Brexit on track
You have got to be kidding me.
If A50 is not triggered by the end of March then I'll agree with you molgrips. Otherwise on track. Happy Days.
Brexit on track
You have got to be kidding me.
No, it is on track,
You have got to be kidding me.
He just means on track to happen.
For a believer, it doesn't have to go well, just happen.
Some truth in that (first part) but I am good with a quick clean exit and WTO rules to allow us to crack on with focusing our economy globally. A bit of a short sharp shock. Worst outcome would be some buggars muddle transition bollix.
@mrmo, enjoyed that. Quite a good metaphor really, lots of hysterical screaming but it's all OK in the end 🙂
Quite a good metaphor really, lots of hysterical screaming but it's all OK in the end
Sadly the brexies aren't in possession of a realistic plan, let alone a flux capacitor 🙁
Vince Cable writes about his opposition to freedom of movement
But I have serious doubts that EU free movement is tenable or even desirable. First, the freedom is not a universal right, but selective. It does not apply to Indians, Jamaicans, Americans or Australians. They face complex and often harsh visa restrictions. [b]One uncomfortable feature of the referendum was the large Brexit vote among British Asians, many of whom resented the contrast between the restrictions they face and the welcome mat laid out for Poles and Romanians[/b].
A point I have made a few times re my Indian relatives
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2017/01/why-its-time-end-eu-free-movement
[quote=jambalaya ]@mrmo, enjoyed that. Quite a good metaphor really, lots of hysterical screaming but it's all OK in the end
This is more like how Brexit is on track then:
It does not apply to Indians, Jamaicans, Americans or Australians. They face complex and often harsh visa restrictions
Now everyone will face complex and often harsh restrictions. Wins for everyone.
And yes brexit is on course which has is why the pm is fighting in the courts to avoid asking Parliament to approve a 50 if she was confident in the numbers there would be no need.
mikewsmith - MemberNow everyone will face complex and often harsh restrictions. Wins for everyone.
Exactly this. The government is promising to make it harder for absolutely everyone. It's a classic bit of Cameronian "fairness"- we're going to shit on you every day but that's Fair because we're shitting on everyone else too. And you're supposed to go, ah well fair dos, you only used to shit on us once a year but that annoyed us because you didn't shit on that guy over there at all. Now that you're shitting on both of us every day we're really happy!
And as pointed out repeatedly the people who voted out don't like immigration. They want it reduced.
Vince does realise that Jam, US and Aus are not members of the single market doesn't he?
Agree with Jamba on one point, we can only determine whether Brexshit is on track at states deadlines. Looks like May will hit March despite everything which is no mean achievement for a remainer like her!
Jamba, a third and last attempt. Please can you explain how this WTO thing works so that I can feel happy that it's nice an easy to crack on with going global. I am a tad worried that it might not be straightforward. Thanks
Why do you need Jamba to tell you WTO isn't going to be straightforward, don't you believe everyone else who tells you it isn't going to be?
WTO seems to work just fine for the US and China trading with EU, no ? No tariffs on services btw. Have said this repeatedly.
Mike it should be difficult to get into a rich successful country like the UK, it's difficult to get into US, Australia etc. My understanding the Aussie system is in practical terms you can get approval to go to say Perth/WA (where Australians don't want to go) but not Sydney/NSW which is almost impossible to get approval for.
As the Cambridge report points out along with many others freedom of movement always presented stresses to the EU which multiplied enormously with it's expansion Eastwards. In the final analysis that has been one of the major factors in our exit.
Worst outcome would be some buggars muddle transition bollix.
Worst outcome would be thousands lose their jobs, the roofs over their heads etc.
WTO seems to work just fine for the US and China trading with EU, no ?
It works but not fine? China and US are not proper comparables to the UK/EU unless of course your advocating we should transition and mirror those countries.
So what if thousands of people are forced out if jobs? They will be able to do what we did in the good old days which is go and work on a German building site.
Oh , erm , well maybe not.
Also really glad to see the price of petrol going up. Don't forget every penny on a litre (soon to be good old gallons again) is a penny in the Freedom Bank.
Worst outcome would be some buggars muddle transition bollix.
Really because your vaunted Cambridge report assumed a transition deal and full (non WTO) trade deal so we'd only loose 2% of GDP
Which bits of the report is it ok to selectively quote and which do we ignore?
Jambalaya's view of the world no doubt. From this weeks New Yorker.
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i'm confused i thought brexit meant better trading relations with non eu nations 😕
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Chinese financiers told the newspaper that a scheme to link the London and Shanghai stock exchanges had "lost momentum".
seems being outside the eu doesn't appeal to the Chinese.
