In fact the one problem I have with cash is I stop by at the farm entrance with the honesty box for the eggs.... I'm running out of smash now to pay. Ive already raided my wee boys piggy bank.
In fact the one problem I have with cash is I stop by at the farm entrance with the honesty box for the eggs…. I’m running out of smash now to pay. Ive already raided my wee boys piggy bank
Meanwhile we’re drowning in pound coins from our egg honesty box now that we can’t give them to the kids to pay for their school meals. Wanna swap?
(Well not drowning exactly, we haven’t got that many hens, but there must be a hundred quid in the quarantine pot)
In the Lakes last summer a few places were cash only. Campsites and chippy.
One cafe's card machine went down and the Q backed up. The staff were getting really stressed. They should either give the food away or ask folk to call back later or pay online with ping it or something.
Frustrating when you have the means to pay and they won't accept it.
Bit like having cash and a business not accepting it:)
It's tricky isn't it.
Mate has lived in Norway for 3 years and he tells me he has never seen cash there.
Mate has lived in Norway for 3 years and he tells me he has never seen cash there.
He is of course exaggerating. I did work on the new bank note series the Norwegian central bank has only just introduced...
But yeah, that is where things are headed worldwide, and I’m all for it.
Card machine is cheaper (0.03 pence per transaction, plus small monthly fees)
I’m assuming that’s 3p and not 0.03 p?
Typo, my bad, sorry: it’s 0.3% charge (actually it’s 0.27% on the lowest card but 0.3% is the average)
But it’s 1.5% charge to pay in cash at the bank. Hefty difference if you pay in £10k cash a week!
I've stopped shopping in a lot of the smaller local shops since Covid. Feel a bit guilty about it but I really don't want to be handling cash and many of them are still cash only. I'd make an exception before just because it was the only option but generally I don't see any reason to be using physical money in this day and age. It's just an inconvenience.
I hoped hsbc would do too, but not via their mobile app at least.
I can pay cheques in on my HSBC mobile app!!
genuinely quite surprised this is so one sided
couple of points
- online banking, yeah all great till your laptop picks up a virus, bad one, scan ongoing, and half your 'access' is cut off (same for power or BB outages) with the extra paranoia in the next few days that anything i have accessed in recent days is potentially compromised and needs securing
- buying rounds, if you dont know which of your mates is up/down then you need to rethink those mates, the one, yeah that one, ensure he buys the first round regularly and explain why
take cash out of the bank and shop local, else soon you wont have those options... someone mentioned lazy stereotyping earlier, well to say that any local business that likes cash/has a broken card machine is tax dodging....
- kids pocket money, via an app that you pay for... wow.
I was all for cash until about 2 years ago when I received this £20 note out a cash machine, complete with a bogie:
Pretty happy not to touch it anymore.
re: investing the money you have in your account - I recon the average current account probably has less than £2k in it over the average year. a bank can lend most of that out as a loan or mortgage (provided the ratios are ok) - I think they have to hold back 20% or so. So they can lend out £1600. Assuming that there are no costs involved in servicing the mortgage, they might be pulling in 1.5% interest rate - or approx £24 in 'profit' from having all your wages. You could blow that in the wrapped up cost of a single phone call to their call centre.
There is a big drive for ‘shop local’ or ‘shop British’ but there should also be a pay with cash drive….
No, there should be a low fees for small businesses drive. Then we all get what we want.
How come monkeyboyjc is paying 2.5% and redfox is only paying 0.3%?
For redfox monthly fees are on top which do add up.
But monkeyboyjc is paying over the odds by the sounds of things
I pay a flat rate of 1.0% with no other fees (izettle). We could save a little bit by switching to a contract but other factors (hassle/reliability/hardware) have so far prevented me.
I would echo redfoxs comments about going cashless.
It has been great in my business. Overall being cashless is quicker to serve customers, less mistakes, no security worries, saves time counting & banking, cheaper, and more hygienic.
Truth is we do actually have a small cash float for the occasional customer who really needs it. That's been maybe 10 in 6 months.
I have not experienced customers shitting on the floor, but if cashless makes that less likely then all the better!
