children and inheritance.

My kids would have the same attitude as yours Ton. And I had the same attitude with my parents. 

I'm/we're just not that money orientated. I'd rather have seen my parents happy and enjoying themselves than thinking they had to limit their lives to leave me anything. And my kids are the same.

Obviously being left something is nice, and helpful, but if it had all gone on care costs for them I'd be happy knowing they were being looked after.

I told my parents to spend as much as possible on holidays whilst they still can, but still advised they get proper advise regarding the rules. As it has changed a lot recently

I keep telling our three that we're spending their inheritance now while we can enjoy it.... sod 'em!*

* not really, there should be some left 😉

I'm at the younger end of those two relationships. Late 30's with both parents and in-laws heading towards 70. Not once has it crossed our minds about expecting any sort of inheritance. And to be honest I'm still hoping it's quite a few years away yet. Yeah it'll be nice to get some (and it'll probably mostly bypass us and help the grandchildren when they are at an age that needs a step up), but not really sure it offsets the inevitable pain of losing your parents.

The response of your friend's daughter is either wholly ungrateful with no consideration for her dad or she's in a financially desperate situation and is planning to rely on all the inheritance money she can get to bail her out.

Situations like that can bring people's true nature to the surface.
In your friends case I'd be devastated to learn my child thought like that, and it's not necessarily due to their upbringing 🙁

OP tell your friend to take up SKIing (Spending the Kids Inheritance)

In your friends case I'd be devastated to learn my child thought like that

100% agreed – it isn't like she isn't going to get anything (well, it seems she might if she doesn't rethink her attitude). My in-laws have just downsized and it's great that they are now financially secure and able to spend a bit on holidays (although my father-in-law is getting a bit past being able to cope with too much travelling) and also being able to treat their grandchildren (I am not entirely sure they are doing this bit 100% by the book so there may be some tax to pay when the inevitable happens). 

I helped my parents sort out equity release on their house (they absolutely did not want to sell so equity release worked for them). They are currently in Gran Canaria on their annual 6 weeks winter sun break, happily spending their money, and I think it is bloody ace.  

he only has one child, who when he told her what was happening, went ballistic with him.

He should crack on and spend every last penny to make sure that entitled brat doesn't see any of it. 

Our only daughter knows she's getting 100% of everything - that may be 100% of sweet FA though! 😀

The daughter sounds like someone I know. Needs to be told where to go. It's give the money to charity to further upset her 

People have  very funny ideas about what they are entitled to. In simple terms children are not due anything. Parents can choose to do whatever they want. 

The very worst of people often stays hidden until inheritance is discussed.

😀 😀 😀 😀 😀 

Take a fictional example of a parent and child in London. The parent bought a house for twenty grand or whatever it was pre-2000's and it's now worth £800k.

The parent did nothing to deserve that bounty but nonetheless wants to release equity and go live it up on the profits. The problem is it leaves the child in a situation where they will realistically never be able to buy a house anywhere near where they grew up, perhaps condemning them to a life on the breadline or having to move far away from their friends and family. But at least the parent gets to have a blast eh?

Is there no sympathy for the child in that situation at all?

Ignoring her down right entitled attitude, with cost of caring for the elderly nowadays, does she really think there going to be any inheritance left? I pity the boyfriend..

Is there no sympathy for the child in that situation at all?

My kids will be very lucky to get any inheritance from me what savings I have will quickly be swallowed up by any care costs I incur. There will be no retirement to swan around in a motorhome etc. I'll have to work for as long as possible after retirement age.  I do have some sympathy for the daughter or people of her generation . We have left them paying for our pensions when it is very unlikely they will get a similar pension in their old age. Meantime the cost of housing is exorbitant too. I can see why they're unhappy

Most of us won't see any money from inheritance until we are in our 50s, 60s or even older. If you are relying on that for your house deposit, you're leaving it a bit late.

The parent bought a house for twenty grand or whatever it was pre-2000's and it's now worth £800k.

Erm, 20k in London? More like 1961, not 2001

Regardless of housing markets, cost of living etc. etc., why does the child think that they are entitled to the parents' money/estate? They didn't earn it, they didn't do whatever the parents did to acquire the wealth etc.

Some people have strange views on what is theirs by right. My parents can do whatever they want with their cash, it's not mine, I didn't work for it - they did. It's none of my business what they do with it.

I typed a long reply but got an error.

