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He's a dead man walking. Hilarious that he refuses to budge, which makes everything worse for his party and better for the opposition. What a farce.
Opposition gains will be minimal and sink before the next election
Anyway, announcement tomorrow of the winter £150 to spend on getting pissed so that'll brighten everyone's day.
Why would left wing voters support Starmer?
Because if they don't they are effectively supporting Johnson. You have to be in power to effect change. Be that wholesale or within the party. Damn the Tories all you want but the vast majority of them are outwardly party, behind the scenes there will be concessions.
Whereas labour will happily eviscerate themselves on the public stage them wonder why noone supports them.
You think that this country will vote for a left wing government?
I think everyone in this country who is neither rich or a racist would vote for a party which would unashamedly redress the imbalance in wealth, power and opportunity between the vast majority and a tiny few rich people. That’s not left wing, just common sense basic fairness. No one will vote for it though if the party putting it forward is too embarrassed, frightened or cowardly to make the case.
Because if they don’t they are effectively supporting Johnson.
Is that the sales pitch? ‘We’re not the tories’. And you wonder why people don’t want to vote for them?! This may come as a surprise but people want something to vote for. They think all politicians are the same. That’s why Johnson won in the first place. It’s why Corbyn overturned a 20 point poll deficit and came extremely close (a few thousand votes in fact) to deposing May. Because they offered something different, something positive.
You think that this country will vote for a left wing government?
The people of this country are in favour of a lot of left wing policies.
The people of this country are in favour of a lot of left wing policies.
Do you mix with white van man and Hyacinth Bucket? Because to them Johnson can do no wrong. Labour's only hope is to copy the tactics Blair/Brown used.
There is no uk wide left wing party to vote for
Hard right tories. Soft right lib dems. Centrist labour. In Scotland we get slightly left of centre snp
Labour’s only hope is to copy the tactics Blair/Brown used.
You mean the very same tactics that saw them haemorrhage millions of votes after 97 and then lost two elections in 2010 and 2015? 97 was very different to now, you can’t just repeat something from 25 years ago and expect the same result, especially when recent elections demonstrate the opposite.
In Scotland we get slightly left of centre snp
And a little to the right where they need too 😁
Blair brought optimism and gave people something positive to vote for. I don't see the harm of SKS trying this.
More strikes occur under Labour and industrial action leads to progress so that's every optimistic reason to vote Squeaky Starmer.
When Trump was in I remember thinking then, what would he actually have to do for the tide to turn?
Agreed. The man literally advised people to inject themselves with bleach. 72 million Americans still voted for him.
Caher
Full MemberLabour’s only hope is to copy the tactics Blair/Brown used.
Ah yeah, the "Blair made Labour electable" myth again.
What they should do, is copy the tactics John Smith used, since he paved the way for Blair and would have been prime minister had he lived.
How is 3 election wins a myth?
Do you really not know? The 3 wins don't show Blair made Labour electable- they show that Labour was electable. That was done by John Smith. Well, and John Major. Blair inherited his winning hand, then won 2 more elections with steadily falling voter share.
The 3 wins are no myth of course but the idea that to get there you copy Blair is. And tbf it's a huge part of the problems Labour has today- they're pretty bad at learning from mistakes but they're worse at learning from successes. The route that actually took them to power has been forgotten
Perhaps 7 more years of Tory rule will do it.
I guess their opinions are as valid as mine.
They're not, because they're halfwits.
Unfortunately their vote counts the same as yours, though.
I've long believed that some sort of basic IQ test should be a prerequisite for the right to vote. Stupid people need protecting from themselves. 🤷♂️
And still no one answers the question:
Would Boris Johnson be prime minister if the UK had voted Remain?
We all know the answer. It all stems from that stupid referendum. All of it.
The infantile foreign policy. The cretinous economic policy. The "3 word signs are enough" tendency. The hopeless "worst of all worlds" covid response. The lockdown pissups. The contempt for the public.
All of it stems from that moment of national disgrace. All of it. Those who voted for it should hang their heads in shame. But most haven't got the self-awareness to think their way out of a wet paper bag.
The irony in this statement is that it’s so f***** stupid you probably wouldn’t pass your own test.
I'm pretty sure I would.
Danny if you’re gonna create a new account at least change the persona too.
Strange isn't it?
That he bothered to create a new account with a different username I mean.