Cash is dying and will die out. It's inevitable. From my generation and younger are almost all converted over to electronic forms of paying and the older generation who still prefer cash wont be around forever. One big driver that will affect peoples behaviour is the inevitability that free personal banking will end soon. We'll all have to start paying for services from banks now they're not earning due to depressed interest rates. And there will be a charge for using cash soon...we'll have to pay to withdraw it and that will push people to electronic payment methods. Shops may have to pay additional charges to process them and will have the dilemma of passing charges onto customers or soaking them up as a business operating cost, but that is no different to any other charge or cost a business faces. And it will be a simple case of the comparison of additional business costs of electronic payments vs. the value of the loss of business for not offering the convenience of electronic payments to your customers...and customers do value convenience.
COVID has helped things. Around me the small handful of businesses who used to be cash only are now offering electronic payments and business has increased with those, so will be interesting if they revert back after COVID. I suspect most if any wont.
I'm not sure if I'll miss cash. Can't remember the last time I went to an ATM and whenever I receive cash these days I'm looking to offload it ASAP as it's just a PITA. Had a tenner kicking about on my home desk for months now looking for an opportunity to spend it. I've been almost entirely electronic for payments for so long now. The idea of having to seek out the nearest ATM before going to a shop now is as ridiculous as walking to the bottom of the garden in the middle of the night to go to the toilet like they did in the days before toilets in houses, or getting up off the sofa to walk over to the TV to press a button to change the channel in the days before TV remote controls.
How come monkeyboyjc is paying 2.5% and redfox is only paying 0.3%?
Because I prob take less in a day than he does in an hour? Volume of scale.
Also 2.5 is my 'worst' card on Amex - to be fair it's usually around 1.2 < 1.5 for most debit cards. Amex charges for me are around £1.5 to £3 a month! I've had bills for 19p in the past and they send an invoice and a seperate DD notice from France in the post! I cost them more than I make them just on postage.
I have an izettle in my taxi - it wouldn't work in the shop as it's to slow, unreliable and can't link to the till. I pay for a propper epos card machine in the shop (aka supermarkets).
My contract with my current epos supplier is up at the end of the year, so I 'should' be able to get a better deal based on the increase in card use.
I'll happily take card payment from anyone, but given the option I'll take cash every time. It goes in my bank the same day, there are zero charges, I make a very very small fee for depositing the money, and it's instant.
Cards I get charged for, it takes at least 3 days to go into my bank, I have to pay for the machine each month, I can't just buy one (although there are service providers where I could).
He isn't exaggerating much (re. Norway) - I have some cash in the house, but haven't actually used it for a year and never routinely carry it. Most small transactions outside e.g. stuff at football matches, drinks etc. are account direct via a phone app called Vipps.
I do find it sad that this thread is so one sided. Its sad that the under 30s are so willing to throw away the choice of cash.
The digital age is very much like the industrial revolution, we can all see it happening, 50yrs time our lives will be completely different.
Its sad that the under 30s
I think you'll find the average age on here is well over that, try nearer 50.
It's a losing battle anyway, most of the public are happy for it to happen, many retailers and hospitality venues are happy for it to happen, HMRC won't be objecting and nor will the banks. All you'll have in favour of keeping it are a few luddities and a load of pressure groups lobbying for the luddites. The government of the day will pass some half hearted and convoluted legislation to keep cash just to look inclusive and cash will die.
Also, if we went completely cashless, I’d bet a crisp £20 note, the banks will suddenly put their charges up.
You're late to the party, card charges to a big hike in 2018 and again in 2019. The business I work in were on pennies per transaction for debit card payments, it's now a percentage. Credit cards went from 0.5% to around 2% or more for foreign payments.
The idea for a bank account for all is a good one but these never work as the charges are exorbitant for those on a low income (a bit like pre-pay fuel meters). The people who need them can't afford a monthly fee for banking or charges for getting their money out to pay cash for a purchase.
I think you’ll find the average age on here is well over that, try nearer 50.
I know that 🙄, but judging by the pro reply's (and my customers) it's under 30s who don't carry or use any cash.
Agree cash is completely dieing out and Covid has spread this up. But, for me at least, cash has massive advantages over card. Like I said earlier, if I were cash only id have thousands a year to reinvest in my buisness.
No, there should be a low fees for small businesses drive. Then we all get what we want.
Not really, by paying in cash your keeping 100% of that money local. Paying by card/phone/watch a percentage goes to the international conglomerates.
judging by the pro reply’s (and my customers) it’s under 30s who don’t carry or use any cash.
I'm 62 and, as above, never carry cash. Hell, I rarely carry a wallet or card. I use my phone instead. Is happily see the max transaction limit increased.
