[Closed] Cougar Grylls

Thought this would be about Mrs Grylls 😳

What about following a section of the Pennine Way or Coast to Coast? Cuts out some of the route finding difficulties and (generally) bail out options to pubs/B&Bs etc. are good should you have any 'issues' but also plenty of options for wild camping. As you've said, planning a route is good, especially if you give a copy to someone else so they know where to look when you're trapped down a hole with an owl.

If it makes you feel better I once got really wound up wild camping over the back of Blencathra once, hearing this crunching noise getting louder and louder approaching my tent, wondering what sort of foul beast was going to tear it's way in and disembowel me/make me it's wife. Turned out it was just a sheep eating grass.

Well where do you want to go? If you want to go in the UK then it's not really survival, just.. well.. camping.

It really is a piece of cake, and nothing to be overwhelmed by.

1. buy the appropriate gear
2. pack the appropriate food
3. plan an appropriate route that goes by an appropriate camping spot
4. stop bike
5. pitch tent
6. cook
7. eat
8. sleep
9. cook
10. eat
11. ride home again

Each point has a different set of tips and advice, so ask away. Unless you're asking about points 4, 7 or 10 in which case you probably aren't up to this. 8 is surprisingly hard the first night out imo but also not something I can help with.

Having just started down this path myself at age 39, and realising that the permuations of kit, packing and ways to do things are massive, the only advice I can offer is:

Start simple, start small, build from there.

(21 years ago, after camping with cubs, scouts, school mates and culminating in DofE Gold i made a very concious "Bugger that decision, being a scout leader now has forced me back into it. Aarrgh!)

DO IT! Seriously, do you really want to look back on your life and wonder where it went? You never know what's around the corner and that's a good enough reason for exploring the UK.

Oh, and zip seal bags. Put everything in zip seal bags. Having dry stuff once inside your tent is a massive bonus.

Go get an OS map for your navigation and a proper compass with mils on it. Find someone willing to give you a crash course in map reading, it's really not that hard if you pay attention. Plot a course and fill out a route card and leave with/post to someone at the finish point..

Pack light, pack smart. You wont need the kitchen sink, keep clothes waterproof, LOOK AFTER YOUR FEET!..

Oh wait.. you mean on foot rather than bike..? It's basically the same anyway, just kit varies slightly.

DO IT! Seriously, do you really want to look back on your life and wonder where it went? You never know what's around the corner and that's a good enough reason for exploring the UK.

+1

Once you get started, you'll gradually get "better" at it, meaning less effort is required to get out there and stay comfortable...which actually just means your appetite for adventure grows and before you know it you'll be doing things you could never have imagined 🙂

The last wild camping I did started in the pub and ended up in the woods not too far from the pub equipped with a tartan bobble hat with the ginger hair sticking out of the side, a hawaian shirt and two bags of bacon streaks from the 24hr garage. Most of us survivied but we never speak of it.

^Thats pretty much any trip to the pub isn't it?^

Does you're missus not let you in after you've been to the pub?

It's the only impromptu overnighter in the woods I've done after a nights drinking and I have a fair sample size to draw upon.

[url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/midges-what-really-works ]You'll need to check this thread[/url] I haven't quite finished my new book 'hand wringers guide to the galaxy' but this will prompt me to create a special chapter.. 😉

A weekend in the UK isn't often 'survival', as long as yr warm and don't get lost/fall into the ocean/deep water/ravine or cycle via a city or A road. 🙂

Just take yr swiss army knife, (Victorinox Swiss Champ is my choice) bivvy, headtorch, tarp(or microtent)warm bag and bob's yr mother's brother.

You might be hungry after a day or so, but that is easily solved by pub lunch, or bags of trail mix and a few apples.

You're talking about a stroll and a kip aren't you? Best take yr phone, map, compass and a whistle just in case it gets mental or someone tries to molest you.

Last time I did what yr doing I ate raw leeks and roadkill pheasant. Finally gave up and bought some nuts in a local pub. The pheasant blood on my hands achieved a raised eyebrow behind the bar, but all was good.