Since I was a kid I've always thought that people should have to sit a detailed exam on how economies/societies worked and the policies/manifestos/history of the political parties before they can cast a vote.
I wouldn't have considered myself eligible btw. Maybe by my current age I would have decided to swot up on it.
I also believe that humans are a scourge on the earth though and that it'd be better if we faced a 100% extinction event. Sadly, I believe we will, but we'll rape and destroy the planet as we go down fighting. If I've learnt one thing over the last ten years, it's that it doesn't matter what people say, they'll remain self centered to the very end. (Me included. It's just the nature of species)
The human race does qualify as an invasive species when you look at it. We also qualify as a virus when you view the Earth as the host. I was saying so back in high school well before a certain film series popularised the idea but people couldn't see it as we're looked at as the best of evolution and thus Top Dog. But that's off-topic so I'll leave that there.
Perhaps 7 more years of Tory rule will do it.
If they manage to win the next election I wouldn't put it past them to remove the rules that say an election has to be held after a certain time. What would we do about it, protest? We're still heading down a very scary path while this lot are in power.
Majority of politicians wouldn't pass a test - certainly on the understanding of economics. They don't even know how their own country finances itself.
It's dogmatic and completely irresponsible to believe the current system serves the population on a long term time frame.
Same goes for Centrism which is wedded to neoliberalism which shafts the vulnerable.
And yes there is a problem with the way people understand this but it's because few politicians are actually strong enough to stand up against it.
I also believe that humans are a scourge on the earth though and that it’d be better if we faced a 100% extinction event
God, I hate this guff - what's the point in the existence of a planet without intelligent life?
Granted, we may not be THAT intelligent, but the alternative - a lump of rock floating about with some bees and fluffy bunnies going about their business uninhibited. Utopia maybe, but for what?
In the event of 100% extinction, it's just a lump of rock floating in space with virtually nothing alive, maybe some amoeba's will form something with a brain a few trillion years later. Let's just roll with how far we've come, I'm sure we'll cope for a few years yet you bloody hippie 😉
God, I hate this guff
Agreed. Nihilistic edgelord bullshit. My normal response is, "why not be the change you want to see?" but apparently that's a personal attack. Wishing everyone on Earth dead is fine though...
Hard right tories
You think these set of idiots in charge are hard right? They really are not
I fundimentally don’t agree with any Conservative policy’s so it’s hard to grasp what people actually see
They have been fooled for the last 40 years. My mother votes Conservative but when I just talk about policies and high level difference between parties she is very much more Labour voter than Conservative.
She just can't vote Labour due to ingrained problem with them, last time because of that Corbyn man.
I think it has also been tested across a wider group that when testing policies in polls rather than parties that Labour polices tend to be more favourable.
Completely rip up how voting/elections work and get people to vote on 10 high level strategies/approaches/policies and then have a government that takes the lead from that.
Well… clear that they knew that what they were doing was incongruous with the rules and advice they were delivering for the rest of us…
https://twitter.com/jack_blanchard_/status/1529411917219086338?s=21
STR. Extinction of humans, not everything.
That leaves plenty of intelligent life on the planet rather than one species that thinks its intelligent but is in fact incredibly stupid.
You think these set of idiots in charge are hard right? They really are not
Their policies on immigration, attacking media they don't agree with, shutting down peaceful protest, limiting judicial oversight, deliberately stoking divisive culture war issues and of course Brexit...
Their policies on immigration, attacking media they don’t agree with, shutting down peaceful protest, limiting judicial oversight, deliberately stoking divisive culture war issues and of course Brexit…
A lot of people don't look at these policies and see the connection to the early stages of far right/dictatorial regimes, both historically and more recently.
Those who don't learn from the mistakes of history etc....
Not sure who this Danny you speak of is. I guess he must have upset the small hard left cabal that circle jerk on the political threads around here. 🤷♂️
Back to the question:
Would Boris Johnson be prime minister if the UK had voted Remain?
And still no one answers the question:
Would Boris Johnson be prime minister if the UK had voted Remain?
We all know the answer. It all stems from that stupid referendum. All of it.
It is quite fun to play "what if" but I'm not sure a huge amount would really have changed, we'd have had about five more uninterrupted years of call-me-Dave and George; austerity would have really bitten the working poor, pretty much the same tactics would have been used to beat Corbyn, I think the main difference might have come when Covid hit, George would have tried to tell us all the cupboard was still bare, so eat out to help out or free LFTs from a government trying to prove they were on top of things... Perhaps the rhetoric and political temperature would have been a bit cooler...
