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actually they’d both be on 8 wins I think
No, it would be 9-8 to Max.
But in addition, there’s virtually no chance of the race winner getting fastest lap anyway. That’s going to either be the second placed driver (if the first two are Hamilton and Verstappen and they’ve got a 25s or so gap over the next car from a different team) or one of their teammates. So if Hamilton wins in Saudi, chances are he’ll be either 1 or 2 points behind Max, but almost certainly not level.
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But in addition, there’s virtually no chance of the race winner getting fastest lap anyway. That’s going to either be the second placed driver (if the first two are Hamilton and Verstappen and they’ve got a 25s or so gap over the next car from a different team) or one of their teammates. So if Hamilton wins in Saudi, chances are he’ll be either 1 or 2 points behind Max, but almost certainly not level.
Can anyone imagine a scenario where LH, MV, VB & Checo are running line astern on the last lap of the AD GP and it all hinges on who gets fastest lap? And it flips as each driver gets fastest lap as they cross the line flip-flopping the WDC?
...and maybe George Russell running way down the field puts in a storming lap and takes previous fastest lap off Checo?
Max can nerf them both at turn one and win the WDC on number of wins
The opponent nerfing thing has been known to work, it did for Senna, 50/50 for Schumacher.
I was listening to an interview with Villeneurve ages ago, he was saying that going into that last race at Jerez he and his team were making a big fuss in the media about how Schumacher had hit Hill in 94 and taken the title to try to ensure that he would be far too well scrutinised to attempt it again with all eyes on him. Didn't work at all🤣 But then Schumacher was excluded from second. Would either of the current ones try it? If they got away with it, great, if they don't and lose second would they care, worth a try? Personally I think Verstappen would be more likely to try it, he seems desperate enough and of course has the points advantage.
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FWIW I think the Schumacher/Hill thing did look like an accident, the Schumacher/Villeneurve one clearly wasn't.
Can anyone imagine a scenario where LH, MV, VB & Checo are running line astern on the last lap of the AD GP and it all hinges on who gets fastest lap? And it flips as each driver gets fastest lap as they cross the line flip-flopping the WDC?
No. If LH must have the FL to win that would have to put him one point ahead of MV (equal points MV wins on countback)
If MV then takes the FL that puts MV 1 ahead (1 less for LH and 1 more for MV) If VB then takes the FL thats 1 less for MV so equal on points and MV still wins. It doesn't matter what Checo does, or indeed a last ditch effort from Russell, LH and MV are still equal and MV still has it.
It could work for the constructors though.
Yeah, that’s straight forward, but I’m curious as to whether VB can do what he’s paid to do and take some points from MV, and MV only finishes third (in either race, I guess).
based on his performances so far this season I would assume that will be a no. If merc are lucky he will score a free constructors points
Ah now I've always thought Schumacher/Hill was deliberate.
Bluearsed – while you are here, have you got anything to add about hoses not being pulled in the pit lane
Nothing to add other than it’s getting that petty between RB and Merc, it wouldn’t surprise me if they left their respective hoses in the way of each other.
Next step is Red Bull are going to paint some black and white stripes across pitlane and employ a mechanic with a baby stroller to wander back and forth across pitlane when one of the Mercs tries to leave the pitstop
Just put Les Nessman on the job.
Can I just repeat that I love the “Karen” Horner nickname. It’s just perfection.
Can I just repeat that I love the “Karen” Horner nickname. It’s just perfection.
I'm not normally a fan of that particular epithet but it does rather suit him.
The irony of the whole situation is that Red Bull's antics mean that most people are rooting for the Corporate Motorsport Giant over the independent.
Rooting for the Corporate Motorsport Giant over the Corporate Marketing Giant you mean?
Mercedes (the whole company) net income was around €4bn
RedBull (the whole company) net income was around €1.2-1.4bn
Neither is exactly a small going concern, now are they? But whereas Mercedes actually make very nice and useful things for a variety of markets, Redbull sold 7bn energy drinks that taste like cough medicine...
mean that most people are rooting for the Corporate Motorsport Giant over the independent.
Perhaps in the UK, in other parts of Europe it's not.
I think it's a shame. It distracts from Max's clear talent. I'd imagine that anywhere he goes, the faint odour of his dad will follow him, but the relentless victimhood status of RB must be pretty wearisome after a while.
the faint odour of his dad will follow him
Can’t help but think there’s a “Jos sticks” pun to be found somewhere.
