Is Gats holding an Ace up his sleeve?
Marcus smith? 🙂
I think actually its a little bit of this - you don't show your best set piece moves and lay out all your tactics in a warm up - but neither do you sandbag to the point you lose the game.
So a little bit of keeping the powder dry, a little bit of disrupted team with late calloffs and a little bit of key players playing badly and poor leadership
Spiced with a little bit of bluff and double bluff
Hogg's press conference shows one thing.
He's been self isolating in the sun. Hope they're playing in the shade or that poor laddie will self combust.
I thought Farrell was carp as well yet Ronan o Gara still fancies him . I would like to bow to his vastly superior knowledge but I still thought he was carp…
RoG who, in the 2nd test 2009, managed to give SA the final penalty so that they could win the game and series. Iirc, it was injury time and they were drawing - at least allowing a drawn series - and he kicked the ball away needlessly, then took the Springbok out in the air. Absolute lunacy.
Marcus Smith looks like he’s been playing for the Lions for several years.
smith could do with being given a few more decent passes to work with. Looks frantic ( especially in the first few minutes)but I guess that how he plays? Certainly does not look like a 3 cap rookie.
Not sure we are learning much new about the players here that we didn't know ( apart from Smith maybe?)
LCD has caught my eye
Lovely touch from Smith there to create the space for the try.
Smith is not a player I have seen much of before. Settled down nicely in the second half and played some nice rugby
Really don't think we have learnt much more from this game. No one really played their way in or out
If Smith was 10 years older he'd be my new man crush!!
if he was ten years older yo would still be cradle snatching 😉
I have to say i was impressed in the second half.
AA; he has been the best 10 in Europe by a mile this year. 2 years ago he said he wanted to be the best 10 in the world and folk laughed at him. Give him another 2 years at his current trajectory and he may well be there. He can do horrible slippery running 10 and switch to "away and have a lineout in your own 22." almost between plays. Mind you, playing outside the form 9 in the Premier helps....who isn't on tour.
It’s easy to look good when you haven’t got a Springbok flanker chasing you down. Smith had an easy time tonight from a pretty poor Stormers side and he still made loads of mistakes. Do that in a test and he’ll lose it for the Lions.
And even with a running 10 like Smith the wings barely got any decent ball.
idlejohn - the problem is that Bigger is limited and turned an ankle, finn is broken and shoulder boy is limited and miles out of form and obviously not suited to the way Gatland wants this team to play
Who else plays10? Hogg?
IdleJon
Full Member
It’s easy to look good when you haven’t got a Springbok flanker chasing you down.
If only the teams in the prem/ hiney cup had thought of trying that...he gets emptied every week, just bounces up and still plays right on the gain line.
With AWJ back, does that mean Murray is less likely to start? Price had a good game yesterday.
With AWJ back, does that mean Murray is less likely to start? Price had a good game yesterday.
I would say so. I also found it interesting that Hogg was on field captain yesterday
Price has been so much better than the other 9s that its really hard to see him being left out.
With a team like the lions so chock full of very experienced internationals then is the on field captain that important that you would want to play a lessor player to get your preferred captain on the pitch?
ONe thing I would have liked to see from smith yesterday is the wee dink over the top to keep a biltz defense honest and to keep them guessing. I could see smith starting given how well he settled in in the second half.
Smith plays the chip over the top really well when he wants to slow pressure. Not enough pressure yesterday. Hogg needs to not be captain I don't think he can play well AND lead. He's also too keen to move upfield . I don't really get the mako love. He looked out of breath running into the pitch and seems to spend a lot of scrums have a lie down.
With a team like the lions so chock full of very experienced internationals then is the on field captain that important that you would want to play a lessor player to get your preferred captain on the pitch?
I'm pretty sure that Garland has said no to this in the past. I don't think either Murray or AWJ are guaranteed to play, I can see neither of them being in the first Test team. Ali Price looks favourite to start to me.
I could see smith starting given how well he settled in in the second half.
I could see Biggar starting and Smith coming on later, or vice versa depending on the days game plan. Much like Gatland did with Biggar/Anscombe, Biggar/Sheedy.
