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Drinking the kool-aid does emanate from the Jonestown Massacre (the Rev Jim Jones ‘mass-suicide’)… which was the point. (And the reason for the emoji)
Sorry, I clearly wasn't paying attention.
Whilst I knew the meaning of the phrase, I didn't know that's where it came from.
Its not
See my post above
No tj, it ain’t:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drinking_the_Kool-Aid
There is a huge difference between taking acid to poison...
I thought the same as TJ before this thread enlightened me. Every day’s a school day.
The phrase predates jonestown
Sorry, I clearly wasn’t paying attention.
Don’t worry, not everyone is the possessor of the Sav X Death Cult Jonestown Memorial Card set... 🤪
The phrase predates jonestown
It did however take on it’s current meaning from being fed cynanide laced Kool-aid. I even gave you a reference and everything.
ETA: no need to get personal so removed inflammatory statement... 😔
you just keep on keeping on and arguing pointless shit, well, because.
I'll add... I used to use this phrase often... I don't think I will be from now on.
The phrase predates jonestown
I can find literally no evidence that this is true TJ, sorry. Not beyond your hippy bus popularising the brand, anyway.
More reading... and it wasn't even Kool-Aid that was used by Jim Jones et el anyway.
Let's not cross swords over this... I thought the "Acid Test" stuff was also where the "drinking the Kool-Aid" phrase came from just as TJ still does. Really not worth arguing over. The phrase has changed for me now... I'm not using it from now on.
I’ll add… I used to use this phrase often… I don’t think I will be from now on.
Ditto. I'd literally no idea, I thought it was analogous with 'eating your own dog food.'
Aside from being in bad taste (so to speak), it's not overly fair on Kool Aid when according to Wikipedia it was "Flavor Aid."
Ditto. I’d literally no idea, I thought it was analogous with ‘eating your own dog food.’
Is that a Lancashire thing?
There was no need for it, sorry.
He does need reminding every so often to just 'let it go'....
I'd always assumed that Acid Test it was like 'litmus test,' the definitive proof of something.
So I just looked it up. And it is, it dates to the late 18th Century where they used acid to test for gold. So your Electric Acid Test there isn't the source of that either. It was in use colloquially by at least the mid-1800s.
Is that a Lancashire thing?
Rationing was harsh.
Dunno where it comes from actually, probably just management bullshit bingo I suppose. I've heard it at work several times, referring to using in-house the products we sell.
Sorry to have caused a rumpus, I thought people ‘of a certain age’ knew of the Jonestown connotation...
And, I was not joking about the memorial card set either... 🤪
You could like, open your own Jonestown/Koolaid thread.
Even though it’s a bit silly, I do sympathise with the ‘what would people do if there was a real war on’ viewpoint. There’s never been a better time in history to ride something like this out. No one’s going to starve and tech means we can all stay in contact. All this bleating about mental-health cos they can’t go to the pub or go on holiday is pathetic.
I also notice a lot of snobbery and hypocrisy. “Those working class people going to the seaside are scum and should be welded in to their tower blocks etc”, followed by a load of rationalising about why they should be able to go to Scotland because they’ve worked hard and Harriet’s has a really tough year at uni etc etc...”
I do sympathise with the ‘what would people do if there was a real war on’ viewpoint.
At the risk of getting the thread even further off-topic, I have thought a couple of times that it was probably a bit like this during the war anyway.
Just without social media you wouldn't know so much about people breaking blackout, cheating on rationing etc.
Of course I wasn't there, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't all like a Powell & Pressburger film.
SO BoJo was photographed less than 2 metres from the MP who tested +ve for Covid, neither of whom are wearing masks, indoors. then Matt Hancock says they were social distancing, despite not.
So with that kind of behaviour going on, what hope do we have of people following any good examples?
All this bleating about mental-health cos they can’t go to the pub or go on holiday is pathetic.