Now he can answer back 🙂
Everyone needs to read this, from the FT.
[url= https://www.ft.com/content/ef13e61a-ccec-11e6-b8ce-b9c03770f8b1 ]The Long And Painful Journey To World Disorder[/url]
The link may not work, in which case Google "Martin Wolf: The long and painful journey to world disorder" and you should be able to read it...
Proper bigger picture stuff. Problem with a lot of Leave voters I think is by definition they're very parochial in their views of the world - they really don't have that broader understanding of politics, history and economics which has led to them feeling the way they do, and hence they've been easily manipulated into believing that leaving the EU will solve all the problems they feel they have. I think a lot of the problems they identify (inequality, slow economic growth, distant elite) are real problems and they're right to shout about them - but they've utterly missed the causation of them and been led into believing the EU is the problem when in fact it's the confluence of far bigger and broader trends... Personally I think Brexit or not, UK is in for a lost generation of slow growth and falling living standards... none of this 'lost decade' nonsense - more like 30+ years...
I'm thinking of emigrating as current UK leadership (Tory and Labour) seems unable to grasp the depth and breadth of the issue and is pandering to their own base and a fearful, tantrumy electorate... which isn't quite what we need in a crisis
Mike it should be difficult to get into a rich successful country like the UK, it's difficult to get into US, Australia etc.
An argument not without merit.
What's that got to do with us leaving the EU?
Bigger picture stuff that focuses on the negatives and ignores the positives Brooess.
[url= https://archive.is/vpKqE ]Link without a pay wall.[/url]
One country wants to leave Europe but that's not much to a community that's gone from 6 to 27. The cold war goes on but is cooler than at almost any point in my lifetime. Proxy wars go on but with both camps on more or less the same side even if one is with the Kurds and the other with Basha. Population is the real problem and is most visible in places where population has outstripped resources.
Anyhow, where do you want to emigrate to? It worked for me, erhaps because I was so positive about where I was going rather than negative about where I was leaving.
Brexit : Chinese official said : "UK is the door to European markets. With no access to Single Market It's just a door"
Go Brexit..
Nipper99 - Member
Brexit : Chinese official said : "UK is the door to European markets. With no access to Single Market It's just a door"Go Brexit..
Wasn't this the reason that Nissan came in the first place?
If we're lucky they'll take a few of their staff when they go and and help with the immigration figures too. 😛
Edukator thnaks for no paywall access. Brooes yes big picture stuff, all maybes etc. Is what I would say. A bit ironic he calls Trump protectionist as that tag could not be more apt for the EU
The countries in difficulty were put in more difficulty because of Germany's refusal to fund debt with Eurobonds in the same was as the Fed funds states in difficulty with money at low interset rates.
The countries where in trouble on their own with a dollop of help from the misconceived euro. Germany is not stupid, the euro is misconceived so issuing bonds which ultimately it wouod be responsible for backing makes absolutely no sense what so ever. In fact it would be financial suicide. The US is one big country. The EU should not have introduced the euro until it was one big superstate.
Nipper if we want the country and lifestyle I think we all share we cannot be in the EU IMO
I am a bit confused about China posters, I thought they where the arch enemy and Osbourne was Satan for wanting to encourage investment from them ? Personally I am good with limited Chinese investment and continued tariffs, maybe even higher than currently on various items.
May will be interviewed on Sky News tomorrow at 10, good news is that it will be freely available online and on replay links.
Interesting post on reddit this evening about the 'bubbles' issue and the worlds we all inhabit: cut and paste alert, but I think this is absolutely key in understanding the divisions (voting and others) in the UK-
"This isn't by any means a summary of the entire issue but it is a key point that I don't see get the attention it deserves.
For the most part, Leavers and Remainers don't interact with the same Europeans. This is an absolutely crucial point.
If you live in London or Bristol or somewhere similar then most of the EU immigrants you've met are probably some combination of educated, affluent, working professionals (and lets face it mostly Western/Northern Europeans). I'm a scientist so my European friends are more intelligent and harder working than most of my English friends. Partially on the basis of this I voted remain.
But if I lived in an ex-industrial town up north and all the EU immigrants I'd ever encountered were low-skill labourers from Eastern Europe who could barely speak English and had moved in to replace the friendly English family who used to live next door, maybe I would have a different perception. It would seem like an invasion of people who didn't share my culture. Voting Leave would have been the easy and obvious choice.
So if you (like me) are still a bitter remoaner, try and bear in mind that other peoples interaction with Europeans may not be the same as yours."
Interesting insight. 2 worlds, almost touching each other.
