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There is going to be a lot of people struggling financially soon, possibly for the first time in their lives.
It's a powder keg and in truth I'm glad the Tories are in power to take the flack for it at the moment.
There is a real lot of **** coming down the line in the next 2 years and I do honestly think there is a good chance Labour will win in '24 now.
I thought the polar opposite to that a year or two ago.
There is hope but im so saddened that it will come out of utter despair for many.
Holy crap! That swing to LibDem is amazing! Actually, so is the boost to Labour. That makes me hopeful, but also a little suspicious that these wards’ central government funding will dry up mysteriously.
Holy crap! That swing to LibDem is amazing! Actually, so is the boost to Labour.
It looks like Labour/Libdems did not field a candidate the last time that Maldon council seat was contested. Some kind of independent given a free run at it.
Either that or they got zero votes!
Poor fella can't even get a trafficking people to Rwanda bounce
https://twitter.com/ElectionMapsUK/status/1515457173614206978?t=TtoQzMhh4ZC5tjGtj7Cmug&s=19
Labour hq won't be too sad at these numbers
Local elections will be the real test tho
Local elections will be the real test tho
The closest real-ish test. The only one that really matters is a GE and we're too far out yet.
Locals can be more tricky, there are plenty of Conservative councillors out there in rural places who have strong local backing due to their NIMBY appeasement when it comes to development etc.
But I hope they get a shellacking and that Johnson goes. I don't buy all this stuff about Johnson being some kind of safety net vs the likes of Truss. If he goes now, there is plenty of time for a new leader to be exposed for what they are before the next GE. And there is also the charge on the Tories as a whole that they chose a man to be PM who is patently unfit for the job, broke the law and was ousted mid-parliament. This type of shitshow erodes public confidence in the whole party and that is a good thing.
You don't keep one shit in power because you're afraid of the next one.
Poor fella can’t even get a trafficking people to Rwanda bounce
That shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone who doesn't caricature voters as ignorant racists.
A YouGov poll which misunderstood government policy and asked the following question :
The Government has proposed a deal where some people who have entered Britain and applied for asylum will be flown to Rwanda, in Africa, for their asylum applications to be processed. Do you support or oppose this proposal?
Found that only 35% supported the proposal and 42% opposed it.
I think it is probably fair to assume that if the question instead of incorrectly suggesting that the proposal was for "asylum applications to be processed" had suggested permanent deportation to Rwanda, which is the actual proposal, support would have been even lower.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/travel/survey-results/daily/2022/04/14/8bb29/1
One of the sad and overlooked things about this 'deal' is that Rwanda actually see opportunity with asylum seekers who are willing and motivated enough to travel thousands of miles, through hardship and danger, to make their country and economy better.
People really are being sold the lie that there's no room left in the UK, so focused on our present first world problems to not see that the UK will be worse in the long run the way it's going.
But I hope they get a shellacking and that Johnson goes. I don’t buy all this stuff about Johnson being some kind of safety net vs the likes of Truss. If he goes now, there is plenty of time for a new leader to be exposed for what they are before the next GE.
@gardentiger this is the argument for grimly hanging on to him for a while so his successor reaps the benefit of the new broom bounce before reality kicks in. It looks like it will be all bad news for the next few years, there is no point installing a new leader so early they get to be seen as the cause of some of that (even if a lot of it will be down to things that will be beyond their control). I think Johnson may be kept in office as a whipping boy for some time.
That flawed YouGov poll… yes the wording gets the policy wrong, but that’s also how everyone I’ve spoken to currently understands the policy (that Rwanda will be holding asylum-seekers while they apply to return to the UK, rather than asylum to the UK being flat out denied to the seekers)… and yes most voters are against the policy… but it is aimed at a particular kind of voter… you know, people who voted for this kind of thing…
Locals can be more tricky, there are plenty of Conservative councillors out there in rural places who have strong local backing due to their NIMBY appeasement when it comes to development etc.
