The trouble is that there is no one concerted Remain campaigner.
Gina miller or Caroline Lucas won't strike a gammon chord. It needs to be white middle class middle aged gent, Jeremy clarkson!
Labour should have a new campaign.
For the living,
Not the dead.
There is also a post doing the rounds on social media about a new Lisbon treaty where we basically become slaves to the Eu. Total lies that will be fact as soon as a second referendum is announced.
Can everyone please get behind a group called Led By Donkeys. They are putting posters up with leave mp quotes . They are at least getting out there and doing something.
@dudeifdoom
https://twitter.com/annietrev/status/1086552343229943808?s=19
Current mp for a lot of farmers now blaming the French for the possibility of imposing tariffs, they are so far into the lie they can't stop.
Just coincidence that something we’ve not seen for twenty years reappears when the government doesn’t appear to GAF about the good Friday agreement and is being dictated to by the DUP
The likelihood of our being brexit/GFA related isn't exactly tiny but A) it's entirely possible that the nut job who did it CGAS about any of that and just likes blowing stuff up (or happens to be in possession of the required stuff and just happens to have a very very strong point of view on brexit) - there was plenty of that during IRA(and other) ceasefires back when. B) that "we've not seen for twenty years" is nonsense too, there have been ongoing pipe bomb incidents,actual bombings and attacks on RUC officers for years, they're just not weekly like they were.
I'd hold fire on pinning this on brexit until it's absolutely clear that's what it is.
I had a very very cursory Google to try find the schedule for the courthouse in question but no luck. I'd wager it's more likely a result of something specific to the target than more overtly political.
Is the car bomb in NI to make a point about the GFA?
After all it appears the govt is in thrall to the DUP, and that won't be happy news to the IRA.
Baaaad news for sheep
https://www.farminguk.com/news/-No-deal-Brexit-could-lead-to-mass-slaughter-of-mid-transit-sheep_50444.html
Re Jacobs dad made predictions that were so wide of the mark that the Eye named him mystic Mogg.
Great supporter of a more liberal drugs policy which may also account for a lot. The Eye also referred to him as Moggadon Man.
According to Andrew Rawnsley in the Gruniad today Mays plan B is revert to plan A plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.
But the muslims are the bad guys now so not as much to worry about.
But after Brexit they won't be able to get in. Oh wait....
Theresa May inflexible? Now that's a turn up for the books, who'd have thought that would happen what a surprise....
So today's plan is to propose an agreement with the Irish Government that the Irish Government cannot legally make?
Wastes a few more days I suppose.
Wastes a few more days I suppose.
Whats infuriating is her 'deal' was dead more than a month ago but she still wastes time.
Be interesting to hear what the Irish government make of that.
Whats infuriating is her ‘deal’ was dead more than a month ago but she still wastes time.
Yeah, but that's the whole idea. Abuse parliamentary process. Run down the clock. May's deal or no deal.
Don’t worry she assured us last week that she is not running down the clock.
Which is why no deal needs to go, its becoming clear to just about everyone the only one she is trying to bully with it is the rational people.
THe ERG/DUP axis of zealotry absolutely will not compromise over the customs union or the backstop. So any 'solution' that is actually possible to impliment will split the Tory party.
And May is far more concerned about that than trashing the countries economy
The Andrew Rawnsley article in yesterdays Observer makes for pretty depressing reading
What's MORE infuriating than that is that there was never ever going to be a ‘deal’ that delivered everything that was promised, and they knew it. The promises were lies.
If they'd have sold Brexit on the truth and won the referendum I'd say good luck to it. Not my personal choice but I'd still have had respect for the process if it really was what the majority of the people of Britain wanted.
Instead here we are (by "we" I mean the general public, not the rich or the politicians) sitting in the middle of what is literally a slow motion train-wreck of a disaster.
