Forum menu
not to mention how many of the armed vigiliates would get shot by the police
The speculation is wild, he did enough.
I guess some people can't help but try to rationalise what they've seen with bravado and bullshit.
I'm glad he didn't shoot him. Fella is going to have enough to deal with psychologically without the mental imprint of a close-in shotgun wound.
No amount of back-patting and medals will bleach that image away.
If you've never fired a weapon before though, it's one hell of a step to get an unfamiliar rifle in an incredibly fast-moving and adrenaline-fuelled situation, then actually aim straight and pull the trigger, knowing you're potentially about to kill someone.
Any aspect of screwing it up (like missing and the bullet hitting a civilian) or the weapon not being loaded / cocked or the guy trying to grab it back as your firing is going to be a disaster.
I've fired rifles in my cadet days. Could I point one at a human (even someone who is obviously a terrorist) and pull the trigger? I very much doubt it.
Sadly I have aimed and fired (and hit) a firearm at another human. It's not something I'm proud of having done or something I'd wish on anyone having to experience.
But actually that's not what I was thinking......though clearly thinking is something it's easier to do in hindsight and not in the moment. I hope in that situation my brain would have have had enough ware with all if standing over a man on the ground with his rifle in my hand to use it as a bloody big heavy stick and bludgeoned the guy until he stopped moving.
Some people seem incapable of seperating a government from a religion.
That requires critical thinking, and those who commit these kinds of acts tend to severely lack in it. As we keep seeing.
JD Vance was, predictably, on Twitter last night saying it never would have happened if there had been enough good guys with guns on the beach
I read this a lot from Americans on Threads for the last couple of days. I've yet to hear of an instance where "good men" with guns have intervened to prevent harm by "bad men" with guns.
I was thinking exactly the same thing. The obvious question to little JD statement is "could you give us any examples of where that's ever actually happened?"
All you end up with is what modern America now is, where everyone is tooled up to the eyeballs and 15 people being shot and killed isn't even unusual.
It does happen very, very rarely. And you have to counterbalance that against the massive number of additional deaths caused by having the country swimming in guns. It's the "my auntie got thrown out of the car crash and survived so seat belts are dangerous" fallacy.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-50952443
A terrible terrible thing to have happened 🙁
2 people, mistakenly blaming all Jewish people for the actions of the Israeli government in Gaza, and in the state of Palestine in general.
But ironically, much of our right wing media, and far right politicians are running stories and comments blaming Islam, for the actions of these two murderers.
These two are not customer service spokesmen for Islam, just as Netanyahu's government are not spokesmen for Judaism.
We really need to look at our media, and even revoke press freedoms if it is being usurped for hateful purposes.
Pushing these narratives only makes things worse.
Well said.
2 people, mistakenly blaming all Jewish people for the actions of the Israeli government in Gaza, and in the state of Palestine in general.
But ironically, much of our right wing media, and far right politicians are running stories and comments blaming Islam, for the actions of these two murderers.
Do we know the killers’ motives yet, beyond the fact that the targets were Jewish?
We do know that one of the killers was investigated (and considered not to be a threat) for connections to IS.
Beyond that conjecture about the motives, and how they were influenced by world events is going to happen in the media, because it is now so “comment” led, rather than “news” led (and all the worse for it).
I daren’t even look at how the rolling news channels in the USA are covering this.
2 people, mistakenly blaming all Jewish people for the actions of the Israeli government in Gaza, and in the state of Palestine in general...We really need to look at our media, and even revoke press freedoms...
Hold on, hold on, hold on. We have no reliable information about these murderers' motivations, let alone any relationship between them and right wing media.
We do have plenty of information about what happens when governments censor and suppress media, especially in reaction to public outrage. It doesn't usually end well.
From the BBC:
Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese says the two gunmen were acting alone and not part of a wider extremist cell.
"There's no evidence of collusion, no evidence that these people were part of a cell," he tells Australian broadcaster ABC, but they were "clearly" motivated by "extremist ideology."
Where is the "extremist ideology" coming from? Is it the same "extremist ideology" that has resulted in barricades and armed police at Christmas markets in Germany?
From the BBC:
Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese says the two gunmen were acting alone and not part of a wider extremist cell.