There's a lot of rebranding to "Local Conservatives" going on at the moment, some sort of effort to distance themselves from the shitstorm that is in Government and focus on local issues. The main ones are being very anti to any active travel measures; reopen the roads, no more parking charges etc to win over the "hard working motorist" vote. Tossers. Middle of a climate emergency, literally last chance saloon to fix the environment and they want to encourage more driving.
Anything to distract from Boris' latest antics though.
[snip...] People really are being sold the lie that there’s no room left in the UK [.../snip]
And yet, population density:
UK - 279 / sq km
Rwanda - 525 / sq km
There’s a lot of rebranding to “Local Conservatives” going on at the moment
Exactly the same is going on here too. The silence has been deafening from our Tory MP, who went to ground about 2 weeks ago and hasn’t been seen or heard from since
… until yesterday.
He’s now putting social media posts out urging people to vote on local issues and not to use this as a chance to pass judgement on the government, so trying to distance himself as much as possible from the Boris shitshow
Yeah, well it’s a bit late for that mate
He’s a fully paid up Brexiteer Boris-cheerleader, or certainly has been up until now
The ‘local issues’ he’s talking about all seem to all be of the ‘jam tomorrow’ variety, and he can’t appear to list anything the Tory party have actually done. Hardly surprising as he’s done the sum total of **** all and it’s pretty obvious to everyone that ‘levelling up’ was always just a vacuous slogan
Expect a ton of distractions, mud slinging and them saying anything they can to try to minimise the damage done to date. They and their media supporters will focus on "The War", "Harry & Megan"....literally anything they can. They'll try to appeal to cycle-hating-motorists, racists, NIMBY's..... anybody and everybody. Much like the Brexit campaign I guess.
Lynton Crosby is back at the helm so expect a dead cat a day, every day, until Election Day and probably stories about Keir Starmers dads history of Islamic extremism, or some other guff that the hard-of-thinking will lap up
The Rwanda polling is also on the very basic "do you like the idea". If people start to grasp the costs it'll be way less popular- even a proper send-em-home racist is going to be a bit conflicted when they learn how ridiculously expensive it is.
crazy-legs
Full MemberThere’s a lot of rebranding to “Local Conservatives” going on at the moment
They'll be quickly adapting the scottish playbook- I've had tory flyers through the door that you can only tell are tory by reading the smallprint. It's all candidates name, no blue, no logos, no party name.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61134002
"The prime minister sealed his place in British history as the first lawbreaker to have occupied the premiership," Lord Hennessy wrote.
He said Mr Johnson had turned his position into "an adventure playground for his narcissistic vanity".
Lord Hennessy accused the prime minister of having "broken the law, misled Parliament and has in effect shredded the ministerial code" when he "should be the guardian of the code".
That shouldn’t come as a surprise to anyone who doesn’t caricature voters as ignorant racists.
42 vs 35 on a policy that is borderline Nazi.
Go us.
42 vs 35 on a policy that is borderline Nazi.
Go us.
And of that a few will be lying, and the 23% don't know are more likely to be the normal too ashamed to say what they think.
The problem you will always have is that at a time like this, when inflation is rampant and folk are focused on cost rises, this type of insular policy is easier to get support for, or at least less negativity.
They’ll be quickly adapting the scottish playbook- I’ve had tory flyers through the door that you can only tell are tory by reading the smallprint. It’s all candidates name, no blue, no logos, no party name.
Shaun Bailey, the Tory candidate for Mayor of London, got done for this by circulating what looked like official London documents. There are quite strict rules about using City Hall and TfL (and London Underground, London Buses etc) logos and he was in breach of all of them.
Still, standard Tory behaviour of lying, misleading and cheating.
And of that a few will be lying, and the 23% don’t know are more likely to be the normal too ashamed to say what they think.
And you start getting closer to 52/48...
42 vs 35 on a policy that is borderline Nazi.
And you start getting closer to 52/48…
LOL! Yeah most people in the UK are practically nazi!
You might change your username but you'll never give up your nonsense, eh Danny?
No idea what you mean old chap.