Perhaps (based on nothing) with someone like Hogg to cover Biggar if something should happen to him, but it's not a good time for Smith to come on.
(based on nothing)
Hogg is a reasonable makeshift 10. I wouldn't like to be relying on him to do so
for Scotland they usually do not have a second 10 on the bench so when Finn has been having his 10 mins rest Hogg steps up, he also started a midweek lions game at 10 and one of the recent scotland games.
Its more of an issue for scotland of course where we only have Finn at 10 worth playing there
If only the teams in the prem/ hiney cup had thought of trying that…he gets emptied every week, just bounces up and still plays right on the gain line.
Oh I agree about that - he’s always looked good in the Premiership. What we don’t know is how good he is when he’s playing with unfamiliar players and systems, and yesterday showed nothing in that respect. The Lions looked very ordinary against a poor team. (But they often look different in the warm-up games when they are testing their game plans.)
I’m withholding my man crush until Smith proves himself next weekend.
Gatland says he thinks the toughest decisions will be made in "the back three and the loose forwards".
"We will go through the process over the next 72 hours and there will be some robust debate," he added.
Dawson also has his selection on the BBC website - seeing how he has got pretty much everythig wrong so far I think we can disregard that. Its a really weird selection
A lot of teams I'm seeing have had Williams at 15 over Hogg, I haven't been 100% invested in watching games but has he looked that good? Hasn't been on fire this season.
Its a really weird selection
Does that mean not enough Scots?
Saw his selection and wouldn't be surprised if he's got 13 out of 15.
Loose head and eight he's gone for English flair, mako and Simmonds, where I reckon garland will go for more grunt, but if awj is fit enough then it might just be pretty close.
No one's really nailed 1 and 8 as their own yet, garland more likely to go with Faletau and which ever prop they decide has best scrum chance- WJones or Sutherland.
Think Williams is popular as the player "in possession", with Hogg having a bit of time out.
Mako who spends most scrums flat on his face. Murray who has been poor, Farrell on the bench as utility back, Curry and Simmonds in the back row. those are the daft picks IMO
williams at 15 is not an odd pick - I rate him highly the bandy legged git. But he is not as good as HOgg IMO and I would have Williams on the wing but that one is a bit of a toss up
I am unconvinced about Daly at 13 as he has had a really mixed bag so far costing at least two tries with wayward kicks but again not a really daft pick
I bet half of them are wrong!
Dawson even says Makos scrummaging is not up to scratch but says he can be subbed off if he gets pummeled. FFS against the Bokke you need a really solid scrum
A lot of teams I’m seeing have had Williams at 15 over Hogg, I haven’t been 100% invested in watching games but has he looked that good? Hasn’t been on fire this season.
He has looked OK but not as good as Hogg.
So you agree about mako and Simmonds, and your other two are Curry and Murray - both world class big game players. Ok
Sweet pass to Hill notwithstanding,Hogg's form has dropped from his own high standards and he was in isolation so I couldn't complain if Williams played, but I suspect Williams on a wing with either a countryman or a saffer on the other. I would be gutted for Price if Murray started ahead of him, Murray is a shadow of the player he was 2 years ago and Price is playing so much better than most Scots ever imagined he could.
Loum - its when you look at the selection as a whole that Dawson made - its just daft. its not a team to beat the Bokke and the idea that you only have two backs on the bench and one of them is Farrell thats ridiculous. 15 pts down, 30 mins to go. You need someone to come on and change the game. so you bring on Farrell riiiiiight
Murray has been pure mince adn Curry is just a poor mans mish with added headless chicken and penalties and in combination with Simmonds I just do not see it working.
Mish - player of the 6N and continuing in fabulous form
Curry is just a poor mans mish with added headless chicken
Curry is a very very good player...and you accuse me of one eyedness!
He is - but he is not as good as Mish - player of the 6Ns so he is a poor mans Mish!
Same sort of player - just not as good.
Player of the 6N remember.
but he is not Scottish
FTFY
Bore off Kryton Projecting much?