Oh wait.. you mean on foot rather than bike..?

Yeah. I considered bike-packing, but figured there was a greater chance of me killing myself that way. Last thing I want to do is have a big 'off' on my own miles from civilisation. Plus there's an accessibility issue I suppose; if I can reach it by bike then there's a greater chance of someone else doing so?

A weekend in the UK isn't 'survival',

I appreciate the sentiment, and I'm a capable and practical type of guy, but I think you greatly underestimate my ability to cut off my own limbs with a rusty trowel.

As a wise man once said, "I don't care what statistics say, it [i]will [/i]be me."

I did this when i was straight out of school. Spent 4 months hiking from Boulder to Banff. Apart from the obvious things like a basic survival course and investing in quality gear, the main bits of advice I would give are have a plan for every eventuality unless you can guarantee you are never going to be too far from civilisation. I would plan on going through a main town at least every 3-4 days - camping on your own in the woods is very appealing but if like me you get bored of your own company, visiting civilisation every few days is a good thing. Tell someone your plans and check in when possible. Agree a strategy for what they should do if they haven't heard from you for 2,5,10 days whatever is appropriate. The last thing you want is to be stuck somewhere with a broken leg knowing no one will be searching for you.

The other main bit of advice is take care of your feet. Very easy to start getting foot-rot if you don't keep them clean and dry.

I think you greatly underestimate my ability to cut off my own limbs with a rusty trowel.

Ye gods! Leave the rusty trowel and any sharp things behind 😉 +1 for telling someone where you're heading and when due back! Doublecheck you told them the right place..

Leave the rusty trowel and any sharp things behind

See, these are the sorts of highly technical tips I need. (-:

I should perhaps clarify, I'm talking about a couple of days (at least for a first outing) rather than actually going feral for the whole summer.

I was going to plan a similar trip with my other half. Me on my bike, and she on a horse. Thought it would be a cool adventure. Turns out horses are quite shit at this sort of thing...

Last thing I want to do is have a big 'off' on my own miles from civilisation.

Ride slower. Carrying all the camping sh*t will help greatly with this I find.

Walking is nice though, Mrs B and I did sections of the SW Coast Path for a couple of years before our wedding to save up. Was lovely. Plus being out in all weathers for hours makes you look well ream, as does walking up hills with a few Kg on your back.

Are you talking about hiking or taking a bike?

If you're thinking of taking a bike and want a bit of guidance, you could book a bikepacking trip with Forest Freeride and i'm sure Stuart will try to meet your requirements:
[url] http://forestfreeride.co.uk/pages/guiding+trips.html [/url]

If you're talking about hiking then try something local within the safety net of your own area and then take bigger steps. I've done a few things in the Cairngorms and it's a great place to get away from it all but be aware of the risks involved. Weather in the mountains is unpredictable. If you insist on going on your own, brush up on your map skills. I can recommend Lyle Brotherton's Ultimate Navigation Manual and You Tube videos.
Practice the skills in your local area.

Plus being out in all weathers for hours makes you look well ream, as does walking up hills with a few Kg on your back.

If you want to reassure your nearest and dearest that you're either still walking or at least haven't finished falling down a mountain side then a Spot Tracker isn't *that* expensive and I believe you can rent them?

I can reach it by bike then there's a greater chance of someone else doing so?

True, but what's your aim? Genuine solitude? For how many days?

There are some pretty remote parts of Mid Wales that get very little foot traffic and are quite 'scenic', which would make excellent spots. Not very accessible by bike though which is why I've only looked at the map and tried the occasional bit of hike a bike. I can suggest a few if you want. If you're staying up North then somewhere like the Forest of Bowland might fit.

Also on foot you can benefit from open access which helps you get away from everyone, BUT you still technically aren't allowed to camp wherever you want. However in a recognised outdoor location you're very unlikely to get trouble even if you are spotted.

As for looking after your feet - sure, but he's not making a solo South Pole attempt so just wear good boots etc. Your first trip should probably be one night, walking a couple of hours from the car, camping and then walking back. It's easy.

