To cut to the chase I ended up touching (and I mean touching) the car in front of me at some traffic lights. Basically when the lights went green they didn't move (on 3 occasions - I beeped him after the second time (gently)). Every time the lights changed I released the foot brake in anticipation of moving off and reapplied it when I realised they weren't moving. On the fourth occasion I braked and the guy got out of the car in front.
He claimed that I'd hit him - even though the cars were no longer touching. I assume I must have hit him as my car rocked gently when the brake was reapplied but it must have been with the force of hand resting on his car!
After having said that I'd hit him, and my questioning as to why he had refused to move on a green light (he stated that, as there was traffic in the junction (not yellow hatched), it was illegal for him to do so!) he admitted that there was no damage (how could there be?) got back into his car and drove off when the lights turned green.
Next thing I know, the police (2 weeks later) write to me to say that I'd been involved in an accident and had left the scene without exchanging details! Told them what had happened and haven't heard back from them since.
Now I've just had my insurance company on the phone - appears both the driver and his passenger are claiming for whiplash injuries, damage to the car and the cost of a hire car whilst the work is done.
My insurance company asked whether I agree to them paying out. Clearly I said no and asked for further details.
I've just been sent the repair estimate on the car - £80 + parts to replace the bumper support but interestingly nothing for paint work.
What I'd like to know is-
what are my rights re asking the other party to get an independent quote? Can I chose a garage of my choice/ my insurance companies choice?
My insurance company have now said they may challenge the whiplash claim because of the minor damage to the car. What evidence have the other party got to provide for whiplash injuries(medical assessment / doctors report etc)? and are the symptoms easy to fake?
Also, do people ever get pursued by insurance companies if it's considered that the a claim is "made up" ?
Cheers
Just write back to your insurance company explaining the above, telling them that you are not authorising any payment, and it sounds like a scam.
Manchester or Brum?
Did you ever admit to anyone that you even hit them? If you did then I can see the claim for the damage going through as technically you are at fault (and a swift couple of kicks by the 'victim' on his bumper after the incident would be all he would need to do if there wasn't actually any damage in the first place). The whiplash seems a bit unlikely to go through as I imagine your insurance company will by a lot more reluctant to pay out on that.
As br - but you should remember that green does not mean go.
If there was traffic across the junction, he was right not to move (yellow hatching or not). You then got impatient and drove into the back of him? Regardless of how slowly you did this, there's no way you should ever have been that close to him. So - no excuses for [i]your[/i] bad driving. Oh - and you should have had the handbrake on until it was clear you were able to move forward.
Does sound like he's gilding the lily a little, but in light of the above, I'd rather hear his version of events too.
Sounds like a scam to me, there was a gang jailed a few months ago for pulling stunts like this.
http://www.superiorcarinsurance.com/CarBuyingGuide/autoscams.html
That link highlights some of the current scams, have you spoken in detail to you insurer, as it is in their interests to identify a scam (less money for them to pay out).
Faking symptoms of whiplash is quite easy, and there are dodgy doctors & other health professionals who can be paid to provide supporting information.
Green means you can enter the junction IF THE EXIT IS CLEAR. I hope this is a troll, I'd claim off/report you too for driving like an idiot, let alone for damaging a car.
It'd be a crap scam if it relied on people getting impatient and driving into the car in front, it's the drivers responsibility to move off when it's safe to do so, not automatically because the lights have changed despite there being a car in front 🙄
As my driving instructor told me
[s]'Don't tell your dad I touched you and I will make sure you get a pass'[/s] 'Red means stop, Amber means stop, Green means stop unless it is safe to go'
but you should remember that green does not mean go.
RED - Ready
AMBER - Steady
GREEN - GO! GO! GO!
RED - Ready
AMBER - Steady
GREEN - GO! GO! GO!
That sounds awfully familiar. You're not my kids are you?
He sounds like he really is taking the piss! However slightly bumping into somebody to make them move? I'm not sure about that one 😆
Threads like this just make me want to stop driving!
I'd rather hear his version of events too
I know you're not new here so there's no excuse for posting nonsense like that.
Classic signs of organised criminal fraud - car in front brakes to cause low speed rear impact at traffic lights / roundabout. Few weeks later the claimants claim for whiplash. This should have been passed to the insurance companies counter fraud team to investigate. Get on to insurance company and ask if it's being investigated for fraud - if not then why not and then explain to them why it looks like fraud to you. Google "staged accident rings" for more info.
Edit - new Government rules being introduced to speed up insurance companies having to pay out for third party injury so expect to see an increase in this.
DaveGr - Member
Classic signs of organised criminal fraud - car in front brakes to cause low speed rear impact at traffic lights / roundabout. Few weeks later the claimants claim for whiplash. This should have been passed to the insurance companies counter fraud team to investigate. Get on to insurance company and ask if it's being investigated for fraud - if not then why not and then explain to them why it looks like fraud to you. Google "staged accident rings" for more info.
Did you bother to read the OP?
Thanks for the various advice and no I'm not trolling, I'm just looking (fairly obviously I thought) for advice
I should point out that my car is an auto, so just releasing the foot brake slightly will make the car move forward.