Last used cash to buy some garlic from a corner shop on Christmas Day - had to make a big detour to find an ATM to get 20 quid. Now I am keeping the coins in my pocket to give to homeless people, who don't accept Amex just yet.
never carry cash. Hell, I rarely carry a wallet or card. I use my phone instead. Is happily see the max transaction limit increased.
This, though I keep a 20 in my phone case, and my car has maybe 20 or 30 pound coins for car parks when hillwalking.
Only downside is forgetting to lift ID (driving licence) when doing screwfix click and collect.
kids pocket money, via an app that you pay for… wow.
This always makes me laugh. My lad has a nationwide account with debit card, so we can just pay pocket money or bus fares in there and he can use it contactless with no fees.
I hardly use cash these days, annoys the hell out of me when we need to pay for parking somewhere that doesn't use an app these days!! need to remember to leave some change in the car...
Amex charges for me are around £1.5 to £3 a month! I’ve had bills for 19p in the past and they send an invoice and a seperate DD notice from France in the post!
That's because it's the law. If you asked them, you could do it all online. A lot of the issues that you're raising about accepting cards could be addressed if you wanted to do something about it. Switch to a cheaper provider, online servicing etc
You can still support local businesses by shopping with them and paying by card.
Also 2.5 is my ‘worst’ card on Amex – to be fair it’s usually around 1.2 < 1.5 for most debit cards.
I have a corporate Amex, and loads of people refused to accept it. Then one day I pointed at the Amex sticker on the door and they said that they could accept it but would rather not because they lose too much money. Which is fair enough on their part as I had another option.
Amex are crap. However my new card is contactless which makes me wonder if the charges are different. Contactless is a different scheme generally.
Thought it worth picking this post apart
online banking, yeah all great till your laptop picks up a virus, bad one, scan ongoing, and half your ‘access’ is cut off (same for power or BB outages) with the extra paranoia in the next few days that anything i have accessed in recent days is potentially compromised and needs securing
I hardly ever use my laptop for banking, I use an app which always works. My watch pays for things without any sort of network connection. Bank branches are closed more than they are open and much more frequently than internet banking services are down. Cash machines run out of cash or are offline more frequently.
take cash out of the bank and shop local, else soon you wont have those options… someone mentioned lazy stereotyping earlier, well to say that any local business that likes cash/has a broken card machine is tax dodging….
I shop local using contactless and, as I said before, more likely to spend money if I can do it instantly and not have to have my wallet on my or go to cash point. Doesn't bother me in the slightest if I do not have the option to use a bank branch, I don't agree with you connecting this to loss of local shops.
– kids pocket money, via an app that you pay for… wow.>
I know, it great isn't it? I give my kids a app which helps them to budget, plan and spend using the same type of technology that will be essential to their daily lives as they become adults. I have complete parental control so I can keep them safe. Why do I apy for it? Because the main banks seem woefully behind the curve here and only offer stripped down versions of adult accounts, nothing smart at all.
It certainly is dying out driven by banks to make more profit. Still happily use cash and I'm not even a coke dealer. But if you interested Instagram is a hive of dealing and most happily accept bank transfers or so a friend tells me.
Edit: PayPal not bank transfer
However my new card is contactless which makes me wonder if the charges are different. Contactless is a different scheme generally.
No it isn't. It's a different form of acceptance (as are wallet transactions), but the underlying payment method is still the card.
go to a supermarket that doesn’t expect you to steal the trolley…
Coin trolleys are so they don't have to pay people to collect trolleys.
– online banking, yeah all great till your laptop picks up a virus
Can't remember the last time I had any virus and it would be very unlikely to compromise bank security. If it was an issue I'd just use my phone, tablet or one of the other laptops.
Plus, as mentioned, most bank use some kind of two-factor authentication such as a physical card reader.
– kids pocket money, via an app that you pay for… wow.
Your paying for the bank account, card services and app.
Cash is dying for kids too: pretty hard to spend cash in online games, amazon etc. My daughter isn't allowed to carry more than £10 cash at school, but a card is fine.
It certainly is dying out driven by banks to make more profit.
I thought it was being driven by a combination of improved convenience and a global pandemic. Silly me.
the charges for using contactless are generally the same as traditional card, however the amex discount rate has dropped significantly in recent years - its now mostly on a par with visa and mastercard, as they're trying to gain acceptance rates (which in the US are again, mostly on a par with both of them)
incidentally, card fees as a whole are trending down as an attempt to stop market disrupters stealing all the card business (as they have in a lot of markets). They will over time effectively trend to zero, and banks will have to make their money in other ways
Not really, by paying in cash your keeping 100% of that money local. Paying by card/phone/watch a percentage goes to the international conglomerates.
