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Bloody hell.
She once got shouted at by David Baddiel (who was next door) for turning the stereo up too loud
If I lived next door to David Baddiel, I'd put on a sample of a football crowd singing 'he's' got a pineapple, on his head', at full volume, on constant repeat. Then I'd go out for the day. Or on holiday for a couple of weeks.
She used our washer and dryer (alien black lace underwear found in dryer)
oh aye...
I couldn't employ a cleaner for the same reason I could never be a traffic warden.
.
Self-explanatory, no?
Kind of... as in, it's a mansion so he's bound to be there all day. Or the other thing I immediately thought?..
Fair play to her for challenging the traditional orthodoxy though
It’s usually the personal trainer
Serious answer.
I just don't think I could get a cleaner....
I'd feel I was abandoning my roots somehow, that working class pride in having worn out, but immaculately shined shoes, the satisfaction in perfectly streak free windows.
I think it also comes from being a domiciliary care worker for years, a big part of that (when we had time, years ago) was cleaning. It was a matter of pride that when you left someone's house it was immaculate.
I also come from one of those areas where it was still common to see people donkey stoning their steps, blokes washing completely worn out cars every week, all that nonsense.
I quite enjoy a good clean. I find it very therapeutic.
And, if I'm honest, now, as a nurse I like cleaning down the ward every couple of hours.
It feels like honest graft.
Perfect.
What are your rates, and when can you pop round?
What are your rates, and when can you pop round?
Surely he'll be paying you for his 'therapy'?
I’d feel I was abandoning my roots somehow, that working class pride in having worn out, but immaculately shined shoes, the satisfaction in perfectly streak free windows.
I think your decadent guilt is very misplaced. There was nothing romantic about the working class days.
Back in the 'working class' days it was probably the stay at home housewife that shined her husbands shoes while he was putting in a shift shovelling coal down 'pit, in between cooking his dinner for a number of hours in a log fired oven while running a feather duster around a small 2 up and 2 down damp, leaky and draughty terrace house and whacking the hell out of rugs with a stick, scrubbing the living daylights out of the tiled floor on her hands and knees and running the washing through a mangle. And when her husband returned from the pub tanked up on warm flat brown beer, felt lucky she didn't only received a slap or two from him and not the beating with the belt. Yeah...them good old working class days. A real sense of achievement for your daily chores.
These days women are educated, they work and have their own careers - some owning and running domestic cleaning companies, own their own homes, own their own cars, and increasingly often pay someone to do the washing and ironing, pamper themselves at the weekend, travel the world on holidays etc. That's progress. You can stick the overly romanticised 'good old' working class days into the dustbin of history. I think most people who lived in the old working class days would take life today in a heartbeat.
I’d feel I was abandoning my roots somehow
Nah, **** that shit. We all work stupid long hours in stressful jobs with minimum free time, and phones and texts that impinge even on that free time. I'm not going to spend precious time off pushing a hoover about, or smearing windolene about. Not when I can get a professional to do it for me.
I have a fairly decent professional job and a busy life and there's no way I'd pay someone to clean for me, but I do live in Yorkshire... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I’d feel I was abandoning my roots somehow, that working class pride in having worn out, but immaculately shined shoes, the satisfaction in perfectly streak free windows.
You want a medal? Nobody's going to give you a medal. Most wouldn't give you the steam off their piss. Let alone decent wages, recognition and respect.
You can stick the overly romanticised ‘good old’ working class days into the dustbin of history. I think most people who lived in the old working class days would take life today in a heartbeat.
Too ****ing right. The romanticisation of the 'working classes' is a middle class affectation, to assuage their privileged guilt. 'Oh look at the honest, hardworking salt of the earth working classes', they coo, as they ignore poverty and hardship they never have to face themselves. What's worse, in many ways, are people who claim to be 'working class', then you discover they actually come from a lower middle class background where parents were academics or middle managers, went to a selective grammar type school, lived in some nice suburb, owned a car or two and holidayed abroad 2 or 3 times a year. IE, just not 'posh', but quite a way off having to actually graft hard in some menial job, to survive. Like being 'working class' is somehow glamourous. **** that.
I'm not romanticising anything.
For me, it's about self respect and the satisfaction of a job done well.
I'm not judgemental about it, people are just different.
