It certainly puts practically every other European country to shame if all the UK has managed over many decades is one solitary anti-immigration MP.
we all know thats beacuse of our rigged voting system
So you're not interested in a discussion you only want to insult me? Then why reply at all?
Anyway, back on track re polls: It has occurred to me that they aren't actually attempting to predict the result; just predict voting intentions. We still have many times more 'don't knows' than would be required to swing it either way, and the polls don't seem to be predicting how they will end up voting.
I seem to remember hearing that don't knows tend to favour the status quo.. if so then remain would be in the bag surely? Maybe this is what the bookies are looking at?
So you're not interested in a discussion you only want to insult me? Then why reply at all?
The only thing I was interested in was challenging your absurd claim that the UK is "quite xenophobic", when all the evidence shows that not to be the case.
If you think that me challenging something which is patently untrue represents an insult then you need to toughen up mate.
I genuinely doubted that you understood what xenophobia mean. So at the risk of insulting you further here is a definition I found on google :
xenophobia
z?n??f??b??/
noun
noun: xenophobiadislike of or prejudice against people from other countries.
"racism and xenophobia are steadily growing in Europe"
61/44
@dmorts you are the Greek Minister of finance and I claim by €350 billion 🙂
@Junky I said months ago this would be the first big debate on here I've been on the losing side of but I am now confident we are going to win
@kimbers 52/48 Leave there will be an almighty fudge, we won't actually leave. EU will come up with a temporary fudge on free movement or at least allow us not to pay any benefits for 4 years. Anyway some superficial
Nonsense and we won't trigger Article 50
Just saw my middle daughter for a quick lunch and she was sporting her IN badge with pride
To be honest, and I can't speak for anyone else, as a Scot I find I am loved for my race/nationality most of the way round the globe - the bits I've been to anyway. And only until they get to know me of course.
I don't personally find mainland Europe xenophobic. Maybe they're nasty to other people of course.
anti-immigration MP.
We have no anti-immigration MPs and a very large number who think control is necessary. See the Labour mug from 2015 posted by ninfan
Listen to the children Jamba. Unless your other children are quitters, in which case listen to your middle daughter - she has to live with it longer than you.
The only thing I was interested in was challenging your absurd claim that the UK is "quite xenophobic", when all the evidence shows that not to be the case.
Assuming I don't know what it means is an insult to my intelligence. As is posting the dictionary definition of which I am well aware.
I won't play that game against you, it's not my style; however I would point out that whilst many people, probably the majority in the UK are not xenophobic as you point out, there are is clearly (to me) a sizeable minority who would put British people first. To me, this is xenophobia. And despite your bluster, there are no simple hard facts where population sentiments are concerned.
Your tone comes across as very nasty. If this is not intended then perhaps you should think about how you come across. If it is intended, then stop it.
I said months ago this would be the first big debate on here I've been on the losing side of but I am now confident we are going to win
As usual you will be wrong but at least this time you will have to accept it 😉
Its going to be much closer than expected but I think remain will just edge then again neither result will be that much of a massive surprise
its surprising that fear of foreigners is greater than fear of financial doom
Really shit campaign though and hard to see how bridges will be built afterwards whatever happens
PS I am out all day Friday so either way I wont be on here to be ridiculed or to rejoice.
@igm I am proud to have raised by kids to be independent, they are all registered and will be voting tomorrow. Their overriding factor is support for freedom of movement, allowing poor people to come to the UK to earn money to support their families and improve their lives. My eldest is the funniest and as she said she had no problem getting work in Spain despite 25% youth unemployment as she noted many young Spanish don't really want to work and would rather do nothing than take a "tough" job. Hats off to freedom of movement eh ?
Well if you were a plumber who is now unemployed as a direct result of the oversupply of plumbers due to EU immigration then you have been directly affected by the policy and would feel justified in feeling aggrieved at the immigration policy. The problem with free movement is that we cannot control or match the skills the country needs to the skills of the immigrants coming into the country. The result is that in some industries there is massive oversupply e.g. plumbers, so affected indiginous british people feel the immigrants are taking their jobs, or driving their wages down. Whereas on the other side we are struggling for key skills in other industries and we are unable to recruit from non-EU nations e.g. Engineers, Scientists etc.
