It’s not Mays fault
The more I hear this the less I’m sympathetic towards her. No, she didn’t start the brexit talk/referendum, but she did trigger A50 before a plan was in place. Thus jumping off the cliff before checking the landing zone, or the quality/existence of her parachute. If a plan was thrashed out before the ‘we are definitely leaving’ law was passed, I can’t help but feel we wouldn’t be having all this drama now. That was the real win for the hard brexiters/remainers, depending on where we are on 30/3
I think May deal will get through
+1
Fear levels turned up to 11 and clocks being deliberately ran down
I do hope she fails thou.
‘we are definitely leaving’ law was passed
Yep it’s all the ****ups are good at, still same people can remove a law.
Yep it’s all the ****ups are good at, still same people can remove a law
Takes time though. How long would it need?
I don’t think he would say “sod the result” – I do think, being a politician, he could term it in such a way that a second referendum would at least be on the table. As it is, he seems to be trying to force it off…
It's still official Labour policy though isn't it?
I believe it is, against the majority of Labour voters but seemingly in line with JC's wishes.
It’s still official Labour policy though isn’t it?
Only in the way that anything not ruled out is labour policy, but it is quite clear that it isn't a direction the labour leadership want to go.
Also, all this uncertainty is costing the country millions. The amount of businesses having to look into and prepare for as many eventualities as they can forsee is ridiculous, and I’m sure there time would be much better spent preparing for an actual event, rather than dozens
Takes time though. How long would it need?
Mmmm a day would do it.
Also, all this uncertainty is costing the country millions. The amount of businesses having to look into and prepare for as many eventualities as they can forsee is ridiculous, and I’m sure there time would be much better spent preparing for an actual event, rather than dozens
And the ‘Deal’ doesn’t actually tell you what trading deal you’ll have after the 2 years, so your none the wiser on what will be.
You couldn’t make this clusterkucf up.
And the ‘Deal’ doesn’t actually tell you what trading deal you’ll have after the 2 years, so your none the wiser on what will be.
This. Mays Deal is just kicking it all into the long grass for (at least) another 2 years of uncertainty. As I've already suggested on this thread, maybe "No Deal" would be better in that we could at least start fixing things next year.
I do hope she fails thou
Quite literally hope we t out the window it's impossible for her to fail ...a win win the corbyntard is about as useful as shit on a blanket and the maytard has outmanoeuvred the ****less c*** every time
.
Anyway happy Christmas fellow Tory Brexit hostages 🙂
As it's Christmas day I've got some amusing vids for you all. A recent one and one from a while back. ZDF is about as mainstream as German TV gets.
No subtitles on the next one which is perhaps just as well.
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/25/brexit-uk-global-joke-rebuild-reputation?
References the German satirical TV shows above.
I would say cakeism, but this way more deluded. I wonder what they are so desperate to evade? It wouldn't be the new tax laws.....
Really? After the failed 'coup', is anyone still giving credence to the ERG's demands?
By anyone do you mean the pm who needs every vote she can find?
If you want to have a say in the rules, stay a member. Simple. Don't have a transition period as a second class rule taker, revoke A50, plan, agee and prepare to Leave without a transition deal. The ERG are avoiding the obvious Leave tactic, because they know that once you agree a way to Leave… membership will look preferable to the majority of … well … us.
Anyone who was worried that the ERG was likely to fold and vote for May's deal should be reassured that they are doubling down with even more ludicrous demands instead. They might as well have required that the EU parliament sing the UK national anthem at the start of each session. Which bit of "leave means leave" do you think they struggle to understand?
Eurosceptic Conservative MPs have warned Theresa May that maintaining a veto over laws that the EU might enact during the transition period after Brexit is a “red line” for negotiations.
If you want to have a say in the rules, stay a member. Simple. Don't have a transition period as a second class rule taker, revoke A50, plan, agee and prepare to Leave without a transition deal. The ERG are avoiding the obvious Leave tactic, because they know that once you agree a way to Leave… membership will look preferable to the majority of … well … us.
Family time over Xmas has (surprisingly) revealed that the Leavers would vote Remain in a referendum next year, even those who still think that long term we should Leave. Everyone wants the clock stopped. No one trusts the current government, or any alternative government that could be formed in 2019, to be able to avoid a messy subservient outcome next year.
The ERG are fundamentalist zealots. In the same unhinged manner as the most hardline ISIS extremist. They’re brainwashed with their own insane ideology and simply will nor compromise under any circumstances.
Trying to reason with them
Is utterly pointless. And making concessions to them simply provokes the next list of demands
The only thing May can do is call their bluff. She won’t, of course
But she has to, in the sense that she has no other deal to offer. She cannot back down on behalf of the EU.
Apologies for the double post. I edited the first one, and got a bonus second post. Another fun forum quirk, it seems.
binners
The ERG are fundamentalist zealots. In the same unhinged manner as the most hardline ISIS extremist. They’re brainwashed with their own insane ideology and simply will nor compromise under any circumstances...
I think there's a simpler answer.
They either stand to benefit personally by the UK not being held to account by the EU on tax evasion or market manipulation, or they are in the pay of billionaires who would benefit.
