They'd let us back tomorrow but it would be without the rebate and we would have to join the monetary union
Bring it on. I couldn't care less how I'm paid or who I work with as long as they do their job.
Bring it on. I couldn’t care less how I’m paid or who I work with as long as they do their job.
The tossers like Rees-Mogg (not heard from that shite in a while, so assume he must be counting his winnings) used 'Vassal State' in a negative way. I would take direct rule from Brussels now and **** most of the Commons off into the river and out to sea with the rest of the effluent.
Let’s stop beating around the bush. Do we reckon this is still valid?
Yes, but the UK needs to be fixed first.
Cut Boris's balls off?
That would actually sort out a few issues in one go when you think about it.
We're not being let back in for 40 years. The best we can hope for is being thrown the odd bone.
We were rejected twice before and once brexshit has stuck its knives into agriculture and filleted the finance sector, there will be such divergence that the uk "economy" will have to take a(nother) massive kicking to align.
From the EU's side, they will give NOTHING to the UK that they can't afford to loose. Once bitten, twice shy.
John le Carré : “a poor island with scarcely a voice that would carry across the water.”
Spain will want Gibraltar, and they'll want to see us really suffer first to discourage the Catalans.
We wont go back for a while
Im sure EU would have as back, but most likely is a Norway deal, because its sellable to UK electorate and the EU
Long way to go yet, Johnson will stumble from crisis to crisis and brexits failure will be blamed on him eventually, because of there's one thing that's become clear, its thar brexit failures are always the fault of someone /thing
On fb I've seen several cut & posts explaining why fuel crisis definitely isn't the fault of brexit & leave voters cling to that desperately
I think the EU would welcome us back, but I think they'd be wary of UK "negotiations" We're in the state we're in because the EU understood full well that Johnson's tactic was to agree a deal to "get Brexit done" with an eye to wriggling out of the more uncomfortable bits later on. Which is why the EU are playing hard. They'd need to be convinced that re-entry would be honest.
I don't think it will happen though. Johnson couldn't give a flying **** about food shortages or fuel panic buying,
stop the flood of ‘winter of discontent’ stories in the news
It would help if they actually started reporting it as it should be a s*** show. But most news outlets wash over the real issue when they daren't mention that b word.
i guess Brexit is done and never to be talked about again?...notcied the BBC have removed the Brexit tab from the News page....its replaced with climate instead...
….its replaced with climate instead…
I approve. Especially with COP26 around the corner. All the tabs have Brexit stories in them anyway... you just have to insert the word into the copy yourself.
Wonder if they'll ever be investigation into the benefactors of Brexit. Farage, Bill Cash, Mogg and the others members of the ERG.
We’re not being let back in for 40 years. The best we can hope for is being thrown the odd bone.
I think we'd be mostly welcomed back in (give it a few years, perhaps) but I think @kimbers has it, it'll be in a Norway style.
We won't be let back in to the big boys decision making club again, we blew that one for a game of Fantasy Empires featuring Mad King Boris Targaryen.
notcied the BBC have removed the Brexit tab from the News page….its replaced with climate instead
Gone since around 19 September according to Twitter. Tim Davie started as Director General on 1 September. Previously, whether it was shown or not seemed to be based on where you are geographically.
UK re-joining EU was discussed extensively on the old thread.
The EU would probably accept an application to re-join but subject to UK accepting...single currency, no rebate, no privileges, no exceptions, nothing more than notional equivalence with Germany and France.
Accept all of this and more - c'mon in, the door is open but your voice won't be heard.
What a complete and utter **** mess.
If you voted for brexit - moron.
If you voted tory - idiot.
If you voted brexit and tory - rot in hell.
There was a piece on World at One yesterday about how Brexit was the cause of the shortages.
The EU would probably accept an application to re-join but subject to UK accepting…single currency, no rebate, no privileges, no exceptions, nothing more than notional equivalence with Germany and France.
They could arrange for the PM of the day to sign the rejoining documents in a railway carriage in northern France. That's the kind of level of national humiliation I could get behind.
The EU probably already has a "take it or leave it" re-entry agreement sat on a computer somewhere in Brussels. They will want no negotiation on it as the people we have to do our side of negotiations are either incompetent or dishonest (or usually both). That might change with a different PM/party in charge but I'm not sure I'd trust Starmer with that responsibility either. If we want to rejoin we need business and the electorate to be demanding it vocally and constantly and the appetite for that fight just isn't there when many businesses and people are spending all their time and energy simply keeping their heads above water financially. The current situation with energy prices is going to push a lot of heads under. If that happens to a large enough extent then maybe, just maybe, there will be a call for a change of PM/government or a rejoining of the single market, customs union and energy strategy.
frankconway
Full MemberUK re-joining EU was discussed extensively on the old thread.