Now, just let me do some vicarious kit-shopping...

For carefree camping you will need

An open space
Enough alcohol to fell a bear
A carefree attitude

1. Walk for enough distance that no one knows who you are
2. Drink
3. Fall over, fall asleep without a care in the world
4. Upon waking, retrace steps
5. Repeat as often as the urge takes you

Now, I'll be the first to admit that step 4 is not the most comfortable experience you'll ever have, but then this is about survival and manliness, so embrace it!! Plus of course, it does away with the need for expensive tents and complex cooking gear.

Admit it, it's a goer, right?

How about joining a group of people and going somewhere like Pen Y Fan for the weekend, or trying to do a section of the coastal path?

With something like the latter, there will be campsites close by and you could easily do a weekend's out-and-back with nice scenery and minimal hassle.

Oh man, I've got loads of good tips for you. Whereabouts are you Cougar ? Fancy a pint sometime, and I'll point you in the right direction.

I don't know as I have an "aim" per sé, I'd not really fleshed it out that much. I was thinking maybe a couple of nights under canvas?

How about joining a group of people

Because that defeats the object. I spend my entire waking life interacting with people, I'd like to stop doing that for a day or two.

Whereabouts are you

East Lancashire. You?

Some people like tents, some like tarps and bivi bags. Tents are probably better imo, especially if you are up in the hills without trees.

You just need to get the credit card out, buy the stuff you need and go and do it.

I suggest somewhere like [url= http://www.streetmap.co.uk/map.srf?x=365772&y=457240&z=120&sv=365772,457240&st=4&ar=y&mapp=map.srf&searchp=ids.srf&dn=757&ax=365772&ay=457240&lm=0 ]this.[/url] See where the contours spread out by that stream - that's probably a bit of flat land where you could pitch a tent. You've got water, which is almost certainly good enough to drink but take Puritabs to be on the safe side; you're not far from the road and you're a bit sheltered. Some early morning walker might see you, but no big deal if they do.

Another possibility [url= http://www.streetmap.co.uk/map.srf?x=359829&y=449980&z=120&sv=359829,449980&st=4&ar=y&mapp=map.srf&searchp=ids.srf&dn=757&ax=359829&ay=449980&lm=0 ]here[/url] - you could walk east along that stream away from the path if you want to be even less likely to be seen.

I don't really even understand properly what a bivvy is. Isn't it basically an elements-proof sleeping bag?

East Lancs? just get t'up t'ont t'moorst't't' or Tod, there are no people there.

A bivi bag is a waterproof for your sleeping bag (name comes from 'bivouac' which means.. an impromptu camp, I suppose). To keep you dry they need to cover your head which is not very pleasant. They need to either be vented somehow or be breathable enough to not suffocate you. Neither works very well, so I've heard.

The next option is a hooped bivi which has a small pole in it that keeps it off your face. Then you're into micro-backpacking tent territory.

There's more or less a continous spectrum between plastic bag and full-on tent - obviously as you move towards tents you gain more comfort and live-ability but also weight and time spent packing up.

You can bivi anywhere there's enough ground to lie down, but it's not very nice if the weather's bad and you've no shelter. Ray Mears advocates using a bivi bag under a tarp (which gives shelter and a place to call home) but you really need trees or poles or something for that.

Bivvy is a term covering many things but basically a flimsy waterproof shelter that at its most basic is a thick bin bag with your sleeping bag in - not recommended unless you like to wake up in your own sweat

See survival bag 😉

Alpkit or similar are good if the weather is good but do you really want to lie out in the rain in waterproof bag ?

This fellow is using a hooped bivi. Clearly not much room to pitch a tent there, but if it rains when he's trying to cook breakfast it's going to be a bit unpleasant.

[img] [/img]

Survival bags are just thick poly bags - bivi bags can be more sophisticated than that and they will be breathable. These people are using non-hooped bivi bags.

