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Corbyn now demanding a GE after having twice turned down the opportunity. Will that be because he's convinced Labour are now in a winning position after yesterday's conference shenanigans?
Corbyn now demanding a GE after having twice turned down the opportunity.
Apart from the two times he turned it down was because he, and everyone else, didnt trust Johnson not to try and get no deal through. His demand today still including the take no deal of the table clause.
I sadly don’t really expect any good to come from this ruling
A prime minister of a democratic country tried to suspend parliament unlawfully.
Stopping that is "good" by any definition
What happens next is unknown, but will probably be a little more good (or less bad) as a result.
Now, I wonder if the BBC will show or refer to Jo Maugham on their coverage this time or cut him out in favour of Cherry again?
No good will come if the ruling simply because it was a no win ruling but potentially a least worst one. It fuels the remain elite narrative and maintains the division.
But hopefully the Public will remember, we could have left by now, but the Tories Brexit Ultras blocked it.
Not the ones I speak to. They just remember the remain MPs voting against the WA and even when reminded still blaim the remain MPs and don't care about the ERG voting it down.
The "optics" around a GE won't have changed. Labour are only likely to succeed in an election if Brexit is delayed and the Leave vote is split between the Tories and the Brexit Party.
Yeah, I should have stopped short of reading the comments on the BBC site about this. Not a happy place if you don't like seeing words like "frothing" "remoaners" and "traitors" being bandied about.
And where is Boris ? In the USA with Trump. I guess he is waiting for that room at the Ecuadorian Embassy to be properly cleaned for him.
The “optics” around a GE won’t have changed. Labour are only likely to succeed in an election if Brexit is delayed and the Leave vote is split between the Tories and the Brexit Party.
I personally don't see them winning a majority, the Libs are on the rise and gunning for Labour more than the Tories which is a shame. The inevitable Coalition talks post GE will be interesting.
I can see that Toad Farage being the bloody kingmaker again, they're at odds at the moment, but Brexit Party Ltd is a one-man, one-policy Party, I wouldn't bet against them calling a GE and just as Labour start feeling cocky, Farage will be offered a safe seat as a Tory MP and cabinet role when he wins.
Unanimous result? Priceless.
I do wonder if there will now be steps taken in parliament to remove him tho.
If only there were some way to remove a government from office. I dunno, maybe everyone could vote or something. They could call it a "general election".
I still can’t understand why the Tory party members who voted him in as party leader and PM remotely thought it was a good move.
Because people who actually join Parties rather than just vote for them usually hold the most extreme polarised views, Super Tories if you will. They often disagree with the moderates who actually vote for them. Labour has exactly the same problem.
Assume you saw the interviews they took pre-vote? They're all crackers.
Jo Maugham was not cut out earlier.
If only there were some way to remove a government from office. I dunno, maybe everyone could vote or something. They could call it a “general election”.
A General Election dissolves Parliament. Parliament appoints a Leader, who in turn appoints a Government. Leaves us leaderless for months at the worst possible time.
The process to remove Boris is already in place, they *just* need to call a vote of no confidence and appoint a new PM, who can, in turn appoint a Government, takes days, but if it could be done, it would have been done by now. Brexit is still the barrier. Libs will want revoke, SNP will want Indie Vote2, Corbynites Red Brexit, everyone else Ref2.
Jo Maugham was not cut out earlier.
Loads of people have been cut off as other people became available, but ETP can't help but get a sly dig at the SNP 😉
"Quick Boris here comes the Fuzz"
Bercow has just issued a statement to say parliament is to be recalled at 11am tomorrow 😂
https://twitter.com/jayrotoole/status/1176434799990452224?s=21
Regarding the BBC's Have Your Say comments - yes, there is a lot of froth and anger going on, but there are still a few gems. In response to a 'Democracy is Dead' comment:
"Our democracy is defined by our laws. Democracy without laws is two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for lunch.
What's happening is your self-serving, over-simplistic view of what you imagine the UK to be is running into the reality of how our nation really works. It's not democracy is dead - you never knew what UK democracy was in the first place."
Which I found rather neat and pleasing.
I still can’t understand why the Tory party members who voted him in as party leader and PM remotely thought it was a good move.
Because fully a third of them are Leave.EU shills who bought their Tory party membership several months ago in anticipation of exactly this. Uh, democratically.
It’s not democracy is dead – you never knew what UK democracy was in the first place
I said ages ago, we could have avoided this mess completely if the remain campaign had invested in 17.4 million dictionaries.
GE is the worst possible thing to do at the moment. Cons currently do not have a majority. There is always a risk they get one (either with or without the Brexit party) after an election fought on Brexit lies. A VONC followed by government of national unity has the numbers already in place to remove Mays red lines, get a better (compromise) deal with the EU along Norway+ lines, and then to put it to the people via a referendum Deal vs Remain. Job jobbed.
Because people who actually join Parties rather than just vote for them usually hold the most extreme polarised views, Super Tories if you will. They often disagree with the moderates who actually vote for them. Labour has exactly the same problem.
Assume you saw the interviews they took pre-vote? They’re all crackers.
I acknowledge that seems to be the case but I think it's way more complex.