The EU would probably accept an application to re-join but subject to UK accepting…single currency, no rebate, no privileges, no exceptions, nothing more than notional equivalence with Germany and France.
Nobody can be forced to accept the single currency- there's no system to do it at all. Even if there was, it'd be easy just not to meet the criteria. The euro's something you have to jump through hoops just to be allowed to use even if you want to.
You can be forced to commit to joining it, like Sweden did in 1994.
For those thinking that the UK would be welcome back, consider how EU public opinion would view that and the impact on any politicians agreeing to it.
People around me in Euroland feel that Brexit has had very little negative impact on Europe, as many benefitting as have lost out. Relocation of businesses to this side of the channel and repatriating economically active people has compensated a small loss in exports. Removing the British right from the parliament and conseil has allowed the passing of measures that failed to get through while Britain was a member. The feeling is that the successful Covid crisis management, especially the financial measures taken, have happened because the financially conservative countries no longer have a champion. Brits slagged of the handling of the Greek crisis whilst opposing any reasonable solutions, Germany had an ally in imobility. This time the necessary has been done.
Those pesky Brits very vocally buggering off has shifted EU politics in a way many, including me, approuve.
I'm beginning to see the silver lining.
Three flights, one expulsion order, two visa applications and payments later my friend's son is in Manchester but now they've announced all classes will be virtual. I'll spare you their opinions.
For those thinking that the UK would be welcome back, consider how EU public opinion would view that and the impact on any politicians agreeing to it.
It would boost the EU's credibility beyond measure to demonstrate that one of its biggest members quit then came crawling back tail between legs. And of course the re-entrant UK would have far less influence and it'd have to agree to all the commitments it didn't before. It would be a huge and possibly definitive victory. And it also removes the very slim possibility that the UK could eventually become powerful on its own and cause problems for the EU.
Three flights, one expulsion order, two visa applications and payments later my friend’s son is in Manchester but now they’ve announced all classes will be virtual. I’ll spare you their opinions.
Why did he apply? I'm not sure I would have.
For a lot of subjects, Manchester is very good. World class. Not everyone wants to go to their nearest University. Widening horizons should go hand in hand with study... although we're doing our best to stop people doing so, aren't we.
Why did he apply? I’m not sure I would have
For the reasons Kelvin outlines, but mainly because he signed up as part of a sandwich course before the terms of the Brexit deal were known. It was all signed and paid for. I can't see the cooperation continuing on the same scale beyond the current year group, other alliances will be formed given the lousy experiences of students on UK placements over the last year. Years of cooperation and building relationships beneficial to both sides down the pan.
For a lot of subjects, Manchester is very good. World class. Not everyone wants to go to their nearest University. Widening horizons should go hand in hand with study… although we’re doing our best to stop people doing so, aren’t we.
I meant why not go to some other EU university. Must've been a lot easier. But Ed answered.
You can be forced to commit to joining it, like Sweden did in 1994.
Did we? We still use the öSwedish Krona here and, as I understand it, have no plans to change that. I thought we'd had a referendum and decided not to change to the Euro a while back too.
Do we even meet the democracy requirements to join the EU? Less than half our parliamentarians are elected.
Did we
Yup, but there's a catch, Sweden would have to do at least two years in the ERM first and that isn't obligatory, so euro memebership can't be obligatory unless Sweeden volunteers to join the ERM.
the pound is starting to show the markets are not happy with the situation and the BofE downbeat forecast. A run on the pound should make Johnsons day.
willard
Full MemberDid we? We still use the öSwedish Krona here and, as I understand it, have no plans to change that. I thought we’d had a referendum and decided not to change to the Euro a while back too.
Yup. Denmark negotiated an opt-out but Sweden committed to join the euro. And then just swerved the issue by not meeting the convergence criteria so they were never allowed to join, therefore their commitment became irrelevant. They could have easily met the convergence criteria if they'd ever wanted to but it suits them not to. "Yes we committed to do it but you won't let us"
And as you say they've since had a referendum and voted against joining it. Which doesn't undo their treaty commitment to joining even though it contradicts it, but that doesn't matter because it was already irrelevant.
