RBS has gone from 250p to 178p since Thursday. It has a market cap of £20B (£29B last week), and we all (via the government) own about 73% of it.
So we are all today about ~£100 worse off - every man, woman and child just through RBS.
oldnpastit - I'm sure its all part of the plan to make Britain great again and we shouldn't be at all concerned...
RBS has gone from 250p to 178p since Thursday. It has a market cap of £20B (£29B last week), and we all (via the government) own about 73% of it. So we are all today about ~£100 worse off - every man, woman and child just through RBS.
A large proportion of brexiteers think the EU is an undemocratic Neo-Liberal organization and that "Bankers" should be taxed out of the country. £100 will seem a very small price for what they regard as sticking it to the 'Bankers'.
Molgrips Leave plan does not [b]have[/b] to go through Parliament. Firstly its impracticable to discuss openly an ongoing negotiation and we are not going to complete a whole negotiation before triggering Article 50. Someone is going to have to make a decision and just crack on with it. Parliament doesn't even have to vote on triggering Article 50
I heard it quoted in Parliament today that up to 70,000 city jobs could be at risk. Interesting as we must have lost 250,000 in last 8 years not least as a result of the tough it mustn't happen again regulatory changes so even if that was true its small beer really. Edit: yes and as above sticking to the bankers was the idea no ?
Molgrips Leave plan does not have to go through Parliament.
Source?
I don't know otherwise, but I'd like some solid facts.
I'll leave you to google it, either way. My comments based on my understanding of how our Parliament works, Referendum a clear mandate and Cameron said he would trigger it asap
I heard it quoted in Parliament today that up to 70,000 city jobs could be at risk. Interesting as we must have lost 250,000 in last 8 years
Please provide a link for 250 000 city jobs lost in the last 8 years please, Jamba.
[quote=jambalaya ]Molgrips Leave plan does not have to go through Parliament. Firstly its impracticable to discuss openly an ongoing negotiation and we are not going to complete a whole negotiation before triggering Article 50. This was surely the problem with the whole Leave proposition. Those in favour of leaving the EU should have requested a referendum to be held only once all the negotiations had been completed and details made available to the public so that an informed choice could be made.
I think from what I have been reading that Parliament is required to repeal the 1972 European Communities Act as it is law and can only be undone with a vote.
IANAEUL
your understanding is essentially STW slang for factually incorrectMy comments based on my understanding of how our Parliament works
A quick pull of the Article 50 trigger is unlikely to be feasible under the UK’s constitutional arrangements and may well not be desirable for any UK Government or Parliament, even one committed to eventual withdrawal from the EU.Brexit is the most important decision that has faced the United Kingdom in a generation and it has massive constitutional and economic ramifications. In our constitution, Parliament gets to make this decision, not the Prime Minister.
Article here from actual constitutional lawyers
https://ukconstitutionallaw.org/2016/06/27/nick-barber-tom-hickman-and-jeff-king-pulling-the-article-50-trigger-parliaments-indispensable-role/
This was surely the [s]problem with [/s] strength of the whole Leave proposition.
Fixed that for you.
If the leave campaign had campaigned for joining (say) the EEA they'd have lost.
No we did not get downgraded
[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36644934 ]You were saying, Jam?[/url]
When I think of the Leave plan for Brexit.....I think of this:
The above confirms the whole remain campain
Referendum a clear mandate and Cameron said he would trigger it asap
But he hasn't. He's leaving it to someone else.
The above confirms the whole remain campain
In what regard?
Also, despite all of the best possible efforts to dumb down the likely effects of Brexit (big scary red lines going downwards on graphs, that kind of thing), no notice was taken, either out of willful ignorance or genuine ignorance.
It is quite difficult to produce a big print guide to why torpedoing your own economy is a bad idea without sounding patronising. They even trotted out Beckham in an effort to engage. What else would have worked, Bungle, George and Zippy with a rainbow-coloured graph? Oh no, the rainbow flag is associated with gay pride. Bad idea, then.
One good thing that might come out of this is increased focus on education funding to at least equip people with ability to grasp basic concepts.
Meanwhile the satire industry announces 1,000 jobs are to go, announcing:
"We've had to give up, because this shit is now writing itself, and it is way dafter than anything we can come up with".
Pleasing to see that my home town has more of a plan than the government...
[url= http://www.thestar.co.uk/news/sheffield-looks-to-china-for-investment-after-eu-referendum-brexit-vote-1-7983742 ]linky[/url]
Cameron actually said he would start to take steps. Can anyone find any credible source disputing the constitutional lawyers who argue strongly that a vote in the commons is require?
[quote=nick1962 ]I find it rich that those who spend so much time on here berating the political elite for being out of touch with real people now want that same political elite to reverse and overrule what real people have voted for.
There's a difference between being out of touch so not doing things to help real people and ignoring turkeys voting for christmas
no notice was taken, either out of willful ignorance or genuine ignorance.
Having a chat now on FB with members of my family, saying that 'the experts should've come out and explained it all'....
Meanwhile the satire industry announces 1,000 jobs are to go, announcing:"We've had to give up, because this shit is now writing itself, and it is way dafter than anything we can come up with".
John Oliver's piece on this consisted of simply explaining what had happened. That was enough.
