Fair enough. I don't really understand those nasty smelly front row types but many folk have been calling for Wyn Jones
I played at hooker once as a schoolboy. never again. Nasty smelly uncouth ogres in the front row *shudders*
FFS dude - is that really needed? You really peed me off and I thought I had annoyed you so tried to make peace. that post is bang out of order.
Come on kids, just laugh at each others bias and move on!!
Deleted - pointless.
So, the 'boks have named their team:
15 Willie le Roux, 14 Cheslin Kolbe, 13 Lukhanyo Am, 12 Damian de Allende, 11 Makazole Mapimpi, 10 Handre Pollard, 9 Faf de Klerk; 1 Ox Nche, Bongi Mbonambi, 3 Trevor Nyakane, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 5 Franco Mostert, Siya Kolisi (c), 7 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 8 Kwagga Smith.
Replacements: 16 Malcolm Marx, 17 Steven Kitshoff, 18 Frans Malherbe, 19 Lood de Jager, 20 Rynhardt Elstadt, 21 Herschel Jantjies, 22 Elton Jantjies, 23 Damian Willemse.
Looks, chunky, although no 6:2 bench
Smallest Bok eight ever?
Smallest Bok eight ever?
Maybe, but the bench forwards are huge!
Sorry, I mean Number Eight, not the pack in general.
Two out and out sevens.
Maybe they've had a tip off that were going Watson Curry for 7 and 8
the times apparantly has a "leaked" team I wouldn't be surprised if its not more Gatland mischief making or just nonsense but:
Hogg, Watson, Daly, Henshaw, VDM, Biggar, Price
Jones, Cowan-Dickie, Furlong, AWJ, Itoje, Lawes, Curry, Conan
Reps
Owens, Sutherland, Sinckler, Beirne, Watson, Henderson, Murray, Farrell.
If that really is the team Adams will be very unlucky I think. I can see the thinking behind that back row but its not what I would have gone for but that a big back row. Nothing really hugely controversial tho IMO
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/british-irish-lions-ali-price-picked-at-scrum-half-with-elliot-daly-at-13-but-no-starting-place-for-owen-farrell-ngcwgd7kn
Is the team that uncontroversial?
the only bit that really worries me is the bench. 20 minutes to go - you need someone to shake things up so you bring on.......Farrell?
I sort of get the logic with Farrell covering 10 and 12 and thus being able to shuffle Daly or Watson around to cover any backs position
Obviously gone for power in the back row ( and the rest of the team) rather than speed or jackaling. Leave curry a lot to do at the breakdown. clearly he has decided to try to match the bokke power game rather than trying to run them around and run past them hence VDM rather than Adams
Still - over all a decent selection I think
The Times seem confident this is the side
Expected British & Irish Lions team to face South Africa
S Hogg; A Watson, E Daly, R Henshaw, D van der Merwe; D Biggar, A Price; W Jones, L Cowan-Dickie, T Furlong, A W Jones (c), M Itoje, C Lawes, T Curry, J Conan.
Replacements K Owens, R Sutherland, K Sinckler, T Beirne, H Watson, I Henderson, C Murray, O Farrell.
Seeing it written down on paper I can't see them winning TBH
Hmmm, Adams omission is a worry, his defence is better than Duhan. I guess Gatland wants smash rather than skills.
Although the official announcement is now at 10am today. It could change. I’m surprised to see Henshaw over Aki as well.
Aki isn't very good. What worries me is I look at that backrow and think, well Faletau, Tipuric and Navidi all fit could match that, Liam, LRZ and Adams could match that back 3. Tomos Williams and Biggar, beat that half back pairing. England and Ireland could match that front 5. Looks a bit light on true world class to me
AA - glass half empty again? the other way to look at is we have so many class players someone misses out.
told you price could force his way into the test side - an underrated player - even in Scotland. I also said duhan could get a game - again underrated and Gatland like big wingers and his defensive frailties are overstated.
