[Closed] EU Referendum - are you in or out?

This is a confusing develpopment [url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38224169 ]mp vote tomorrow[/url]

Am I right in thinking MPs are going to have to basicaly promise to pass A50 in parlement when the time comes, in return for being given May's brexit plan, but the Government "would not confirm any specific form of document on any specific timetable to fit with the commitment to publish a Brexit plan, apart from saying that it will be before Article 50."

So wheres the motivation for MPs to go along with that? 😕

Big climbdown from May tho. Nice to see. I think she has realised that she is going to lose the appeal

Labour just want to be seen to have acheived "something"', so this empty gesture suits both sides, and lets things carry on just as they are…

Oh, there are Labour and Tory MPs, of both Leave and Remain persuasion, that want parliament to do its job, but the leadership on both sides want Brexit sorted as quietly and "apolitically" as possible behind the scenes, with MPs kept out of it.

At least it seems like our Prime Minister is getting down to the detail of the Brexit, it's going to be red, white and blue

(Fighting the urge to make a misogynistic joke about women being more interested in the colour than what is under the bonnet...)

GrahamS - Member

Very simple we ask them to break their own rules because it is all about money.

Right.

So if that was an option... why didn't we do it ourselves when we were part of the EU?

Negotiate within EU? Are you trying the line " ... to be in the club in order to change the club rule ..." ... Again? 😯

UK have been having weak leaders for sometime now so very weak that they dare not even give the people a referendum until ex-PM Cameron, who had no choice because the EU ZMs got extremely arrogance sensing the weak UK govt went for hammering the UK PM but guess what, the people come to the rescue of the ex-PM or the New PM by sticking two fingers up to the EU ZMs.

Most UK leaders and their cronies of career political elites do not have the guts rock their own career boat ... in a way UK was slowly rotting away tbh.

Life has been too good for the politicians and their supporters but nobody gives a flying pigs except blindly complying with the EU ZMs.

Labour just want to be seen to have acheived "something"', so this empty gesture suits both sides, and lets things carry on just as they are…

Indeed.

Hats off the Giv lawyer for making the best of a very bad job today. With a lawyer son, its been quite an interesting afternoon of stuff to debate suprisingly. Cant see the appeal winning, but some clever, if flawed, arguments. Smart guys.

Negotiate within EU? Are you trying the line " ... to be in the club in order to change the club rule ..." ... Again?

No, I am futilely trying to make some sense of what you are saying.

You are claiming that other EU countries will happily break EU rules for the chance to have an individual trade deal with the UK. Yes?

And there is nothing the EU can do to stop them. Yes?

All I am asking you is this: if these rules are so easily broken, without any punishment, then why didn't we just do [i]that[/i] ourselves, instead of leaving the EU?

in a way UK was slowly rotting away tbh

Was it?

[img] [/img]
([url= http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.PCAP.PP.CD?locations=GB-EU ]Sauce: World Bank[/url])

kelvin - Member
We could be giving away our huge "home market" just as other big markets put up barriers to us.

Nope, does not work that way because opportunities are for everyone.

I have tried rearranging these words, but still can't find any actual meaning in them.

Is it a TMay quote?

Negotiating from within was possible. Once out there will be no negotiation. It'll be a case take it or leave it based on what is acceptable to the necessary number of EU countries to get any agreement at all.

How do you give away your home market? Because you sound like it is one sided affair.

The EU is losing a big chunk of their home market… but they're not giving it away, we're taking it away.
They get to keep 'nearly all' of it though, unlike us.

In reality we would be taking away a small amount from each ofvthe member states whilst losing a comparatively enormous amount...

GrahamS - Member
All I am asking you is this: if these rules are so easily broken, without any punishment, then why didn't we just do that instead of leaving the EU?

The rules are not easily broken from within because of the political inept of the individual nation leaders.

This is because majority of the EU leaders are "infected" by the views that they should look after their own personal political career self interest only. The become the EU ZM "collective drones".

The will to allow change or to risk own political career is simply too much to bear for most of those political leaders. It is much better to bow to the EU ZM rules to justify their own existence and by showing "unity" amongst the EU nations states leader. i.e. everyone is looking at each other for the first move to see what will happen.

Therefore, it will be Impossible to break the rules from within as the EU ZM drones will apply rules blindly and can justify their action whatever that is.

Now that UK is out of the ZM EU club the EU ZM drones are at a lost to apply the EU ZM blind club rules, because UK is not an ordinary small drone like some of them.

The irony is UK have to be out in order to change the predictable reaction of the EU ZM rules.

Bear in mind, many of their own people are not exactly happy with their current arrangement (EU rules on individual states) so let's see which of those EU ZM drones will play the roulette with a Glock.