[img] [/img]

they are also not much lighter than a tarp or a really light tent either

They are ok though but not my preference

Preston, but with car, so can travel.

Top tips.

Bivvy bags are ok, but if the weather is changable, tents are much better.

When packing your rucksack, it's always a case of weight vs comfort. How much do you actually need to carry with you for your journey, bearing in mind that that the longer you have to carry your pack, the heavier it will get.

A slightly thicker sleeping mat will give you a better nights sleep, and is always worth the weight penalty.

Most people consider food and stoves, but forget about how to get clean drinking water, Bearing in mind that carry enough water is always going to punish you, as 1L of water = 1Kg, a better option is to invest in a filter sytem for gathering water at source, such a s this http://www.watertogo.eu/ Cheap, lightweight and reliable.

Don't underestimate the distance you can travel in a day, when considering the terrain you are covering. Rough mountain miles, and flat field miles are two different things.

Good boots will save your feet, but only if your feet are conditioned for walking lots of miles. If you haven't done any walking recently, you will feel it regardless.

Yeah, the better the bivi bag the heavier they are, and the more they approach the weight of a super-light tent. Personally I like tents, and you can easily get one for under 2kg which is nothing really when you're walking. Remember a lot of super light kit is aimed at people racing or going for maximum performance, which you wouldn't be, and has compromises.

a better option is to invest in a filter sytem for gathering water at source

Yes, but if up in the mountains it might be overkill - tabs have always worked for me (but I get silver-based ones rather than iodine or chlorine).

If you haven't done any walking recently, you will feel it regardless.

Quite right but remember you don't have to walk very far to achieve your aims...

I like bite sized bikepacking adventures. I'm a pussycat Grylls. Managed a wee one in Dorset last weekend. Nothing too hard or crazy. [url= http://www.farawayvisions.com/bikepacking-dorset/ ][/url]

Give us a shout sometime Cougar, in the meantime, here's some inspiration for you.

http://www.alastairhumphreys.com/microadventures-3/microadventure-3-sleep-hill/

Buy and read this book: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Book-Bivvy-Ronald-Turnbull/dp/1852845619

and this one http://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Shit-Woods-Environmentally-Approach/dp/0898156270 😉

For pooing - buy a plastic gardening trowel from B&Q, use it to cut out a lump of turf (or just dig) - poo, then fill it in. Don't be close to water when you do this, and that's all you need to do. Use moss for paper if you want, put your bogroll in the hole, or just put it in a ziplock bag and take it home. I reckon it'd degrade well enough if buried.

Error in last reply .[url= http://www.farawayvisions.com/bikepacking-dorset/ ] Try this [/url]

I just got another smaller greener micro tent, 20 quid in sale from Go Outdoors, fine if you're under 6 foot with hardly any gear, often use it for local one or two night wild camping, job done, as they say.

[url= http://jamescarron.wordpress.com/features/backpacking-on-a-budget-hi-gear-soloista/ ]High Gear Soloista[/url]

Cheers all, appreciated.

in the meantime, here's some inspiration for you.

Yeah, "microadventure" is pretty much what I'm aiming for I think. (I'm about to tick his first one off too, I'm in a race at the weekend.)

I think on reflection I'm not quite ready for bivvying quite yet. I was looking at sub-two kilo tents with envious eyes at the weekend, though I'll pass on that Soloista as Hi Gear are owned by Gellert, purveyors of the porous. I wouldn't trust them to make anything other than sieves and tea bags.

What's your budget for a tent?

Not had probs with the Soloista TBH, but is early days. My other sub 2kg is the now rocking horse poo status 'tiger paws' Argos special. Why did I pass on the green one to later get the orange one?! Still best £15 quid I ever spent.

What's your budget for a tent?

The ones I was looking at were around the £50 mark I think, though I don't have a 'budget' per sé. I've learned from bitter experience that camping is one area where the adage "buy [s]Gellert shit[/s] cheap, buy twice" really holds true. I'd rather pay more for something half decent than try to save a few quid and end up throwing it away in disgust and buying something else again; false economy.

