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problem is once you declare someone ‘great’ you are abslving them of the bad things, no matter how horrific
Personally I don't think that is axiomatically the case but I deliberately put the word "great" in quotation marks because I don't think the use of such a word (or indeed "villain") runs the risk of implying that someone's entire life and personality can be summed up in a single word.
He was a ****. And that's exactly what we needed, a nice guy isn't going to win a total war, a ****ing arsehole who can willingly sacrifice other humans will though.
OK, got it, so that's why CIA/MI6 supported Saddam in 1963 Coup of Iraq, then continued to arm and support him to help fight Iran (the same Iran destabilized by a 1953 CIA/MI6 coup) until shortly before Gulf war...
If a nasty pasty serves the interests of HM Government/US State Dept/Oil Industry then nasty is good.
Guess that's why Saudi Arabia gets away with so much.
Half term already?
Nah mate, just the kids on strike...
Extinction crises or something, nothing to worry about.
so is JHJ playing the long game with this post?
Don't come on here peddling your outrageous conspiracy theories mike...
My Grandad wasn't scarred for life by WW2 just so you could come on here and express an opinion!
Next you'll be waffling on about Venezuela and oil and how we could all live in some kind of peaceful, clean air, low cost utopia with solar and tidal energy if not for all the shady buggers who seek to divide us for power and profit.
If a nasty pasty serves the interests of HM Government/US State Dept/Oil Industry then nasty is good.
Meanwhile..........
What I love about jhj threads is that no matter how they start, you always know what will eventually happen. The fun is guessing when the tinfoil will start to rustle. It’s like one of those comedy shows with a long running catchphrase....it’s funny because it is so awesomely predictable.
Both , wrong bloke for the job followed by right bloke for the job .
My Grandad wasn’t scarred for life by WW2 just so you could come on here and express an opinion!
My dad bore the scars from incarceration in Changhi Goal, as a Japanese POW, and brought me up in such a way that I can have an opinion.
One of those ways was to ensure I knew about the actions of those who left the scars on his back, but to not let that knowledge poison my opinion of their descendants.
Well he did get rid of road tax.
And then went on to sell car insurance.
Mostly a hero, with a small smattering of villain for good measure. Regardless, he is, for me, the greatest Brit of all times, i dare say very few people, if any, would have been capable of his feats in WW2. If ever one man had a destiny, it was he, and WW2 was his.
He's neither and both in truth.
i dare say very few people, if any, would have been capable of his feats in WW2. If ever one man had a destiny, it was he, and WW2 was his.
Does that get you out of everything? Thankfully history can look objectively
Er no. History is proverbially not about its ostensible subject matter but instead is the history of the time in which it is written. Hence the backlash we see here.
Or we can look at all his history of all his time not just the moments it worked well
Never mind Tonypandy, this is the big boy:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/soutikbiswas/2010/10/how_churchill_starved_india.html
He was basically the Bojo of his time, out of his depth as a politician, but good with a quick soundbite. WWII needed an inspirational leader, so the propaganda machine created his myth, while the "adults" surrounding him guided policy despite him, not because of him. He got the credit, because it was needed at that point in history.
I don’t agree he was the Bojo of his time - that gives too much credit to Bojo and not enough to Churchill. He was a genuinely inspirational leader and that is clear from contemporary accounts ie Alanbrooke again (who is otherwise very critical of Churchill) said ‘thank god for Churchill’. As I alluded to earlier the propaganda was to some extent of Churchill’s own making as he pointed out himself when he character assassinated Chamberlain - ‘poor Neville, history will judge him harshly. I know because I will write it’.
Bojo on the other hand, is just a **** in an ‘I love Churchill’ t shirt...
A villain with just a couple of "heroic" moments.
Mel Brooks take on the subject.