The irony of the whole situation is that Red Bull’s antics mean that most people are rooting for the Corporate Motorsport Giant over the independent
This has got to be one of Red Bulls biggest own goals- they've somehow managed to make Mercedes, the winner of every single world championship since 2014 and with one of the biggest budgets in the paddock, look like the plucky underdogs. Whuuut?!? Literally just a few months ago everyone was groaning at the thought of Merc and Hamilton winning yet another season, and now it feels like we've all been given persmission to root for them again. Perfect! 🙂
the Schumacher/Hill thing did look like an accident
the Schumacher/Hill thing looked nothing like an accident if you ask me!
Great battle this year, becomes quite clear the whole “sport” is run as entertainment. But I am entertained.
And try as I might to like VES, he keeps doing things that make it impossible. And is in a team that does the same.
“Mercedes actually make very nice and useful things for a variety of markets”
Umm. Really?
They make some really naff ugly cars.
They’re no Ferrari, or Lotus, or Skoda even.
Neither beautiful nor particularly practical.
Don’t like Red Bull either to be honest.
But at least they aren’t as bad as Ineos.
Sorry? Secondary sponsor you say? Oh.
The AMG GT is lovely, the Unimog is practical as are their trucks, busses and vans - there are a whole host of other things in between.
I think Red Bull's issue stems from trying to look like the cool kids whilst competing seriously at the highest level. They've now had a sense of humour failure.
I read earlier today that the Mercedes’ rear wing has been tested officially under a significant load, and found to not flex. RB are now saying Mercedes swapped it for a different wing…
#rollseyes
I read earlier today that the Mercedes’ rear wing has been tested officially under a significant load, and found to not flex. RB are now saying Mercedes swapped it for a different wing…
Is that the one they took away in Brazil? Not much chance for swapping there!
and where did you read this, without a bona fide source I'm not believing a word of that
This article raises the question of why the Red Bull wing only started oscillating recently - after the revised loads tests to detect flexy wings, in fact. Plausible that Red Bull changed the carbon layup to modify the flexy properties and that set up a resonance that caused the oscillations. Obviously, Merc would have protested if Red Bull kept running the flappy wing so Red Bull had to change it to avoid the risk of a DSQ for a non-compliant wing or being sent to the back of the grid if they had to repair it again after qualifying.
bruneep
and where did you read this, without a bona fide source I’m not believing a word of that
It might have been here as I read the same thing yesterday.
https://www.planetf1.com/news/mercedes-rear-wing-test-rock-solid/
Does anyone subscribe to F1's official streaming service?
https://www.formula1.com/en/subscribe-to-f1-tv.html#en-CA
Just wondering (a) who provides the commentary & analysis (and whether it's as good as/better than C4) and (b) whether there are adverts during the coverage?
I'm trying to figure whether to get a one month subscription so I can watch the last two races live (for $9.99) versus 2x 24hr passes for TSN here in Canada versus a self imposed news blackout then watch the highlights late in the day on C4 via a vpn
Answering my own question!
https://support.f1.tv/s/article/Who-are-the-F1-TV-live-commentators?language=en_US
Seems it's Crofty and Martin Brundle...
I guess that'll be the same coverage as on Sky then?
Looks like Lawrence is spending $$$$
Formula 1: Aston Martin sign Mercedes’ chief aerodynamicist Eric Blandin - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59402630
I guess that’ll be the coverage as on Sky then?
Maybe, I've never had Sky. Does Sky insert advert breaks into the coverage?
(Only watched one Sky race)
No adverts during the race, several before and after.
I watch the Sky coverage at my parent's house. The pre and post shows are littered with ad breaks, promotion of all their other channels or sporting events and trying to flog their Sky Glass TV's. The actual commentary is ruined by Croft being a shouty moron and his constant plugs for Sky Q and Glass. With C4 seemingly giving up on making the highlights show as good as they can (guessing contractual constraints have worn them down) I only watch the Sky coverage as it's quality time with my dad and means I don't have to risk catching the results before seeing the highlights.
I quite like the Sky coverage, Martin Brundle and David Croft make a good team I reckon
Nope, no adverts during the race
With C4 seemingly giving up on making the highlights show as good as they can (guessing contractual constraints have worn them down)
When the C4 coverage is done properly its actually very good, obviously allowing for the fact its a highlights show. But they seem to chop and change the line up every week.
I think the C4 team has improved a lot, Alex Jaques drove me mad for his first few races, sounded like a local radio DJ, but he seems to have got the hang of it now. Billy Monger spent his first few months just stating the bleeding obvious all the time but he's been really good this season, just takes folks a while to get good at a new job I guess, and I do quite like Steve Jones.
And where would we be without DC's 'overrotation/underrotation' drinking game?
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Just a shame their website is so flakey
Alex Jacques still annoys me...his habit of making single words into two ...."main-tain", "Pi-erre".
