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I believe it is, against the majority of Labour voters but seemingly in line with JC's wishes.
It’s still official Labour policy though isn’t it?
Only in the way that anything not ruled out is labour policy, but it is quite clear that it isn't a direction the labour leadership want to go.
Also, all this uncertainty is costing the country millions. The amount of businesses having to look into and prepare for as many eventualities as they can forsee is ridiculous, and I’m sure there time would be much better spent preparing for an actual event, rather than dozens
Takes time though. How long would it need?
Mmmm a day would do it.
Also, all this uncertainty is costing the country millions. The amount of businesses having to look into and prepare for as many eventualities as they can forsee is ridiculous, and I’m sure there time would be much better spent preparing for an actual event, rather than dozens
And the ‘Deal’ doesn’t actually tell you what trading deal you’ll have after the 2 years, so your none the wiser on what will be.
You couldn’t make this clusterkucf up.
And the ‘Deal’ doesn’t actually tell you what trading deal you’ll have after the 2 years, so your none the wiser on what will be.
This. Mays Deal is just kicking it all into the long grass for (at least) another 2 years of uncertainty. As I've already suggested on this thread, maybe "No Deal" would be better in that we could at least start fixing things next year.
I do hope she fails thou
Quite literally hope we t out the window it's impossible for her to fail ...a win win the corbyntard is about as useful as shit on a blanket and the maytard has outmanoeuvred the ****less c*** every time
.
Anyway happy Christmas fellow Tory Brexit hostages 🙂
As it's Christmas day I've got some amusing vids for you all. A recent one and one from a while back. ZDF is about as mainstream as German TV gets.
No subtitles on the next one which is perhaps just as well.
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/25/brexit-uk-global-joke-rebuild-reputation?
References the German satirical TV shows above.
I would say cakeism, but this way more deluded. I wonder what they are so desperate to evade? It wouldn't be the new tax laws.....
Really? After the failed 'coup', is anyone still giving credence to the ERG's demands?
By anyone do you mean the pm who needs every vote she can find?
If you want to have a say in the rules, stay a member. Simple. Don't have a transition period as a second class rule taker, revoke A50, plan, agee and prepare to Leave without a transition deal. The ERG are avoiding the obvious Leave tactic, because they know that once you agree a way to Leave… membership will look preferable to the majority of … well … us.
Anyone who was worried that the ERG was likely to fold and vote for May's deal should be reassured that they are doubling down with even more ludicrous demands instead. They might as well have required that the EU parliament sing the UK national anthem at the start of each session. Which bit of "leave means leave" do you think they struggle to understand?
Eurosceptic Conservative MPs have warned Theresa May that maintaining a veto over laws that the EU might enact during the transition period after Brexit is a “red line” for negotiations.
If you want to have a say in the rules, stay a member. Simple. Don't have a transition period as a second class rule taker, revoke A50, plan, agee and prepare to Leave without a transition deal. The ERG are avoiding the obvious Leave tactic, because they know that once you agree a way to Leave… membership will look preferable to the majority of … well … us.
Family time over Xmas has (surprisingly) revealed that the Leavers would vote Remain in a referendum next year, even those who still think that long term we should Leave. Everyone wants the clock stopped. No one trusts the current government, or any alternative government that could be formed in 2019, to be able to avoid a messy subservient outcome next year.
The ERG are fundamentalist zealots. In the same unhinged manner as the most hardline ISIS extremist. They’re brainwashed with their own insane ideology and simply will nor compromise under any circumstances.
Trying to reason with them
Is utterly pointless. And making concessions to them simply provokes the next list of demands
The only thing May can do is call their bluff. She won’t, of course
But she has to, in the sense that she has no other deal to offer. She cannot back down on behalf of the EU.
Apologies for the double post. I edited the first one, and got a bonus second post. Another fun forum quirk, it seems.
binners
The ERG are fundamentalist zealots. In the same unhinged manner as the most hardline ISIS extremist. They’re brainwashed with their own insane ideology and simply will nor compromise under any circumstances...
I think there's a simpler answer.
They either stand to benefit personally by the UK not being held to account by the EU on tax evasion or market manipulation, or they are in the pay of billionaires who would benefit.
