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Still kinda nervous watching cases rise and rise. Want to wait it out a bit to see what happens over winter before committing to gigs, cinema, crowded places indoor and outdoor.
Currently at Portobello beach, visiting, but I've now retired to the car as it was getting quite crowded in certain areas despite the sea fog.
Wanted to go to the Malverns, but will wait till next year for that too. Could be busy, could be a well spaced field...
Got tickets to Repercussion in Manchester which is a club event in a huge warehouse space + outdoor section. Plan was to stay in the outdoor bit only or at the back, whatever, but yeah I'm not 100% sure now.
Guessing toilets and bar queues are going to be pretty risky regardless of what else we do. It starts at 2pm though so might do an early start and early finish as will just be having a few beers anyway rather than staying up for 48 hours straight like the old days.
As Henning Wehn pointed out for comedic effect at the Fringe, LFT test results mean nothing, as you can tell the NHS whether you were positive or negative to suit whether you want to go to a gig/festival, or have some time off work.
Had to show the LFT acknowledgement text to get into his show.
soobalias
Free Membermasks in shops is not “back to normal” – it may be what ‘you’ are comfortable with but any benefit is calculated and essentially unproven. If you think a shop is risky, maybe just stay on the sofa and support amazon.
Well, first off the person you're responding to didn't say masks in shops is "back to normal", they said it's now normal.
We're at a point where we have to balance the risks against the benefits/drawbacks. So yes wearing a mask in a shop is unlikely to make any difference, in that isolated nstance. But it's also extremely low effort- one of the very lowest impact things you can do to reduce the risk. And it's something that happens a lot.
Meanwhile there are things which are higher risk, but which can't be done with masks, or not without serious detriment. But just because we allow or do those things, doesn't mean we shouldn't take steps to reduce risks in less risky situations.
It can seem unintuitive to wear masks when doing a low risk activity, but also doing a higher risk and not wearing masks, in the same climate. But nothing's in isolation, all the tiny risks go in the same bucket as the big risks and so things that everyone does or people do often, like going to the shops, even if they're low risk, add up. And small mitigations of those also add up. And X number of masks worn in shops, can cancel out Y amount of going to orgies.
SSUK in 10 days, currently thinking I'll avoid the front of the crowd, and swap the usual double digits of beer for Berocca.
Jabbed a couple of weeks ago so should be nice and resilient. But it's right at the start of a block of freelance work, and having not worked all summer so really can't afford to get ill.
😬
Queensland’s chief health officer, Dr Jeannette Young decided to close the state’s borders to people from Sydney hotspots, telling The Guardian, “with the Delta variant, we’re seeing very fleeting contact leading to transmission. At the start of this pandemic, I spoke about 15 minutes of close contact being a concern. Now it looks like it’s five to 10 seconds that’s a concern. The risk is so much higher now than it was only a year ago.”
Céline Gounder, a clinical assistant professor of medicine and infectious disease at NYU’s Grossman School of Medicine told STAT News, "At the beginning of the pandemic, the CDC said that a close contact was somebody that you’re indoors with unmasked for 15 minutes or more.
"The equivalent of that with the delta variant is not 15 minutes, it’s one second."
https://www.politifact.com/article/2021/jul/28/how-contagious-delta-variant-it-isnt-easy-quantify/
going to the shops, even if they’re low risk, add up. And small mitigations of those also add up. And X number of masks worn in shops, can cancel out Y amount of going to orgies.
It's slightly worse than just additive as well.
I.e. it's not 0.001 probability at Tesco + 0.1 at Torture Garden =0.101. If everyone wears a mask in the supermarket, then no one catches it there and we can all* wear gimp masks without catching COVID.
*Well, 50%.
I’m thinking on the basis that there’s probably more chance of me having a crash/being mugged/run over etc., on the way to a gig as there is of catching Covid and it then being serious.
Yeah, I thought that. I ended up with 15 months+ of long covid. It's not something I'm keen to revisit, so I'll be avoiding risky events and places for now thanks. I might revise my opinion when more information on the efficacy of vaccines in preventing long covid is available.