I forked out for a NowTV pass for a month so I could watch the last 3 races (well, two, cos I'll be away for the Saudi one). I quite like the Sky coverage so far (apart from Crofty, who is indeed a shouty moron). I won't be forking out for it for next season tho
With NowTV can you going a live stream late and get it to return to the start? One of the annoying things C4 app doesn't do
This is one of the reasons I kept my Humax freeview recorder. I know there are tons of streaming options out there, but a lot of them are a bit shit.
With the Humax, I can record the F1 on C4 and then watch it later easily skipping the Coulthard-Red Bull-ocks as well as the adverts.
I tend to watch the highlights show on Monday mornings. With Virgin, our Tivo box allows us to FFWD fast and when we hit play it restarts at a few seconds before the bit that was playing. So after the first couple of laps I hit FFWD and keep my eyes glued to the top left corner. Whenever it says "Replay" I take that as an instruction to hit play which means I get to see just the interesting bits and it takes about 10 minutes.
I'm hooked on the BBC audio commentaries of qualifying and the race, though.
With NowTV can you going a live stream late and get it to return to the start?
I don't believe so, no (happy to be told I'm wrong!)
I’m hooked on the BBC audio commentaries of qualifying and the race, though
Agree...I think it's way better than either TV options (even if I can't tell the two main presenters apart!!
I don’t believe so, no (happy to be told I’m wrong!)
Thanks, think the only app I’ve ever seen doing it is iPlayer so probably right
Ah poo - Sir Frank Williams RIP
Not without his flaws, but who is? One of the last great privateers of F1, and even though the family are no longer involved I hope his name makes it back to the sharp end of the grid one day.
Growing up watching F1 in the 80's with my dad Frank was as much a part as of it as The Chain, Marlboro livery and Mansell's moustache. RIP Frank
RIP Frank - one of the great personalities of F1 and as an underdog frequently dominated larger and better funded teams, and managed some of the greatest drivers the sport has ever known.
Really sad to hear. I never met him but living in Wantage and Didcot I knew many people who did and they all sang his praises.
Williams have always been ‘my’ team. Don’t know why I started with them, but I’ve always followed them. I would have loved them to be back at the pointy end one last time before Sir Frank passed.
R.I.P.
Have you noticed how the best racing drivers are all named after Scottish towns?
Lewis Hamilton
Stirling Moss
Eddie Irvine
Ayr Toon Centre
You forgot about Niki Lauder
And (Bridge of) Allen Prost
Good point
Just found Ayrton Senna Road, but it’s in Reading
Danny Hulme
Johnny Dumfries
Jackie Stewart(on)
James Hunt(ly)
And I see Bettyhill is both a place, and wife and mother to F1 champions (two separate people).
Emerson Footdee-paldi
Johnny Dumfries
Aka the Earl of Dumfries, so actually properly named after the place.
BTW anyone bovvered about Lando moving to Monaco? At least he's openly admitting it's for financial reasons rather than making up some baloney about it being a good base for European races or whatever
BTW anyone bovvered about Lando moving to Monaco?
Couldn't care less. IMO we should still be in the EU and able to move and live freely anywhere in Europe.
Nope, don't care where drivers live. Slight jealousy aside
BTW anyone bovvered about Lando moving to Monaco?
I often wonder how they manage to do stuff there.
Things like being in the factory with the engineers and designers or testing (or using the sim nowadays),that must be a pain when you are several hundred miles from your team's base. I suspect the job is a lot more than just show up at racetrack, drive car, go home.
If you take into account the amount of tax he would have paid in the last few years while living in the UK he's most likely paid more then than you or I would pay in a lifetime.
I often wonder how they manage to do stuff there.
Things like being in the factory with the engineers and designers or testing (or using the sim nowadays),that must be a pain when you are several hundred miles from your team’s base. I suspect the job is a lot more than just show up at racetrack, drive car, go home.
They're allowed up to 90 days in the UK per year, plenty of time to do sim work and factory visits. They train like hell away from races but that can be done anywhere really. Don't forget that a lot of their year is taken up by race weekends, travelling and testing. ISTR an interview with Eddie Irvine saying while he officially lived in Monaco he only actually spent a few weeks there a year, just enough to claim it as his residence. Of course he timed it to be when the weather was good, as anyone else would!
Couldn’t care less. IMO we should still be in the EU and able to move and live freely anywhere in Europe.
Apart from Monaco not being in the EU….
Can’t blame Lando, I’d do the same as him in that position.
For 23 weeks of the year they will be away racing, add in the 90 day rule here, sponsor visits and like Irvine he’ll spend little time in Monaco…
Do we have any thoughts on how the coming weekend may unfold?
I won't be surprised if MV takes LH out, and after Karen goes crying to the stewards it's a racing incident.