"There's no evidence of collusion, no evidence that these people were part of a cell," he tells Australian broadcaster ABC, but they were "clearly" motivated by "extremist ideology."
Knowing how NSW Police, Australian Federal Police and ASIO work with each other, and their very cavalier attitude toward the truth and integrity in leadership...I'll want more than a vague allusion from Albo as reliable info on the murderers' motivations.
See above links and below for examples of anti-Semitic acts done for money, law enforcement infighting and political misrepresentation of the "caravan plot", and the ultimately non-religious and non-political motivations of the last terrorist siege in Sydney, even if they were shrouded in religious-political terms. The murderer there was a misogynist, a sexual assailant about to be brought to justice and a loser in life.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2025/may/07/karen-webb-resign-step-down-nsw-police-commissioner-ntwnfb - pay attention to the last 4 paragraphs
Monis was described by Abbott as having indicated a "political motivation,"but the eventual assessment was that the gunman was "a very unusual case—a rare mix of extremism, mental health problems and plain criminality."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lindt_Cafe_siege
These two are not customer service spokesmen for Islam, just as Netanyahu's government are not spokesmen for Judaism.
Very true but Netanyahu's government is much, much closer to being a spokesman for their religion than two men that nobody would have ever heard of before are for theirs.
Very true but Netanyahu's government is much, much closer to being a spokesman for their religion than two men that nobody would have ever heard of before are for theirs.
No more than our government is a spokesman for the entire UK.
These two are not customer service spokesmen for Islam, just as Netanyahu's government are not spokesmen for Judaism.
Very true but Netanyahu's government is much, much closer to being a spokesman for their religion than two men that nobody would have ever heard of before are for theirs.
As i understand it that's really not the case.
Matters of Jewish faith are dealt with at a community level, and there os no mechanism for a centralised spokesperson.
The only difference as 'spokesmen' is their political clout.
Matters of Jewish faith are dealt with at a community level, and there os no mechanism for a centralised spokesperson.
Whilst that may be true in Israeli society, that's not the perception that Netanyahu and his government project to the world, especially when anyone decrying their actions is labelled antisemitic.
Netanyahu no more speaks for Jews around the world than Trump speaks for Christians around the world. They might both claim otherwise, but they’re both full of…
I'm sure there are a couple of STW regulars already working on how they can blame it on their usual targets.
What does that mean. Genuinely. Who are these "usual targets"?
No more than our government is a spokesman for the entire UK.
And again - the UK government is much, much closer to being a spokesman for the UK than two people that you have never heard of before living in the uk somewhere
I'm sure there are a couple of STW regulars already working on how they can blame it on their usual targets.
What does that mean. Genuinely. Who are these "usual targets"?
The great thing about that incendiary comment is that the group that person refers to as the "usual targets" and the group any angry reply refers to could be totally different! It's a perfect device for fighting with everyone! 🤣
Matters of Jewish faith are dealt with at a community level, and there os no mechanism for a centralised spokesperson.
Whilst that may be true in Israeli society, that's not the perception that Netanyahu and his government project to the world, especially when anyone decrying their actions is labelled antisemitic.
So? It is no truer because a right wing nutjob and his government claim it.
Netanyahu no more speaks for Jews around the world than Trump speaks for Christians around the world. They might both claim otherwise, but they’re both full of…
Apart from that is not the same, at all. Israel contain half of the worlds jewish population and very much stands for Jewish people, with obvious historical reasons why that is. So like it or not, the government represents Israel just as the UK government represents the UK.
If the UK government murdered 40,000 people and destroyed their land I would expect hatred towards UK people to increase notably.
Agree with your main point, but 40,000? What revisionism is this?
If the UK government murdered 40,000 people and destroyed their land I would expect hatred towards UK people to increase notably.
While I agree with your point, that would still be no justification for murdering 15 Brits on the other side of the world.
All parties need to stop creating this vicious cycle of hate and terror, and I despair that wider world governments are not prepared to take meaningful actiin to make it happen.
While I agree with your point, that would still be no justification for murdering 15 Brits on the other side of the world.
I didn't say it was justified, just not a surprising reaction.
Agree with your main point, but 40,000? What revisionism is this?
Okay, 72,500 then. Was just an example close to the country in question murder rate.
The quite predictable critique has happened, I get people are hurting but criticising cops for taking cover behind a car whilst trying to get eyes on the shooter isn't it.