35/77 = 45% broadly in favour of shipping migrants to a third world country with a record of incarceration and 'losing' the papers of such people.
As the other poster said - if you consider that some of the "don't knows" are likely to have felt some embarrassment but be in favour then it is by no means a stretch to get to 52% in favour. Presumably you're cool with 45% of the population of a developed country, naturally 'protected' by being an island, with a ludicrously high standard of living, supporting a policy of this nature? If so, why don't you just say it?
Presumably socialism is just for the 'right' kind of person. 🤷♂️
Yeah you need to read the question asked and the poll result, something which you obviously don't want to do as it doesn't fit your narrative. You would much rather focus on a question which wasn't asked and your own false poll result.
The whole proposal is totally unnecessary, costly, and repugnant. But to call it "borderline Nazi", an ideology which you constantly claim the majority of British voters support, is clearly absurd.
The idea was pinched from the Australia, not a country known to be borderline Nazi. And Priti Patel employed a former senior Australian government minister as an advisor to the proposal, again, not known for being a neo-Nazi.
I think you might need to read up on Nazism Danny.
“We are taking bold and innovative steps and it’s surprising that those institutions that criticise the plans, fail to offer their own solutions.”
She's unbelievable. So because she dismisses every other possible immigration strategy out if hand, that's somwhow justification for this Rwanda policy. Oh, and if Crosby is advising, perhaps he ought to suggest avoiding the word 'solution' in such rhetoric.
I'm vaguely amused by the predictable criticism of Welby for 'moralising' this morning! I thought that was his job...
Tories normally love a bit of moralising too...
Shaun Bailey, the Tory candidate for Mayor of London, got done for this by circulating what looked like official London documents. There are quite strict rules about using City Hall and TfL (and London Underground, London Buses etc) logos and he was in breach of all of them.
Nah, they're not using any logo's, most prominently their own. My propaganda came in a lovely shade of maroon with yellow writing, could have been anyone.
I don't want to get into an argument with you, Ernie.
I'm new around here but my more experienced co-STWers inform me that you are considered a 'forum big hitter' that also does a tidy line in behind the scenes sneaking. Allegedly.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others - type thing.
TTFN.
I’m new around here
Of course you are. Dannyh is probably your evil twin brother.
Btw what is your opinion of Denmark's social democratic government?
Full blown Nazis?
I know I can't win a STW argument against a man of your unique skills.
You are totally correct. I lose.
The idea was pinched from the Australia, not a country known to be borderline Nazi. And Priti Patel employed a former senior Australian government minister as an advisor to the proposal, again, not known for being a neo-Nazi.
I think you might need to read up on Nazism Danny.
Agreed, I think it's important not to chuck that accusation around, especially given the current atrocities being seen in Ukraine.
I will say though Ernie, Australia is known for particularly harsh treatment of both immigrants and the original inhabitants of the territory. We shouldn't be holding them up as a beacon of decency.
Anyway, time to get back to the PM lying to parliament and the country I feel. Have written to my MP today.
I will say though Ernie, Australia is known for particularly harsh treatment of both immigrants and the original inhabitants of the territory. We shouldn’t be holding them up as a beacon of decency.
Yup, there's plenty of evidence that racism is deeply ingrained in Australian society, as it is shamefully in the immigration and asylum policies of sadly many European countries.
I don't think it's necessary to make the comparison to the Third Reich however.
I know I can’t win a STW argument against a man of your unique skills.
For someone who is "new around here" you have learnt pretty quickly Danny.
It's OK, I have now seen the light with the help of Ernie.
Summarising across a few threads I can now say I am convinced of the following course of action.
At the local elections I am going to vote Tory. This is because they are sat on a 80 seat majority, so will win the next election come what may. Johnson has his faults but Truss, Raab, Sunak, Gove would be worse. And anyway, Boris is just giving people what they want. He's not such a bad bloke really - spur of the moment confetti socialism with a patriotic wrapper - it's the best we can do, after all.
