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Sssh
It's only for loyal members of the British resistance - we don't want the Brexies to know.
The whole Gib/Falklands thing cracks me up..
What's left of the "British Empire" is going to get broken up & there'll be FA the Brexit Brigade will be able to do about it.
So much for Rule Britannia.
So much for making Britain great again.
You've been well & truly stitched up!
tbh gibraltar is a strategic[military] interest so wont be given up
The falklands are too political to be given up but they are clearly "stolen lands" that hark back to our empire days
We have no moral claim to the territories but that is irrelevant here we wont be giving them up whatever anyones personal view is on the issue
Quite savvy of the EU to unite and support a member on this issue though and show solidarity now they can take sides.
You mean the unihabited islands that a bunch of colonisers are claiming we stole?
If anything, we stole Gubraltar.
We stole half the planet and paid for the munitions we needed to do it by drug running and slave trading.
are you starting to have a plan for us now then 😉
that plan only works once.
sbob - Member
tjagain - Membersbob - but we need the EU much much more than they need us!
You're still making the same mistake of treating the EU as a single entity, which it is not.
I'm not sure how to make my point any clearer, other than reminding you that we are the EU
Woosh - the point you don't want to recognise is that for trade purposes the EU is a single entity. leavers keepo saying " the Germans need to sell their cars to us, they will want to make a deal.
This is bollox - no single country in the EU can make trade deals. Its on an EU wide basis
Hence for trade purposes its both sensible and right to refer to the EU as a single entity
No good for me. With my addictive personality I need to stay well clear of certain things.
Gibraltar.
Back to now that's what I call Brexit with Simon & Garfunkel I think "it's is a rock, we are an island..."
Gibraltar is easy, they can go independent
The real weakness with the "they need to sell us BMWs" argument is that you can't eat them. We import most of our food from the EU...full tummies are about to get a whole lot dearer!
If Gibraltar can go imdependent, can it then be in the EU? Asking for friends up North.
German car manufacturers are the red herring that keeps giving.
The Leave politicians that keep leaning on that stick don't really believe they are key to a deal.
Leave fanatics keep referring to it without understanding that it's just another bluff by people who want to pretend things are simpler than they really are.
we've always imported most of our food though
we've always imported most of our food though
That makes now the perfect time to antagonise our trading partners.
[quote=chickenman said]The real weakness with the "they need to sell us BMWs" argument is that you can't eat them. We import most of our food from the EU...full tummies are about to get a whole lot dearer!
Not sure I follow. We import BMWs and we import food. But food will cost us more ? Will BMWs also cost more ?
yes but we can do without BMWs.
[quote=mattjg said]yes but we can do without BMWs.
You're clearly not middle management.
wont somebody think of the Audis?
It's also possible food import volumes will rise if the farmers can't get affordable labour and have to switch to intensive automatable crops like wheat.
We currently import ~40% of the food we consume, although this is rising year on year. Much of this is fresh produce, particularly during winter. We could be self sufficient for cereals/potato if required but not much beyond Cabbage after that. But only if we stop building houses on our agricultural land.
It's funny the Germans loaned Greece the money they needed to practically bankrupt themselves in order to keep buying imported goods, remind me again who needs who?
Despite the posturing from various Euro states that have had their noses put out of joint by the Brexit referendum they still need a strong economy like ours to buy their stuff, tin pot economies like Greece can't do it anymore and as is constantly pointed out but seemingly ignored the UK is a net contributor....deep down other Euro nations must be crapping themselves about where the extra money is going to come from once the UK leaves....Portugal?, Spain with its 25% youth unemployment?.....near bankrupt Greece, maybe that bastion of honest and non corrupt Italy will cough up the missing billions!? Lol.
This is why the EU is pushing for a 'divorce settlement'....they want the UK's money to keep coming in even though we're leaving. If anyone needed an example of the greedy, self serving and corrupt organisation that the EU has become its that farcical idea of seemingly compensating the remaining EU countries for daring to leave.....maybe if their economies performed better they wouldn't be making such stupid demands.
If I was May I'd also get together with Trump and threaten to withdraw UK and US troops from Germany and leave that country open to Putins expansion plans....let's see how much grand standing from Merkel then.
Whether the EU likes it or not the UK army trounces any of the pissy little individual EU nation armies, they need our firepower more than we need Italy's joke of an army for example.
While I'm in belligerent mood so what if Brexit slows rampant consumerism and materialism, not a bad thing in my book....let's also threaten WTO tariffs should the EU show it's true petty colours and then the UK can screw French farming in the process, bedlam on the continent and a resurgence in UK farming, they are many positives to this.