Playing roulette with Glock. 😆

Above is a post from a crack den in meadowell (part of Newcastle)

ZM Zambia (according to ISO)
ZM Zu Mir (German Command)
ZM Zeitgeist Movement
ZM Zombie Mode (gaming, Counter-Strike)
ZM Zone Message
ZM Zone Marker (VHF Station Location Marker)
ZM Zettameter (10^21, one sextillion)
zM Zeptometer (10^-21, one sextillionth)
ZM Zuhair Murad (Lebanese fashion designer)
ZM Zware Metalen (Dutch: Heavy Metal; music website and forum)
ZM Zone Mixte (French: Mixed Zone; athlete interview area)
ZM ZixMail
ZM Zolid Matters (website)
ZM Zusammenfassende Meldung (German: Summary Report)

ZM, Chewkw?

Not that knowing what ZM means will make anymore sense of your post which resembles the output of a random sentence generator given the inputs of "EU" and a page of some zombie novel.

This is because majority of the EU leaders are "infected" by the views that they should look after their own personal political career self interest only.

The UK does very well at that already without EU influence, lol!

oldmanmtb - Member
Above is a post from a crack den in meadowell (part of Newcastle)

Once again (God knows I keep asking) what exactly are we going to sell the rest of the world- bear on mind my mate Bob is sat waiting for his £36k manufacturing job in Hartlepool and he is already a bit p****d off its not arrived yet, I need all you pro brexit folks to give me a rough cut 5 to 10 year plan that gets Bob a job (no cub scout refs please!) As to be frank the rest is just high brow bollocks by the way Bob has a fork lift truck licence and a city and guilds in Plating... so Jamba Ninfan etc what's the plan....

ZM, Chewkw?

"Zombie Maggot" I believe.

A chewkwism - something about bureaucrats and/or politicians and/or establishment.

Not that knowing what ZM means will make anymore sense of your post which resembles the output of a random sentence generator

He does [i]occasionally[/i] have lucid moments.

I just hope he still recognises his children when they visit. It can't be easy for them.

Once again (God knows I keep asking) what exactly are we going to sell the rest of the world

Tea and Jam, man, come on, do keep up.

*ignoring that most of our sugar, fruit and tea is imported (don't tell Theresa).

I suppose Bob could load it with his forklift...

Edukator - Reformed Troll
ZM, Chewkw?

Not that knowing what ZM means will make anymore sense of your post which resembles the output of a random sentence generator given the inputs of "EU" and a page of some zombie novel.

ZM = Zombie Maggots that can generally equate to brain rot with all the associate symptoms. You will find a lot of such infection in the EU bureaucratic system. 😛

Bear in mind our brain is rotting slowly as we aged just like our body so I am not surprised to see acceleration of brain rot working in the EU bureaucratic system because the thinking bit has been taken out.

mattyfez - Member

This is because majority of the EU leaders are "infected" by the views that they should look after their own personal political career self interest only.

The UK does very well at that already without EU influence, lol!

I know, I know! We already have them clinging onto EU ZM rules so desperately they now try to fight to justify the EU ZM rule set. I mean the rules override the people will. In fact they see the EU ZM rules as an end by itself. Their existence is to justify the rules. 😆

Sorted it was staring me in the face - Bob could take it off one ship and put it on another - would have to open the container to get the stuff out, we are gonna need some Dockers as well
Shit this is shaping up thanks you visionary Brexiteers.....

Jamba Ninfan no need for a plan, me and Mattyfez have it sorted...

Also we could sell coffee to south America, ice to the Eskimos and sand to the Arabs. So much potential in these new and emerging markets once we are freed from the shackles of the EU.

oldmanmtb - Member
Sorted it was staring me in the face - Bob could take it off one ship and put it on another - would have to open the container to get the stuff out, we are gonna need some Dockers as well
Shit this is shaping up thanks you visionary Brexiteers.....

Ya, if Bob sticks around with the current EU ZM system his next generations or descendants or children might even be fighting a revolution against a distance EU ZM system in his own land.

Tell Bob to endure a bit for the good of his next generations if he does not want to see them fighting the EU ZM drones at his doorstep.

Enough of the constant ZM references chewkw. It's really tedious and has got you banned before so change the record.

salad_dodger - Member
Enough of the constant ZM references chewkw. It's really tedious and has got you banned before so change the record.

[b]Are you a remainder or a Brexiteer?[/b] Just want to know so not a trick question.

a distance EU ZM system in his own land.

Fighting distant 'zombie maggots' in our own land. I suppose that's a good point, I don't think anyone wants to fight distant zombie maggots,that are both near and far... quantum trans-dimensional zombie maggots? That's even worse than regular zombie maggots. Ain't nobody got time for that. It would be a most disagreeable predicament.

mattyfez - Member

a distance EU ZM system in his own land.

Fighting distant 'zombie maggots' in our own land. I suppose that's a good point, I don't think anyone wants to fight distant zombie maggots,that are both near and far... quantum trans-dimensional zombie maggots? That's even worse than regular zombie maggots. Ain't nobody got time for that. It would be a most disagreeable predicament.

EU system ... fighting the EU bureaucratic system. i.e. they send their enforcers to you.

So not mutant invertebrates from planet X? Good I was getting worried there, especially if military assistance from our neighbours is unlikely to be forthcoming.