I would prefer a 5:3 bench with someone capable of shaking the game up there. Murray, smith, Adams bench with that team
TBH I am not that convinced by Price. Murray is by far the best option. Is he on the bench? Smith whilst awesome in Prem still has to prove international credentials.
Murray is on the bench if that leaked team is right. I think you might be surprised by price. clearly the form SH on tour and underrated IMO
the proof of the pudding is in the eating tho
The actual team - not the leaked one
SOUTH AFRICA v THE BRITISH & IRISH LIONS
15. Stuart Hogg (Exeter Chiefs, Scotland) #783
14. Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby, England) #816
13. Elliot Daly (Saracens, England) #822
12. Robbie Henshaw (Leinster Rugby, Ireland) #824
11. Duhan van der Merwe (Worcester Warriors, Scotland) #841
10. Dan Biggar (Northampton Saints, Wales) #821
9. Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors, Scotland) #843
1. Wyn Jones (Scarlets, Wales) #842
2. Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs, England) #851
3. Tadhg Furlong (Leinster Rugby, Ireland) #818
4. Maro Itoje (Saracens, England) #825
5. Alun Wyn Jones – captain (Ospreys, Wales) #761
6. Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, England) #826
7. Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, England) #853
8.Jack Conan (Leinster Rugby, Ireland) #839
Replacements:
16. Ken Owens (Scarlets, Wales) #829
17. Rory Sutherland (Worcester Warriors, Scotland) #840
18. Kyle Sinckler (Bristol Bears, England) #814
19. Tadhg Beirne (Munster Rugby, Ireland) #838
20. Hamish Watson (Edinburgh Rugby, Scotland) #847
21. Conor Murray (Munster Rugby, Ireland) #790
22. Owen Farrell (Saracens, England) #780
23. Liam Williams (Scarlets, Wales) #833
ooh Murray, Farrell and Williams(at 15) have my heart racing. That would be a hell of a combo.
I think you might be surprised by price. clearly the form SH on tour and underrated IMO
the proof of the pudding is in the eating tho
Being in form against the Sharks/Lions/Japan whatever is like saying you played amazing against Italy.
I am skeptikal. We got beaten by SA - A and whilst it was obviously a decent SA 1st team not and A side, I think the saffers are only going o get better...
We got beaten by SA – A
Who played 9 and 10 in that game?
Prefer that bench, never rated Lawes at 6 I'd have gone with Bierne but can see the sense in him as a bench option.
I wouldn't have started AWJ or wyn Jones and DVdM.
Ali Price is the best 9 in squad but he's not a Dawson, Howley or Phillips type.
Makes you wonder if Henderson was the leaker!
Bench does look better with williams there.
Why engage with the troll TJ?
Just for a laugh 5plus8, explain why Murray would be a better selection that Price. I will start for you...
He isn't Scottish.
Over to you
Now now duckman - I was trying to get this thread back to more even tempered 🙂
I have to say the the Farrell / Murry combo makes me want to cry.
Why engage with the troll TJ?
Calls me a troll. Tells others not to engage..
Just for a laugh 5plus8, explain why Murray would be a better selection that Price. I will start for you…
Engages.
You are a bitter man. There are plenty of great scots players. I just don't think Price is all that. and I mentioned DVH as being a defensive risk (which is all over the papers.) Thats it.
I like Sutherland, I would have liked to see Cherry on the plane, but unfortunately there are also a few other really good hookers.
Mish was good in 6N, but I am also skeptikal that it will translate.
I also rate Hogg, I don't think he has his best game at Exeter, he seems to paly way better in internationals than he does in prem.
If I upset you, use that forum blocker tool.