The English upper classes are selling out England, just like their Scottish counterparts did to Scotland in 1707.
Follow the money.
They’re the hardest right of the free-marketeers.
All they see is how much more money them and there mates could be making once free from pesky things like workers rights and environmental controls. How much less tax they’d Have to pay if they could tear up the existing social contract...
Anyone sick of hearing about Brexit?
Yes. I'm also getting to the point where I'm past caring what happens even though I know that's a dangerous place to be.
I think it's a mistake to believe that it's all about money. Some are motivated by personal gain but for many it's more of a group identity thing. I work in climate science and it's the same with climate sceptics (who incidentally overlap strongly with brexiteers, tobacco denialists, Obama birthers and other right wing extremists). It's not about money or even "belief" really, it's about alignment with a group that has specific shibboleths. If you can say "leave means leave" or "Obama is a Kenyan" then you're in the club.
I think there’s a simpler answer.
They either stand to benefit personally by the UK not being held to account by the EU on tax evasion or market manipulation, or they are in the pay of billionaires who would benefit.
The English upper classes are selling out England, just like their Scottish counterparts did to Scotland in 1707.
Follow the money.
In terms of people who support Brexit, I think there are the following groupings.
1. The short-term currency hedgers. They make an instant killing every time something volatile happens (especially when they are given a tip off by someone in a position to tell them when to place their bets). Evaluation = sane but utterly cynical and don’t give a shit beyond the next currency trade.
2. The longer-term spivs who want to profit personally, but also have a dogmatic political hatred of public services. These people want to bring education, but especially the NHS, to its knees. The services will then ‘fail’ and the argument for private investment grows. When segments of the NHS have been hived off and put out to tender, the vultures move in with seemingly amazing tenders. On being awarded a slice of the action they make a monumental **** up of it, whilst taking enormous dividend and exec salaries, and it then has to be taken back by the public purse to be rescued. The culprits, meanwhile, are left untouched, and even if they are, the dosh is offshore. Evaluation = sane up to a point, but unhinged and very cynical and don’t give a shit about everyday people.
3. The politically committed. Mostly xenophobic nationalists who don’t have the first idea how the world works. They will be pissed off when more brown people arrive to offset the lesser number of Europeans coming to the UK to work, but as their primary motive is hatred of anything internationalist or collaborative, they can’t see anything beyond the next opportunity to stab any part of a liberal consensus. Evaluation = stupid, but more because they think they understand the world, but actually don’t have a ****ing clue.
4. The terminally thick who believe everything in the Daily Mail and think the 1950s are some kind of ideal. Evaluation = thick as pig shit but difficult to blame as to be culpable you need to have some kind of thoughts. These people are incapable of any kind of critical thought.
And that’s about it. You either need to be cynical, unhinged, greedy, racist, xenophobic or downright thick to support Brexit now. Of course various combinations of the above are permissible.
Just to add to number 2 above. If the Tories are ousted when Brexit proves to be a monumental mistake, watch the number of MPs who have just lost their seat who take up senior positions, or non exec directorships, or paid ‘advisory roles’ with the firms that stand to benefit.
I see one of the ex-leaders of UKIP is now putting the case for an English Independence referendum, ie out of the EU and the UK, and leave the rump of the UK as Scotland, NI, and maybe Wales.
Whats that, how much do you need? What do you want?
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/28/pm-accused-brexit-deal-desperation-john-redwood-honour
I've been reading through some fairly inspirational people who have dome things to help and inspire people being recognised in the honours list but that one stinks.
Why those migrants are still trying to enter the UK?
I thought there would be a stop to illegal immigration with Brexit.
I see one of the ex-leaders of UKIP is now putting the case for an English Independence referendum, ie out of the EU and the UK, and leave the rump of the UK as Scotland, NI, and maybe Wales.
I found this article in the Express. It made little sense so I checked her comments on Facebook. She literally cannot string 2 coherent sentences together. Her posts come across as if she is drunk.
There is a stop to illegal immigration now, that is why they are being stopped. Nothing to do with Brexit but the Brexiters probably try and link it in somehow due to the inherent issue with anything not 100% British.
How are you going to stop illegal immigration?
Another Brexshitters deluded fantasy.
This guy seems to be type 1and 2 from above. Shameful
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/28/crispin-odey-hedge-fund-bets-against-uk-economy-brexit-profit-falls?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other
He's another John Redwood.
How are you going to stop illegal immigration?
Good border controls, detailing who has come into the country and why. If they have not checked back out of the country then go find them and kick them out. Would cost a lot of money to do it properly for very little gain (but as you say would be a Brexiters wet dream)
epicyclo
Subscriber
I see one of the ex-leaders of UKIP is now putting the case for an English Independence referendum, ie out of the EU and the UK, and leave the rump of the UK as Scotland, NI, and maybe Wales.
To be fair, she's the same one that said they'd solve the national debt overnight by printing loads of money, and when asked about the inflation impact asked the interviewer "Would there be any impacts? We'd have to look into that"
And crazily she is still and elected MEP.
When I phoned them up, UKIP had never heard of the 30% tax on chocolate that the WTO would impose on us.
They agreed it was unfair and said they would look into it.
As yet they've not called me back.