We’re at a point where we have to balance the risks against the benefits/drawbacks. So yes wearing a mask in a shop is unlikely to make any difference, in that isolated nstance. But it’s also extremely low effort- one of the very lowest impact things you can do to reduce the risk. And it’s something that happens a lot.
I'm still wearing masks in shops not because I'm worried about myself particularly (double vaxxed etc.), but more as a courtesy for the people in the shop who will be seeing far more people every day than I will. I like the people in my lbs and it'd be a real shame if they got ill.
As for events and things, I've done a bit of holiday travelling over the last couple of weeks including time in busy train stations and trains etc. All felt a bit 'goodness look at all these people', so while I'm fine sitting in a restaurant or something I think I'll stick to small scale stuff/riding my bike for the time being.
Feel absolutely fine about "risky" events.
Its funny that because it's constantly been in the news it's now a risk, yet we don't discuss about the risks of driving to said events which can be as risky as actually catching and dieing of the disease itself especially when double vaccinated.
Funny how the mindset can be driven by the media.
Like everyone, it's something I've been thinking about a lot.
I've come to the conclusion, based on nothing but what I can learn from the news, that there is no longer much, if any point avoiding 'risky events', in fact, it might be counterproductive to do so.
As I understand it, based on the last thing I read on the news, that being vaccinated does very little to stop you spreading it, and offers a good protection against catching it, but it's far from 100%, what it does very, very well is almost completely removes the chances of me getting up in Hospital, or dying from it, and it does the same for, most, if not all people. Everything else is a bonus, this was always the intent as far as I know.
Based on the current 'restrictions' here in Wales and the almost complete lack of them in England, it seems to be inevitable that, even vaccinated I will catch Covid eventually, in the same way I will catch a Cold and other viruses multiple times during the rest of my life. Even if I spend the rest of your life, living like we did back in the darkest days of the first wave, one day, it's going to find me.
Why do I say counterproductive? Well, and again I don't pretend to be an expert, I just read the same news stories as everyone else, the vaccine effect dwindles, I had my 2nd Jab 12 weeks ago, so it's now 60% effective (at what, I don't know) down from 70% back in June. I'll probably get a booster here in Wales, AFAIK and based on what the Wife has been told in the Vaccination Centre, Wales will be starting all over again in about 3 weeks, I'll probably get my booster in Feb-ish.
As I understand it, Covid is never going to go away, this will only ever truly end when we've all been exposed to it so much that it is just 'another cold' and you can only do that on an individual basis, we don't have an collective immune system of course.
I can only assume/guess/conclude that the best way to avoid getting really sick, or dying of Covid, is to build the best immunity I can now, whilst my vaccine is working effectively and before the inevitable next, potentially worse variant arrives. That's not to say I'm going to hold a 'pox party' or go around licking door handles, but this period now, whilst most people are vaccinated and it's working well, it possibly as good as it's going to get for a few years at least.
That's not really even taking into account the whole, 'you've got to live your life at some point' side of the discussion, which is of course perfectly reasonable.
Its funny that because of constantly been in the news it’s now a risk, yet we don’t discuss about the risks of driving to said events which can be as risky as actually catching and dieing of the disease itself especially when double vaccinated.
Control the things you can control. Don't worry about those you can't.
I can't control the way that it seems a vast majority of drivers are bell ends thus won't worry about it.
Wearing a mask in a shop(or another place while I'm living my life) makes no odds to me really unless I'm paranoid the media are lying to me and want to be "edgy"
The Scotland game euros pub thing happened to all the young apprentices at work who went down on the bus. The whole bus ended up positive.
Funny enough despite the apprentices being vocally anti vax/anti restrictions before the incident....they are all now mid vax programme except 1 of them.....
Thought the very same thing today as I booked a gig for mid-November, we have 4 over a 3 week period, 3 of those rearranged from last year. It is telling that bands I would have expected to sell out very quickly haven't. Will just make sure we're comfortable in a part of the venue that isn't as squashed together etc.
Will just make sure we’re comfortable in a part of the venue that isn’t as squashed together etc.
I know how you feel.