You've said on this very thread that you take the cash to the bank daily? If you grabbed wadges of 20s out the till to pay cash directly to the drivers that deliver your stock I would change my mind, but I'm pretty sure you dont.
I do feel for someone in your situation, as a small business, where you are getting charged on your income, not your profits; and more importantly you are having to do both things in parallel (cash and card) to keep all customers happy, and thus you must deal with the disadvantages of both systems.
Consumers/customers are free to pick the one they want, and the vast majority of the people on this thread seem to like the benefits of card payment.
Cash is also dying in schools - I have to put dinner money on Parent Pay for my kids.
Even back in the 1980s in my school dinner money was used to buy a dinner card once a fortnight. Children on free school meals just got the cards without handing over cash, so no-one knew.
Really interesting reading about the kid's pocket money/school lunch things with cards and apps etc. As I don't have kids I hadn't thought about that angle! It does make sense on a few levels: parental control, teaches financial budgeting (a very good thing IMO), reduces theft issues and the free school dinners angle is interesting too. I was a receiver of free school meals for a short time back in high school and got bullied for it (more than normal) when I was spotted going to the reception hatch for my weekly vouchers and using them at the till, when everyone has a digital card that issue disappears completely.
@monkeyboyjc - your situation sounds very unique and if it works for you then great but the vast majority of businesses don't have that option so have to either make a special trip to the bank to deposit their cash or pay a security company to collect it from the premises on a regular basis. the cost of either of these is a direct cut to the bottom line not to mention the security risks involved.
@reluctantjumper I've 10+ buisness within a mile all who accept cash, all rarely bank it with me at the PO, most if not a come in the shop regularly (daily). They could bank it but decide not too... Various reasons, but mainly because they pay suppliers with it rather than Bacs.
I'll be awkard. Cash is so handy.
Easiest way to transfer funds. Even more crucial if internet banking is not wanted. What a complete ball ache that is. Switching on computer, looking for passwords, wondering why the hell the buttons don't do what you want.
Less traumatic to lose than a card as you don't have to wait for a bank to send you a new one. So you lose a few quid. Just how often does it happen?
Easier to keep track of. It is in you hand or not.
More reliable when dealing with strangers.
Easier to carry. A fiver wraps nicely around a light battery and just buys two pints. You can screw a note up into your sock or under an insole.
Don't even mention phones. I have a mobile but god knows where it is. Haven't tried to use it since going to France in May 2019.
Of course not talking about thousands or even hundreds.
Personally I'd be quite keen to go down the Swedish route of eventualy phasing cash out entirely and ensuring everyone has a bank account and the skills to use it.
Cash just seems like imperial weights now, something archaic which should be consigned to the dustbin of history.
I’ll be awkard. Cash is so handy.
Easiest way to transfer funds.... etc.
Wow!!
Easier to carry. A fiver wraps nicely around a light battery and just buys two pints. You can screw a note up into your sock or under an insole.
Where is this pub? Must have been 10 years ago I was annoyed when my local cricket club bar (the cheapest places, generally) went from 2.50 to 2.60 and left you with loads of stupid change.
You know what else is convenient, and has less foot smell? A smart watch (they literally wrap around your wrist) or mobile phone (nicely pocket shaped, and diificult to lose), and you dont have to remember to replenish your stash after each use either.
Just another attack on the poor. Not accepting cash should be illegal - as it is in New York (ISTBC).
Fine for the stereotype STW member, but out in the real world there are plenty of financially compromised people who find budgeting far simpler with a given amount of real cash for the week.
Good Devil's Advocaat @mattsccm but..
internet banking is not wanted. What a complete ball ache that is. Switching on computer, looking for passwords,
In the 90's maybe. These days I just log into the app on my phone using my fingerprint. Done. Damn sight easier than searching for my deposit book and/or making a trip into a branch.
Less traumatic to lose than a card as you don’t have to wait for a bank to send you a new one.
Online banking app allows me to withdraw cash from an ATM without a card. And Apple Pay allows me to pay by card.. without a card.
More reliable when dealing with strangers.
Paying by card gives you certain guarantees and a proof of purchase Cash doesn't.
Don’t even mention phones. I have a mobile but god knows where it is. Haven’t tried to use it since going to France in May 2019.
You are my dad and I claim my £5.
Also.. please come home.