The people behind this who have their own agendas knew and still know exactly what the outcome was always going be, and pushed for it on that basis. Once you accept that they did it for themselves, and NOT for Queen and country, then everything - every lie, every confusing interview or statement, every "secret" that slips out, makes sense.
I read a comment on Twitter this morning that in a Sky TV debate quite a lot of people seemed to think "No Deal" means things stay as they are (i.e. We remain).
I can believe that. A lot of people were/are ignorant of the basic facts (or have been "misled" if you want to be charitable).
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Jesus H. That many people think no deal means we just remain in the EU?!
We are bloody doomed.
There may be some variation in response due to semantics. Of course no deal actually means crashing out in chaos but imo it should mean staying in, ie if we cannot reach an a agreement on a deal then the default "no deal" option should be staying in.
Jesus H. That many people think no deal means we just remain in the EU?!
We are bloody doomed.
Hardly surprising is it? Instead of watching the news there is probably East Enders/coronation street/home and away/towie/some other glib soap about ‘real people’ on instead and let’s face it who wants to watch boring news when there is some adulterous tittle-tattle to watch?
Yesterdays Observer was saying the same. There's a rump of leavers who seem to think that 'no deal' just means everything carries on as normal.
Terrifying that this countries entire economic future has still been left in the hands of liars and frauds at every conceivable level, who are blithley assuring everyone that 'no deal' will be just fine.
The obvious question is, in the event of a no deal crash-out, and the ensuing chaos, how will all those people react when they realise the true extent to which they've been conned?
In the absense of any leadership from May, not all the Tory party is completely unhinged, though it often feels like it. From the Guardian just now:
Richard Harrington, the business minister, has already said he will resign from the government if Theresa May opts for a no-deal Brexit. Other ministers, including some in cabinet, think that same, but Harrington has been the most explicit about this. And this morning, in an interview on the Today programme, he went further. He said a no-deal Brexit (something May has refused to rule out, and something which Tory Brexiters insist would be manageable, if not ideal) would be “an absolute disaster”. Asked what he thought about the prospect, he said:
You said, “Does [the prospect of no deal] bring shivers?” It does bring more than shivers, because I have examined in depth what might happen, I’m part of the government’s plans for Brexit. I’ve seen what may well happen with this cut-off date. Crashing out in my view ... is an absolute disaster. It’s not a road to a free trade agreement, it’s not a road to anything. It’s an absolute disaster for the country and it’s supported by a minority of a minority of people.
Harrington said he was not just worried about the tariffs that would be in place in the event of a no-deal Brexit. He was worried about the impact of friction at the border, particularly on the car industry, which is dependent on just-in-time supply chains. He said he was “afraid” of Jaguar and Mini closing in the event of a no-deal Brexit. Claiming that the UK would be able to manage trading with the EU on WTO terms was “fanciful nonsense”, he said. And he ended the interview saying:
It says on my business card “minister for business and industry”. I’m not prepared to sell business down the river for other people’s political dogma.
Quite alarmed that the brexiters appear to have jumped on the btl comments in the john Harris guardian article. And the refusal to engage or listen to reasoning suggests it's just to goad the guardinistas or whatevs. Talk of the EU 'rabble' and 'totalitarian'EU. Utterly insane
Not sure if this link has been posted before, but the article absolutely nails it
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/17/opinion/sunday/brexit-ireland-empire.html
Britain’s rupture with the European Union is proving to be another act of moral dereliction by the country’s rulers. The Brexiteers, pursuing a fantasy of imperial-era strength and self-sufficiency, have repeatedly revealed their hubris, mulishness and ineptitude over the past two years. Though originally a “Remainer,” Prime Minister Theresa May has matched their arrogant obduracy, imposing a patently unworkable timetable of two years on Brexit and laying down red lines that undermined negotiations with Brussels and doomed her deal to resoundingly bipartisan rejection this week in Parliament.