I would add that there's a difference between the mental health issues from severely restricted contact with friends and family - not everyone is tech savvy - and thinking your mental health is suffering because you haven't had your fortnight in Benidorm this year. As ever, we tend to use broad brush language when there's actually quite a lot of variation in people's experiences.
@chakaping. Probably a mixture of both. For some, it’ll likely relieve some tension and also be a bit of a balance check that they’re not the only one getting annoyed and/or upset.
I think the downside is that if we keep posting about “infringements” then it makes it look like everyone is ignoring the rules and that, in turn, makes us each less likely to abide by them “because no one else is”.
I hadn't thought about it normalising the rule-breaking, but that is a good point.
Personally I sometimes vent - like when I saw a group of 10 or more MTBers last Saturday - but I usually restrain myself because I feel I'd be adding to the negativity and the general Daily Mail-esque "hell in a handcart" vibe.
There's actually been a good amount of intelligent comment in here though, and people do see that the UK Gov't has failed us all badly.
Cougar
Well, yeah, I understand “drunk the Kool-Aid” to mean that you’ve perhaps blindly or unwisely bought into something. I don’t understand the relevance here unless the poster was suggesting that the whole pandemic thing is a hoax. And I rather hoped that no-one could be quite that stupid so figured I’d probably misunderstood.
Uh, stop stressing ... I've used the term about this pandemic quite often.
Be it correct usage or not I've used in it the context of blindly following rules.
When I challenged your earlier statement I said in part the problem we are in is due to people blindly following "rules" with no common sense.
One of your examples is "nosemasks"... blindly following the rule... yuep they are "wearing" a mask. Kids being sent into shops as "they are not allowed to wear a mask", just about any covidiot that wants claiming medical exemptions... people I know with asthma refusing to wear a mask when they wear one in pollen season....
Banning mask wearing for children in classrooms even when those children live with vulnerable people.... forcing the sibling of someone sent home to self isolate to go into school and then preventing them wearing a mask.
Our local council declared all it's construction, tree trimmers and grass cutters to be "key workers" in Lockdown #1, all legally safe?
All these are following the RULES... and then add to that the patriotic duty to go to a pub or resto. I walked past a Wetherspoons a few hours ago in the window it had a poster with a whole load of legally safe "Sunak Cocktails"
All these are LEGALLY SAFE things ... as was travelling to Aberdeen from London to get a Covid test...
Add some confusion if its legally safe to drive to Barnard Castle with impaired vision? (Covid or not)
Actual real research and science that has been conducted over recent months it has been proven that planes are amongst the safest places you can be regarding transmittal of Cov
You are probably referring to the 'study' done by the United Airlines and Boeing. They used a mannekin, no one movedand it only faced front. It also seemed to assume that airplanes run the filtration system at full tilt for the entire flight, which they notoriously dont do because it costs to do so. It also assumed 1 infected person and that everyone else wore a mask
Its findings were also disputed by doctors.
intuitions all told us masks would make a difference and they had zero impact on the occurrence or severity of a second wave, so our ‘common sense’ intuitions don’t necessarily apply in the real wor
The study you talk of seems to based around the idea that masks do have a measureable effect, so you should probably pick one of the two and stick to it. Flying is safe if everyone wears a mask and masks have zero impact? Errrrr.
SO BoJo was photographed less than 2 metres from the MP who tested +ve for Covid, neither of whom are wearing masks, indoors. then Matt Hancock says they were social distancing, despite not.
A lot of people think they are social distancing when they aren't. Especially after a few drinks. Yes, we could meet friends at the pub in the summer but the 2 metre rule for non-household members still applied. Local TV news yesterday had a reporter interviewing someone on a charity run, running alongside them, less than 2 metres and no mask. It just normalises incorrect behaviour.
But I think there is a case that focusing on the minority breaking the rules does distort our perception of what the majority are doing to try and follow the rules
Banning mask wearing for children in classrooms even when those children live with vulnerable people…
Who is banning children from wearing masks?