I would never pay for my car to be cleaned, or my work shoes to be shined, I just prefer to do it myself.
A friend paid for 2 hours per week cleaning pre covid, during covid he found that the 2 hours had been split between 4 people and they spent 30mins in his house blitzing it before leaving.
As much as I do like deep cleaning the house since mini-oK arrived I find I have less time and from this thread am tempted to get someone for a couple of hours a fortnight
I’m not romanticising anything.
But:
working class pride
That's 'romanticising' being working class, in my book. What's wrong with not having someone else do manual tasks for you? Are you not 'good enough'? Don't you 'deserve' that? Or is such only for 'better' people?
Not at all.
There's nothing romantic about being proud of a job well done.
I pay for builders and decorators, because I'm crap at both those things.
I don't feel guilty about it in the slightest.
But I do take pride in the fact that I keep my own car, shoes, house etc clean and get a certain amount of satisfaction in doing so.
There’s nothing romantic about being proud of a job well done.
No. Nobody is saying that. But then why mention your 'class'? Nobody talks of 'middle class pride', do they? This 'working class pride' thing is a myth propagated and perpetuated by ruling classes, who would very much like the proles to stay in their place, and not get ideas above their station. Forget 'working class'; you're a nurse, so immediately of far greater social importance than any ****ing banker or 'project manager' or whatever bullshit job you can think of. Don't pigeonhole yourself according to someone else's made up values. Have pride in yourself.
But I do take pride in the fact that I keep my own car, shoes, house etc clean and get a certain amount of satisfaction in doing so.
Our bathroom is sparkling, because I put a lot of effort into keeping it that way. It's the envy of all our friends. I'll jet wash the bins (we share with 2 other households) not because it's my 'job', but because I know I'll do a much better job than any other bugger. But **** painting and decorating; more than happy to let someone else do that. And as for cleaning; we live in a modest flat, not some sprawling pile full of children and animals, and getting someone in to clean it would just be downright lazy. But cleaning, like collecting the bins, unblocking drains etc, are vital jobs that need doing, and should not be relegated to their 'lowly' status. Sure, most people don't like doing them, but hey, they have to be done, and not everyone can ponce around being graphic designers or ****ing 'project managers', can they? 😀
And as for cleaning; we live in a modest flat, not some sprawling pile full of children and animals, and getting someone in to clean it would just be downright lazy.
The very first thing I did when I got my first flat was arrange for cleaners to come in. When she saw it she laughed and said I have to pay by the hour but it wouldn't take that long to clean, which I said, that's cool just take a load off when you're done. My flat was always spotless, and it was the cleaning firm's favourite job as they essentially got to have a paid break...winner winner chicken dinner
But then why mention your ‘class’? Nobody talks of ‘middle class pride’, do they? This ‘working class pride’ thing is a myth propagated and perpetuated by ruling classes, who would very much like the proles to stay in their place, and not get ideas above their station.
Because I come from a working class, socialist background 🙂
And despite the efforts of various governments I'm proud of the fact that my parent's generation fought hard for social justice whilst refusing to conform to the stereotypes of those who would denegrate them as a feral, ignorant underclass.
Because I come from a working class, socialist background
So do I. But I don't bang on about having some kind of 'working class pride'. Because that's just bollocks. Nobody aspires to be 'working class'; wearing it as a badge of honour is merely marking your position in the social stratification as created by the ruling classes.
And despite the efforts of various governments I’m proud of the fact that my parent’s generation fought hard for social justice whilst refusing to conform to the stereotypes of those who would denegrate them as a feral, ignorant underclass.
Which generation was that? How old are you??
I'm assuming you live in some tied cottage, 2 up 2 down, and only eat raw gravel (on a Sunday, and then only if you're lucky), as would befit a 'proper working class' person. Because anything else would be frightfully bourgeois, non? 😉
But I don’t bang on about ‘working class pride’
Irony overload....
I'm not sure you fully understand the concept of 'irony', my friend...
My parents were born in 1916 and 1932.
Nobody aspires to be ‘working class’
I never said they did.
.....wearing it as a badge of honour is merely marking your position in the social stratification as created by the ruling classes....
I disagree, for the reasons outlined in my previous post.
I don't 'wear it as a badge of pride' but I AM proud of them and their generation for what they fought for, how they conducted themselves and for what they believed in.
...bridges argues...