Starmer is just a neoliberal shill, so there's no way I could vote Labour, unless they bring back Corbyn. The Libdems are neoliberal shills to a man too - so I can't vote for them either. Voting Libdem or anything else is tantamount to a spoiled ballot anway, so I've just got to roll my sleeves up, stop being a gloomster and get behind Boris and, more importantly, Britain.
I will also be advising anyone I meet that this is basically the only way forward.
👍🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧👍
Parliament is back in session this week, so Boris is off to India, so he won’t be at PMQ’s
What an utter shithouse that man is.
Parliament is back in session this week, so Boris is off to India, so he won’t be at PMQ’s
The Beeb suggest he's not going to India?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61140292
What an utter shithouse that man is.
But yes, he is
I worry that the 'other fines' we are waiting for might never appear and Bojo will escape.
I worry that the ‘other fines’ we are waiting for might never appear and Bojo will escape.
My guess is he will get additional fines but the proud party of law and order will just shrug and say who cares about law and order when it comes to our betters.
Whether the public will care and hence punish them in the locals which could then maybe have an effect on the tories who knows.
The key thing though is to make a note and whenever any tory muppet starts trying to take the highground about law and order keep reminding them. Same as when the right wing rags will inevitably try claiming the labour leader didnt quite bow the right way or dress right at memorial day. Just remind them of when Johnson turned up looking like a sack of shit and couldnt even manage to follow protocol.
If it didnt matter then then they can sod off in future.
Isn’t the whole point of today’s statement to Parliament about trying to mitigate the effect of the additional fines that they know are coming?
It’ll be the usual sorry/not sorry failure to apologise, where he once again casts himself in the role of the victim in all of this.
I’m more than happy to watch his reluctance to stop digging. Outside the fully paid-up, blue rinse racists this is not playing well at all, as most people are (rightly) still making direct comparisons with their own sacrifices through lockdown.
Let’s hope it all contributes to a massive shoeing at the local elections in a couple of weeks.
I hope that the failure of Tory MPs to denounce their glorious leader now will be duly noted by people when they’re calling for his head after the local elections
Well, you weren’t bothered 3 weeks ago…
The key thing though is to make a note and whenever any tory muppet starts trying to take the highground about law and order keep reminding them.
I'm locked and loaded for the moment some gammon has a pop about riding my bike where I shouldn't.
I'll start politely by stating that rules are something of an elastic concept these days and see where it goes from there.
Brandon Lewis doing his stint as toady of the day. They're on a rotation.
Shapps-Lewis-Jenrick occasionally Raab on the stroker of the day rota.
Note that Truss, Gove and Sunak will not go anywhere near it.
Unsurprisingly, any amount of lawbreaking is acceptable to Lewis as long as the PM is concentrating on “moving forward”. They’re just hoping the unrolling of time and events will excuse Johnson of his wrongdoings and failures. A tactic that has clearly been in play all along… “wait for Sue Gray…”
As for a nice piece of h double standards look to how the scots tories are going after Sturgeon for forgetting to put her mask on for a few moments - for which she was reported to the police and then warned by the police.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-61142777
I don't have an issue with that though - she didn't wear a mask so should be pulled up about it. It is how it is then dealt with and what she does that is important. From what I understand, she corrected the mistake, has apologised and has had a chat with the Police about it all. The Police have decided it isn't worth pursuing any further.
She isn't denying anything, she isn't trying to hide anything, so I've no issues with anyone chasing to flag rules have been broken. However, it does seem rather amusing that they are chasing it hard when they avoid any of this from their own - that is the amusing bit out of this.
indeed.
I hope that the failure of Tory MPs to denounce their glorious leader now will be duly noted by people when they’re calling for his head after the local elections.
I wonder if the tory MP that made the emotional speech about burying a parent has now been silenced, or is still angry enough to go into round 2.
Yeah you need to read the question asked and the poll result
I think you're being overly optimistic there. I don't think the exact wording of a poll really matters most people will skim read, see the topic and poll according to their feelings. I was pinged by this one and it's actually worded better than most. I often end up choosing "don't know" since the question is too poorly worded.