5plus8 - even AA knows Price is the best 9 on tour. DVMs defensive frailties are a myth. It all stems from one huge blunder in the 6N which was totally his fault and the inside defense left him exposed. I have watched every game he has played for 3 years and his is simply not a defensive liability - certainly not compared to A Watson who was at fault for two tries in the warmup game
DVH as being a defensive risk (which is all over the english papers.)
fixed that for you
In the 6 nations - A Watson - 15 tackles made, 7 missed DVDM - 13 made 3 missed thats a significant differnce. Of course its easier playing in a better team
So you can't explain why Murray is better then? No worries.
What worries me is I look at that backrow and think, well Faletau,
AA; Faletau has looked like carrying Bath last year has emptied him, he has looked knackered. I had picked him as a bolter when the squad was announced but Conan has simply been better.
After last couple of games I'd have young Marcus in place of 22, but I like that squad. Getting tingles of excitement about the test.
(No response required, thanks whingers)
It’s just my opinion
Interesting. I totally share your opinions expressed in that post. Not that that means anything on this thread because everyone else has FACTS 😆
He's got to get a run out sometime to prove himself against the big boys. will be very interesting, lets hope its the making of him.
Also AA - I am not sure why Lawes is in the squad, he has misfired for England for a long time now.
And simmonds notable absence, I am not convinced by him either, so glad he isn't there.
I would agree DezB
Agreeing with my edit, obviously TJ 😛
Certainly not the team I’d picked, but Gatland obviously has a game plan & wants players that fit it.
Lawes in the back row probably points to the line out strength of SA.
Daly at 13 - expecting lots of kicking.
Front row - I’m pleased for Luke C-D , the rest are all good players, could have been any combo.
Lions Rugby tends to keep it simple, with the odd flash move. They don’t play together enough for any other way. Biggar is the right choice for that.
Josh Adam’s must feel unlucky. He’s always scared me as an opponent. Am I right in thinking he isn’t very tall? How is he under the expected barrage, as that’s the only reason I can think of?
Finally, I’m really glad all nations are properly represented. On merit too. For the first time in ages I feel all home nations are strong.
How is he under the expected barrage, as that’s the only reason I can think of?
Catching??? High ball? He is imperious. I dunno why he has been left out.
I am not sure why Lawes is in the squad, he has misfired for England for a long time now.
And simmonds notable absence, I am not convinced by him either, so glad he isn’t there.
Lawes was in the ascendancy again and then got injured. When on form he’s hugely disruptive in defense. But let’s see.
Also not convinced by Simmons on this tour, I was hoping we’d see more of his magic, but we haven’t. Maybe EJ saw it before we did.
Luckily VDM has Watson to help with his catching. 😉
Adams can feel very unlucky I think. He could not have done any more. I think DVDM has got in purely on his size. Gatland likes big wingers
An Englishman an Irishman and a Welshman went into a scrum front row.... Love it. 🙂
When on form he’s hugely disruptive in defense.
He is also good line out option, but I often felt his ball in hand, attack etc was too easy to stop. That's my issue with him.
Simmons on this tour, I was hoping we’d see more of his magic, but we haven’t.
He was the first to admit his try record this season is due to the Exeter machine putting him there.
but Conan has simply been better
I agree he has.
but Duckman thinks I am not allowed to, well **** him.
No, I was just pointing out your constant anyone but Scotland posting. I have at no time said you aren't allowed to post and was just reminding TJ of your bias( he pointed it out to you himself during the 6n if you recall.) By the way; your "reasons" for preferring Murray are exactly why Price was picked in front of him.
Seems a reasonable team. Murray is luck to be on the bench, his form has not been good and surprised that Farell made the bench - expect because he can cover 10 & 12 and his goal kicking.
Very unsurprised that Simmonds not included - I always thought his selection was a little strange. For Exeter he is a star, but concern about having to perform at higher level without the Exeter machine was always going to be a stretch. In any case Conan is the form 8 and Curry can cover him
Based on the SA A game, think the Lions may do well to old it to a 14 point loss. Lions always do better in late tests when they have had a chance to meld in tough games.