I've booked a restaurant and 2 bars for a night out in a few weeks 'in town' some might even call them nightclubs (I'm waaaay to old for night clubs). I don't know what the format will be, assigned seating, table service, social distancing or a complete pre-covid style free-for-all.
I've decided I'll go with it regardless, I never thought it would be like this, we had a thread, must have been a year ago about what we were all going to do after covid and most of us wanted to embrace 'normal life' with a renewed vigour and never take social contact for granted again, but it hasn't worked out like that has it? I think it will take a long time before that feeling of slight shock and panic when someone comes 'too close' to feel normal again, a few months at least when covid isn't in the news and it starts to fade into the back of our mind. If it's safe, I'm really looking forward to not worrying about it anymore.
That’s not really even taking into account the whole, ‘you’ve got to live your life at some point’ side of the discussion, which is of course perfectly reasonable...
...or the impact you getting infected and spreading COVID could have on other people, not just yourself.
My level of comfortable "risk" is still very low, I tolerate a sizeable proportion of my work colleagues (~100 in per day before delivery) not wearing masks inside the depot and I just about tolerate sharing a van with two different colleagues on delivery each week.
Sometime soon I'll need to tolerate getting on a train and being surrounded by people not wearing masks in England and from the sound of things, a number ignoring the legal requirement in Wales.
And for now that's it, I wear a mask everytime I go indoors besides at home and I try to keep 1m+ away from others. So many in Southampton are trying to "pretend" Covid is all over now but it blatently isn't from those who are testing positive, we recently at work had the worst outbreak since the pandemic started.
My locally living double jabbed + 2 months mother-in-law, unjabbed sister-in-law and her unjabbed partner (conceiving concerns) have all had Delta recently and come out of isolation between the weekend and today.
My partner and I have had Covid at least once back in March '20, possibly twice as my partner was back to herself last summer after prolonged breathing complications in March, before coming down with similar issues in October and she hasn't worked since Xmas due to Long Covid.
I'm expecting Boris to be under severe pressure to re-introduce some restrictions this autumn/winter.
Its funny that because of constantly been in the news it’s now a risk, yet we don’t discuss about the risks of driving to said events which can be as risky as actually catching and dieing of the disease itself especially when double vaccinated.
Car crashes won't ever increase exponentially and overwhelm the NHS though.
Funny how the mindset can be driven by the media.
And basic logic.
Car crashes won’t ever increase exponentially and overwhelm the NHS though.
Having been nearly wiped out by a learner with a driving instructors car this morning, who nearly took out the oncoming council van as well, I wouldn't be so sure.....
I'm still being overly wary of going anywhere that means I can't keep out of the way of other people.
Double jabbed and, according to all indicators, wouldn't be to badly effected if I did get infected.
However, if I test positive it impacts my work rotation. That could possibly mean being off work on sick pay or reduced pay for 2 months+. A risk I can't take.
Also, Mrs Seadog, because of other health complications, would find it very hard. Aoiding each other in out small house would be impossible.
Car crashes won’t ever increase exponentially and overwhelm the NHS though.
You should take a drive around West Yorkshire.
With the current vaccine rollout it's also less and less likely the NHS will be overrun. Impact other services maybe.
With the current vaccine rollout it’s also less and less likely the NHS will be overrun
Well that's what the media says.
Late 20's and I'm feeling happy to go to my gigs in the autumn. I still wear a mask in shops though, for the people like on the first page who have conditions you can't always see. They're obviously not going to be in a gig anytime soon but we can at least make them feel safe in normal life settings
I never liked crowds before covid. Now I have an excuse to not go to populated places.
Two of my nieces went to Boardmasters. Both caught the virus. The youngest has been pretty ill and much worse than flu. They are 18 and 16. Personally, I wouldn't without precautions (vaccination, masks and hand washing).
So I wrestled with this last week! Got 2 tickets to see the 1st James gig of the tour. I’d been missing live music and paid up, but then the questions started, not just from me but Mrs fp also. Mrs FP wanted to sell or give away her ticket at one point. However we went….. to start with most people did their best to keep some kind of social distance, but by the 3rd song that was it, no one I could see was wearing a mask and everyone was singing, including Mrs FP. It was great! James stayed on for 2 hour plus and it was like normality had returned to my life after 18 months.
