For anyone interest...
 

[Closed] For anyone interested to see what happens when a big jet swallows a big bird...

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Looks like the bird was a kite, somewhere around a 3-4 foot wingspan, it’s rare to get such clear film of it happening.
http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/26734/check-out-this-crazy-shot-of-a-c-17-ingesting-a-big-bird-on-takeoff-at-the-avalon-air-show


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 4:42 pm
 DezB
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The danger birds present to aircraft isn't insignificant.

Excuse me, but I see that as the danger aircraft present to birds! 🙁


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 4:45 pm
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The C-17 involved in the incident, tail number 05-5140, hadn't flown the following day so it may have received some damage or required more detailed inspections before it could take to the skies again.

I think there's a fair chance of that


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 4:48 pm
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My Dad helped design nuclear bombers in the 1950s. Apparently the chicken gun thing was real, they used to fire dead chickens at prototype bombers from a cannon to see how much of a mess it would make.


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 5:58 pm
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That link doesn't work.


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 6:07 pm
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Got the spinning roulette wheel spam thing. Thanks for that 😑


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 6:33 pm
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#prayforthebird


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 6:37 pm
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Indeed, the last thing that goes through a bird's brain as it collides with an aircraft is it's own arse.

A reverse-Grayling if you will.


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 6:48 pm
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We almost hit a vulture once, those are ten times as big as that kite. It was I n a helicopter over Aneto (highest mountain in the pyrenees) with 4 bikes strapped below it. It was already pretty bumpy and I fly like BA before he had his milk. Suddenly the helicopter drops out the sky and to the right really violently. I thought that we were crashing for sure! The pilot Was pissing his pants laughing at my fear for the whole rest of the flight. :/)


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 6:56 pm
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Silly question but why can't they fit a grill in front of the engine?


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 7:02 pm
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Posted : 04/03/2019 7:05 pm
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My Dad helped design nuclear bombers in the 1950s. Apparently the chicken gun thing was real, they used to fire dead chickens at prototype bombers from a cannon to see how much of a mess it would make.

The urban legend I heard was they were using a chicken gun to test some new plane canopy. They would fire a chicken at the canopy, and if it broke they would redesign it stronger and try again. This went on but they were destroying all the canopies they tested, that was until someone suggested maybe they should maybe thaw the frozen chickens out first…


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 8:14 pm
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This one's a classic....

The C17 one is a bit of an over dramatisaiton in the video title...the engine didn't explode. It surged and probably recovered and continued to operate. Engines usually do a pretty good job of mincing birds...and rabbits too that get a bit too close and are unlucky enough to get sucked off the runway. They're like 60,000 horse power blenders.

The large engines on big wide bodies are required to be able to ingest birds as part of their certification tests, 6 8lb Canadian geese (dead but not frozen) simultaneously and continue to operate for a minimum of 5 minutes after the ingestion to simulate a bird strike on take off and safe go-around without the engine shutting down. Pretty spectacular test.

I once heard of a bird strike at 35,000 feet. There was some suspicion at first, but after some consultation with Canada goose experts who confirmed it is possible, though rare, for Canadian Geese to get that high if all the conditions are right, and after DNA tests of the remains of the bird inside the engine (yes, it is standard practice to DNA test the remains of any animal ingested into an engine to confirm the species), it was confirmed it was a Canada goose. It's a big sky at that altitude....not exactly that poor birds lucky day!


 
Posted : 04/03/2019 8:39 pm
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The C17 one is a bit of an over dramatisaiton in the video title

I rather agree, but it was the quality of the video and how close it was, plus actually seeing the poor bugger ingested by the engine and turned into a flambé that impressed me the most.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 1:55 am
 cdoc
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until someone suggested maybe they should maybe thaw the frozen chickens out first…

I think it was Mythbusters that tested this and found that there was no difference between the impacts. Surprising, but the physics doesn't lie!

Edit* They found it was plausible, dependent on speed. Under 120 mph the frozen will have greater penetration, above 120 and the difference is negligible.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 2:05 am
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Silly question but why can’t they fit a grill in front of the engine?

Above a certain speed, the birds would just go through anyway. Look at the damage they do to solid titanium turbine blades.