...nickc feels left out...
I don’t ‘wear it as a badge of pride’
Now, where's that irony meter...
As I said in a previous post, I'm not being judgemental about the fact that people have cleaners!
I'm merely stating the fact that I prefer not to have one and why.
I’m assuming you live in some tied cottage, 2 up 2 down, and only eat raw gravel (on a Sunday, and then only if you’re lucky), as would befit a ‘proper working class’ person. Because anything else would be frightfully bourgeois, non? 😉
You are free to assume what you like.
I've not classified myself as anything.
I have referred to my background and that of my parents and their generation.
I’ve not classified myself as anything.
Irony meter? Anyone seen it? 😀
Enough already. So you don't feel you need a cleaner. No need whatsoever to bring class into it though, was there? No.
Jesus wept....
Remind me never, ever to discuss anything with you, ever again.
It's ok; I'll let you have the last word, if it makes you feel any better.
Oh, bugger...
Now, where’s that irony meter…
You can pay someone to do ironying as well if you want
But what if I've got too much working class pride?
Remind me never, ever to discuss anything with you, ever again.
Welcome to Singletrackworld. I'll show you around sometime 😆
🙃
You can pay someone to do ironying as well if you want
Well, I for one thought that was mildly amusing. 👏
Jesus! This got derailed in a strange way. I’m getting the feeling bridges was once beaten up by a working class housewife or possibly forced to work in a mine.
Best way to avoid cleaning is to have small children. I’m resigned to cleaning in about ten years or so. No point in the interim as it’ll be filthy again in 5,4,3...
Jesus! This got derailed in a strange way. I’m getting the feeling bridges was once beaten up by a working class housewife or possibly forced to work in a mine.
He's realy a chatacter from that Monty Python sketch with the working class poet whose son wants to become a miner.....
TUNGSTEN CARBIDE DRILLS?!
Aside, if I were still a moderator then right now I'd be trying to work out which Returning Banned bridges was. But I'm not so, eh.
Isn't it just better to get on with your own life, rather than obsessing over someone who might be someone else or whatever it is you think I've done/not done? IE; get a life? Just an idea, like...
Jesus! This got derailed in a strange way. I’m getting the feeling bridges was once beaten up by a working class housewife or possibly forced to work in a mine.
Actually, my mum was a home help for a good few years when I was growing up, which involved lots of cleaning of elderly and vulnerable people's houses. I've done cleaning jobs. Cleaning work is often seen as 'lowly', and menial, not least because it's mainly done by women. How many of the men on here would be happy working for £10/12 an hour, for example? Exactly. It's not work that is valued nearly as highly enough in our society, when it's importance is much greater than a vast number of other types of work. Cleaners have been hit so hard by CV, and many are already on very tight margins as it is. And many, especially in London at least, are migrants, so often aren't entitled to any income support or other benefits. So even if you aren't posh, employing someone to do some professional cleaning right now, would be showing working class solidarity.
Tidying != Cleaning. Took me 40 years to realise this.
Tidying != Cleaning. Took me 40 years to realise this.
'zactly.
We get a cleaner in for 3 hours every couple of weeks. she's here now. We make sure the house is tidy before she comes, otherwise we're paying her to move stuff around, rather than clean.
One of the biggest causes of arguments in our house was cleaning and tidying and our different ideas about when it was necessary and what the priorities were. Worth paying the money just to get the arguments out of the way; having a lovely, clean house is a bonus!
Re: previous page's argument: some jobs you like, some jobs you don't. I like working on my bike, servicing suspension, building wheels, working in the garden. Would much rather do them myself than pay someone else to (unless, for instance fitwheels can build and deliver cheaper than I can get the bits for)
Some jobs I don't really care about and don't get much satisfaction from, and/or I'm not interested enough to get good at them - time constraints means there's less time for the jobs I enjoy more, and the things that are actually fun, like playing with my kids and riding bikes. For me, I'll gladly pay someone to pack before moving house, clean, paint - I think I'll be paying someone to decorate next time we're dong that. Servicing my car.
No need to value-judge anyone because they enjoy different jobs to you. Cooking, gardening, car/motorbike/bicycle mechanics, painting, furniture renovation, ironing, polishing shoes, - one man's ball-ache is another man's meditation, enthusiasm, craft, hobby, pride.