It really feels like she’s ‘banning’ herself from realising life can be fun.
Random thought here - solo hobbies / interests aside, do you do fun stuff together? If her life is all "work" and she sees you out "having fun" then I can see how she might be a little resentful. Not that that excuses her behaviour, mind.
Ohh, and get Google calendar on your phones if you don't already.
It's great being able to stick all my racing in the calendar in advance, that ways we both know what's coming up, and it's not a surprise to her when I say I'm off at the weekend whilst at the same time diffuses any argument along the lines of "you're always away" because we can both see the calendar and it's less than once a month at most, and outnumbered by the number of "Prosecco with the girls in London" type events!
Some ligamental issues, which really affect her chosen hobby significntly
You are both athletes like me and mrs rocket *cough*
When she's injured she never asks me about any run/ride and when I'm crocked I stay glued to Netflix when she comes in with a phone full of QOMs
When we're both crocked we only talk to the cat
When we're both ok we discuss training plans and how to save 0.3 seconds
I think another issue is that she's terrible at talking about things.
She freely admits her family (parents and siblings) were never there for her, so she's learnt to just 'keep it bottled up' and she admits that she feels everyone just disapoints her.
As such, it's as if she's waiting for me to disapoint. Which of course I invariably will (hey..I'm only human after all..) and then that simply confirms her fears about people.
I try to make time for us, but with 2 kids, a paucity of childminders, and the fact she frequently works into the evenings, our hours are limited at the best of times..
If you can’t do this, or nothing changes, you’re into the realms of either counselling or walking away. With any partner you have to ask, is she / he enriching my life, or making it worse? If the latter, why are you both together? Do the pros outweigh the cons?
I think this..frequently..
DrP
Sheesh fella...you're not exactly filling us with hope for the future for you guys.
My first marriage involved me playing a lot of sport and her not! I always argued that I played sport when I met her, so why would she expect it to change! Besides, its good to have your own space in a marriage with your own interests and friends! However, that marriage didn't last, despite me giving up 50% of them, when our child arrived.
Second marriage and its a different dynamic, in that she has her own stuff and doesn't worry about me doing what I want to do. Now I think, I can't remember a proper argument in the last 15 years....some petty bickering, but nothing involving full on shouting at each other. That makes me feel a bit fortunate!
I try to make time for us
Do or do not, there is no "try."
Seriously, I don't believe that you can't make time to spend an evening or a weekend doing something fun together, even if you have to schedule it weeks in advance. That's not a partnership, that's existing together. It doesn't have to be extravagant even - when was the last time you packed the kids off to bed and snuggled up on the couch with a bottle of fizz and a good movie? When was the last time you brought her flowers home for no reason? Come to that, when was the last time she did that for you? (Note, this may backfire if the response is going to be "what's this for, what have you done?")
And +1 for the Google Calendar. You can create a shared calendar you can both access, you can plan ahead and prevent double-bookings. We adopted a policy of "if it's not in the calendar, it doesn't exist" and it worked really well.
She freely admits her family (parents and siblings) were never there for her, so she’s learnt to just ‘keep it bottled up’ and she admits that she feels everyone just disapoints her.
The fact she recognises it is a start. This sounds like the sort of thing counselling / CBT might be able to help with, maybe?
This is a sad thread and agree with Cougar that a talking therapy is needed but has to be the right type. Issues from childhood can stay with you, it may be tricky for her to open up so a therapist asking the right questions/able to draw out responses is imperative. Doing nothing can not be an option.
Wives getting all agro because Husbands (it’s usually that way around) are spending time they could spend staring at their phones whilst the TV is on at the same time as them on other things is as old as marriage. That’s usually what it boils down to – ‘selfishness’."
This so much. Mine moans that I have loads of free time to enjoy myself while she doesn't but sits in front of the TV flicking through Facebonk on her phone.
Seriously, get some couples counselling! What's the worst that can happen.....
It's a very relatable situation. I think trying to keep any competitive sport going through the small child phase is tough.
You and I have raced in the same events over the last few years OP - although I prefer gears; ) - and with a toddler and soon to be newborn I guess I have an inkling of what you are trying to balance and I do find it a struggle.
The other half is really quite reasonable about me racing and riding this season, but it has been our single biggest cause of friction over the last 10 years. Similar to you, its been a case of her not having a comparable hobby / time commitment to something, but I did also take it too far in the past.