A couple of cops in the hospital, the long weapon welding suspects engaged by cops with pistols and some think the cops didn't do a good job.
That takes some balls 'metaphorical' to close with long equipped shooters when your weapon has an effective range of 20m and less, and that's if you're a bloody good shot.
That takes some real professionalism and courage.
The Prime Minister of Israel does not speak for all Jews, whatever he (or anyone else) might claim.
The Prime Minister of Israel does not speak for all Jews, whatever he (or anyone else) might claim.
Of course, but when he claims to do so, and while Israel is widely referred to as “the Jewish state” and while Jewish community leaders such as the Rabbi of Bondi and our own Chief Rabbi express support for the IDF actions it’s inevitable that the confusion may arise.
Apart from that is not the same, at all. Israel contain half of the worlds jewish population and very much stands for Jewish people, with obvious historical reasons why that is. So like it or not, the government represents Israel just as the UK government represents the UK.
If the UK government murdered 40,000 people and destroyed their land I would expect hatred towards UK people to increase notably.
So where was/is the international condemnation/terror attacks for the hundreds of thousands of civilians killed by the US and UK in Afghanistan? That war wasn’t even for a border enemy and the country was discarded in a wreck.
None of the recent attacks have anything to do with what is happening in Israel and Gaza, it is an excuse to be antisemitic.
Okay, 72,500 then. Was just an example close to the country in question murder rate.
If the attacks of October 7th happened in your community, to your family, in your country, you wouldn’t mistakenly call deaths due to war murder. It’s easy to take a ‘moral high ground’ in a war that doesn’t affect you.
That takes some balls 'metaphorical' to close with long equipped shooters when your weapon has an effective range of 20m and less, and that's if you're a bloody good shot. That takes some real professionalism and courage.
It seems the latest reporting suggests that the murderers were shot by a detective using a pistol from around 40m away. I don't know much about guns at all but that seems pretty impressive under the circumstances.
mistakenly call deaths due to war murder
How about death resulting from war crimes - are they "murder" or not ?
mistakenly call deaths due to war murder
How about death resulting from war crimes - are they "murder" or not ?
Can you point me to where you raised issue about the war crimes the UK and US committed in Afghanistan, for an enemy that isn’t even on our border? It’s called war. Can you leave your disguised antisemitism until my friends husband is out of hospital, who was shot on the beach.
Go find somewhere else to spout your hate.
That takes some balls 'metaphorical' to close with long equipped shooters when your weapon has an effective range of 20m and less, and that's if you're a bloody good shot. That takes some real professionalism and courage.
It seems the latest reporting suggests that the murderers were shot by a detective using a pistol from around 40m away. I don't know much about guns at all but that seems pretty impressive under the circumstances.
That is impressive, genuinely.
your disguised antisemitism
At some point in the past this might have been an effective ripost. We know better now.
If someone tells you that they have someone affected, in hospital, fighting for their life, and you can only think to make a smart arse reply, then you are a horrible human being.
it’s inevitable that the confusion may arise
We wouldn’t post “it’s hardly surprising is it” type posts when Muslims are targeted in the UK, or New Zealand, would we? We wouldn’t be pointing at the actions of Iran’s Supreme leader, we’d be pointing at the perpetrators. Our concerns would be with the victims. The same basic minimum of understanding should be shown when Jews are targeted in the UK, or Australia.
[Mod] All, please keep to the topic and stop with the offensive posts. Thread will be closed otherwise. Thank you for your co-operation.
In the wake of the extremist shootings and gatherings of neo-Nazis calling for the elimination of the "Jewish lobby", Australia's Minister of Home Affairs has been wielding the "visa cancelled" stamp.
Having deported a South African neo-Nazi, he has now ordered the cancellation of a British neo-Nazi's visa. The deportee's name and when he is likely to arrive back in the UK has not yet been disclosed.
A British national who has been charged with displaying Nazi symbols has had his Australian visa cancelled and faces deportation to the United Kingdom as the Albanese government starts drafting tougher laws on hate speech after the Bondi terror attack.
The man, 43, was charged with four breaches of the criminal code this month after federal police seized swastika-bearing swords from his Queensland home and determined he had used social media to promote pro-Nazi ideology and violence against the Jewish community.