Yes, Green doesn't mean go, but when you see the lights change you anticipate that you'll move forward. The traffic in the other lane moved forward on every change of the lights - it's a very busy junction that is always blocked by traffic coming from the other direction - the only way to progress is to merge. However I not looking to make any excuses.
My car (unintentionally) touched his and I don't deny it.
It's the fact that at the time there was no damage and now suddenly there is and it's accompanied by a claim for personal injury (whiplash). This is why I'm seeking advise.
The repair estimate for £80 to replace a bumper support makes no mention of any damage to the (painted) bumper itself - ie there isn't any. I'd like to know whether I can insist on another estimate being sought but this time at a garage of my choosing or at least my insurance company's.
In the light of the whiplash claim I'd like to know how they were so badly injured given that there isn't a mark on the paintwork.
Cheers
Just to update -
The claim has been settled
3rd Party Injury £2,000
3rd Party Solicitors £2,500
Car Hire - as yet unpaid, but I believe claim in for £500+
Damage to Car £80
...and if anyone wants to know why your premiums are going up there's your answer 🙁
Shocking
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If you werent sure you touched/'hit' his car then how could you have?
Even when parking, if you nudge a car behind/infront you definitely feel that (at the very least through your car lifting/dipping slightly).
It sounds like you are being scammed.
Sadly it sounds like you were way too close to the car infront anyway. As you've indicated though vigorously defend the whiplash and ask for the Police to be involved with the potential scam.
I was rear ended when stationary at a roundabout when the driver 'thought' I'd be setting off as he could see the otherside was clear (he didn't see a motorbike that I'd seen). He hit me at a fair rate of speed as well.
the front of midlifcyclists car:
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only a gentle nudge!!
Awful, a complete failing by you, the police and the insurance company.
😕
You should have said he reversed into you!
My wife bumped into a van in really slow queueing traffic, no damage to her car but she managed to push their rear doors in - to note, a Freelander fits between the rear pillars of a large Transit.
The passenger put a claim in for whiplash too...
Jesus, I've gone off BIG in Karting and surely there is more chance of whiplash going into tyre barriers at full speed than there is of a low-speed shunt.
My car insurance has gone up £50 even though I've never claimed. Thanks!
[b]Olly[/b]
whoever you know who can fix that for £80 - you need to post their details.... 😉
Anyway my car wasn't damaged
[b]Hora[/b]
Yes, I must have touched their car, but only at the extreme end of the dip under breaking - it would have been my number plate that touched. The cars weren't touching at the end of the incident.
My insurance more than likely settled because it was the easiest thing for them to do. The 3rd party solicitors were threatening court action. Personally I would have preferred that it had gone to court.
[b]LHS[/b] - what it must be to be perfect...
It is more a reflection of the way things are going with regard to litigation , H&S etc that I wished to highlight. Very sad really how things have changed.
[b]br[/b]
It has to be remembered that the damage amounted to £80... basically a mark on the paintwork.
How much was the passenger awarded in your wife's case?
[b]Hora[/b]
Yup - mines gone up a fair bit as well.....
LHS - what it must be to be perfect...
Perfect? £5000+ worth of claims for a no damage / no injury claim reported 2 weeks after the incident happened??
Somewhere between you, the police and the insurance company there are some serious failings for this to have happened. I suspect that it is the insurance company from previous dealings I have had with them.
Interesting how much of the claim doesn't get paid to the "victims" isn't it? Only about 40% usually goes in compo and sadly this is yet more confirmation of that (figures also don't include costs of either insurance company BTW).
I'd be willing to bet that the medical people who the victims were referred to held qualifications in Africa, Eastern Europe or (shall we say) less well known educational establishments as well. I appreciate how this sounds, but it is often true.
What a ****in joke.
Midlife Cyclist Hope your excess wasn't too high
MLC - they wanted £5k for 'time off unpaid'...
Does sound like your insurance company bottled it and you'll end up paying for it in the long run 🙁
Thank **** I selected the legal option on my insurance quote. I never want to be in your position OP 🙁
You should always be able to see the tyres and tarmac of the car in front of you to avoid exactly this scenario.
Sounds like the car in front is stretching the truth by quite a bit. Whiplash? Yeah right!
I was rearended on the motorway and put in a legitimate claim for bad whiplash, and it took 2 years and about 4 seperate "specialist" visits before they paid out a measly £1500. Must have cost about 4 times that in admin and consultants charges!
Just an aside, how about we change the 'other party' to a cyclist. What if the OP only 'touched' the back wheel of the cyclist as he passed a t-junction but managed to knock him off his bike?
Would we be so forgiving of a driver who at the end of the day is not in control of his car? If he cant stop at a set of lights, maybe he cant stop his car from rolling out of a junction.
Would we be so forgiving of a driver who has, at the end of the day hit the back of the cyclist and caused him damage/injury?
There are so many posts on this site about cyclists claiming for accidents against motorists that it is a near weekly event. The standard response is get your equipment paid for (Agreed) and go for compo on the injuries (Even though 50% of the time there arent any or a bit of gravel rash). Is this really any different?
Or are we looking at it sympathetically because the OP is a cyclist.