Things I did that were my fault included being obsessed with riding further away - Wales, FoD etc (we live in the south east) so riding would regularly involve a long day out almost every week. In my situation now, especially as a one car family, that would be too much. But it doesn't sound like you are doing this! I ride after kid bedtime (like you) but also get an afternoon at weekends, a luxury I think will stop with a newborn. So you don't sound like you are asking for too much, in comparison.
I also stopped racing XC and Brass Monkeys. I now have winter off and am only doing a few (five?) races this summer. Having the winter off seems to make my Spring / Summer commitments look more restrained and there's less perception I am constantly on the bike or training 🙂
I sat down with her in January and marked the events I wanted to do in the calendar, which we agreed before I paid for entries. I'm also with the folk who suggested that it's important to fight your corner on this, once you are confident that you aren't being unreasonable.
I likewise feel I could do a lot more and I really enjoy riding at the moment. I'm dealing with this by looking at it as a phase. While we have babies and young toddlers, I think I am doing well to keep riding, racing and enjoying it. In a few years time the pressure will reduce (maybe!) but I've seen so many friends quit the sport entirely when family arrives that maybe you should also be proud of what you are achieving and not beat yourself up about doing more / better, but that isn't a criticism.
You get tuesday evening for a ride then offer her wednesday evening for whatever she wants.
Cougar... RE "Seriously, I don’t believe that you can’t make time to spend an evening or a weekend doing something fun together, even if you have to schedule it weeks in advance. That’s not a partnership, that’s existing together. It doesn’t have to be extravagant even – when was the last time you packed the kids off to bed and snuggled up on the couch with a bottle of fizz and a good movie?"
I wholeheartedly agree with you on this... I love to chill and just hang out on the sofa also.. However, genuinely, in her eyes it feels that just 'hanging out at home' isn't doing something, thus doesn't count...
I dunno... clearly with 2 kids and busy jobs, we can't live life like we're students (Out boozing every evening, lying in till midday) but it seems what we CAN do isn't good enough....
Will try the counselling route..again..
DrP
My first marriage involved me playing a lot of sport and her not! I always argued that I played sport when I met her, so why would she expect it to change! Besides, its good to have your own space in a marriage with your own interests and friends!
The classic being men marry a woman and hope she stays the same, women marry a man hoping he will change 😉
It sounds like she's depressed.
If you want to sort things out, you need to drop your rides for a bit and listen to her. Have a long heart to heart, don't arrange to go out, don't try and rush her into it, but try and be a bit more sympathetic to how she's feeling and what the root of this all is.
If she's still unwillng to try and break any ground, perhaps you need to talk about drawing a line under things as you're not working anymore, but don't make that a thing unless you're 100% commited to it being a thing, because otherwise it'll break the both of you.
Oh and be warned, she might have a hell of a lot to tell you that you might not want to hear, some of which might knock you for six.
There's a reason so many people "want a quiet life". These situations are seldom an easy fix.
Best of luck
Hmmmm Pidge. Genuinely surprised at this. Maybe if coming on here, then might do to get some proper professional help, individually yourself or as a couple?
It sounds like she’s depressed.
Or she's just a bitch 🙂
Ride less?
Genuinely, how much time do yo spend cycling and fettling in a week? set some time aside for a date night or something.
I wholeheartedly agree with you on this… I love to chill and just hang out on the sofa also.. However, genuinely, in her eyes it feels that just ‘hanging out at home’ isn’t doing something, thus doesn’t count…
So how about something more interactive, then you're doing something rather than just "hanging out" together. Board games maybe? Modern board games are great, we've come a long way since Scrabble and Monotony.
You get tuesday evening for a ride then offer her wednesday evening for whatever she wants.
She actually fits in lots of her own things, now i think about it.. Ballet on a monday eve (which I rush back from work for, to allow her to go)..had her nails done today.. fits in a weekly massage... :-/
I'm getting bored of the sound of my own voice offering her evenings to do things, TBH... I think it all boils down to the fact she can't do the activities she REALLY wants to do, and resents me for being able to do mine. Perhaps?
DrP
Wives getting all agro because Husbands (it’s usually that way around) are spending time they could spend staring at their phones whilst the TV is on at the same time as them on other things is as old as marriage. That’s usually what it boils down to – ‘selfishness’.”
This so much. Mine moans that I have loads of free time to enjoy myself while she doesn’t but sits in front of the TV flicking through Facebonk on her phone.