Basically I agree with roli case.

The older generation needs to carefully consider the lucky breaks they got, and actually accordingly to not be a selfish git.

This is what I intend to do for.my kids. I'll work longer than I need to so I can hand more cash to them because they are growing up in tougher times

This does not excuse the daughter's entitled behaviour 

Posted by: el_boufador

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I typed a long reply but got an error.

Basically I agree with roli case.

The older generation needs to carefully consider the lucky breaks they got, and actually accordingly to not be a selfish git.

This is what I intend to do for.my kids. I'll work longer than I need to so I can hand more cash to them because they are growing up in tougher times

This does not excuse the daughter's entitled behaviour 

Ditto - also got an error msg & was discussing doing exactly the same just the other night, using some of my pension pot to gift to one of my kids will make a huge difference to their life now, no need to wait 20 or 30yrs, but will mean I work till I'm 70...

You are choosing to do this as you are a nice person and want to help your kids.

The bit which troubles me is when people expect it like it's a given (I know we all die but people have differing views on this). I'm talking people of all ages here, not just twenty-somethings. My friend in her late 40s is really annoyed with her sister as their parents have helped her more over the years and she is demanding that the will is updated now to reflect this.... 🤦‍♂️. Her parents are only  in their early-70s so should be around for a long while yet.

I agree with roli_case.

House price inflation has been a way for older generations to take money from younger ones.

House prices need to fall. That’s going to leave a lot of people up shit creek.

I'm 63.  My parents are 90.  I haven't got mine yet.  My parents and I had a discussion about money when they retired. I said aim to spend it all by your mid 80s and they succeeded apart from the house.

I get 1/4. My sister and my two nephews get 1/4 each.

I have no kids.  My nephews get 1/3 of mine.  The rest widely spread among extended family and friends. 

Inheritance keeps wealth in the hands of the wealthy.  I'd like to see it taxed much more heavily 

When I my parents and my sister die my nephews get 3 valuable houses.

Unless we're all 70+ we aren't the golden generation!

I know for certain we'll need all of our assets in retirement (another 11 years away) just to survive*. We haven't got tens of thousands to fund our daughters life. We help out where we can though, but she's now 22 and working and living away self-sufficiently.

And don't judge all parts of the country by SW standards - around my way (mid-Derbyshire) you can buy a perfectly decent terraced house for £150k ish.

(*not go on x3 cruises a year - just basic living).

Posted by: elshalimo

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My friend in her late 40s is really annoyed with her sister as their parents have helped her more over the years and she is demanding that the will is updated now to reflect this....

Apart from the demanding element I can see your friends point. Families often have one sibling who leaches off their parents while others work hard and stand in their own two feet. That leaching can amount to a lot of money over the years.

all kinds of nasty stuff came out, with the main issue being that there would be nothing left for her once he has passed.

Just wait until she finds out about care home fees, and how much will be left of any property after that.

She's going to go crazy when HMRC take their cut

Money & families are what keeps lawyers afloat - or at least that's what I've learnt from dealing with a friend's estate & his estranged family.

I'm probably going to get flamed for this but, I remember the late 70's and early 80's vividly ( and I was only 10 in 1975 ) because my mother was really worried and couldn't hide the pressure she was under. She was recently divorced and receiving very little support from my father. Times were hard, mortgage rates were over 17%, businesses were collapsing, high unemployment and 3 day weeks, strikes, petrol rationing, etc. The 2000's were also a challenging decade. My mother is in a good place now and I don't begrudge her lifestyle because she really struggled at times. It's an interesting debate, but I think we forget how much suffering that generation had to endure yet they are often targeted as the 'lucky ones'. Also before the internet came along there were so few additional costs so it was perhaps easier to live a more frugal life when times were tough or your needed to save for a deposit. Now we are surrounded by so many additional costs which are ingrained into our lifestyles which just didn't even exist - Netflix, mobile phones, Spotify, the take away culture, etc. Hope she spends the lot!

My parents do their best to not spend their pot of money despite me telling them to spend it. They know it'll make a huge difference to me but I've told them I fully intend to spend it and I won't be paying off my mortgage. Everything will be split 50/50 between myself and my brother despite the fact that he just bought an apartment for 2mil and has also just bought two porsches. However, my parents know I'm very grateful for anything they do leave me and I wouldn't dare to have such a poor attitude about it. I'd rather they travelled or bought a new TV with it.