BTW anyone bovvered about Lando moving to Monaco? At least he’s openly admitting it’s for financial reasons rather than making up some baloney about it being a good base for European races or whatever
It's legal so it comes down purely to morals and it slightly grates on me that the people who can pay uk tax and still bank millions and live a very luxurious lifestyle instead bugger off and pay as little tax as possible as soon as they can.
Specifically to Lando it's also in bad taste after doing his "thank you key workers" schtick a few races back.
Anyway. Got that off my chest finally! On with the racing
I won’t be surprised if MV takes LH out,
I think a lot of people are expecting this, myself included!
It would be an incredibly unsatisfying way to end what has otherwise been an amazing season
Do we have any thoughts on how the coming weekend may unfold?
In my head... Redbull are quick and Max take the front row, but have rear wing problems again and lash it together after Q3 with no penalty, much to totos annoyance. From the start Max builds a 10s lead then just after his first stop his rear wing flap fails catastrophically causing him to retire (unhurt) and both mercs pit under the safety car to give them a 1-2 finish. Horner blames Renault, Pirelli and Merc for the rear wing failure.
It’s legal so it comes down purely to morals and it slightly grates on me that the people who can pay uk tax and still bank millions and live a very luxurious lifestyle instead bugger off and pay as little tax as possible as soon as they can.
I would absolutely get the heck put of this country and minimise the sheckles I contribute to this government's coffers if I could.
You need serious money to own property in Monaco. Just read that £1million will get approx 15m2.
Don't mind as long as they no longer refer to him as British driver, (in the same way that I hate Connery and Connelly being referred to as Scottish, they're not they're settled yanks who came from Scotland, to seem less of a dick I also believe that migrants to UK be referred to as British and not Syrian or whatever, do your bit here and you're one of us)
Do we have any thoughts on how the coming weekend may unfold?
Horner and Wolff will spend the weekend sniping and moaning at each other. The track will turn out to favour one team over the other based on how hard the front or rear tyres are loaded. Depending on which team that is, either Hamilton or Verstappen will dominate. The question is whether their teammate finishes second or not. If Hamilton wins with Bottas second, that would make him a slight favourite for the championship. If Verstappen wins with Perez second, that would make him a strong favourite. If I had to put money on it, I'd bet that Hamilton wins with Verstappen second.
BTW anyone bovvered about Lando moving to Monaco?
Well, if foreigners moving to the U.K., taking jobs, and pushing up housing costs is bad then surely a Brit moving overseas and taking his money with him must be a good thing.
Apart from Monaco not being in the EU….
Hey don't go wrecking my point with simple things like facts.
BTW anyone bovvered about Lando moving to Monaco?
Uk is a shit show at the moment, lets face it we'd all move there if we could.
Do we have any thoughts on how the coming weekend may unfold?
Fast circuit with a long straight suggests rear wings might be in the spotlight again.
Obviously it’s nonetheless tough to predict, and I wonder if front tyre stresses may again play a role, but I’d put a few quid on us going to Abu Dhabi with Lewis either one or two points behind Max in the championship. The pressure is on Hamilton and he has one simple objective, which is to win the race. That’s when he’s at his best, and the car seems to be coming on song, so even if he’s off the pace in Q1 I’d back him for pole and a lights-to-flag win unless something wild happens. Valtteri’s brief will be to make sure that Max doesn’t get a late pit window to make it a two point gap with fastest lap, though whether he can fulfil it is another matter entirely…
As for the rest of the field, who knows and who cares! 😂
Is there a rule about how far you have to stay behind the car in front during a safety car?
Just thinking, say the order is LH, VB, MV, SP when the safety car comes in. LH goes for it straight away, but then VB dithers about for ages and crosses the line (and only once he does that can MV attempt an overtake) say 10 seconds after LH, who is long gone by then. I've never really seen this done.
Is there a rule about how far you have to stay behind the car in front during a safety car?
Yeah there is a rule for this very reason.
Yeah you can't bimble. Can't remember the rules but there have been issues in the past
You have to stay within 10 car lengths of the car in front during a safety car
You have to stay within 10 car lengths of the car in front during a safety car
So, whats the penalty for failing to do so, I wonder.....? They'd be hard-pressed to penalize LH for something VB does in Andrew's scenario...
(Could you imagine the epic whinging from Red Bull!)
I’m absolutely confident Mercedes won’t stoop to that. This isn’t Flav we’re talking about.
Good question! I've never seen a penalty applied, but I have seen some drivers pushing their luck on occasion
They’d be hard-pressed to penalize LH for something VB does in Andrew’s scenario…
It’s a team game though mind. I’d expect massive penalties for all involved if that’s how a championship was won (like, all excluded from the full championship for example)