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I've heard some stupid things at work,
i)went from my usual head-down-get-on-with-it self to incredulous fury in 0.0006 seconds recently when my supervisor said
"Jews control Hollywood and have made the Nazis look worse than they were, and there aren't any WW2 films where Germans aren't Nazis"
(shock on his face and the only other person in the office at the time was priceless)
ii)spent 20 minutes trying to explain to my boss that Al Murray (as the Pub Landlord) was ripping the piss out of his views, not agreeing with them,
iii)large South Asian population in the town I work in so predictable bulleffluent about p**** everywhere, usually go for the simple "how do you know where they're from, did you ask them?"
Lifer the Jews may well control Hollywood just like Gay people control the media, its just peoples assumptions, just because theyre popuular and well paid, you see very few poor jews and even fewer poor gay people, its all down to jealousy and lack of understanding.
Sometimes people see racism where its not,ask your foreign freinds if theyre offended if you have any foreign freinds.
+1 on what phil said.
I used to work with a Turkish girl who was extremley racist towards Greeks. I understood it was down to those countries differences. It was considered by her to be a normal part of Turkish life to hold a racist manifesto towards Greeks. I don't fully understand those countries differences, and nothing I could do would change her deep rooted opinions. I made it clear I wouldn't join in any racism and if we worked alongside each other to keep her beef to herself.
My White mate is dating a black girl, he often gets racist comments but when he stands up and people see his 6'4 bodybuilders frame the comments usualy stop quick.
My mum's side of the family is racist to its core- you won't change their views and it's not really worth trying IME.
Everyone's a little bit racist sometimes. They wrote a song about it I think.
[i]So thank **** for the Klux Ku Klan eh ?[/i]
That's not what I meant, but I suspect you know that.
[i]Racist jokes get passed around all the time ,it doesn't make you racist if you laugh does it?.Do you laugh at jokes about the Irishman Englishman and Scotsman?[/i]
Given they are all essentially the same race I don't see how the jokes can be racist?
Personally I enjoy jokes about the Scots, and tell plenty myself, and I am one. I'm quite happy to play along with the drunken skinflint stereotype.
That's not what I meant, but I suspect you know that.
So bearing in mind that the title of this thread is [b]"Dealing with racism"[/b] what [i]exactly[/i] did you mean by this :
[i]"People are entitled to their own views. I've got loads of friends who I disagree with on lots of things, but generally speaking we accept the other's point of view. If everyone thought/spoke/acted the same way the world would be a duller place."[/i]
As the particular "view" we are discussing here is racism, you are very clearly suggesting to the OP that "the world would be a duller place" if some people didn't have racist views.
Otherwise I can't see the point of your comment.
I meant that if the price we have to pay for freedom of thought/speech is the KKK (and I do agree they are knuckle dragging morons) then it's a price worth paying.
And the point of my other comment is that the world would indeed be a duller place if we all thought the same way, or acted the same way, or had the same culture, or the same likes and dislikes.
My point isn't about racism per se, it's about tolerance, and how true tolerance means accepting not everyone thinks the same way (and yes I do accet the irony in that statement, in that people like the KKK and the BNP are amongst the least tolerant around).
yes odd you seem to tolerate diversity of opinion but also to let people dislike diversity of people.
The world would be a fairer and nicer place if people were not racist- it would not be duller unless you think the BNP,Combat 18,NF and EDL bring a bit of joy to the world with their colourful [see what I did there] opinions on race.
EDIT: Written before reading your post above.
ow true tolerance means accepting not everyone thinks the same way
You are right but we dont need to tolerate the intolerable nor tolerate those who are intolerant
is racism just a british thing?
is racism just a british thing?
Definitely not!
is racism just a british thing?
i think they might have had a slight problem with it in germany once, but i'm not sure.
Just yorkshire iirc
is racism just a british thing?
Typical racist comment.
ernie, you sussed me.
i am the most racist biggoted person i know........just ask on here.
they will all agree wth me........ 😀
unfortunately junkyard you can't be a tolerant society with a freedom of speech and then exclude certain groups because of their loathsome views.
I used to part of the ANL and AFA and come to realise that by meeting intolerance and bigotry with further intolerance and violent clashes we were no better than the thugs we were combating.
Reasoned debate and argument is the only way forward but there will always be an element of human nature that seeks to differentiate along tribal lines, whether that be race, religion, football team, sub culture etc..
you cannot stop hatred and bigotry by banning it in a public forum it has to bee seen as the nasty filth it is.
project - MemberLifer the Jews may well control Hollywood just like Gay people control the media, its just peoples assumptions, just because theyre popuular and well paid, you see very few poor jews and even fewer poor gay people, its all down to jealousy and lack of understanding.
