Hmm… again and again we were told that if our membership if the EU was “just about trade” then there would be no need to Leave… by people asking us to vote Leave in 2016.
No need for the war time language though. Leave that to the PM.
Most of the MPs need to be voted out in the next GE as simple as that.
I predict the two main parties will get hammer in the next GE which they deserve.
Both govt and opposition are so weak they look like silly.
Watching the debate (such that it is) live on German TV, no dubbing, no subtitiles, think about that. When has there ever been anything in German presented on British TV under the same conditions?
Oh look. Dominic Grieve has just stood up to speak. I wonder if he's going to join his remain hero mate Ken Clarke in opposing Johnson's deal? What's that? They're going to vote for it? The very people the lib dems have promised to support and who thought would be good candidates as interim PM to stop brexit? Politics is a weird world. The only lesson to be learned from this whole sorry saga is that you can never trust a tory, or their lib dem lapdogs.
^ Allo Allo. Pretty sure that was in French and German 🙂
What a car crash.
Our government is an international joke.
Even if we don't leave the EU, the UK will never be taken seriously again, it's not parliament, it's a kangaroo court.
Ok anyone care to explain what the Letwin amendment means,doexBoris have to write the letter now?
Re: that Led By Donkeys video that kelvin put up.
We've got a Whatsapp group at work that has been running since the vote was announced. Someone totalled up all the people that declared their vote at the time and it came out as 27 Leave out of 40 (group is roughly 50-odd in total). Someone linked to that video and another round was done as to how people would vote knowing now what we do. The new count is 31 Remain out of 43 replies. That's a strong swing, especially as a lot of us live in the Welsh Valleys that were strongly for Leave!
I despair.
Ok anyone care to explain what the Letwin amendment means,doexBoris have to write the letter now?
In ordinary times, yes. But nothing Is guaranteed in these times.
think it means blowjo doesn't have the votes
Classic Cummings/Trumpism now. Throwing out deliberately conflicting messages about writing the letter and what that might mean.
Yeh but the law is the law.
They're just blustering and spinning, it's pathetic and embarrassing.
opposing Johnson’s deal?
capitulate
verb [ I ]
UK /kəˈpɪtʃ.ə.leɪt/ US /kəˈpɪtʃ.ə.leɪt/to accept something or agree to do something unwillingly:
Get a bloody grip man.
Get a bloody dictionary man.
Today’s events… the Tory Party have come together, but many still don’t trust their leader. This is all sliding towards this Withdrawal Arrangement being entered into, but with the PMs feet held to the fire to make sure he sticks to it. Not good for the country in the long term, but better in the short term than leaving this month without any agreement at all. There are still paths that can be taken to get this “deal” voted on by the public, but it seems highly unlikely, doesn’t it? We’ll see. “Not yet” is soon to become “never”… as many probably hoped, as regards a referendum before we leave.
So MPs back a delay and Boris says not.
Ha ha love it.
Well done Labour - yet again "magic grandad's useless brexit enablers" block another critical Government move.
He's just so useless isn't he Binners?
On a serious note of the Labour Brexiteers there were only 6 against the Letwin amendment.
Blustering and spinning the way truly desperate people do when they are in a corner.
These guys and their mates between them have millions of pounds resting on Brexit happening. They literally can't afford for it not to happen.
The tory Party just consists of Johnson and Cummings.
The rest of the tories don't have a clue what's going on. They are either laughing or trying to figure out how to keep thier jobs.
Welcome to UK government 2019.
It's a disgrace.
Looking at how the DUP have voted… they may be willing to try and block this Withdrawal Agreement, come what may. Which would have some logic to it, wouldn’t it? Very pro-Brexit… but not at any price. But even if they do decide to try and kill the Withdrawal Agreement… I don’t think there’s any realistic chance enough “Tories” Will join them. Who knows… 🤷🏻♂️
Also Ken Clarke backing the deal ... Swindleson's suggested PM caretaker.
Those of you obsessed with Swinson and the LibDems at this time come across as a bit screwy, you do know that, yes? They keep voting with Labour, and not the government.
think it means blowjo doesn’t have the votes
On the contrary looks as if he does based on division lists, amendment vote was lost by 16, 8 of those who voted for it back the deal so that wipes out the majority and there are a number of abstentions who say they will vote for the deal which takes him over the line.
