[Closed] Corpses on Everest

[i]lol thats nuts[/i]

The place sickens me. Brings out the worst in people.

The body building forum? Yeah, I know what you mean.
I like this on the first page of a body building forum thread...

[i]What is the point of climbing a mountain? [/i]

Apart from the fact that it's someones loved one paraded on an internet froum for cheap titilation why would you post that? Everest is strange. It's a place where it's suddenly acceptable to step over a dying man to carry on as you were and leave them to die on their own with no human comfort. Just because you are at high altitudes doesn't mean you forget your humanity. Ronald naar was a partciclarly good example being filmed in a tent on everst listening to a dying man pleading for help whilst saying to the camera " there's no point he's already going to die"

It's grim alright - the place is becoming a tomb. Not sure I could tolerate passing all those corpses on the way to my personal conquest.

cheap titilation

I don't think that was the OP's intent; more reflection on the horror of it.

Speechless. RIP

I don't think its [i]acceptable[/i] tazzy, just nothing they can do about it.

Summit fever. A very strange terminal disease that attacks normally sane healthy people. A bit like what happens to middle-aged born-again motorcyclists on summer weekends.

Just because you are at high altitudes doesn't mean you forget your humanity. Ronald naar was a partciclarly good example being filmed in a tent on everst listening to a dying man pleading for help whilst saying to the camera " there's no point he's already going to die"

Kind of depends on whether in helping someone you are placing yourself at risk or not. First rule of rescue, don't become a casualty.

I'm sure there are plenty of situations even in this country when people say that there's no point in helping people as they are sure to die. It's not a pleasant thought but it is reality in some situations.

I don't think its acceptable tazzy, just nothing they can do about it.

They could give him some bloody comfort.

I did my ML with a guy who had summited,Phil Sanderson. He was telling us that there are companies who will take ANYONE up. They have a loss rate of 50% 😯

I think people who climb Everest know the rules of the game, and would not expect someone else to jeopardise their life or give up their own climb just to say some nice words before they die.

Once you've made the decision to leave the last camp all the rules change, nobody can afford to operate on 'normal' standards, if you did the result will be two bodies instead of just one.

No climber goes up there without knowing the facts of the full risks ....... whether they all really, really grasp the full reality and finality of the consequences of the smallest error ........ not until it happens perhaps?

They could give him some bloody comfort.

You would die on Everest.

If it wouldnt be so detrimental to the nepalese economy and people I'd hope that they'd close everest to climbers.

take the risk, suffer the consequences.

alpine mountaineering is a very selfish sport, ask mr bonnington, he will agree.

If it wouldnt be so detrimental to the nepalese economy and people I'd hope that they'd close everest to climbers.

This

There was a cleanup last year.

They should tax the climbers more, enough to send a few parties up a year sto clean their mess up. It's not just the bodies the whole place is a mess.

Whoops

" there's no point he's already going to die"

It's probably true that Naar could not help him medically, or even move him to a safer location (the storm made it extremely dangerous to move).

The point is that Naar offered no succor, which some consider inhumane. Joe Simpson makes a point that it was the lonelyness of his impending death that was most horrible.

I suspect it's not cut-and-dried, it was a dire situation for everyone and Naar probably felt a keen responsibility to his team, to survive and possible still climb, but not anyone else. An also perhaps, that he was just too terrified of confronting the horror. This is not an excuse BTW.

I take the point that extreme/near-death situations can bring out the worst. But they can also show the best: Boukreev's efforts, for example. Regardless of whether you liked Anatoli's style, he did a lot to help people, up to the limit of is considerable power.

The idea that someones summit bid comes before even attempting to save someones life sickens me to the core.

Sooner they whack a train up it and pop a cafe on top the better!!

You would die on Everest

No, I wouldn't. I would probably take many attempts to reach the summit tho.

[i]You would die on Everest[/i]

He means if you tried to confort someone instead of concentrating on your own survival.

That rather depends on the situation.