Sometimes people see racism where its not,ask your foreign freinds if theyre offended if you have any foreign freinds.
I think there's a point in there someone but damned if I know what it is.
nasty filth to one is the opposite to another.
Having seen it from many viewpoints you need to realise it's not going to go away. Ever.
It's a part of life and you need to deal with it.
Fortunately in the UK we are quite sheltered from it all. But we are tiny in the big old bad word...
unfortunately junkyard you can't be a tolerant society with a freedom of speech and then exclude certain groups because of their loathsome views.
Yes but you can and should challenge those views.
zedsdead..........nail on the head. 8)
you can't be a tolerant society with a freedom of speech and then exclude certain groups because of their loathsome views.
well of course freedom of speech means I have to stand up to allow [ oh why cant we swear on here] those I oppose most to have this right - even those who , if they got power, would deny it to me. I agree
We should never tolerate it though.
[i]You are right but we dont need to tolerate the intolerable nor tolerate those who are intolerant [/i]
I'm afraid we do need to tolerate it. By all means argue against what you don't agree with, but don't seek to ban viewpoints just because you dislike them.
kennyp - Member
...I enjoy jokes about the Scots, and tell plenty myself, and I am one. I'm quite happy to play along with the drunken skinflint stereotype.
Me too, especially when it's my round... 🙂
see post above yours - I agree re freedom of speech. I wont tolerate it in the sense I wont let it go unchallenged - see my first post re this- I have not mentioned banning
being the butt of your own jokes is one thing other people making your race /nationality the butt of them is another thing all together.
It is some way from thses sort of jokes to BNP memebership but every journey begins with the smallest step
[i]being the butt of your own jokes is one thing other people making your race /nationality the butt of them is another thing all together.
[/i]
Not sure totally I agree. I think it's more down to whether the joke is funny, or is being told just to be nasty about someone. A classic example is the one about ****stan being kicked out the World Cup because every time they got a corner they opened a shop. I've heard that joke described as "shocking" and "utterly racist" but to my mind it's just harmless humour. Equally, I'm quite content for non-Scots to make jokes about the Scots. Doesn't bother me one bit.
[i]It is some way from thses sort of jokes to BNP memebership but every journey begins with the smallest step[/i]
That's true, but if you think about it the reverse is also true. Say you outlaw the BNP, then by the "first step" argument you also end up outlawing jokes such as the one above.
Can I just say this thread is one of the reasons I love the STW forum? Many opportunities to descend into chaos, but didn't. Reading through posts above I genuinely found some further insight and perspectives I hadn't though of.
They believe that 100% of the people born in the part of the country are bad people. Pretty much her words. How else am I meant to assess that?
It sounds very much like she could be Bosnian referring to Serbs or Croats. Considering the recent history in that part of Europe, it's understandable that someone who has experienced hatred directed towards their particular ethnic group due to past historical religeous and political conflict would feel equal hatred towards those responsible. Under the circumstances I would find it difficult to try to convince her otherwise. Casual hatred of another ethnic/religeous group just because their God has a different book or they wear funny clothes or whatever is another matter altogether, and I refuse to accept any bigotry or racism on those grounds.
Earlier someone referred to a relative loathing the Japanese because of his experiences liberating POW's. My dad was a Japanese POW, in Changi, Singapore, a dreadful place to be incarcerated. He had a couple of books written about it, which I read, and he took me to see 'Bridge On The River Kwai', but he never spoke of his experiences to me, (he died when I was eleven), he left me to make my own mind up, and he even bought Japanese made binoculars. He never encouraged any racism in me, and, while I acknowledge the evils carried out by Japanese soldiers in the war, I also recognise the cultural background that led to it and harbour no ill feelings, quite the contrary; I've met quite a few Japanese who work at a friend's hotel for short periods, and like them immensely.
[i]My dad was a Japanese POW, in Changi, Singapore, a dreadful place to be incarcerated. He had a couple of books written about it, which I read, and he took me to see 'Bridge On The River Kwai', but he never spoke of his experiences to me, (he died when I was eleven), he left me to make my own mind up, and he even bought Japanese made binoculars.[/i]
It takes one hell of a guy to respond to something like that in the way he did. You must be very proud of him.
Some of my best friends are racists, but I wouldn't let my sister marry one!
It takes one hell of a guy to respond to something like that in the way he did. You must be very proud of him.