If we were a drain in the EU they'd have probably cut us loose already but they know the billions we pump into the corrupt project, the security we provide at the Russian border and how our imports support continental farmers....stuff them, threaten to take it all back, no ridiculous 'divorce' settlement (i mean really that tells you everything you need to know about the circus that is Brussels) and lets see resurgent British agriculture, trade deals with emerging Asian, Brazilian and Indian economies without EU interference and just get on with things.
The doom mongers are becoming really boring, like the worst stuck record, I look forward to Brexit working, the EU realising they can't impose any fines/divorce settlements on a country that isn't part of their little club anymore and doesn't fall under their jurisdiction and the inevitable stamping of feet that will follow.
The EU is showing its true vindictive colours at the moment and I for one can't wait to leave.
I spent time in Australia a few years ago and felt I had more in common with those guys and girls then the French, Germans and Spanish etc over the channel.
What you also have to consider with farming are a few more details,
Diesel, imported, fertiliser imported.
And the biggie.
CAP
about half of farm income is currently CAP, this is being scraped, has to be, that is the £350M going to the NHS....
Also i seem to believe that the WTO is working to scrap all subsidies and as a minor country we won't have anywhere near the clout of the US or EU.
ALOT of farmers are going to go bust. simple economics really.
It's funny the Germans loaned Greece the money they needed to practically bankrupt themselves in order to keep buying imported goods, remind me again who needs who?
Despite the posturing from various Euro states that have had their noses put out of joint by the Brexit referendum they still need a strong economy like ours to buy their stuff, tin pot economies like Greece can't do it anymore and as is constantly pointed out but seemingly ignored the UK is a net contributor....deep down other Euro nations must be crapping themselves about where the extra money is going to come from once the UK leaves....Portugal?, Spain with its 25% youth unemployment?.....near bankrupt Greece, maybe that bastion of honest and non corrupt Italy will cough up the missing billions!? Lol.
This is why the EU is pushing for a 'divorce settlement'....they want the UK's money to keep coming in even though we're leaving. If anyone needed an example of the greedy, self serving and corrupt organisation that the EU has become its that farcical idea of seemingly compensating the remaining EU countries for daring to leave.....maybe if their economies performed better they wouldn't be making such stupid demands.
If I was May I'd also get together with Trump and threaten to withdraw UK and US troops from Germany and leave that country open to Putins expansion plans....let's see how much grand standing from Merkel then.
Whether the EU likes it or not the UK army trounces any of the pissy little individual EU nation armies, they need our firepower more than we need Italy's joke of an army for example.
While I'm in belligerent mood so what if Brexit slows rampant consumerism and materialism, not a bad thing in my book....let's also threaten WTO tariffs should the EU show it's true petty colours and then the UK can screw French farming in the process, bedlam on the continent and a resurgence in UK farming, they are many positives to this.
If we were a drain in the EU they'd have probably cut us loose already but they know the billions we pump into the corrupt project, the security we provide at the Russian border and how our imports support continental farmers....stuff them, threaten to take it all back, no ridiculous 'divorce' settlement (i mean really that tells you everything you need to know about the circus that is Brussels) and lets see resurgent British agriculture, trade deals with emerging Asian, Brazilian and Indian economies without EU interference and just get on with things.
The doom mongers are becoming really boring, like the worst stuck record, I look forward to Brexit working, the EU realising they can't impose any fines/divorce settlements on a country that isn't part of their little club anymore and doesn't fall under their jurisdiction and the inevitable stamping of feet that will follow.
The EU is showing its true vindictive colours at the moment and I for one can't wait to leave.
I spent time in Australia a few years ago and felt I had more in common with those guys and girls then the French, Germans and Spanish etc over the channel.
Right............I presume this is satire?
If I was May I'd also get together with Trump and threaten to withdraw UK and US troops from Germany and leave that country open to Putins expansion plans....let's see how much grand standing from Merkel then.
You're going to get a right grilling - but here Deviant - I think you're right. The rhetoric coming out the EU hasn't been good either, Spain is an unreliable Nato ally who supports the Argies and is going to hold us to ransom over Gibraltar. France and Germany will do practically anything to try to carpet bag the financial industry...etc etc etc.
As a remainer, I think we're need to get properly ****ing nasty with the continent if we're going to make this work. I don't see what the issue was with threatening them over intelligence sharing etc, sod them - let them know that we'll give no quarter - even if that means cutting our hands off to spite our faces.
Deviant, as the EU have said, Brexit is a no win situation.
your point about spain, i could counter less than half the UK population is currently in work. So more people by a big margin are benefit recipients than net tax payers.
Not a very good situation to be in and with the current political climate going to get worse.
The EU is showing its true vindictive colours at the moment and I for one can't wait to leave.
I spent time in Australia a few years ago and felt I had more in common with those guys and girls then the French, Germans and Spanish etc over the channel.
Perhaps you did but pragmatically they're the other side of the world not a 90 minute ship ride away.
tom_w1987, where is the current french english border? Think about why the refugee camps were in sangatte and Dunkirk.