Watson was player of the 6N and has continued his cracking form. Curry is a very good player yes and unfortunate to be up against such a class act. very similar sort of player but without Watson experience and Curry does too much headless chicken. 4 years time for him IMO
so who really has nailed down a place in the starters? its still really open IMO and as the quote I put from gatland above some really tricky selections
the only folk that have really been significantly better than their rivals IMO are:
Furlong, LCD and Price. Obviously the best in the tour party in their position maybe ad Adams to that
Mish has Curry and while i still say Mish is better i accept there is very little in it and it could go either way and neither will let the team down.
Hogg / Williams is a similar story
second rows no front runners but we all assume AWJ will get the nod
Back rows any 3 from the group will not let you down
Standoff Biggar is the front runner But Smith is coming screaming up on the outside
Centres Henshaw maybe the closest to securing a place Harris the safe option Daly the high risk high reward option
wings? pays yer money and takes yer choice
Its really opon and really fascinating
Only 3 guys have played themselves out of contention IMO - Vunipola ( and he looked better int eh last game) Murray and Farrell
Itoje plays. That is nailed on. The bloke is a freak. Yes he gets things wrong sometimes but he is an extremely good player.
All the arguments over selection seem to be about what a player can’t do as to what they actually do well.
All the arguments over selection seem to be about what a player can’t do as to what they actually do well
Not all of them, have you seen Dawson's test team? That one is based entirely on your nationality. 😀
He’d fit in well here then!
I think Itoje is a fabulous player but somehow what I have seen on this tour so far he just seems to be below his best. too many penalties and not as effective as he can be. trying too hard? In the 6N I thought that was his downfall - england were poor and I think he tried to do too much
I would be perfectly happy if he was in the test side tho and he probably will be
I just think on what we have seen so far he is not clearly better than the other 2nd rows.
As an aside I gained respect for him from "the battle of scotston" Sarries V Glasgow a couple of years ago Were he was critised for being unsporting. However he spent the entire game with Ryan Wilson trying to wind him up, was on the receiving end of some pretty unsporting play and not a word of complaint from him nor did he loose his temper despite Wilsons best efforts
The team I'd pick
Hogg
Williams
Daly
Henshaw
Adams
Smith
Price
Faletau
Watson
Bierne
Itoje
Henderson
1/8th Mile
LCD
Sutherland
Vunipola
George
Sinkler
Lawes
Simmonds
Davies
Farrell
DVdM
What I hope Gatland will pick for shits a giggles
Williams
Adams
Henderson
Farrell
Watson
Murray
Faletau
Curry
Bierne
Itoje
Jones
1/8th Mile
Owens
Wyn Jones
I think itoje has suffered from being in the championship, he's stood still while the game has moved on in the prem, might be by a tiny amount but now he's chasing. I'd still start him with AWJ as supersub, there were worries months ago about the hard ground, big hits and his shoulders.
I'd start suzz (not just because he comes along to the pumptrack and can actually ride a bike well) LCD yep, Simmonds nailed on, Price fast enough both in delivery and of foot to not get caught by faff, Smith will operate best with price's fast ball. "Mish" he's disruptive enough to cause the big SAs issues, Henshaw solid and carrying first phase ball in the defensive back line, DvdW 14
Shit what if, in a dramatic twist, DvdW seconds before KO takes off his lions shirt to reveal a SA shirt beneath and then take his place on their wing?
We have previous for that, you aren't allowed 16 players on the park at one time...ARE YOU AA?
We have previous for that, you aren’t allowed 16 players on the park at one time…ARE YOU AA?
Eh? My first selection has 15, second one has no 10 I'd pick Faz to boil the most piss!!
In more serious talk I think Faletau still gets picked at 8 over Simmonds even though he's been a bit below par, its a gamble but Faletau is simply too good a player not to gamble on, he is also a tremendous asset in defence with a phenomenal work rate and that side of his play hasn't been needed...some big calls though, no doubt. TBH I think The Irish Barbarian has been the best 8 on your but the Faletau has a much higher ceiling and Simmonds has more potential.
yer teams no bad AA - Not sure Sutherland has convinced that much and maybe conan at 8?
AA; Wales had 16 players on the pitch in a 6N game a few years ago.
Not sure Sutherland has convinced that much
Vunipola has scrummaging issues, and Wyn Jones is bang average throughout, picked Sutherland by default!