I think there's a few helicopters fitted with them though.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 8:15 am
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Silly question but why can’t they fit a grill in front of the engine?

That would have a huge effect on airflows, and vibration, as well as increasing the potential for Foreign object damage hugely, ie sections of it breaking off and getting inside the compressor.

Most of these bird strikes go up the bypass, ie the low pressure side of the engine, the real damage is done within the high pressure side - compressor, combustor, turbine etc, the damage a 1/4" nut can do in there is quite impressive.

Seen the results of a few birdstrikes, one notable example was a vulture on an Air India 80C2, the F1 blades looked like they were made of torn tin foil.

I've also seen a 14v cordless drill go through a UPS MD11 engine, that was a bad day....


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 8:24 am
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Another reason why they can't fit a grill onto the front apart from the reasons already stated are that it would accumulate ice which would shed off and be ingested into the engine...and ice is much more difficult and hazardous to the engine than birds.

Birds generally don't cause a problem. Sure when a big bird like a goose, flamingo or something like that goes in it can cause a problem, but that is extremely rare and mostly they're small birds or mammals and the pilot might not know about it and it might not even be spotted until many flights later when a small increase in vibration is detected by the engine monitoring systems or something like that. These engines are designed to ingest birds, they're even tolerant to birds being ingested into the core of the engine...like I said, rows of rotor blades and stator vanes make extremely efficient mincing machines.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 11:03 am
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Absolutely, have seen the odd feather on an F1 blade when the swallows are back from their winter holidays, engine doesn't miss a beat.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 11:28 am
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@PJM,

I can confirm. I did my apprenticeship at the RAE Farnborough, worked there for 10 years in total.
We did have a test rig that would fire frozen chickens* into jet engines, known as the bird gun but more commonly recognised as the Rooster Booster!

*Frozen chickens were found to better emulate a bird strike impact in an engine in a test situation than a merely 'oven ready' variant.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 11:39 am
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Back in my cadet days I was on an operational Nimrod flight out of RAF Kinloss, whilst loitering over a patrol area the Nimrod ran on only 2 engines. When they started up the other 2 to then head home there was a bit of bang/squeal etc which they put down to a bird getting lodged in the off line engine intake. That's my coolest bird strike story, bro!


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 12:45 pm
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Not just birds
http://www.famouspictures.org/man-sucked-into-jet-engine/
At least one recorded fatality but it in the link, fortunately.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 12:53 pm
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This is the navy crewman getting sucked into the intake from the link above. He survived, apparently, because he got wedged in the intake and his jacket went into the engine and the pilot shut it down.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 1:05 pm
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Fascinating thread chaps, good job


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 1:17 pm
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The frozen chicken gun thing is definitely urban legend (not the gun, which is real - obviously you test glass against high speed projectiles but the "thaw the chickens you idiots" bit), I've heard it about various air forces, Concorde, British Rail with the HST, multiple airlines etc.

The video is interesting, but a bit underwhelming really! Also chuckled at the notion there may be "some damage" to the engine...


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 1:17 pm
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A friend of my was flying out of Copenhagen last month and they had a bird strike a few minutes out which shut down one engine. They dropped when it hit (stuff all over the cabin) and they turned round and headed back to CPH at low altitude. They landed with full fire engines and emergency services shadowing. He’s a very experienced flier and he said it was the scariest thing he’d had in +40yrs of frequent flights. The engine looks toast in the picture he sent me after landing.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 2:05 pm
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Silly question but why can’t they fit a grill in front of the engine?

Only a matter of time before EasyJet offer an in flight barbecue.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 2:11 pm
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the “thaw the chickens you idiots” bit), I’ve heard it about various air forces

On mumsnet too.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 2:14 pm
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Only a matter of time before EasyJet offer an in flight barbecue.

LOLs. Imagine the Ryan air version. LOLs at hols2 also.


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 2:37 pm
 kcr
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Snopes has a pretty definitive history of the chicken gun story:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/catapoultry/

I originally heard it told as a cock up by the High Speed Train engineers (as mentioned above) when they supposedly tried to copy aircraft testing methods. I imagine it will keep running for a long time!


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 4:56 pm
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Worlds most powerful chicken gun, chooks away!
Chooks away


 
Posted : 05/03/2019 8:03 pm