Consider what happens if french customs decide to impose controls. because they can?
It really is a no win game.
Something else to consider we lost the cod war because the US sided with Iceland. Don't look to others to dig you out of this hole.
even if that means cutting our hands off to spite our faces
So there is a plan!
ps our Army is really that strong? All we ever hear is numbers are being cut and the kit is ancient.
Popped into Sainsburys earlier, for the first time in a few weeks, some serious price hikes!
Basics chocolate 30p to 50p
1kg palm oil free peanut butter ~£5 to £6.80
Malties ~£1.40 to £1.80
Gold Blend 150g refill £4 to £4.50
I need another pay rise on top of the planned pay rise to cover this! It's no coincidence I've been using Co Op and Lidl more recently, but even their prices are going up.
Something else to consider we lost the cod war because the US sided with Iceland. Don't look to others to dig you out of this hole.
I didn't dig this hole - I voted remain.
But if my economy is going to get torched because of this, I want to see the EU's economy and security getting torched as well.
Walking away from NATO would be an entertaining start.
Right............I presume this is satire?
Even if it is, a huge section of the UK population thinks this way. Sadly.
[i]If Gibraltar can go imdependent, can it then be in the EU? Asking for friends up North.[/I]
Only if it's through a constitutional/democratic process, so they can't just UDI. The reason why Scotland is asking Westminster for the right to hold a referendum.
If either UDI'd then the EU (nor UN) wouldn't support them.
Popped into Sainsburys earlier, for the first time in a few weeks, some serious price hikes!
Too bloody right the coffee I buy has gone from £3.50 to £3.75!
But if my economy is going to get torched because of this, I want to see the EU's economy and security getting torched as well.
So your response to "us" telling the EU to get stuffed is to try and hurt them? 😐
We are torching our own economy. The EU are protecting the interests of the countries that value the EU. It ain't rocket science.
ps our Army is really that strong? All we ever hear is numbers are being cut and the kit is ancient.
And we start entering the realms of why the **** the EU was set up. To stop european countries going to war!
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Do we really want to be this ****ing stupid AGAIN!!!!!!
Gibraltar is easy, they can go independent
We made a huge mistake in not following the French example years ago by making the overseas territories like the Falklands, Acesnsion, Bermuda, BIOT etc. into integral [i]departments[/i] of the UK.
So your response to "us" telling the EU to get stuffed is to try and hurt them?
Well, it would seem that is the EU's response as well. I'm quite happy to admit that telling us that we can't be in the single market is fair play - but some of the other stuff coming out the continent raises an eyebrow.
The EU are protecting the interests of the countries that value the EU.
No, they've been far too confrontational - if they wanted to protect their interests this would be done quietly with the least amount of pain for everyone, it doesn't seem that it will - as other member countries are lining up to see how they can personally gain economically and geopolitically out of this.
On Gibraltar, we handed Hong Kong back because it suited.
Do we really want to be this ****ing stupid AGAIN!!!!!!
Very significant reason for voting remain IMO. Seventy years of uninterrupted peace in western Europe, it's never happened before.
[i]German car manufacturers are the red herring that keeps giving.[/I]
+1
We've a BMW and a Land Rover (both top spec's), I'm pretty sure we'd buy both again in the future and accept whatever the price is, if we wanted to save money (and didn't care what we drove) we'd no doubt run around in 7-year warranties (Kia's etc).
IME all cars will be impacted by Brexit due to import/export of either the full car or a large percentage of their components nevermind the base metals - it's a long time since we've mined iron ore in any quantities (although we've plenty of deposits) and bauxite has pretty much always been 100% imported for example.
Gibraltar is a very interesting issue in that there is an overwhelming majority for staying in the Eu and for remaining a UK dependency ( is that is legal status) so thats very hard to unpick
As for all the nonsense about the EU needing the UK - yes they do but to nothing like the extent of the other way round and there is no way on earth the EU are going to allow free trade from a UK which can undercut them with lower employment rights etc.
Verhofstadt:
“Twenty million people have died because of nationalism in Europe,” he told his audience at Chatham House.
“There is not one family living on the continent and certainly not in Britain who has no grandfather, grandmother, who was not a victim of these stupidities, these atrocities at the end of the 19th and the whole 20th century.
“Putting your future organisation of Europe on nationalist ideas is the most stupid thing you can do. It’s playing with fire knowing what it has created in the past.”
I agree with Guy. And not Nigel and his nation-state weebling, he's pathetic.
Gibraltar is a funny one though. If you look at it on a map it really looks like a bit of Spain....
Personally I think the end decision should be given to the people of Gibraltar in a "do you want to be a part of Spain, part of whatever remains of the smouldering ruins of the UK or 50:50 split". Seems the only fair and reasonable thing to do (with some kind of av set up and a minimum threshold).