The next 6 days however started with the same thing, a FAST Covid test and the worry that it would be positive. As all the days started the same it seemed the results were too - all negative. Woohoo I went out enjoyed life and didn’t die - or get a mildly annoying virus!
However north of the boarder on the same night(I think?) my brother in law went out to see Huey Morgan and a few days later tested positive!
Not sure what you should make of that:
James fans are less likely to carry Covid? Huey Morgan is a super spreader? Scotland is dangerous? O2 Oxford can’t give you Covid if you had the AZ vaccine as the students that worked on it all got drunk there? None of the above?
Whatever, you will know when the best time to go out to these events is for you, and until that band/dj/festival calls keep safe, keep well, and keep riding (whatever size your wheels!)
@paul0
About 10, plus the staff and other tables in the bar. This was in Southampton.
They may have caught it elsewhere but the likelihood is that it was in the one place given that was the only time they all met up together.
It's purely anecdotal but enough to make me think about it i.e. it could just be one person in an enclosed space.
There was a local outbreak as mentioned above.
Went to a gig at Omeara in London last week. Small venue, pretty crowded. I'm double-jabbed, my daughter single-jabbed. We were the only people wearing masks that we could see, and no covid status was checked on entry. TBH we nearly came straight out again, but decided to lurk at the back instead. A week later we have both tested negative multiple times, so my advice would be that mask wearing certainly doesn't hurt at the moment. For all that, it was great to be seeing live music again!
I'm currently isolating having caught Covid at Bloodstock festival. I'm double jabbed and knew the risks, I figured we have to start living again sometime. I would hope everyone at the festival thought the same.
I'll still wear masks in shops etc as those are places where people need to go and don't want that same risk forced upon them. Indeed here in Scotland we still have to and I think that's a good thing.
I've got more gigs coming up and will happily go to them all and am happy to follow any entry requirements they request.
I feel fine about it personally. Doubled pfizered and healthy. Been to one very small festival, lot's of pubs and restaurants and had a garden party for 20 recently. Off to London to the Globe Friday. Will do masks on crowded public transport but not keen on wearing in gigs or events as it takes away from the enjoyment and release. Full on packed nightclub would probably not be up for though that's more about not being used to being in a crowd and getting too old for all that.
If you think a shop is risky, maybe just stay on the sofa and support amazon.
There are plenty of older people who wouldn’t go near internet shopping. I wear a mask in shops to reduce the chance of spreading the virus and putting them at risk. Soon we’ll be both well on top of vaccinations to reduce spread and illness and have many improved drugs to help those that do fall ill and/or can’t be vaccinated. In the meantime, we all know exactly how to help protect others while shopping. Refusing to do so marks you out as being… well… what’s the nice way of putting it?
Anyway, been to one gig (social distancing was in place and I still managed to end up buzzing from it) and have several gigs lined up… Nick Cave in Bradford and New Order in Halifax. Great to have musicians on stage again. I’ll be mask wearing at gigs for a while yet, strongly suspect most won’t be, that’s up to them at this point though. Not sure it’ll stay that way.
Well that’s what the media says.
And the data, readily available to all.
Would love to resume going to...gigs, cinema, restaurants, pubs but won't yet.
Covid secure means nothing since johnson removed all restrictions and I value my health more than a bit of short-term pleasure.
I continue to assume that everyone else is irresponsible and don't care about covid so my behaviour and double vaccination is the only protection I can rely on.
As for masks, for those who wear the cheap disposable and generally ineffective ones how often are they replaced? Single use, daily, weekly, longer?
Hand sanitising or washing them more frequently - 10 minute wonder; next time you go shopping spend 2 or 3 minutes at entrance watching how few people use the available sanitiser.
Unmasked staff and customers, little if any social distancing.
That applies generally; it's not limited to shops.
Those considerations inform my decision.