[I]Wasn't this the reason that Nissan came in the first place?[/I]
Its the reason most internationals base themselves in the UK when they want to have a crack at Europe. Also don't forget both Honda and Toyota plants:
Vehicles per annum
Honda - 122k
Nissan - 500k
Toyota - 172k
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_the_United_Kingdom#2011_to_present
So if you (like me) are still a bitter remoaner, try and bear in mind that other peoples interaction with Europeans may not be the same as yours."Interesting insight. 2 worlds, almost touching each other.
Then there is the 3rd bubble where they don't actually interact with any but believe what Mail/Express etc. are pumping out about crisis this/takeover that etc. The immigration issue is over inflated by those who want to make it an issue.
and while Australian immigration is once again being help up here is a sample of the updated citizenship test 😉
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-01-08/take-the-new-improved-australian-citizenship-test/8165646
Germany is not stupid,
In which case it is simply a bad partner. The EZ needs surpluses to be re-circulated if it is to work. That's basic. Germany remains in denial over this and the fact that creditors also have to take haircuts for making bad decisions. Blaming periphery countries is disingenuous. Germany is as much to blame for the failure of the EZ as the PIIGS
On Reddit piece which I think is illuminative I would add that the majority of my international colleagues are global, in fact very few are European. My primary interaction with Europeans work wise would be at the cleaner/ au pair end of the spectrum. Most of the colleagues I worked with at German Banks where not German or even European.
Germany is as much to blame for the failure of the EZ as the PIIGS
Perhaps more so ? They designed it, they ignored what was happening in Greece. They set the behavoural standard when they fiddled their own figures so they could join ! etc look who just got the big sub-prime fine Deutsche, the Lanesbanks stuffed full of it via CDOs ... Where was the Bundesbank / BaFin ?
Remind me again, are we in the EZ?
Most of the colleagues I worked with at German Banks where not German or even European.
Odd, the people I worked with in European Banks, from director down, were European. One of those being Deutsche Bank, another PNB Paribas to name but two.
Yet more experts
Why do these agreements take so long? The last generation of trade agreements was focused mainly on removing tariffs. Multilaterally, the single biggest recent event at the increasingly ineffectual World Trade Organisation has not been the conclusion of a successful round, but, rather, China’s accession in 2001. The next generation of bilateral agreements, of which Ceta is the template, is complex. They reflect the realities of modern commerce and go beyond trade, touching upon behind-the-border issues such as standards, regulation and opening government contracts to competitive bidding. This complexity means that the deals take years to negotiate and conclude. In our amped up media environment, there are special interests making noise at each step in the process, ensuring that trade and investment deals are a marathon, not a sprint.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/08/trade-negotiator-shocked-at-brexiters-ignorance
Very nice summary really and should be compulsory reading for the brexiters as to the tough road ahead.
jambalaya - Member
May will be interviewed on Sky News tomorrow at 10, good news is that it will be freely available online and on replay links.
I do hope everyone is taking notes from TM's interview because if her bit in the telegraph is anything to go by it won't take long
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/07/determined-build-shared-society-everyone/
Zero substance, zero plans, zero how and a lot of should. Talking the good talk about making things better but not really saying anything about how.
She really is quite vacuous
Is no longer Big Society, but Shared Society
Vague promises of a better tomorrow with 0 substance, nothing changes
May is coming across like an employee st a large multinational I contracted at once, very good at been an employee (very political and very important to be seen to do/say the right thing) but hopeless at actually getting anything done - so work was done by contractors and 3rd parties.
I can't even imagine she believes herself.
On that Reddit piece, in Castleford (a northern(ish) English town) where I work I met a number of Poles (Eastern Europeans I think). They came across as hard working and customer aware. Perhaps not the values of the local population (actually to a large extent I think they are) but they blinking well should be.
Good people.
Vague promises of a better tomorrow with 0 substance, nothing changes
Remind me of the opinion polls and who is in Government ? Plenty of things are changing and the Tories are getting further ahead every day as a result
Remind me of the opinion polls and who is in Government ? Plenty of things are changing and the Tories are getting further ahead every day as a result
You seem to be a bit confused about this democracy thing. Voting and polls don't actually do anything. You can vote for the Sun to rise in the west but that won't make it happen. The whole country can express a preference for May, but she still has no plan.
You dont like them and think they should be ignored as they are always wrongRemind me of the opinion polls
Is that what you needed reminding off or do you not even want to have one thing - beyond Muslim bashing- that you say and hold consistently?
- so work was done by contractors and 3rd parties.
This is how Britain has worked since the. 90s
if we want the country and lifestyle I think we all share we cannot be in the EU IMO
What country and lifestyle do you want which the EU is precluding?