Exactly SbZ.
The excuse of well if I helped it would endanger my life doesn't wash. Knowing that information beforehand means that if you choose to climb you choose to give up your humanity. And to gain what? A tick that is so devalued these days as to be not much more noteworthy than running the London Marathon,

He means if you tried to confort someone instead of concentrating on your own survival.

This.^

I was not commenting on your climbing abilities Molgrips. You might be the human embodiment of a mountain goat for all I know.

Like these fellas:

[img] [/img]
[img] [/img]

Molgrips - I'm guessing that, from your comments, you'll never be in that situation and will never understand the mentality of those who go there.

I'm not saying that I do but I don't think it's fair to judge people in such extreme circumstances from the comfort of your desktop. As said above, no one climbs Everest without an understanding of the associated risks. I don't think "comfort" is a word used much there.

IanMunro I think that devalues the achievement of climbing Everest somewhat. How many people have died trying to run the London marathon?
I have huge respect for anyone that has tried to climb Everest, mainly because 1 simple mistake / error / bad decision could cause failure or death. Marathon running whilst hard going is unlikely to bring the normal participant to the edge of the abyss.
Im not trying to justify the callousness of it, but I can at least understand it.

I would probably take many attempts to reach the summit tho.

Thing is, you don't GET many attempts - you don't have the strength (mental or physical) and you don't have the time and you don't have the money.

A tick that is so devalued these days as to be not much more noteworthy than running the London Marathon,

I think perhaps that's the crux of the problem. Some people [i]don't[/i] see it as a difficult challenge any more, and go into it thinking "loads of people have done this."

Well that's a fair point.

What I was trying to say though was that whilst obviously not putting myself in enormous jeopardy I would consider it very important to comfort a dying man. The point about making many attempts is that whilst I would like to climb a high mountain such as this I would not risk too much to do it like some people do.

Of course one cannot judge based on a few small bits of information.

It's probably true that Naar could not help him medically, or even move him to a safer location (the storm made it extremely dangerous to move).

The point is that Naar offered no succor, which some consider inhumane. Joe Simpson makes a point that it was the lonelyness of his impending death that was most horrible

Ironically, Naar died on a mountain last month. Would be interesting to know if anyone ignored his plight.

and will never understand the mentality of those who go there.

TBH, I don't want to. I've met some people who went on one of those overpriced "trips" - selfish bastards the lot of 'em.

I have huge respect for anyone that has tried to climb Everest

I have more respect for a nurse.

The idea that someones summit bid comes before even attempting to save someones life sickens me to the core.

What would you realistically expect to achieve high up on Everest? It is likely that the only thing you would end up doing is to put yourself at risk.

As for banning an activity that you consider to be dangerous, well I certainly don't agree with that. Provided everyone is made fully aware of the risks and consequnces, I see no reason to ban it.

I have respect for people that climb a new route up everest, or climb it in winter, but none for those people that get dragged up the tourist route.

deadlydarcy - Member

I have more respect for a nurse.

8)

[edit] did you have a particular nurse in mind? TJ is one too y'know... 😆

I have more respect for a nurse.

So if a nurse climbed Everest, you would just feel ambivalent?

What is it with human nature that so many people feel the need to save others from themselves?

If you start going beyond dealing with the normal risk reduction (even at this high level*) where do you stop? and where will you end up with a basic human need totally smothered and sanitised?

*excuse pun.

did you have a particular nurse in mind? TJ is one too y'know...

YGM... 😉

You will wear that outfit again won't you? x

[i]I have huge respect for anyone that has tried to climb Everest, mainly because 1 simple mistake / error / bad decision could cause failure or death.[/i]

Ah well I have pretty much no respect for anyone who's climbs Everest. It's neither an indication of extreme technical merit, of physical endurance, or pushing the boundaries of human achievement. It does however often appear to be an example of someone placing their own personal desires above consideration of anything else.

Out of interest, have you read "Dark shadows falling", and what was your take on it? If you haven't it's well worth reading.

There's plenty of stories of climbers giving up summit bids to rescue fellow climbers.
[url= http://www.everestspeakersbureau.com/danmazur.htm ]Clicky[/url]

*excuse pun.

Never.

You could have also gone for mounting risk.