The English upper classes are selling out England, just like their Scottish counterparts did to Scotland in 1707.
Follow the money.
They’re the hardest right of the free-marketeers.
All they see is how much more money them and there mates could be making once free from pesky things like workers rights and environmental controls. How much less tax they’d Have to pay if they could tear up the existing social contract...
Anyone sick of hearing about Brexit?
Yes. I'm also getting to the point where I'm past caring what happens even though I know that's a dangerous place to be.
I think it's a mistake to believe that it's all about money. Some are motivated by personal gain but for many it's more of a group identity thing. I work in climate science and it's the same with climate sceptics (who incidentally overlap strongly with brexiteers, tobacco denialists, Obama birthers and other right wing extremists). It's not about money or even "belief" really, it's about alignment with a group that has specific shibboleths. If you can say "leave means leave" or "Obama is a Kenyan" then you're in the club.
I think there’s a simpler answer.
They either stand to benefit personally by the UK not being held to account by the EU on tax evasion or market manipulation, or they are in the pay of billionaires who would benefit.
The English upper classes are selling out England, just like their Scottish counterparts did to Scotland in 1707.
Follow the money.
In terms of people who support Brexit, I think there are the following groupings.
1. The short-term currency hedgers. They make an instant killing every time something volatile happens (especially when they are given a tip off by someone in a position to tell them when to place their bets). Evaluation = sane but utterly cynical and don’t give a shit beyond the next currency trade.
2. The longer-term spivs who want to profit personally, but also have a dogmatic political hatred of public services. These people want to bring education, but especially the NHS, to its knees. The services will then ‘fail’ and the argument for private investment grows. When segments of the NHS have been hived off and put out to tender, the vultures move in with seemingly amazing tenders. On being awarded a slice of the action they make a monumental **** up of it, whilst taking enormous dividend and exec salaries, and it then has to be taken back by the public purse to be rescued. The culprits, meanwhile, are left untouched, and even if they are, the dosh is offshore. Evaluation = sane up to a point, but unhinged and very cynical and don’t give a shit about everyday people.
3. The politically committed. Mostly xenophobic nationalists who don’t have the first idea how the world works. They will be pissed off when more brown people arrive to offset the lesser number of Europeans coming to the UK to work, but as their primary motive is hatred of anything internationalist or collaborative, they can’t see anything beyond the next opportunity to stab any part of a liberal consensus. Evaluation = stupid, but more because they think they understand the world, but actually don’t have a ****ing clue.
4. The terminally thick who believe everything in the Daily Mail and think the 1950s are some kind of ideal. Evaluation = thick as pig shit but difficult to blame as to be culpable you need to have some kind of thoughts. These people are incapable of any kind of critical thought.
And that’s about it. You either need to be cynical, unhinged, greedy, racist, xenophobic or downright thick to support Brexit now. Of course various combinations of the above are permissible.
Just to add to number 2 above. If the Tories are ousted when Brexit proves to be a monumental mistake, watch the number of MPs who have just lost their seat who take up senior positions, or non exec directorships, or paid ‘advisory roles’ with the firms that stand to benefit.
I see one of the ex-leaders of UKIP is now putting the case for an English Independence referendum, ie out of the EU and the UK, and leave the rump of the UK as Scotland, NI, and maybe Wales.
Whats that, how much do you need? What do you want?
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/28/pm-accused-brexit-deal-desperation-john-redwood-honour
I've been reading through some fairly inspirational people who have dome things to help and inspire people being recognised in the honours list but that one stinks.
Why those migrants are still trying to enter the UK?
I thought there would be a stop to illegal immigration with Brexit.
I see one of the ex-leaders of UKIP is now putting the case for an English Independence referendum, ie out of the EU and the UK, and leave the rump of the UK as Scotland, NI, and maybe Wales.
I found this article in the Express. It made little sense so I checked her comments on Facebook. She literally cannot string 2 coherent sentences together. Her posts come across as if she is drunk.
There is a stop to illegal immigration now, that is why they are being stopped. Nothing to do with Brexit but the Brexiters probably try and link it in somehow due to the inherent issue with anything not 100% British.
How are you going to stop illegal immigration?
Another Brexshitters deluded fantasy.