Posted by: ton

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he only has one child, who when he told her what was happening, went ballistic with him.

all kinds of nasty stuff came out, with the main issue being that there would be nothing left for her once he has passed.

For many people though, inheritance is literally the only way to any sort of decent sum of money. Maybe she's made financial decisions with that in mind? That's not to say she's right or wrong or that her attitude is OK. But large sums of money (or worse, the potential for large sums of money) make people do strange things.

My Dad and my aunt had a right falling out over my Grandad's estate. My Dad ended up doing most of the work around tidying the place up, selling it and so on and he took his own sweet time over it; meanwhile my aunt was just wanting the whole thing done ASAP and her share of the cash. That sounds horrendous written down but she was disabled and certainly in no fit state to be shifting furniture, redecorating prior to sale etc and she had care costs to meet because disability benefit didn't come close to covering it.

And just to add, neither my sister nor I were left anything at all - which was entirely my Grandad's right. 

My former boss - his MiL died after a very long period of illness, frailty, care homes etc and the care costs took out half the total value of the estate.

I'm also with roli on this one.

I fully intend to give my kids a chunk of cash towards a house deposit asap, and will inheritance plan so they hopefully get a chunk more. Anyone who is in a similar position and doesn't seems like a bit of a &£# to me.

Lots of us old people are in a far better situation than the next generation, and to kid ourselves that is purely down to our awesomeness and work ethic is just deluded.

PS1 I emphasis the " in a similar position" part of my post.

PS2 I fully support any government efforts to restrict the amount I can leave to my kids tax free.

Your money to do what you wish with. Article in The Times a few days ago describe how a 26-year-old now "hates" her late grandad because he left her £120,000 and her brother £200,000. 

Basically, you can kind of see why he did it. I neither expect nor need anything from my parents. 

Balance...

I'm fully aware of how much more difficult my daughter has/will have things compared to me, particularly as regards housing costs (whether buying or renting). We support her a little financially and I'm happy to offer more, whether that's up front or in some investment, when we can. However, we've also worked bloody hard to get to the point we're at and we have every intention of making sure we're able to enjoy the years remaining to us. 

FWIW, she has never once approached us with an unreasonable request, or attempted to make us feel guilty about our spending. We were thinking of moving house and downsizing (potentially releasing some cash for her) but she'd rather we didn't sell her "home". 

Poor attitude on her part. But on a similar point, we chose to have one child and we have also worked hard to make sure she will have a house mortgage free when she gets to that age. Rightly or wrongly I feel we’ve been lucky where she won’t be in anything approaching the same way. I’m 52 now…

It's kind of interesting... in the UK you have free will over all your assets, so you can leave everything to a donkey sanctuary if you wish...

In Spain it's a bit different, they have a thing called 'forced sucession'.

Essentially, very simply putting it, that means that two thirds of any estate automatically goes to next of kin, split equally and cascades down though family, by blood and/or marriage accordingly.

So you can only really have free will over one third of your estate.

I personally think it's a bit archaic, as it takes away freedom of choice, to a large extent, ~66%.

Back in the UK, it's very important you have a will to prevent legal problems down the road, a couple of hundred quid on a well written will is a very sound 'investment' for your beneficiaries, as it will void any legal challenges very easily.

For example in a very simple case, you may have 2 offspring... offspring 'A' might be a bit of a twunt, and also quite well off, so you may choose to leave 70% of the estate to offspring 'B', and that's that, it's basically incontestable.

@Dickyboy add boundary disputes to the list of legal money-makers.

My late Nan was really shrewd, bless her. She left her house and posessions 100% to me, and she seperated the rest of the estate (basicaly bank accounts in cash) between me and my niece (she getting 70%, Me 20%, and the remaining 10% to some family friends).

Just to clarify, my Niece (from my previously dead brother) and I are (were) her closest blood relatives, so it was really easy the way the will was written.

My mother (and stepdad) is (are) really very well off and from time to time she informs me of various will changes, investments they are leaving for one or another of the children etc etc.

I point out to her that she's got 20 years to go until she's as old as her mum when she died, and that puts me comfortably into my 70s... so there's a fair chance she'll outlive me!