Absolutely, I just regret the fact that I never had a chance to speak to him as an adult, to find out first hand what he experienced there. He carried the scars on his back from ill-treatment but made nothing of it. Mum always said it was that experience that caused his early death at 44, but he was a heavy smoker, had a thyroid problem and had a heart attack, so inconclusive. There's a photo somewhere of him with a group of POW's just after liberation, but I think my cousin has it. He looks remarkably well in the pic, surprisingly.
countzero's description and also the possibility raised by the ethnic cleansing that we've seen in Eastern Europe is something I struggle with. If acts like these were perpetrated on my family in the name of race, I can see that I might respond in hatred of the race that had done it. I'd like to think that I could still see that races are not inherently evil, but there are evil people in any race but I couldn't guarantee it.
****stan being kicked out the World Cup because every time they got a corner they opened a shop.
One problem with this joke is that it is just wrong, most Asian owned corner shops are owned by Gujaratis, from India. The joke is racist because it treats ****stanis and Gujaratis as 'all the same'.
Whilst I have every sympathy for those who were brutalised by the Japanese in South East Asia, let us not forget that this was merely one Imperial army fight to reinstate the colonial power which had been and would continue to be as brutal to the local population
which had been and would continue to be as brutal
You have no idea what you are talking about.
There is absolutely no comparison whatsoever between the behaviour of British Imperialists, and that of Japanese Imperialists.
And unlike you, the peoples of the colonies knew that.
That is why for example, 2 million citizens of India volunteered to help the British Empire defeat Japan. Which represents the largest volunteer army, ever, anywhere, in history.
North Koreans the superior race you inferior, ... you maggots, Dear Leader Kim steps on you.
Ernie, I've disagreed with many things you've written, but what you said above was 100% sppot on.
For someone to suggest the British and Japanese were similar in how they treated their colonies is utter ill-informed nonsense.
[i]The joke is racist because it treats ****stanis and Gujaratis as 'all the same'.[/i]
In that case I'm racist and am quite happy about the fact.
The joke is racist because it treats ****stanis and Gujaratis as 'all the same'.
That's not racist; ignorant maybe but misunderstanding of political boundaries is not racism.
Am I racist in saying I like Indian restaurants? Because a significant proportion of those I like are most likely Bangladeshi.
I'm white and scottish, in no way am I a minority in the UK, however when living in Asia, I have been on the receiving end of racism many tinmes.
Simple things from being told I can't enter a restaurant because I'm American, to abuse being shouted at me by young men in the street.
It's not pleasant, but at the same time I didn't really care. I had to teach using text books (modern text books) with black characters in them who had massive lips and big white eyes. My students were effectively instituitionally racist, they were really rude about black people, but it was more a fear of the unkown than anything else.
Mrs Q was a bit racist, but again that is this drummed into her nonsense in Thailand that black skin is lower class so therefore anybody who is black must be dirty and poor.
However since living in the UK and spending the vast majority of her days with asylum seekers and immigrants, she realised that what she had been led to believe was crap and although there were still a few knobbers, in the most part people are ok.
Mrs Q had a great time in Korea, she never once received any of the negativity that can be shown towards people from SEA (other than the twunts at immigration the first time who held her there for three hours, but that is another story).
She used to have fantastic conversations with Koreans in Korean and broken English about why she looked the same as them but didn't speak Korean properly. Mental.
Back in the UK, she has only been on the receiving end of direct racism a couple of times, and some indirect stereotyping a few times. A lot better than we expected.
What to do about a racist friend. Hard to say. He has a belief that doesn't go with your own, it's up to you if you keep seeing him but you need to tell them why you don't want to if you make that decision.
I truely dispare with the whole rasism card. The boundrys of what is not acceptable seem to shift to the point of lunacy in my mind. How for example can a black board possibly offend anyone? No cant call it that, its a chalk board. Who you calling chalky? Where does it stop? Its got to the point where mindless ideots with zero common sense will brand everyone and anyone racist. Its counter productive and just confuses people, if not anoy them for something they ment absolutly no offense by to the point where I have just given up trying.
I truely dispare with the whole rasism card.
The EU are banning bent bananas too you know!
The EU are banning bent bananas too you know!
So what are we going to throw at the coons then? It's political correctness gone mad I tell you!
(it's a joke... )
I have just given up trying to understand what you mean
fixed it for you
I've heard that joke described as "shocking" and "utterly racist" but to my mind it's just harmless humour
it is playing to a national sterotype I find it to be a poor joke with racist overtones - more likely to be told by a racist who thinks they can defend it as it is less blatant than jokes told in the 70's that are more obviously racist/negative. Would I say it no - as it is not very funny and could be percieved as racist.
Some of my best friends are racists, but I wouldn't let my sister marry one!
She must be so proud of your judgement skills.
Am I racist in saying I like Indian restaurants? Because a significant proportion of those I like are most likely Bangladeshi.
No just ignorant - you have proved that point many times though jon 😉