I think the net benefits of migration are beneficial - I think that has basically been proved beyond all doubt by now, but I can sympathise with the view of a British plumber if they disagree and want to vote leave - I personally havn't been affected but they have. That's not Xenephobia.
so how does the actual vote work, will we get results in like a GE?
Jamba - like it. I'm at the other end of that employment thing in that I've been trying to employ engineers just recently. Decent jobs, as in a training scheme that pays about the average UK salary on day one and it goes up from there. Can I find good quality UK kids to do that job? Even with freedom of movement I'm struggling to fill posts. Taken on some good Greek kids but not enough.
If you are an unemployed plumber, you are not very good at it.
Conversely if you are a good, unemployed plumber in the York area, what do you know about solar water?
oversupply of plumbers
Just move to Wales, when i was re-doing bathroom & kitchen had real difficulties getting hold of a plumber who wasn't over-booked
Your tone comes across as very nasty. If this is not intended then perhaps you should think about how you come across. If it is intended, then stop it.
I think you should take his advice and toughen up - the man is blunt (which is rather refreshing) but not nasty.
arent most brexiters retired anyway?
In my workplace- cancer research lab- we are not only dependent on EU funding (about 20%) but also scientists pathologists and bioinformaticians in particular are highly sought after, recruiting globally is the only way to ensure we get the best candidates, recruiting from within the EU is much easier and cheaper for us.
We have many europeans here and they are quite shocked by the level of xenophobia that this campaign has unearthed.
so in my entire institute I dont know of anyone backing Out, apart from 1 junior doctor, who is constantly having to defend his position to bemused colleagues here and on his hospital shifts;
this is what he sees in work every day [img] 
[/img]
fwiw my parents are out (had a few arguments there) one brother out, 1 in, my inlaws all in
and on my facebook friends 90% in
Its more the whole economic suicide thing I've got an issue with
Avoiding economic suicide is one of my main reasons for voting Leave. Whatever Cameron says being in the EU is exactly like being shackled to a corpse
arent most brexiters retired anyway?
Far from it, as @welsh said 80% farmers, fishing community, low-skilled and unskilled workers plus unemployed all pro-Leave
I'm so pro IN its quite astonishing.
Serious question now, does anyone know what will happen to EU national if Brexit win?
Get visa I guess?
simons_nicolai-uk - Member
Why I am voting Remain.
by Ben Goldacre, aged 41.
A smaller democracy will not be “more representative”.
The UK government is no more under your control
Best contribution. All the Nationalist Little Englander Farrage clones should read it. Then go away and think about it before saying ANYTHING ELSE.
Best contribution. All the Nationalist Little Englander Farrage clones should read it.
Racist!
There's some narrow minded bigots over here in Wales too!!! 👿
Best contribution. All the Nationalist Little Englander Farrage clones should read it. Then go away and think about it before saying ANYTHING ELSE.
In all honesty it's a distilled version of the postings from remain in here, leave are mostly fingers in ears whenever facts are mentioned.
Anyway Thursday beckons, it will happen, my Friday at work will be spend watching the totals roll in and hopefully see common sense prevail.
As an aside on the racist theme, a lot of people like to pain Australia as a racists spot (where I live at the moment) it can be, but my time in the NW and other areas tells me the UK has a long way to go before becoming an open and inclusive society. People fear change, thats a motto that leave have used to sum up not leaving. In reality it's a phrase that applies to them. The UK has changed and evolved for the better with immigration and diversity, it has grown multiculturaly and started to move towards a better place. Keep going and don't stop, borders will be consigned to history, the world needs less barriers not more.
Serious question now, does anyone know what will happen to EU national if Brexit win?
Get visa I guess?
I hope so, otherwise my company will lose several good engineers.
Given the 1.3 million UK citizens living in the rest of Europe I imagine some kind of deal would need to be struck.
I wouldn't worry though because any post-exit trade deal we made with Europe would likely involve signing up to (rejoining) the European Free Trade Association and agreeing to the free movement of workers, [url= https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway%E2%80%93European_Union_relations ]just like Norway does[/url]. 😀
I'm so pro IN its quite astonishing.
Pint Thursday ? I'll put a sweatshirt over my Vote Leave Tee
my Friday at work will be spend watching the totals roll in and hopefully see common sense prevail.