But we'll never know, and now we have to deal with the situation as it is.
Unfortunately I think Boris has actually managed to ride this one out, the 54 letters should be in by now IMO, if they're not submitted by CoP today I reckon he's staying put till the next GE.
what’s the point in the existence of a planet without intelligent life?
Maybe rather than a reactionary post on an internet forum you might dwell on that for a bit, there’s some pretty intellectual deep thinking that can be done on that.
Granted, we may not be THAT intelligent, but the alternative – a lump of rock floating about with some bees and fluffy bunnies going about their business uninhibited. Utopia maybe, but for what?
You kind of made his point, life and the universe isn’t always about you/humans.
Would Boris Johnson be prime minister if the UK had voted Remain?
No. Or if he was, he’d have to point to something other than “got Brexit done” when asked what the point of him and his team was.
Oh, and as for the side chat… I love people, I want humankind to flourish.
You think that this country will vote for a left wing government?
We do, in my country.
#Scotland
Would Boris Johnson be prime minister if the UK had voted Remain?
It's a simple enough question. I didn't ask "would things have been broadly similar if Call Me Dave had stayed after a Remain majority?"
Would Cameron have been stupid enough to do all this Partygate shit? No. Would he have been stupid enough to get caught? Definitely no. Would he have been in power with the help of a machiavellian shit like Cummings with the inevitable Rooney-Vardy soap opera style fallout and revenge story line? No.
Lockdown pissups under Theresa May? Not likely. If only because no one would have turned up.
Add 'Partygate' to the long list of **** ups.
The hopeless response as Kabul fell - Raab - would not be anywhere near a senior minister role if it wasn't for Brexit.
The A-Level exams debacle - Williamson - would not be anywhere near a senior minister role if it wasn't for Brexit. Sorry, that should be Sir Gavin Williamson - would not now be a knight of the realm if it wasn't for B...
On and on and on.
This is what people voted for, they should own it.
Barclay's turn to debase himself defending the fly tipped sofa this morning.
Either he's very stupid or he has a personal agenda. He's not stupid. People who believe his bullshit are.
Radio4? That was a very revealing interview... mostly because of his multiple attempts not to reveal anything at all. Doubling down on the idea that the PM didn't know about anything that was going on around him, day in day out, week after week, month after month. Every listener must have been completely incredulous, and I'm sure at some point everything Barclay has been sent out to say for Johnson this morning will be dumped and denied, and a new story (which we're not even supposed to believe) concocted and given to willing followers to fill the airwaves and column inches with.
Oh... and attending a leaving do was "essential" work for a leader during a pandemic, even when that leaving do has resulted in fines for attendees. When pushed on this, as regards all other leaders with staff... it got honed down to a description that basically meant it was only true for the PM. Which I suppose is a kind of honesty. It's Johnson and how rules relate to him, after all.
The question about the death of a member of cleaning staff from Covid would have stopped a normal human in their tracks... the way Barclay shrugged it off was unbelievable cold. Quite impressive, in a dark horrible way.
"56 [MPs] are under investigation for sexual misconduct, and that includes three of his Cabinet ministers" BBC in March
How long will that take?
God, I hate this guff – what’s the point in the existence of a planet without intelligent life?
Why does there have to be a point?
All the current BS being spread is setting the scene for the HoC committee investigation into whether Johnson intentionally misled parliament. He/they are playing the line that he reasonably thought what he said was correct. He wasn't there, he didn't know.
We all know its BS, but he is creating his defense.
Indeed. And because it's so unbelievable... he's sending out people to lie for him to reduce how many times he must deliver the blatant lie personally. He knows it's a lie. Those seeding the lie know that it is a lie. The interviewers know it's a lie. The committee members will all know it's a lie. Most of the public know it's a lie. Truth doesn't matter. Keeping the dear leader in power is all that matters...
...time to watch Hypernormalisation again.
The question about the death of a member of cleaning staff from Covid would have stopped a normal human in their tracks… the way Barclay shrugged it off was unbelievable cold. Quite impressive, in a dark horrible way.
The name of the cleaner?
Emanuel Gomes.
You and I both know exactly what the Brexies would be thinking...