Yep, I think we've so far managed to mostly dodge that bullet at home, it's not always easy - I think Mrs Jay would prefer I was home every evening to keep her company, but oddly some nights we barely talk, it's not we're arguing or anything, it's just there's not much to talk about and he's usually elbow deep in some 'goss' with her mates from work via Whatsapp or FB. I try to get out once a week for an evening ride or just to hang out with one of my mates for a bit. I'm happy to say she's becoming quite close to a couple of mates from work, well they don't work together now which if anything helps so she can do the same. Sometimes a man just wants to eat supermarket cooked chicken with his hands and shoot Nazis in the face on the Xbox.
One 'thing' I often have to try to handle at home is that for me, 'Fair' doesn't mean always mean 'Equal' or 'Same'.
I sometimes have these slightly odd conversations like she's been negotiating on my behalf with herself. She wanted to go to NYC last summer to see her Sister, I encouraged her to go, but at one point she said "well, you did go to Canada with your mates" which I did years ago, 2010 or 11 I think. I don't think at any point I complained about her going, but it was like we'd pre-argued it and she'd successfully won on points.
set some time aside for a date night or something.
We did this for a bit, I think I over-did it slightly (its in my nature) I earmarked every Saturday night for a special meal, fancy wine etc, but sometimes life gets in the way I'd get argo if something got in the way.
Now it's sharing a few beers or wine which is, if anything nicer.
I am a truly awful person when I'm injured, IF I can't do any sport at all, i.e. I can't cycle or run or swim. I become completely unreasonable, ungrateful and can't enjoy anything. Fortunately (for my relationship) that's only been a couple of months in the past four years.
Is Mrs DrP not able to do any of her desired physical hobbies, long-term? Sounds like that's not quite the case if she can go to ballet, but it's a really ****** situation if so - and I could totally imagine behaving in the way you've described her as doing.
Not sure what the solution is if that's the case though 🙁
Maybe she doesn't like you very much anymore and maybe its mutual?
Difficult to overcome issues like those!
As an aside to the subject matter of this thread ..could I just point out that you don't have to be significantly overweight to be diabetic..it can be hereditary ..as in my case type 2 ..both parents ( one deceased ) are / were diabetic ..my brother who is of similar build is also type 2 ..while my sister who is paranoid about it does everything she can to combat it ..
Just saying ..😁
I know depression has been mentioned, but have you explored that? She may be mourning the loss of her activities/hobbies, and is expressing that as resentment towards you being able to do your activity.
My GF has run for her country, was passionate about running to the point that it was almost her raison d'etre. We even met through various running circles.
Then she was diagnosed with a condition that means she'll never run again. The sense of loss that I saw in my GF was akin to a bereavement and she fell into a very dark place for a period.
I tried no end of times to suggest to her things that she could try doing, when I just needed to be there and support her through the dark times.
[i]OwenP wrote:[/i]
It’s a very relatable situation.
A lot of very relatable things on here - the resentment at me spending time doing my sports being a thing, but I discovered that when I did a lot less than I had before nothing changed, that was simply a symptom. The big things I can relate to though are her being terrible at talking about things - we went to counselling and she still wouldn't open up, we stopped doing counselling because she didn't want to do any more because it appeared there were things she simply won't talk about (TBH I should have known then that the end was inevitable). That and the lack of doing anything fun together - we didn't have any sort of going out "date" for years when kids were small, and probably not much in the way of staying in or any appreciation of any effort I made, which I think killed any hope there might have been. To come back to the original issue though, we've barely argued at all - partly because I go into conflict avoidance, but I don't think it's just that, as she's not good at communicating she just built up resentment.
Anyway, I'm not sure how helpful my own issues are (though I think this thread has confirmed I'm doing the right thing - it's clear that spending time with her no longer enhances my life in any way). Though I'm feeling that there are a few obvious big red flag issues here - if you're not communicating properly and you're not having fun together then those really need fixing now whilst you still have the chance.
Can you post a MumsNet link to what she is saying about you please 🙂
The size of the chasm between perceptions sounds quite epic
I think it all boils down to the fact she can’t do the activities she REALLY wants to do, and resents me for being able to do mine. Perhaps?"
I'm going to say this 100%. I'm an awful person when injured and if I was told I had to stop completely and permanently I'm sure I'd be a wreck. We tie up a lot of our identity in activities. e.g Mountain Biker or Skier or Railway enthusiast that not being able to do it would cause huge issues. Last year I broke my shoulder and then sweamrs went way (on a previously booked) to a mountain bike stage race. I was never even going to do the race and had always planned to stay at home looking after sweajnr but all of a sudden I resented her having fun whilst I couldn't (despite the fact I was never going to do the race).