To some extent regardless of why they JOINED what matters is their reasons and motivations NOW.
For many reasons they can end up being completely different things...
I think for many the belonging part ends up being more important than the doing...
For others it's about power within the party ABOVE how well/poorly the party does...
for others its about power for the party ... more or less regardless of if its good/bad for the country.
Bercow has just issued a statement to say parliament is to be recalled at 11am tomorrow
and just in case the MPs havent thought of it themselves he has just happened to mention they can call for an emergency debate.
Looks like labour are going to be winding things up a day early to turn up enmass.
Wonder if Johnson is going to go for an early flight home or will he be busy asking Trump how to stack a court in his favour.
A General Election dissolves Parliament. Parliament appoints a Leader, who in turn appoints a Government. Leaves us leaderless for months at the worst possible time.
I'd be happy with that, a leader with a -40 majority isn't a leader.
The process to remove Boris is already in place, they *just* need to call a vote of no confidence and appoint a new PM, who can, in turn appoint a Government, takes days, but if it could be done, it would have been done by now. Brexit is still the barrier. Libs will want revoke, SNP will want Indie Vote2, Corbynites Red Brexit, everyone else Ref2.
100pc agree here.
A VONC followed by government of national unity has the numbers already in place to remove Mays red lines, get a better (compromise) deal with the EU along Norway+ lines, and then to put it to the people via a referendum Deal vs Remain. Job jobbed
Well that would be perfect, but they've had a long while to do that and they can't/don't want to for all kinds of reasons.
A prime minister of a democratic country tried to suspend parliament unlawfully.
Maybe he could appeal the verdict to the European Court of Justice?
Oh, wait a minute....
A govt of national unity, at best, could only seek an extension to A50 then call a GE. It could not command a majority for anything else.
As I said many moons ago the next GE will campaign base on the current situation (Brexit related) ... 😆
Can't wait to hear what Jacob reet-smug has to say about this.
A govt of national unity would also be fuel to the fire of those who bandy round the "unelected" accusation at anyone they don't like. (eg. BBC comment vitriol aimed at the "unelected" businesswoman Gina Miller - so when did we get to vote on businesspeople too?)
Ka Boom.
Also - pure meme gold.
The Procedures / rules have triumphed over the Referendum result / the people's will. 😄
The logic (procedures) does not stack up to the end goal (Referendum). 🤣
It's the two competing leave side that cause me concern both wish to distroy in order to rebuild along ideological political theory ideas, not the more complicated nuanced world in which we live. I am just agast at how these nut jobs managed to sell theory's to their respective sides with the challenges being ignored.
The Procedures / rules have triumphed over the Referendum result / the people’s will. 😄
That's exactly what rules are for.
That’s exactly what rules are for.
Precisely. Yes, rules are rules.
But that is also exactly where the problem is.
The Procedures / rules have triumphed over the Referendum result / the people’s will.
When you live somewhere that doesn't have procedures and rules and laws and stuff, that's called a dictatorship.
Remember 'Taking Back Control'? You must do? Written down the side of a big bus? Mop-haired fella usually stood in front of it?? Well... this is what they meant by all that.
wasn’t even close another 11 names to add to the “enemies of the people” list
You called it.
https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/leave-eu-brands-judges-enemies-of-the-people-1-6287075
A referendum trumps the rule of law, the judiciary, parliamentary democracy etc. Come on people, Hitler knew this, why don’t you?
What are the odds on a temporary coalition govt tomorrow?
I wonder if any MPs are enjoying Thomas Cook holidays at the moment...
Might not make tomorrow’s session if they are.
The speed at which they got that out suggests to me that a) Leave.EU were expecting Boris to lose and b) they were very well prepared for it.
It's insane isn't it. The highest legal authority in the country is now the "enemy of the people" for ruling that parliament has to go back to the job of discussing something 17.4 million people, many of whom are now dead, voted for in an opinion poll three years ago. I thought these lunatics wanted to "take back control" of our own laws?
Christ, what have we become.
But that is also exactly where the problem is.
In all of this total and utter mess, parliamentary rules are really not the source of the problem.
Is Leave.EU directed by/run by/advised by The Prime Minister Dominic Cummings?
Either way, standard defamatory tactics, nothing new to see there - just another log to chuck on the fire of the frothy leavers.
This morning's news has cheered me right up. 🙂
dannyh thanks for that quote. Very good. This whole mess is exposing the profound and wilful ignorance of a sizeable chunk of our population. But the way that things go with such personality-types is that once their ignorance is exposed they simply double-down to ‘save-face’, and then seek further entrenchment in like-minded echo-chambers/populist politics/politicians/opportunists/blatant liars.
And so on. Such behavior/attitudes are at once fire and fuel for such a bad situation. It is infuriating, possibly irretrievable, and (ironically) in itself the actual biggest threat to a functioning democracy.
” Unlawful, void and of no effect."
Is that the new "Strong and Stable?"
So the libdems have had their conference, labour have mostly had theirs... when is the tory one? Have they managed to do themselves out of a conference while letting everyone else have theirs? The chance of parliament voting for a recess now is, let's be honest, slightly lower than zero...