This guy seems to be type 1and 2 from above. Shameful
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/28/crispin-odey-hedge-fund-bets-against-uk-economy-brexit-profit-falls?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
He's another John Redwood.
How are you going to stop illegal immigration?
Good border controls, detailing who has come into the country and why. If they have not checked back out of the country then go find them and kick them out. Would cost a lot of money to do it properly for very little gain (but as you say would be a Brexiters wet dream)
epicyclo
Subscriber
I see one of the ex-leaders of UKIP is now putting the case for an English Independence referendum, ie out of the EU and the UK, and leave the rump of the UK as Scotland, NI, and maybe Wales.
To be fair, she's the same one that said they'd solve the national debt overnight by printing loads of money, and when asked about the inflation impact asked the interviewer "Would there be any impacts? We'd have to look into that"
And crazily she is still and elected MEP.
When I phoned them up, UKIP had never heard of the 30% tax on chocolate that the WTO would impose on us.
They agreed it was unfair and said they would look into it.
As yet they've not called me back.
Crispin Odey's name must be where the work odious comes from. And the ****'s been photographed wearing a poppy, these guys are the true patriots
Crispin Odey’s name must be where the work odious comes from.
Yeah, but it’s not all bad. I mean, look at the fat bastard. The irony would be if he pegged it just when he decided to jack in the insider trading and was about to spend all his dosh. Sometimes you just have to place all your trust in karma.
dannyh
...Sometimes you just have to place all your trust in karma.
Like the Tory MP who voted to remove Legal Aid support for unfounded allegations, and has now had to sell his business and spend all his life savings defending himself against unfounded allegations.
He has seen the light he says... "It's unfair"
We say Karma 🙂
haha - the disgraced Dr Fox is trying his hand at project fear 🙂
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46713498
I thought the two mmmh what was it 47m ish each to the two euro ferry companies was quite funny.
They still don’t get it though it’s more than just getting more ferries.
haha – the disgraced Dr Fox is trying his hand at project fear
Pretty shit attempt really. 50/50 chance of no Brexit also means 50/50 for No Deal, thus enticing both ERG loons and remainers to vote down the deal, with both having a 50% chance of getting what they actually want.
haha – the disgraced Dr Fox is trying his hand at project fear 🙂
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46713498
/blockquote>Hard to keep up with them from ‘no deals better than a bad deal’ to now we’ve got to the bad deal or no Brexit.
They still don’t get it though it’s more than just getting more ferries
The bottleneck isn't going to be ferries, it's going to be customs officials to process everything.
it’s going to be customs officials to process everything.
Won't they need training?
Or will all the potential extra staff just pick it up as they go?
Can't remember the source now, but I read something the other day which posited that a 2 minute delay at customs will result in a 20 mile tailback inside the first day.
Won’t they need training?
Or will all the potential extra staff just pick it up as they go?
12-18 months, apparently, according to a bloke who runs one of the customs firms.
Presumably we started recruiting around Christmas 2017, so we should be fine.
Christmas family chats have revealed a group slightly further to the right of the ERG, a group that feels that no deal doesn’t go far enough, and that we should repeal any law made by ‘unelected EU beauocrats’ as ‘they all hate us, because we’ve fought wars against pretty much all of them over the years’ and bring back things that ‘everyone wants’ such as the death penalty. Because Ian Huntley. This isn’t one mad old fool either, I’ve never felt more embarrassed by the views of a parent & stepparent....
we should repeal any law made by ‘unelected EU beauocrats’
That shouldn't take long, as the number of laws made by unelected bureaucrats is "none."
Also, we haven't fought any wars against other European countries in my lifetime. I wonder why that might be...
Ignorance really is our greatest enemy here, isn't it.
All this was explained. What I also found out was that the Labour Party are all Marxists, I haven’t lived through a labour government and all the Tory party do is fix all the problems caused by labour ruining the country.
My dad has also joined the Tory party, as he was hoping for a leadership challenge, an wanted to put in a JRM or equally vile snake in as ‘it would be a start’
(This is also the man who admires Donald Trump as a president as ‘he delivers on promises’
I almost knocked myself out my eyes rolled that hard. It’s as if he just blindly reads and believes any right wing news outlet)
Can’t remember the source now, but I read something the other day which posited that a 2 minute delay at customs will result in a 20 mile tailback inside the first day.