Genuinely curious how many of this critical of festivals and large gigs were at event like ard rock? There seems to a be a little bit of snobbery about who’s activity and event is justifiable… or maybe that’s just me being critical. I don’t recall protests of “don’t visit Swaledale and ard rock as it’s isolated and locals don’t have the healthcare provision. (Nothing against ard rock it’s just an example)
Eh, I’m not sure anyone mentioned local healthcare provision or suggested events shouldn’t go ahead? Comments have mostly been about risk of catching covid at different events. I’m not sure anyone going to ard rock has popped up on here either, but it hardly seems comparable to a music festival or gig..
don’t tolerate a***holes very well at the best of times, but hopefully there won’t be any at a HMHB gig,
Dunno about assholes, but it’s not entirely unusual for a bunch of blokes of a certain age to start a body-slamming moshpit in front of the stage at a HMHB gig - I just moved to the side a bit and let them get on with it. A lot of paracetamol and ibuprofen consumed the next morning I’m sure. 🤣
I’m certainly going to the gigs I’ve got tickets for, I’ve got proof of my vaccinations, and I’ll happily wear a mask if necessary.
I’m going to see The Specials in Halifax on Sunday.
I’ll be getting right up the front as reading all the posts in this thread every other gig go-er is going to be standing at the back.
Its quite interesting that on a site for mountain bikers which in its self is a risky pastime/sport there seem to be a lot of extremely risk adverse people when it comes to covid. Not a criticism more of an observation.
I am off to see New Order in Manchester in a fortnight, I am double vaccinated and they are checking covid status on entrance. I also suspect the audience won't be skewed towards the young. I am excited :-0)
I am not a regular one for gigs anyway, but I have cracked on with outdoor stuff with other folk - 24:12, marathon champs (support) and now just back from a scout camp.
Tbh it felt great doing these things after time away from them.
I don't think I would feel comfortable with a mass indoor event though.
Well, eldest (due his second jab next week) has just tested positive on LFT this morning. I've tested negative, MrsMC hasn't bothered testing and gone out to do a work visit 🤦♂️, youngest not out of bed yet.
Lovely souvenir of the Edinburgh Fringe
Its quite interesting that on a site for mountain bikers which in its self is a risky pastime/sport there seem to be a lot of extremely risk adverse people when it comes to covid.
If I fall off my bike, it doesn't break my 80 year old neighbour's hip. Communicable diseases are different to sports injuries.
And the data, readily available to all.
Assuming you ignore the non UK centric data
I'll hold off on removing the sensible personal controls that don't effect me in anyway such as masks , sanitising and handwashing for the protection of me and others around me till at least we have a data set that isn't based on a time period when deaths and hospitalisations were low prevax (ie last summer)
I know an 18 yo who went to Boardmasters who does some freelance video editing work for me.
He caught covid, it’s knocked him for six for the last week. He sounds f* awful on the phone - can’t stop coughing and it sounds grim. Hasn’t been able to get out of bed
I suspect the alcohol and lack of sleep have contributed to making it hit hard though.
extremely risk adverse people when it comes to covid.
It's almost as if different things are different and should be viewed/dealt with separately isn't it.
No way will I be doing indoor events or socialising for the foreseeable future (until later next year I’d guess). That includes pubs, restaurants, airports etc. A) I can’t spare time off work to have covid and b) Mum is immuno-compromised so I don’t fancy infecting any of my family. I’m just about OK with supermarkets at 7am.
It's quite interesting that on a site for mountain bikers which in its self is a risky pastime/sport there seem to be a lot of extremely risk adverse people when it comes to covid.
I guess most people feel like they have a handle on the level of risk they are taking with mountain biking. Whereas the risk posed by covid to the vaccinated middle-aged contingent is still a bit of an unknown (I'm not talking about hospitalisation), so I can understand it.
It's just anecdotal but joefm's story up the thread suggested all 10 vaccinated blokes caught covid at an event, 8 were fine, 2 still suffering weeks later. Not great odds if that is in any way representative. Hopefully some better data will emerge a some point. I'm not keen to push my luck, although on the other hand with kids at school it feels almost inevitable, so perhaps sooner is better than later?