There was an extra pot of money from life insurance when my father died when I was 23, £30k, and my mum informed that that money was saved in the "pot" for me and my brother when she married Colin (stepdad). I didn't say anything to her, but £15k would have been very useful at the time - house deposit, for a start - and I knew it'd just be swallowed by inflation if left until death. Sure enough, there's so much money now that a few years ago I was informed that money was just absorbed into the "pot" now.

I honestly could not care less; we've paid off the mortgage now and have "enough" money and savings not to worry within a simple life; but my mother is incredibly tight and will not spend an extra penny on enjoying life (for example, they go on holidays as helpers for blind people - not to help, really, but because they're subsidised!)... I really do wish she would spend my inheritance (that I may never see) on just splashing out a bit and bloody enjoying herself for once!

Money in the bank makes her happy and feel secure though, so that's that and care home bills and inheritance tax (very tight, but never looks at tax planning!) will do for most of it anyway. 

I can't imagine being like the lass in the OP... does she want dad to top himself to speed things up a bit, too?!

First of all Ton I’m glad you and your family are together on this. No sympathy with the friends kid. She needs to realise that the money isn’t hers, it might go on care costs, it might be 30 years until she sees it. I’m 58 apparently i have a 25% chance of living until I’m 93

Take a fictional example of a parent and child in London. The parent bought a house for twenty grand or whatever it was pre-2000's and it's now worth £800k.

The parent did nothing to deserve that bounty but nonetheless wants to release equity and go live it up on the profits. The problem is it leaves the child in a situation where they will realistically never be able to buy a house anywhere near where they grew up, perhaps condemning them to a life on the breadline or having to move far away from their friends and family. But at least the parent gets to have a blast eh?

Is there no sympathy for the child in that situation at all?

The problem is that inheritance might not help at all. It’s the same as the above. I’m 58 both parents in great health. In your scenario I’m going to live near where i grew up as i retire, what are they doing for the other 40 years?  Plus it’s entirely possible for a couple to spend all of that money on care costs. 

So should you free up £400,000 by down sizing and want to help your kids then the thing to do is hand over some cash. That way they know what they are getting and when they are getting it.  But that’s entirely your choice

Our kids will share whatever is left when we die, which may be nothing after what I hope will be a long retirement and care costs.

Her parents are only  in their early-70s so should be around for a long while yet.

Crikey - I lost my dad at 69 and mum at 70 (15 and 12 yrs ago). Early 70s is young, but not for everyone 🙁

(from my previously dead brother)

has he been resurrected?

Posted by: elshalimo

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Erm, 20k in London? More like 1961, not 2001

Real life case. 1997 house in Homerton 70k. Sold a few years ago for ~900k.

Posted by: FB-ATB

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(from my previously dead brother)

 

has he been resurrected?

You know what I mean, smart arse 🙄 

I mean't to say pre-deceaced, in case it needed spelling out for you.

Honestly...

Posted by: reeksy

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Posted by: elshalimo

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Erm, 20k in London? More like 1961, not 2001

Real life case. 1997 house in Homerton 70k. Sold a few years ago for ~900k.

But how long ago was it £20k?

My mum is multi-millionaire as a result of the company she started. She's semi-retired now, currently half-way round the world on one of the many cruises she now takes in the name of "spending the kids' inheritance". I was offered an 'in' to the company on day 1 and I declined, my sister bought in. My mum has said that when she's gone the company stays within the shareholders, at which point my sister will be 51%, so when she's gone I get nothing. I'm cool with that even though if it was a traditional inheritance split I'd be in line for a 7, maybe 8 figure sum. It would be beyond amazing to inherit that amount but I didn't put anything into the business and it's a going concern, so all credit to those who are and will continue to be involved.

OP's mate's daughter sounds delightful.

My parents downsized in their sixties, then did equity release. When my dad died 15years ago my mum had care home costs in the last years of here life (she died 6 years ago). All the money was spent. They had a great retirement with loads of holidays and left a couple of thousands to my son/neice/nephew. I was absolutely in support of their choices.

id expect this to be normal for lots of people, with people living longer and care home costs. To the OP friend’s daughter - she may not get a penny. There is no rights or certainty to inheritances.

House price inflation has been a way for older generations to take money from younger ones.

And also from poor to rich

Inheritance increases inequality and is fairly damaging to society.    

It keeps the poor poor

The older generation got lucky breaks and the younger generation are screwed, but the solution isn’t for a small proportion of the latter to get huge unearned windfalls while a large proportion get sweet FA and remain screwed.