Indeed. All the additional delay gives him is time to cement his support. Not sure why the amendment was getting cheered to the rafters outside by the crowds.
Boris will have his deal by the 31st, his election victory shortly afterwards.
I can't wait until Scotland finally decides to get out of this shthole of a union.
Westminster is an embarrassment
Well done Labour – yet again “magic grandad’s useless brexit enablers” block another critical Government move.
In this case I think we can thank the DUP rather than Corbyn. If it wasn't for them then Letwin would have been defeated and the deal voted through today.
The deal would have been voted through without the amendment to put it to a people's Vote that Corbyn opposed.
Like I said, it's difficult to tell what is due to Corbyn's intentions and what is due to his incompetence.
Doesn’t the Ben law kick in though?
Yes but the intent is to have a further vote on Monday if that passes through the Houses of Parliament, he is entitled to withdraw the request under Section 1(4).
So by 11 pm tonight BJ has to write/send that letter if I am correct?
Let's see.
It was the DUP & Tory rebels what did it today
But enough labour rebels that Johnson is set to win his vote Monday or Tuesday
Were there any Tory rebels?
Am I right in thinking that MPs have voted to make BJ ask for an extension and he is refusing to do so?
So Perfefle is saying he won’t send the letter. What about the court case a couple of weeks ago? The one where the government gave an undertaking to follow the benn act - and therefore the judge saw no reason to continue with the case...... isn’t that pretty bad? Contempt of court?
Am I right in thinking that MPs have voted to make BJ ask for an extension and he is refusing to do so?
Yes, PM BoJo will refuse as he said in the Commons.
Nothing they can do about it. 😄
I think if you're prepared to lie to the Queen then you're prepared to lie to anyone.
Maybe Barbara will have a chat with him between now and then.
Hmm Don’t forget that Suspended Court of Sessions case.
He’s playing games for the upcoming election.
So Perfefle is saying he won’t send the letter. What about the court case a couple of weeks ago? The one where the government gave an undertaking to follow the benn act – and therefore the judge saw no reason to continue with the case…… isn’t that pretty bad? Contempt of court?
Yep but it was suspended and the Judge is right to see if he complies with his undertaking
Just as well I'm not running one of the the EU 27, my attitude would be to refuse an extension, let the UK crash out and then start negotiating from a position of strength. Impose a complete package of measures to suit Ireland and the rest of the EU and sit on WTO conditions with no concessions until Britain signs up to the total package.
...my attitude would be to refuse an extension, let the UK crash out and then start negotiating from a position of strength.
Yes, that is much more logical instead of current impasse.
But before they start negotiation there should be a GE in the UK.
😄
Just as well I’m not running one of the the EU 27, my attitude would be to refuse an extension, let the UK crash out and then start negotiating from a position of strength. Impose
He got the deal as it was in their favour - sorts out his NI mess.
They’re already in a position of strength.
I'm also a bit confused. I'm of the understanding Boris would have to send the letter had the vote on the deal been passed. Am I right in thinking because they didn't vote, that's his get out clause, and why he sees no obligation of sending it?
But even if this is the case, and they vote early next week, and it passes, he still must send the letter?
Or am I way off the mark?
True, dude, but the balance shifts dramitcally in the event of no deal. Once the possibility of withrawing Art. 50 goes then it's no longer negotiation, it's begging with zero leverage. The worst Britain can threaten at the moment is withdrawing Art. 50, if Britian has left with no deal what leverage is left - nothing.
... if Britian has left with no deal what leverage is left – nothing.
Try it.
They might just have underestimated UK.
It's not possible to underestimate the UK, that's what the EU has learned from the last three years. What you gonna do? Nuke us? 😉
They might just have underestimated UK.
Three-and-a-half years, two extensions, seven defections, 21 deselections, three prime ministers, countless amendments, two prorogations, one Supreme Court judgement, and we’re still at square one.
And you think the UK has been "underestimated"?!
Is this the moment when the UK finally jumps up, throws off it's cloak of utter and complete incompetence and goes "haha, we fooled you all along!"
No, I don't think so either.
Nothing they can do about it.
On the contrary, he can be banged up for being in contempt, but you carry on in your anarchist fantasy.