The obvious question is, in the event of a no deal crash-out, and the ensuing chaos, how will all those people react when they realise the true extent to which they’ve been conned?
blame it on jeremy...
The obvious question is, in the event of a no deal crash-out, and the ensuing chaos, how will all those people react when they realise the true extent to which they’ve been conned?
They probably won't put two and two together combined with the Tory government and media convincing them that it was not caused by the no deal brexit. i.e. the gullible will continue to be gullible.
blame it on jeremy…
and there will be plenty of useful idiot "moderates" willing to assist.
I think we have already seen the approach which will be taken. All the talk about traitors and enemies of the people.
It would have been fine apart from those remoaners who stabbed us in the back.
The labour party has lost 150,000+ of their fabled 500,000 membership over the last year due to Corbyns por-Brexit stance. Would they be these 'useful idiot moderates'?
The obvious question is, in the event of a no deal crash-out, and the ensuing chaos, how will all those people react when they realise the true extent to which they’ve been conned?
Had a depressing realisation this morning that the likes of Rees-Mogg don't need to care. They'll carry on blaming and bullshitting, and carry on making money. If we manage to turn the ship around enough to remain, and there's a blood on the streets backlash, they'll be able to blame, bullshit and make money off the repercussions.
There's no incentive on JRM whatsoever to reconcile, to soften the language, to compromise, to stop lying about how great no-deal will be. The nastier it is, the more opportunity he'll have to make money.
fabled 500,000 membership over the last year due to Corbyns por-Brexit stance
That would be the membership who were so unimportant when compared to the voters? The ones in the heartlands who are in favour of brexit. I get confused as to which group is more important.
Also a cursory check shows that claim has been disputed and was in the Sunday Times with unattributed sources. So looks like you are playing a blinder for the hard right press again. Keep up the good work.
. The nastier it is, the more opportunity he’ll have to make money.
Yup. He is following dearest daddies playbook to the letter.
The ones in the heartlands who are in favour of brexit
Care to suggest a single seat in the UK where you think more Labour voters voted Leave than Remain? Placating UKIP and the more unhinged Tory voters in "the North" will not result in a Labour government.
Labour voters at the last election were overwhelming in favour of Remain. No idea what would happen if we had either an election or a referendum now… but pretending that Labour voters have forced the Labour leadership's "position" on Brexit is just an excuse.
I am not a moderate or a centrist, I suspect I am far to the left of any of the gullible morons still defending Jeremy. I can just see that brexit will cause far more pain and suffering than any event in my lifetime.
I can remember as a child the first time I saw my father cry, when one of his friends committed suicide after losing his job as an electrician down the mines, and subsequently separated from his family as he struggled to cope having been cast aside to tory dogma. These kind of stories will be repeated by the thousands maybe tens of thousands in a post brexit britain, and Corbyn has done **** all meaningful to fight it.
Brexit will be far worse than a mere tory government as we have known, it is an alt-right coup that will devastate lives for decades, and may never be recovered from.
Care to suggest a single seat in the UK where you think more Labour voters voted Leave than Remain?
The figures are 60% of Labour constituencies voted leave.
Getting precise figures of the overlap of voters for Labour and brexit doesnt look that easy but some easy examples:
Sunderland, Doncaster and Wakefield all had high brexit votes. So its fairly safe to assume they meet your criteria.
You can also look at the Best for Britain poll which showed a loss of 11% of votes outweighing the potential gain.
Labour voters at the last election were overwhelming in favour of Remain.
Evidence for this please. The members were but as far as I am aware voters were a tad more complex with a slight favour for second referendum.
but pretending that Labour voters have forced the Labour leadership’s “position” on Brexit is just an excuse.
Which will be why the leadership has been threatened with rebellion by some ministers if they even say they want a second referendum. Since those ministers are worried about their constituencies.
Since those ministers are worried about their constituencies.
They are worried about their votes, not their constituencies.