What did you do previously prior to kids / her injury? Maybe you both need to start doing something different a bit of the time (possibly board games per Cougar) but possibly something active. Ice skating? Tennis? Is childcare really so tough you can't get one night a month/fortnight free? If you're both equally novice at it then no worries about expectations etc.
Sweamrs and I are lucky we have same rough interests. Nothing says romance like a date night zwift once sweajnr is asleep.
We have our fair share, more lately and certainly more than I'd like — I don't buy any of that "an argument's good every now and then" BS.
It sounds like OP's other half is similar to mine in that she knows she wants to / ought to be doing something, but doesn't know what that "something" is. You get it in the neck because you know what your "something" is, and you're "being selfish" because you go out and do it whilst she stays at home not knowing what to do.
I gave up a career so that we could be together, and it has created a wedge between us that you don't notice most of the time; but mid-argument it becomes obvious. I had to stop a lot of the training I was doing so that I could work on an alternate career which fundamentally changed who I was.
A lot of our arguments are centered around the idea that "we're not being the people we want to be" and I suspect that it might be the same for you guys? If you feel like you're being held back from being truly competitive, you might have conveyed that, or even said it in an argument. That might cause her to feel guilty for holding you back, and in her mind stopping you from training makes you less likely to be competitive and therefore like she's not holding you back from anything special?
Also, my OH wants a similar situation to yours where I'm always at home, but not necessarily doing something together. Even being in a different room or working on my laptop is being "too distant", yet her FB & Instagram scrolling is perfectly acceptable whilst her crappy TV program is on in the background.
I called her out on it mid-argument once, and continue to remind her when she's ignoring me in favour of her phone. Calling her out on her double-standards and her behaviour that goes against what she says she wants has been a Good Thing for us; but it was a bit of a fraught road getting here.
I'd say the same as others have. It's all about communication. Even if it starts as an argument, try to talk over the same points later in a more reasoned manner. That way they become legitimate concerns and things you can work on/hold each other to, rather than just ammunition mid-argument.
Does she have any REAL friends? That she can go out and get pissed with / have a meal / go to a film? Just soemthing away from the home for a while? Everybody needs a pressure valve, Mrs B is noticeably more argumentative for no reason if she hasn't got out with the girls for a couple of weeks, or been unable to run for some reason. I'm probably exactly the same but don't acknowledge it.
I'm not sure I can help but I can certainly sympathise - your situation sounds shockingly similar (except the race winning bit!).
I average about a 2 hour local ride every 2-3 weeks and that is always resented as if mountain biking is another woman. Recently I didn't ride for 4 months; the first time back out got the same reaction even then.
It sounds to a man's brain like an easy problem to solve but it doesn't work like that. Give her lots of time to do what she wants to do and she doesn't use the opportunity "I didn't want to go for a bike ride" "I like just spending time with the kid(s)" etc. Response to a mountain bike ride might be "why don't you just go for a run for your exercise?" (I've never got any joy out of running, I mountain bike because I enjoy it, the fitness benefit is incidental).
I have never really reconciled myself with the idea that one person wouldn't get pleasure from their partner's happiness. To be quite honest the suggestion somewhere up there of depression or similar has long been my hunch but there are other issues too. Does she get what she wants from her job, or used to get from it pre-kids?
[i]jdumont7228 wrote:[/i]
We have our fair share, more lately and certainly more than I’d like — I don’t buy any of that “an argument’s good every now and then” BS.
It is if the alternative is never sorting out the issues and building up resentment, and provided you can settle your differences and make up afterwards (there's an obvious implication there, but it's not something I have any experience of, so I've no idea if it's a real thing...) rather than post argument turning into resentment.
Also, my OH wants a similar situation to yours where I’m always at home, but not necessarily doing something together. Even being in a different room or working on my laptop is being “too distant”, yet her FB & Instagram scrolling is perfectly acceptable whilst her crappy TV program is on in the background.
like looking in a mirror!!!
I guess this is one thing that bothers me! She can sit on the sofa, being 'mentally absent' doing work emails/social media etc (Aesthetic work is very social media based), but I'm not allowed to be physcially absent. Again, I wonder if it's because she claims it's works, so 'not fun'??
WIll try to ahve a chat about things tonight. Again, cheers for the input; both from those in a similar boat, and those with good suggestions x
DrP
OP, you are describing my life. If you find the answer please let me know.
she can’t do the activities she REALLY wants to do, and resents me for being able to do mine
I dunno what it is that she can't do, but it sounds sporty if injury has stopped it. Could she maybe get into coaching, reffing or something ? (obviously you can't suggest that but maybe someone else who knows her could)
Best of luck with it; I see quite a lot of "that sort of shit" in my marriage though it manifests a bit differently. Afraid I largely ignore it currently.