Brandon Lewis doing his stint as toady of the day
Jeez. Even by the current standards that was embarrassing. I guess the problem is if they try a rehearsal in advance they will accidently oversleep instead so just have the ones who are happy to blunder in.
It comes to something when the defence being offered is that the Prime Minister is too stupid to understand the rules he himself wrote and had told the rest of us repeatedly that we had to obey.
Thats apparently what he's going to run with today in his statement to parliament
"I'm so thick that I was unaware I was breaking the rules"
He's not a lying, devious morally bankrupt ****, honest, he's just a bit dense.
Thats where the Tory party is at the moment
Sounds just like my 11 year old whenever questioned why he did something stupid - "I DIDN'T KNOW!" in as loud a voice as he can muster. Doesn't wash for him and don't see why it should for the "Prime Minister" of the country.
What job is he actually suited to?
I worry that a local election kicking will be seen as enough of a penalty for Tory "transgressions"... A bit of faux contrition after the locals is to be expected.
We're still about 2.5 years from a GE and they know they can probably claw a poll lead back inside of 10 months with some very public Jingoistic sloganeering, pretend "tax giveaways" and a bit of character assassination of the opposite benches.
The current crop of scandals and Dead cats are really just intended to haze the public into apathetic disengagement so they don't notice the NHS sell-offs or yet more contracts for chums that come next...
It's easy to get all triumphant over perceived victory in local elections, the truth is Boris will still be PM for some time to come and his agenda will not have changed...
Half price train tickets anyone?
Yes, they'll be great at half term or for my commute. Oh, wait...
I wonder if the tory MP that made the emotional speech about burying a parent has now been silenced, or is still angry enough to go into round 2.
I imagine the Whip's Office or one of Carrie's SPADs have made a call reminding him of his future job prospects.
No thanks, I already have indigestion from all the other red meat.
Jeez. Even by the current standards that was embarrassing. I guess the problem is if they try a rehearsal in advance they will accidently oversleep instead so just have the ones who are happy to blunder in.
Nah, they've just got a rota of utterly shameless lying bastards ready to deploy. The ones on the rota themselves know the only reason they've got to where they have is by toadying and burying any principles they may have once had. Why do it?
Position.
Status.
Money.
Covid contracts for mates.
Kickbacks from developers.
Non-exec directorships for life afterwards.
Etc.
They’ve bumped Johnson’s statement back an hour so that Priti Vacant can announce some more immigrant-bashing measures as the warm-up act
Maybe a proposal to fire them all into the sun?
Like a bald man masturbating alone into an open pedal bin, Boris Johnson’s Brexit Britain disgusts itself. And yet, despite being observed on the gents’ toilet’s security camera that is the modern world stage, it continues its abasement unabashed.
That's worth the price of admission on its own. All done with Lee's characteristic style, but also all true.
We’re still about 2.5 years from a GE and they know they can probably claw a poll lead back inside of 10 months with some very public Jingoistic sloganeering, pretend “tax giveaways” and a bit of character assassination of the opposite benches.
That's exactly what I'm expecting come the general election as well. Sorry for having such a low opinion of so many UK voters, but there we are.
But local elections aren't just a comment on the government, they really do matter in their own right. Please encourage people to vote if their councillor is being elected at these up coming elections. Your local representatives really do matter. Support and/or reject them. Don't just ignore them.
That Guardian article would be funny, if it wasn't so sad.
Sounds just like my 11 year old whenever questioned why he did something stupid – “I DIDN’T KNOW!” in as loud a voice as he can muster. Doesn’t wash for him and don’t see why it should for the “Prime Minister” of the country.
Can I suggest Speeder as leader of the opposition?
That's the same stage I'm at, very hard to laugh at any memes or jokes about any of this as it's gone way past the point of being funny.
So the speaker can throw someone out of the chamber for suggesting that the PM mislead the house, but then claims it isn't for him to decide if the PM mislead the house or not. And allows the house a vote when the PM's party has a massive majority.