That would be the advert that the Port of Dover paid to display at the Tory party conference earlier in the year... and despite this the ferry contracts have just been awarded as an "extreme urgency" that was "unforseeable"
https://www.kentlive.news/news/kent-news/port-dover-just-trolled-tory-561681?
Page 1415, what a great date in English history...along with 1966 and now 2016; now where can I find the sarcasm emoji???
I look forward to the thread getting to 1815.
1066 the overlords took over
1966 we won the world
2016 we won independence
Shits happening faster....
So by 2026 we might have left the EU
And by 2066 we will be back in...
1066 the overlords took over
1966 we won the world
2016 we won independence
What? We're getting rid of the Normans? Coming over here with their noblesse oblige...
<Picks up pitchfork and heads for Roger de Courcey's house>
Have we done Seaborne yet?
They don't even have ships yet!
Ignoring the fact that they don't have any ships, but expect they're going to have to hire a few 'foreigners' to crew those ships...but needs must.
The fact this Government can just spunk millions of quid on something that might never be used defies belief
Ahhh Brexit opportunities:-)
The fact this Government can just spunk millions of quid on something that might never be used defies belief
Look at the money spent on consultants and the turnover of staff at DEXEU I’d brace yourself on defying belief this isn’t over yet.
Anyone setting up a Customs training University yet ?
The fact this Government can just spunk millions of quid on something that might never be used defies belief
Don’t stop there, though. Look at the companies and individuals to whom the millions are spunked. Then watch carefully who ends up working as paid advisors and lobbyists for those companies at a later date.
Follow the money.
That would be the advert that the Port of Dover paid to display at the Tory party conference earlier in the year…
One interesting point I hadn't realised from that. If Dover goes titsup.com then the ROI - an EU member state - is utterly boned. Is the EU27 doing anything to replace trade routes with anything direct to Ireland?
No problem, the Brittany farmers can just take their ferries off the Portsmouth crossings and send them Ireland instead. 🙂
Seabourne Freight shares the same registered Address, 59 Mansell Street, as the Maritime Law firm Campbell Johnson Clark whose Director is called Mark Bamford. I wonder if Mark could be related to Anthony Bamford of JCB, the largest Tory donor?
. I wonder if Mark could be related to Anthony Bamford of JCB, the largest Tory donor?
Well they are definitely brothers, but can't find a link to seabourne. Would it surprise me..absolutely not..
Would love to know if there was a link between the two
it’s going to be customs officials to process everything.
They clearly won't be able to handle it so will just wave everything through or continue with whatever is done now. The stuff coming in is still the same stuff and if it isn't really checked now why would you need to start checking it?
The stuff coming in is still the same stuff and if it isn’t really checked now why would you need to start checking it?
Because under WTO we have to demonstrate we control our borders. Alternatively, we'll be so desperate we'll just wave through all containers marked as "tariff-free essential goods" when in fact they'll be full of counterfeit cigarettes or drugs. Organised crime bosses much be rubbing their hands in anticipation....
Expect spam containers of healthy spam and carnation milk
Follow the money.
Brexit is the heist of a lifetime. And it is actually enabled by the people who are going to be screwed over the most. It would be funny in any other context.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-bamford-72391a99/
You sure about the Bamford connection? Too young?
The Bamford connection would make sense. Why else would the government give nearly £14 million to a company less than 2 years old, with no ships, staff and a port needing to be dredged before trans shipping can commence?
Edit: From the inside track of Customs Officer training. They are increasing class sizes and everyone who has ever taught in the past is back in the classroom. Target is 300 extra trainees per quarter for the foreseeable.
A bit of digging tells me it's not the same mark bamford
The stuff coming in is still the same stuff and if it isn’t really checked now why would you need to start checking it?
Do you really need help with this?
Do you understand why we have a customs union, common external tariffs and trade policy, single market etc? Find out what they are all for, and what they enable, please. You've had two ________ years now!
Look into the additional paperwork* required as a starting point, and ask who will be checking it and where.
[ *not only in the literal sense - digital submissions are not magic performed by robots - cameras do not do perform the same task as customs officials ]