Triple or better still quadruple that and you'll have a much better time.

£50 tents are like £100 MTBs, generally.

For one-man lightweight affairs, seriously?

Maybe I've been lucky with the tiger paws, but it's really well designed, can just sit up in it, could improve porch space with a few small mods but really is ideal for the few nights as long as low/mid level camping and choosing pitch wisely.

If it breaks (hasn't in 8 years) I'll prob get a Wild Country Zephyros or similar.

How much do you want to spend?

Have a look here:

http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/equipment-c3/tents-shelters-c25/one-person-tents-c74#sort3

These a re pretty serious though. that one a £750 would suit you I'd be bound.

Tents are more comfortable than a bivy but less flexible. I have only tried to bivy once (on the Cuillin Ridge). It pished rain and my £75 brand new bag leaked like a bloody sieve. I bought a proper goretex one but I've never used it yet.... 😳

For one-man lightweight affairs, seriously?

Since when does light weight = cheap?

EDIT get this:

http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/wild-country-tents-zephyros-1-tent-71110048?id_colour=98

That looks like a good tradeoff between price, quality and weight. 1.5kg isn't super light but it's pretty good, and it looks to have enough space inside. You might even be able to sit up in it.

I fricking love bivvy bags.

Other than saving half a kilo, why would I want to spend an extra fifty quid on the Zephyros over, say, something like [url= http://www.caseysoutdoorleisure.co.uk/item/Vango/Soul-100-Tent-2014/5NU ]this Vango[/url]?

I've got one of these

http://www.backpackinglight.co.uk/bushcraft/WF101.html

It's great, packs up small and light, super easy and quick to pitch and has plenty of space for me and my gear and even my bike at a push! I bought it after getting fed up with my skinny coffin shaped low profile tent.

Nice company to deal with too.

Other than saving half a kilo, why would I want to spend an extra fifty quid on the Zephyros over, say, something like this Vango?

Piece of mind and the ability to pitch a tent badly.

The most important element to a tent is where you put it.

Don't underestimate the value of saving half a kilo. That's a lot when it's on your back all day.

That Vango - for one it's a tunnel design, not good in wind, and two - fibreglass poles. Bad combination in my experience.

Not that Vango are bad tents per se, they make some ok tents, just be choosy. My favourite basecamp tent is a Vango Halo 200 - shame really if it was half the weight I'd look nowhere else...bombproof design, loads of room, loads of clearance between outer and inner, and two doors. In fact might try using the flysheet only with better pegs see how light I can get the pack

Nice company to deal with too.

Yep, backpackinglight are a good company, I've had no problems with ultralighoutdoorgear either.

Other than saving half a kilo, why would I want to spend an extra fifty quid on the Zephyros over, say, something like this Vango?

Quality.

I find a pack up to 10% of body weight is fine, up to 15% bearable. Beyond that suffering starts far too quickly to enjoy walking holidays.

I've got some really nice stuff such as a Vaudé two-man tent which is 1.7kg but it often gets left at home in favour of a 1kg hooped two-man bivi because I'd rather wake up a bit damp than carry the extra 700gm.

When there is surface water or snow around a stove saves carrying water. You should boil for some time though so a petrol stove is a better bet than a gas stove with a pile of heavy gas canisters.

I've got breathable jackets from Schöffel, North Face, Eider etc. but the lightest is from Lidl; 16e for a 350gm jacket that is waterproof, longer in the body than most and only a little more clammy than the 580gm North Face Gortex that cost 20 times more. The Schöffel is very pleasant to wear, cost an embarrassing sum and weighs nearly a kilo; it goes on bike trips but rarely gets put in a rucksac.

All this to say: weight is so important that light, cheap things that are just about up to the job are often the best choice.

Some inspiration perhaps

http://www.gofar.org.uk/ukultrasbyregion2.html

Taken at a slower pace of course.

You should boil for some time though so a petrol stove is a better bet than a gas stove with a pile of heavy gas canisters.