[url= http://www.webmd.com/diabetes/news/20040920/healing-wounds-with-maggots ]http://www.webmd.com/diabetes/news/20040920/healing-wounds-with-maggots[/url]
Maggots appear to be quite useful little buggers.
I couldn't possibly comment on zombies as I've never met one (I don't think they're real either).
So, these useful little buggers than run around Europe, chewkw, what about them?

mattyfez - Member
So not mutant invertebrates from planet X? Good I was getting worried there, especially if military assistance from our neighbours is unlikely to be forthcoming.

The purpose of the formation of a "European army" is just that. They will be used to suppress individual dissenting states or views.

That is the reason why they are rather toothless now because the EU bureaucratic system is not complete yet. If they want to enforce their rules they will need to have force. Physical force otherwise the system will not work.

They will be formed to protect and to guard the EU bureaucratic system. i.e. the system is not there to guard the people but to guard the system. The nature of a bureaucratic system is to justify the rules to govern with authority and power vested in those bureaucrats. They will impose if they can physically and with EU army that's where we are heading.

As EU is still manageable at the moment the physical force is not needed because there is no urgency but they are slowly building that up. However, when when EU bureaucrats increasingly find it difficult to govern the individual states, who are unsatisfied with their current condition, the EU army will be sent to impose.

Yes, all this will happen population expansion cannot be stopped.

Wow. Pass the tin foil, sounds like we've some hats to make.

captainsasquatch - Member
Maggots appear to be quite useful little buggers.
I couldn't possibly comment on zombies as I've never met one (I don't think they're real either).
So, these useful little buggers than run around Europe, chewkw, what about them?

Those are the good ones as they will turn into insects of this world. I have no problem with them.

However, the human kind and the system they created to justify their existence those are the dangerous ones.

'Freed from the shackles of the EU' currently translates as:

'In order to minimise disruption to global trade as we leave the EU, over the coming period the government will prepare the necessary draft schedules which replicate as far as possible our current obligations.'

I'm sorry, we're going to be bound by the pre-Brexit sand quotas in our dealings with Arabia. Bob might have to wait a little longer for the plan to take shape.

hot_fiat - Member
Wow. Pass the tin foil, sounds like we've some hats to make.

Ya, what can they do if individual member states decide to disobey the rules of the EU system? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. The EU bureaucrats can do Nothing at all.

How do they enforce the rules then if the civilised rules does not work? 😆

Clover - Member

'Freed from the shackles of the EU' currently translates as:

'In order to minimise disruption to global trade as we leave the EU, over the coming period the government will prepare the necessary draft schedules which replicate as far as possible our current obligations.'

I'm sorry, we're going to be bound by the pre-Brexit sand quotas in our dealings with Arabia. Bob might have to wait a little longer for the plan to take shape.

Actually UK is rebooting the world system. 😀

UK is setting the world example of anything can be done if the will is there.

Actually UK is rebooting the world system.

UK is setting the world example of anything can be done if the will is there.

yes, screw co-operation, back to the nation state. which inevitably leads to war and conflict. Never miss a business opportunity. After all the weaponry is one of the UKs main export industries.

Chewkw I am not sure Bob could get his head around you.... would be an interesting conversation to watch though..
I shall show Bob some of your threads? If that's ok with you.

Actually UK is rebooting the world system.
UK is setting the world example of anything can be done if the will is there.

By emulating what we've got as closely as possible?

Okaaaay

mrmo - Member

Actually UK is rebooting the world system.
UK is setting the world example of anything can be done if the will is there.

yes, screw co-operation, back to the nation state. which inevitably leads to war and conflict. Never miss a business opportunity. After all the weaponry is one of the UKs main export industries.

Actually the reason Bob is in his current predicament is down primarily to his fundamental opinion that the world (UK) owes him a living at a certain level (£36k) and once he had finished his apprenticeship back in the 80s that there was no further requirement to learn new skills (he is academically) quite smart. It's odd as my old man who is 84 soon started his working life as a farm worker with horses but he didn't just stop when tractors and ultimately much more complex machinery came along.

oldmanmtb - Member
Chewkw I am not sure Bob could get his head around you.... would be an interesting conversation to watch though..
I shall show Bob some of your threads? If that's ok with you.

Nothing against people but a dangerous bureaucratic system.

[url= http://www.lefigaro.fr/international/2016/12/06/01003-20161206ARTFIG00266-le-referendum-a-reveille-le-nationalisme-britannique-et-une-hysterie-chauvine.php ]http://www.lefigaro.fr/international/2016/12/06/01003-20161206ARTFIG00266-le-referendum-a-reveille-le-nationalisme-britannique-et-une-hysterie-chauvine.php[/url]

really positive opinion of the UK here!

[url= http://www.lemonde.fr/referendum-sur-le-brexit/article/2016/12/06/brexit-bruxelles-mise-sur-un-accord-conclu-en-octobre-2018_5044346_4872498.html ]http://www.lemonde.fr/referendum-sur-le-brexit/article/2016/12/06/brexit-bruxelles-mise-sur-un-accord-conclu-en-octobre-2018_5044346_4872498.html[/url]

and more positive opinions...