How are the results going to be announced? By constituency or just the final result with a big drum roll?
Serious question now, does anyone know what will happen to EU national if Brexit win?
Get visa I guess?
Nothing at all, they have a legal right to remain. I suspect many will stay 7 years and thus get a UK passport.
TBH what we have heard nothing about is how will freedom of movement work the day after we trigger Article 50 as we remain a member of the EU for a further 2 years. I wonder if they'll try and vote down our rebate ?
How are the results going to be announced? By constituency or just the final result with a big drum roll?
By constituency, Sunderland expected to be first at 2am
The result will be announced by having it tattooed on Borises bare, spotty arse, then firing him naked out of a big cannon, over the Houses of Parliament, while the worlds media gasps in awe at British democracy in action
I want to know if it affects the Tour de Yorkshire, French run as it is.
The result will be announced by having it tattooed on Borises bare, spotty arse, then firing him naked out of a big cannon, over the Houses of Parliament, while the worlds media gasps in awe of British democracy in action
Doing the rounds on Facebook 😆
friday's going to be amazing! i'm going to wake up in my Union Jack jim-jams to the sound of a squadron of Spitfires racing overhead and leaving a trail of hot buttered crumpets behind themI'll run to the corner shop past all the british children who are laughing and squealing with excitement as they make a beautiful statue of the queen out of happy wriggling bulldog puppies - with two corgis for her eyebrows!
bunting flutters everywhere and the man from the betting shop steps into the street - "guess what! England just won the World Cup & The Ashes & The Grand National and here's the best bit - Boris put a bet on it for everyone! you're all MILLIONAIRES!!!"
the red arrows fly overhead dropping fish and chips as i walk into the corner shop, get my morning paper and go to the counter. "how much please?" i say to the asian lad there. "1 pence, everything in the whole shop now costs just 1p!" he laughs, "leave it on the counter, i'm off back to ****stan - we all are!"
and he's right! outside in the streets jolly old nigel farage is leading a huge crowd of happy foreigners - turks, poles, romanians, syrians - there's even a few English people with heavy suntans mixed up in there! nigel's playing Rule Britannia on a long pipe, rather like the pipe that takes the gas into your oven, and they're all following and smiling and talking foreign, bless them!
just then boris flies overhead in a concorde made of Bank of England gold - "don't worry!" he laughs "I've cut out all the bits the French made!" and with that he crashes into the ground at 1200 miles an hour, along with the economy, the country and all the dozy nostalgic foreigner-fearing ****wits who fell for his bullshit.
grow up. wake up.
How are the results going to be announced
[img] 
[/img]
@ Jamba I have been here nearly 20 years, and I don't intend to get a British passport.
Planning to move back to rural France in the near future anyway but was just wondering if it would affect my current position.
Keep drinking the EU koolaid man. You're doing well . . .
Koolaid?
Nah.
I think you're the one whose been on the hallucinogens..
The very idea that the EU has secretly chosen the UK as a dumping ground for all & any refugees, which you have totally failed to back up by the way with any proof, is enough to convince me that you're this guy:
[img] 
[/img]
The result will be announced by having it tattooed on Borises bare, spotty arse, then firing him naked out of a big cannon, over the Houses of Parliament, while the worlds media gasps in awe at British democracy in action
I'd stay up to watch that!
Can they do it constituency by constituency....
grow up. wake up.
🙂
when is someone going to mention 10 billion savings is really not very much? - buys you 1/5 of RBS - would take 85 years to pay off the 2008 bailout (not including interest).
buys you 1/5 of RBS
About a half now
when is someone going to mention 10 billion savings is really not very much?
Probably about the same time that someone mentions that 184,000 people a year (our EU net migration) is only 0.28% of our population and isn't actually very much.
buys you 1/5 of RBS
Yeah, but what's that in imperial hospitals?
or 20% of trident - point is there is money there if they wanted it.
Claiming leaving EU is going to sort out public services is a red herring.
problem is all the numbers, economists, stats, campaigning etc just dont bother some people
its a gut feeling about taking back control from the foreigners
Claiming leaving EU is going to sort out public services is a red herring.
It's also patently untrue as GDP will take a massive hit post Brexit (according to 99% of all Economists).