Why the **** should anyone obey the law, it is clearly only imposed on the little people. Immorality is not only legalised, but encouraged and rewarded for those that have money and power, while poverty is being criminalised.
But local elections aren’t just a comment on the government, they really do matter in their own right. Please encourage people to vote if their councillor is being elected at these up coming elections. Your local representatives really do matter. Support and/or reject them. Don’t just ignore them.
A lot of folk can’t be bothered to vote in a general election, local elections are just a nightmare to get people voting, let alone having a plan.
Down here it’s tories or Lib Dems, and ghdd Ed Lib Dems have to do a power of work to get seen and heard, Tory candidates just gave their circle of friends and age old tories getting them in without much fuss.
Can I suggest Speeder as leader of the opposition?
Thanks but no - I never did do debating club and it shows.
Our local elections are being very strongly fought by the local Tories they are very organised and their propaganda game it strong. Countless "Newsletters" coming through lately. All featuring "local" issues or the restructuring of the election boundaries which they somehow seem to find puzzling. Odd as it's their own idea . . . . #gerrymandering
It's a shame that the local LibDems simply can't compete but then I doubt they have even 1/10th of the budget in this marginal.
The damn propaganda pamphlets go straight in the recycling though it'd be more appropriate to use it in the toilet.
Yvette Cooper making mincemeat out of Priti Vacant again, then Theresa May putting the boot in too
I don't think Boris has maybe thought his warm up act through properly
A lot of folk can’t be bothered to vote in a general election, local elections are just a nightmare to get people voting, let alone having a plan.
That’s absolutely how it is. Do your little bit to persuade friends and family to vote if you get the chance though. I’ve been out this morning doing a leaflet drop and talking to some people I don’t know. Outside my normal comfort zone, but we have a great councillor I’d like us to keep and just placing my own vote isn’t enough.
Tory candidates just gave their circle of friends and age old tories getting them in without much fuss.
It’s the same all over semi-rural England. Which is why we need more people voting, especially younger voters.
Sorry for having such a low opinion of so many UK voters, but there we are.
It is well earned.
When is he on? I need cheering up, although I don't expect anything to change.
He's due on at 4.30 but factor in that, tardy as ever, he's always at least ten minutes late.
Its not like any of it is going to come as a shock to anyone, just doubling down on the same old 'dog ate my homework' bullshit
Priti Patel doesn’t come across as very bright.
Can you think of any of this lot who do?
She's very dull to listen to, trying to clever drop words in to make her look like she's got a moral backbone. It's more transparent than anything I've ever seen.
Hmm… I have BBC Parliament on in the background and waiting after reading Binners’ post. A mistake. So depressing. Swayne talking about capturing asylum seekers and deporting them as if they were 18th century criminals. I keep hearing Conservatives saying “send them back”, as well, despite this policy not being about sending anyone back to anywhere.
All the most friendly questions repeat the line “the opposition have no plan to break the business model of the people smugglers”… obviously the line being given out. But opposition MPs keep bringing up “safe and legal routes”… which sound like part of a plan to put the smugglers out of work to me.
Can you think of any of this lot who do?
Point taken, however Patel, Truss, Dorries and Raab have taken the art of coming across as thick as mince to a new level.
So Johnson quickly delivers his “I was ignorant of the law” excuse, and segues straight into Ukraine. Not worth watching.
Ukraine...
The new vaccine programme
the only thing the fly-tipped sofa will talk about, no matter what the question was
The 'fulsome apology' didn't sound like much of an apology at all. Mainly because it wasn't
They don’t like the word “dishonest”… do they.
He really is completely shameless, isn't he?
Priti Patel doesn’t come across as very bright.
When the Prime Minister is a dribbling piss artist whose only 'cleverness' is dropping a bit of cod Latin in every so often, then the 'top team' are unlikely to be intellectual powerhouses.
After the referendum there were only ever three types of person who were going to want to be associated with such an absurdity.
1. Idiots
2. Crooks
3. Idiotic Crooks
Hence the current cabinet.