I don't like to boil water for drinking. Takes far too long and too much of a faff. I fill a bottle/bladder when I find a stream, pop in a puritab, then 10 mins later I'm sorted.

Also, to counter Edukator, I don't notice an extra 2-3kg if I'm just walking, so I don't count grammes, I go with comfort. I do on the bike though.

fibreglass poles. Bad combination

I thought fibreglass would be a [i]good[/i] thing?

They like to snap. Better tents get Easton alu poles or possibly carbon.

Ah, ok. That'd give you a bad day.

Noted, ta.

That Vango is only 2000mm waterproof so despite what it says I wouldn't expect it to withstand prolonged rain of the sort that afflicts Glastonbury for example. Having said that I find Vango tents quite reasonable and good value for what they are.

We regularly used to sleep out on climbing/walking trips, bothies, howfs or just out in the open. Funny how the sleeping out has now become the objective and it's a 'microadventure' Also, I'm slightly horrified that a moderator on this forum is asking these questions 😉 Mind you, he does seem to know his IT.

pop in a puritab

Yeah, I wanted to know a bit more about this. Is there value in some form of "purification system" for water, or will tablets do in the UK? I really don't want to be having a picolax night in the woods.

I'm slightly horrified that a moderator on this forum is asking these questions

That's very sweet, but I promise I'll come back.

Fibreglass poles are heavier than heat-treated aluminium and tend to shatter in windy conditions.

I'm happy with 12kg in the panniers on my tourer, Molgrips, none of it is bearing down on me an. 15kg is OK too, it might slow me a little on the hills but 120-200km a day is no problem. A 9kg rucksac in the mountains or long distance things like St Jacques is OK. 12kg feels too heavy at the end of the day and knocks a few kms off my comfortable range. Just a walk-in to a climb with 15kg is a chore.

The danger is that you take so much stuff 'just in case' that you get knackered carrying it all. We once 'rescued' a couple from the top of Ben Nevis who were digging in for the night, -10 February, because they were exhausted and disorientated. They had at least three tins of rice pudding and the bloke had set off a flare to attract attention.

I promise I'll come back.

Can you read a map?

Water - I'd drink from streams high up in Scotland. More hesitant in the Lakes and busier bits of Scotland now. Puritabs or similar work fine. In NZ (1996) we used tabs then filtered to remove the taste. My trousers stayed up with just a belt though 😉

Can you read a map?

In so far as I can look at a piece of paper and apply a degree of common sense, yes. Your actual map-and-compass orienteering, no; I need to go and read up on that.

Ah, ok. That'd give you a bad day.

Noted, ta.

Snapping poles is where bivvy bags come in handy.

I've been "wild" camping in Scotland for 40 years and never used any sort of water purification system or, for that matter, having to boil water for any length of time.

Can't you find someone willing to lend you some gear and take you out for an induction 😉

This is suddenly getting expensive. Shopping list:

[i]Need:
[/i]
Tent,
Camp mat,
Food,
"Puritabs",
Map,

[i]Have but may need to replace for weight weenie reasons(?):
[/i]
Rucsack,
Stove,
Mug / pan / cutlery,
Sleeping bag,

[i]Have:
[/i]
Head torch,
Swiss Army knife,
Heavier duty lock knife,
Compass,
Clothing,
Emergency phone,
GPS (basic eTrex thing),
Fire starter,
Entertainment? Magazine or something,
Hip flask,
Medium-ish dry sack,

Can't you find someone willing to lend you some gear and take you out for an induction

I'd be grateful for loan gear, but I think it's important for me to actually "do it" under my own steam.

Aye - but having someone show you the ropes for a first night out isn't a bad idea.

From your list...

No need for two knives
Map and compass AND GPS is a bit of duplication. I rarely go out with a compass these days (and if I need one, the phone does it).
For one/two nights, one decent sized mug or small pan will do you.
A spork and a swiss army knife is all the "cutlery" I use

I'd forget puritabs and buy a Sawyer Mini Filter. Light and absolutely zero hassle. Massive lifespan too.