As old as the hills.
Many a man has succumbed to constantly keeping the peace in a never ending hostage negotiation, appeasing their partners escalating whims no matter how unreasonable, childish and selfish. Often ends in affairs/divorce or some kind of breakdown when keeping up the façade becomes untenable.
You often see it repeated when a new partner/next victim comes a long (some actively seek out partners who will put up with it) and you feel a bit sorry for them, as they're made to dance like a puppet.
Unfortunately you will have to have it out with her, discussing the causes and feelings involved, or it will carry on, with the goal posts constantly on the move. There needs to be some lateral movement on both sides! An understanding both of you have certain things, that make you what you are as individuals and there is no malice in the resultant actions that piss the other off. Setting out ways you can both tolerate doing the things you need to do to live a relatively happy life, including things you do together and separately to maintain/improve your relationship.
Not an easy discussion to have if the person is defensive, uses diversion and gets aggressive! The all too common retorts when difficult truths have to be dealt with.
Are you both happy with your sex life?
I've found that is the bedrock/keystone of a relationship. Without a good sex life frustration and resentment builds. And it is also a good barometer of how your relationship is. Sex life was good, but now not? Suggests a problem.
YGH
(divorced)
Hora? Is that you?
I pretty much agree with what lunge and martinhutch said on page 1 so I won’t repeat that.
However, my jaw dropped at several ridiculous comments that women are generally selfish and waste their time sitting on the sofa staring at their phones while watching junk on tv, and would prefer to scoff ice cream instead of solving their problems. You didn’t choose your partners very well! Mr Pea and I go biking together and if we didn’t, I’d be out there anyway, not watching tv!
This is markoulinis wife. This sounds similar to our situation (although perhaps not to the same degree). In my case feelings of frustration towards my OH usually are just projections of feelings of frustration about myself. I am feeling frustrated, angry with myself and my situation and this comes out badly to the ones closest to me. Offers of 'quick fixes/solutions' to my problem, like find a new hobby, also infuriate me because they usually mean 'your attitude causes ME a problem. You need to get a grip asap because I am affected by this negativity and I don't like it'. In other words, it's as if you're saying 'it's all about ME!'
Instead of offering 'solutions', which she is already aware of herself, my advice would be to preoccupy yourself with understanding why she feels angry/frustrated/ worried. Have many discussions and really listen to her. But not just that, because don't expect that you will ask once and she will just be happy and willing to spill her most inner and scary thoughts. Really<span style="font-size: 0.8rem;"> try to understand what's troubling her. Sometimes even vocalising your worries can be a scary thought because you are also trying to hide them from your own self. So talking about them to someone else is difficult. If and when she will talk to you, just listen and try to empathise and understand. Don't jump into trying to solve her problems! (See previous point). </span>
Sorry for the essay and i hope this helps
I think what you are describing are symptoms not causes. something else is the cause.
Mrs TJ and I do not argue often these days - 38 years together and disgustingly happy most of the time. We have a real partnership of equals and have explicitly discussed issues that annoy the other and found solutions to these issues even if they are only armed truces! sometimes you just have to accept some things "just are" and learn to live with them. For example - MrsTJ would always save for a rainy day, I would always blow my money on fripperies and live on potato soup the rest of the month. We compromise somewhere in the middle and don't let the others attitude annoy us.
When we do have rows it does tend to be pretty explosive to the point we did seek professional help good few years ago
for me this is one =for couples counselling if you cannot discuss the issues
vickypea / markoulini I agree with.
Tj- have you got a recipe for potato soup 😉
From reading your posts here DrP I have to say that it sounds like you're describing my marriage in many respects but without the kids or the winning bike races.
We went through similar problems for a couple if years or so and tried anything I could to sort them out but to no avail. I pretty much stopped racing the bike, would only ride on weekdays when I was off work (shift worker) so we could have weekends together, tried getting her more involved with my hobbies or trying to help her find some if her own but nothing helped. We tried counselling but in all honesty it was a waste of time.
The toughest decision I ever had to make was the choice between me spending even more time and effort trying to fix things or walking away. I realised that walking away was the best option so that the problems didn't end up ruining my life as well as hers.
The funny thing was that we never actually argued as such, we'd have some disagreements now and again but never anything major.
I hope you manage to get things sorted out DrP as it's a horrible situation to be in.