Pah, who needs experts. We've got the Sun and Fail...
dannybgoode - problem is the Chinese are now saying that due to not having access to the European market Britain is not as attractive a place to invest. They may be bluffing - but why would they?
And I quote Daniel Hannan just a few minutes ago:
No-one on the leave side doesn’t want free trade with Europe,” prominent pro-leave MEP Daniel Hannan just said on BBC News.
As far as Europe goes, it should be possible to stay inside an arrangement with the EU with bilateral deals, which would allow for free movement, but what we will not have are foreign courts deciding who can come into the UK.
---
So why did people vote to leave again?...
The Remain campaign did not get a message across that spoke to the larger voting public that addressed the concern(s) they have/had.
I think genesis that is the issue. They should have dumbed down the economic argument from international trade deals etc to the cost of a holiday to Benidorm.
The immigration argument to 'so you want to get up at 5am to go fruit picking etc'.
Would have resonated far more
People voted to leave due to a belief about immigration - rightly or wrongly
Anyway the meal deal at the sandwhich shop next to work had risen from £3.95 on Friday to £4.95 today !!!! #CostOfBrexit
Having a chat now on FB with members of my family, saying that 'the experts should've come out and explained it all'....
I thought people in this country had had enough of experts?
(You really couldn't make this stuff up).
I do hope, oh so much that the deal thats struck is access to the single market, because it quite clearly as seen in the markets is that important, but with the continued free movement as the compromise.
Well, at least we got our 'identity' back hey.
So Hannan wants all the good things but doesnt want to pay his share. Typical politicians.
France, Holland, Italy, Austria, Finland, Hungary, Portugal, and Slovakia all appear to be considering referendums .. (Ipsos Mori Poll)
linky?
@mike you'll be sleeping but S&P have downgraded the UK, theynwhere the outlier as the other agencies tookmaway the AAA a while ago. This will make no difference imo as many investors take the "lowest of" when it comes to credit ratings. Also as noted previously rates are already lower on a flight to quality, ie investors buying more government debt
[quote=dannybgoode ]So why did people vote to leave again?...
Because they're thick? Well somebody had to say it!
(and no, not all of them, but enough that the small minority voting for well thought out reasons could swing it)
So Hannan wants all the good things but doesnt want to pay his share. Typical politicians.
Why should the UK pay when we import more than we export ? Its the EU that wants access to our markets.
People voted to leave due to a belief about immigration - rightly or wrongly
Correct, and as this was indeed "the big issue", why the hell did it get blown out of all proportion and become a referendum on the whole of EU membership? Careless at the very least.
France, Holland, Italy, Austria, Finland, Hungary, Portugal, and Slovakia all appear to be considering referendums .. (Ipsos Mori Poll)
The best we can hope for now is that everyone else votes out and we start all over again.
But he hasn't. He's leaving it to someone else.
He's been handed a sh1t sandwich & doesn't want to take a bite - who can blame him?
Yes, he made said sh1t sandwich but I don't see anyone for Remain falling over themselves for a nibble?
What does that tell you?.....
We're all in the queue for the shit sandwich buffet?What does that tell you?.....
The Remain campaign did not get a message across that spoke to the larger voting public that addressed the concern(s) they have/had.
The problem with "getting a message across" is that it relies on both the sender and receiver being able to understand it. Where do you think the fault lies? I refer again to the big booklet that we all got through the door. What about the Moneysupermarket guy who was regarded as the best impartial voice? Everyone knows about him, he's the geezer who gets you money off your bills, if you can be arsed to do something about it.
The evidence was there. In academic-speak. It was there in dumbed-down speak. It was there, full ****ing stop.
And anyway, if people were so unsure, why did they just not abstain and leave it up to others?
To my mind, for three reasons:
1) They were genuinely not intelligent enough to realise what they were doing.
2) They thought they knew what they were doing (getting 'rid' of foreigners - including British people with browner skin than theirs), so chose to ignore impending economic meltdown as it was perceived to be 'worth it'.
3) Old and pissed off with some laws being made in Brussels by people they hadn't voted for themselves, and not needing to give a shit about the next decade as they're already retired with the mortgage paid off.
How many more times can we do the "it's someone else's fault we cocked it up" line of argument before its proponents see it is horse shit?
The problem with "getting a message across" is that it relies on both the sender and receiver being able to understand it.
It also requires the sender to engage with the receiver. With our highly polarised press and media our "receivers" would only be seeing stuff from the "senders" they read/watch/listen to. On both sides. No-one sees each others arguments.
Why should the UK pay when we import more than we export ? Its the EU that wants access to our markets.
FFS, Jambas are you just taking the Mikey wih this stuff now?
True Danny - its time people took responsibility for their actions, (2) BTW
It also requires the sender to engage with the receiver. With our highly polarised press and media our "receivers" would only be seeing stuff from the "senders" they read/watch/listen to. On both sides. No-one sees each others arguments.
So we need one-to-ones, then? Because people only want to look at one side of the argument it is somehow the other side's fault? Have a look at what you are saying and then have a little thinking time.
At least the "I now know I am a gullible moron" excuse holds water.
Repeating over and over again that "I didn't get the email" is just laughable.
After the Brexit disaster , other countries might have a referendum but with a different question , not in or out .