In the case of Sweden, they just declined to join ERM2. You have to be in ERM2 for 2 years before you can adopt the euro. They could have achieved the same by not meeting any other convergence criteria but ERM2 was simple and also a nice clear political statement.
This came up a lot in the Scottish indy ref, it was a recurring blatant lie that "scotland would have to join the euro". Irony of course was that if Scotland had wanted to, we probably wouldn't have been allowed, and all of the No campaigners would have been shouting that from the rooftops instead.
For those thinking that the UK would be welcome back, consider how EU public opinion would view that and the impact on any politicians agreeing to it.
I can't see many EU states going for it unless it involved a delicious dollop of extra humiliation, perhaps The Queen having to make a Games of Thrones style walk of shame through the centre of Strasbourg.
I had a brexit bonus today. I work for a car company in Belgium and was offered two different 12month overseas assignments; UK and USA. The UK would be nice as I could see friends and family more often, plus working on good projects. USA would just be a nice challenge. For both, I would have expanded my experiences and also got an effective pay rise.
But, due to no longer being an EU citizen, I can't leave Belgium for longer than 6 months without the risk of losing my right to live and work in Belgium (withdrawal agreement) or compromising a future citizenship application. Meaning I can't take up one of these opportunities. But, my Italian colleague can. He can go to USA/UK and come back to Belgium, or Italy, or wherever else he likes.
Sorry to hear that.
Couldn't you do the assignment then come back to Belgium for a couple of weeks' holiday? In some things like this you only need to spend a few days back in that country to reset the clock.
In other news, I see we are going to allow gene edited crops (as opposed to GM) to be grown in the UK on a much easier basis than they are in the EU. This is possibly a good thing?
I see the latest to join Tim Whatsisname from Wetherspoons in the 'oh just **** off, this is what you campaigned for' club is the Brexiteer boss of Next who've just issued a statement asking the government to relax immigration rules so they can get enough staff in to fulfil their Christmas orders.
Simon Wolfson. A very clever, yet very insecure little man.
Many years ago I worked at Next - apparently the thing that caused him to almost explode with rage was Katie Price (or Jordan or whatever) telling him to "**** off, Harry Potter" at some do or other.
Wonderful!
Another Brexit win.👍
We might just manage to really help the EU recover from Covid economic losses as we start to import practically every ******* thing we need. 👏
Except people of course.
I think the problem with rejoining, and the damage we've done generally, is this:
We have for many years enjoyed status beyond our station. Two world wars and one world cup, British Empire, they need us, etc. The fact of the matter is, we're a has-been little island languishing up a rainy cul-de-sac. The bulk of what "made Britain great" is all quietly *ing off to pastures new, whilst the ones like Garage who promised us they'd * off still haven't.
We used to be respected, admired, and were for a long time. Look at London 2012, it was a triumph.
Now the EU and indeed most of the world just thinks we're roasters. We've destroyed the goodwill that we've built up over decades. If we were to rejoin it would take a slice of humble pie that would make Mary Berry blush, and we just aren't capable of humility. We're better than them.
^^Valid points there unfortunately.
On another note, the BBC are being a little daring given their current predicament.
Interesting timing too with the conference soon to begin!
"Who funds the Tories and why."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-58721596
Couldn’t you do the assignment then come back to Belgium for a couple of weeks’ holiday? In some things like this you only need to spend a few days back in that country to reset the clock.
It’s a risk thou if you do that, if there was anything that prevented you from coming back,like closure of the borders or no planes you’d be at the mercy of the Belgium bureaucrats.
Unlikely but not impossible.
I have exactly the same issue, live in an eu country but not an eu citizen. Brexit removed the freedom of movement from people who voted with their feet.
Hmm nearly a year in,
where’s the Freeport’s and Singapore on Thames then.
Did I miss something, only benefits I’ve heard of are blue passports ,no tampon tax,allowing use of imperial measures.
(I’m not jumping on the relaxing of gm field trials.)
I’d hate to downplay the benefits as I’ve missed anything but that’s nearly a year, I thought I’d have seen something tangible.
I’d hate to downplay the benefits as I’ve missed anything but that’s nearly a year, I thought I’d have seen something tangible.
We won didn't we. What more do you need?
Just about to listen to this (I don’t get up early enough to hear the BBC shining a light on what’s happening in the UK and why on air, daytime broadcasting seems, er, reluctant to pull back the veil):
02/10/21 - Farming Today This Week: The Food Supply Chain Crisis