I just can't fathom why they are not out in their constituencies shouting from every rooftop, how they have been lied to and conned by a bunch of posh **** investment bankers looking to profit from their constituencies suffering and misery. Instead they care more about pursuing a policy that will devastate their constituents lives even further just in case they lose some votes, ****ing self serving arseholes are not fit to be labour mp's.
I just can’t fathom why they are not out in their constituencies shouting from every rooftop
Because the chances of that working is pretty minimal.
that will devastate their constituents lives even further just in case they lose some votes
Or to be more charitable (although overall I think it is biased to self preservation) if they do lose the seats then the tories would be able to slash and burn those areas anyway.
If anyone heard Harrington on R4 this morning he managedto remain quite calm as Peter Lilley just spun out so much bollox, Id have been far less polite
Even Nick Robinson was having trouble taking him seriously, when he claimed it was all 'project fear' whipped up by the media & robinson pointed out these were direct quotes from teh boss of JLR & head of Calais port Lilley just started to gibber randon words for a bit
Also very good post by Peston on FB this morning
assuming we delay departure Farage is planning the 'Brexit Party' & would likely clean up and wed be sending an even bigger bunch of UKIP-like clowns to the EU parliament 🙁
Even Nick Robinson was having trouble taking him seriously, when he claimed it was all ‘project fear’ whipped up by the media & robinson pointed out these were direct quotes from teh boss of JLR & head of Calais port Lilley just started to gibber randon words for a bit
It was embarrassing to be honest. It was such a straightforward and obvious point from Nick Robinson. No trap needed to be laid, yet Lilley still sounded like he was on the receiving end of a forensic questioning.
But - what the hell - the core of public support don't listen to R4, so got away with another one.....
Because the chances of that working is pretty minimal.
So instead they will just cede to an alt-right coup? FFS at least go out fighting, if brexit happens it won't matter if they hold onto their little fiefdoms they will have failed their constituents and condemned them without even raising a whimper in opposition.
The only noises that have come out of the Labour Party for the last few days are them complaining about Fiona Bruce being horrid to Dianne on QT. They're still at it this morning.
Well... that and Kier Starmers latest unsuccessful attempt at trying to bounce Corbyn into actually maybe possibly engaging with this whole Brexit thing on any kind of meaningful level
Nice set of priorities there you totally ****ing useless bunch of half-wits
The tory right are ratcheting up the rhetoric to drive the Brexit debate in an ever more extreme direction, and the labour party are just sat back and letting them get on with it, totally unopposed
Kier Starmers
Hasn’t he been replaced by Barry Gardiner?
The labour party has lost 150,000+ of their fabled 500,000 membership over the last year due to Corbyns por-Brexit stance. Would they be these ‘useful idiot moderates’?
Uncritically parroting a disputed and unattributed claim is pretty much the definition of "useful idiot".
The only noises that have come out of the Labour Party for the last few days are them complaining about Fiona Bruce being horrid to Dianne on QT.
Hardly a surprise that, the ball is very much in the court of May and her dysfunctional party. There is only one thing for labour to do, and that's to stand back and watch the show. If it results in a no deal brexit then they'll suffer some fallout, but it will destroy the tories so they may have calculated that it's worth the risk.
Ah, disaster socialism advocacy finally. Love it.
Ah, disaster socialism advocacy finally. Love it.
Not advocacy, just an explanation. My own opinion is that the 'lexit' approach carries far too high a risk of the opposite happening, which is a far right reactionary govt a la Trump taking power in the wake of no deal chaos. The left just isn't strong enough to beat them unfortunately.
However I do think this is where the labour party are right now. More by accident than design though, but they have little option but to hold course and hope it works out. Their only other option is committing electoral suicide and political parties aren't in the habit of doing that.
It's perfect storm of s*** unfortunately on both the tory and labour sides, and I reckon there's only one inevitable destination, which is a no-deal brexit. Our political system just isn't capable of solving a problem like this.