just pathetic. Nobody doubts his ability, but his public persona leaves a lot to be desired.
he's excellent to watch
I’m not a fan of how he races to the letter of the rules, rather than the spirit of them. Eg the rules on being alongside on the inside at an apex, where he’ll let off that brakes, dive bombing in with no intention of making the corner, knowing that by the letter of the law, because he’s along side, it’s down to the other driver to get out the way, or face a penalty. Poor rule admittedly, but still.
Lando is a deserving champion and McLaren have done a great job turning around a team that appeared destined for Williams like years in the doldrums.
But BIG thanks to Red Bull for turning it into a proper championship!
At least when Mercedes had Nico and Lewis fighting they let them battle it out properly with no underlying favouritism rumours lingering.
And Webber's chip-on-the-shoulder demeanor has well and truly rubbed off on Piastri.
he's excellent to watch
I’m not a fan of how he races to the letter of the rules, rather than the spirit of them. Eg the rules on being alongside on the inside at an apex, where he’ll let off that brakes, dive bombing in with no intention of making the corner, knowing that by the letter of the law, because he’s along side, it’s down to the other driver to get out the way, or face a penalty. Poor rule admittedly, but still.
I'm no apologist for MV though he's slightly more palatable sans Whinger Spice. But, criticising someone for following the rules is a bit odd. If the rules allow for this behaviour, they should be changed. Otherwise people may adopt different interpretations with differing results - as we've seen in the past few years.
Sadly, when he's up against it, I'm pretty sure the 'arrogant prick' persona will reappear. Leopards/spots/old dogs/news tricks etc...
I’m not a fan of how he races to the letter of the rules, rather than the spirit of them. Eg the rules on being alongside on the inside at an apex, where he’ll let off that brakes, dive bombing in with no intention of making the corner, knowing that by the letter of the law, because he’s along side, it’s down to the other driver to get out the way, or face a penalty. Poor rule admittedly, but still.
I'd say that's a problem of the rules. The fact that Max can consider them and implement actions to precision at ~200mph into a corner whilst considering these things is what makes, him, Sainz and Lando great to watch.
I'd say that's a problem of the rules. - Making the rules do what you mean to do is really difficult.
A simple example at the local school: a couple of parents left their kids to pick them up late, so the school introduced a £10 penalty. If you didn't pick up your kid in the first half hour, you paid £10. It went from 1-2 parents leaving their kids late to all the parents leaving their kids an extra half hour, paying £10 for childcare and toddling off home.
You make the rule to stop the car on the outside slamming into the car on the inside of the corner, and suddenly the car on the inside can do what Max does and push the one on the outside out. Whatever you do, there is consequence.
I’m not a fan of how he races to the letter of the rules
I think that's because these rules were made in response to Max's most unsporting overtakes.
The old rules were too ambiguous and relied on "common sense" and essentially not being a dick. Unfortunately whilst the new rules did reign his behaviour in slightly (i.e. you now at least have to stay on the track at the exit when attacking to keep the position), it left us with the "divebomb to get to the apex first" situation.
Same thing with the moving under braking rule. The old rule was basically "use your common sense, don't move when somebody else is already committed otherwise you will crash and somebody might die". Then Max starts doing it tactically and we need a rule to reign it in.
Oh I’m not saying what he does isn’t clever or effective, clearly it is, it just doesn’t sit well. IMO the ‘common sense’ and DBAD rules were fine, until max & whinger spice et al started kicking up a fuss.
See Landos pass of tsunoda. Common sense says no penalty, rightly so. Max fans on the internet demanding a penalty as he overtook off track, calling him a cheat.
Well done to Lando and Mclaren. I know "papaya rules" had its critics but I think trying to embed fairness into how you go racing can only be a good thing.
I think that's because these rules were made in response to Max's most unsporting overtakes.
The old rules were too ambiguous and relied on "common sense" and essentially not being a dick.
This. Very much this.
I find Max hard to like because of the petulance, the deliberately crashing into people, the running people off the road, and many other things.
But the real tragedy is the damage to the rule set that has been done by the FIA pandering to his behaviour, and altering rules or codifying acceptable behaviour after the fact. And now we are where we are with F1 rules. Rules unlike almost every other racing series.
For me, this is Max’s legacy. And while undoubtedly a prodigiously talented driver, he’s made the sport worse.
Edit - I think that might actually be the problem. I’m assuming it’s a sport. While they’ve clearly demonstrated that at its core it’s entertainment…
FFS, it's taken me this long to notice the pun in the title. Time to go home from work as I'm obviously being a bit unobservant 😳
Senna and Schumacher were equally dicks when needed.
It's funny how we applaud driven individuals in many walks of life, yet Senna, Schumacher and Verstappen overstepped the mark on multiple occasions.
It's even more disappointing when all three obviously had/have prodigious talent and don't really need to act so obnoxiously.
Does anyone specifically listen to the drivers radio messages? I'm not sure whether MV is fairly or unfairly targetted but his broadcasted messages seem a LOT more petulant than other drivers and I'm not sure that's just Drive To Survive production values!
Senna and Schumacher were equally dicks when needed.
It's funny how we applaud driven individuals in many walks of life, yet Senna, Schumacher and Verstappen overstepped the mark on multiple occasions.
I was a big fan of Schumacher when he first started but his utter ruthlessness was a huge turn off and I came to loathe him. Senna's crash with Prost was a black mark on his record but I don't think he ever had the constant nastiness that Verstappen displays when things don't go his way.
At least when Mercedes had Nico and Lewis fighting they let them battle it out properly with no underlying favouritism rumours lingering.
those rumours are just people shit stirring on social media. It’s been pretty obvious that McLaren have been tripping over themselves in their effort to make sure they treat their drivers equally, which is the other thing that the keyboard warriors on social media like to beat McLaren up about, so make that make sense