You are probably referring to the ‘study’ done by the United Airlines and Boeing. They used a mannekin, no one movedand it only faced front. It also seemed to assume that airplanes run the filtration system at full tilt for the entire flight, which they notoriously dont do because it costs to do so. It also assumed 1 infected person and that everyone else wore a mask
Reminds me of
My neighbours have different family and friends over every weekend. This weekend it was her elderly dad. Last weekend her kids and grandkids. Weekend before that golf buddies over for lunch after a game.
It’s hard not to be pissed of when we are making sacrifices and not seeing people so we can stick to the rules. Our families all live a long way away so if they come they need to stay. We don’t have the option for just meeting up for a walk. So we just don’t see them.
Same here sadly Frank. Relatives are all a long way away, so have become Zoom relatives this year. It’ll really hit home over the Christmas break, we normally see everyone and have huge “not enough room at the table” get togethers with sleeping bags made full use of. We haven’t seen the kids’ grandparents all year. House behind us have been having 10+ people over for a party every weekend, all year. And this is while they know of a series of deaths on our road. The response to this is very variable… everyone can claim they are using their common sense no doubt.
Who is banning children from wearing masks?
My girlfriend works in a school. Masks aren't allowed in class, kids and staff alike. The exceptions are one-to-ones where they can wear a visor. And, irony of ironies, outside.
Whether this is national policy or the head being a control freak I do not know, I have a sample size of "one."
Actually, I have an ex who's a teacher, I could ask her and increase my sample by 100%.
My girlfriend works in a school. Masks aren’t allowed in class, kids and staff alike. The exceptions are one-to-ones where they can wear a visor. And, irony of ironies, outside.
Whether this is national policy or the head being a control freak I do not know, I have a sample size of “one.”
Actually, I have an ex who’s a teacher, I could ask her and increase my sample by 100%.
Surely this is reportable?
https://www.cieh.org/ehn/health-and-safety/2020/april/hse-opens-up-anonymous-hotline-for-workers/
Whistleblowers can now report COVID-19 concerns directly to watchdog, rather than via management.
Plenty of primary teachers have reported the same… not allowed face coverings when with their own class. I know of several schools were the kids aren’t allowed masks in class either. The HSE exception for schools seems legally sound (if perhaps lacking in logic).
I would add that there’s a difference between the mental health issues from severely restricted contact with friends and family – not everyone is tech savvy – and thinking your mental health is suffering because you haven’t had your fortnight in Benidorm this year. As ever, we tend to use broad brush language when there’s actually quite a lot of variation in people’s experiences.
Actually though, I think upthread someone made a good point. Most of us do work really hard all year, for the opportunity to make our lives better. An awful lot of people hang their year on the holidays, the chance they have to get away from the daily grind and just enjoy themselves. Maybe like a mental reset switch, where you can compartmentalise all the shit "over there" and be in a better place.
I'm not like this at all, but I can understand (especially if you have a terrible job or your life is horrible) that "two weeks in benidorm" or whatever can look pretty inconsequential from outside, yet might carry a large portion of someone's reason for existence. My mental health is tied to my ability to ride, a fact pretty common on here. For an outsider, that would sound ridiculous, but it's true. Bit more empathy on all sides wouldn't go amiss I feel.
Weird. I know they believed it wasn't necessary due to the bubbles but I didn't realise it was actually being prevented. I know Bojo sad it wasn't necessary and you couldn't teach or learn with your face covered ( except for niqabs).
There have been some schools that have allowed it and some that have required it. So it seems like it must be set by school or region or something.
Wonder what those schools would do if someone insisted on wearing one in class.
Wonder what those schools would do if someone insisted on wearing one in class.
Children refusing to remove a face mask when requested will be removed from the class and if they continue to refuse sent home.
Plenty of primary teachers have reported the same… not allowed face coverings when with their own class. I know of several schools were the kids aren’t allowed masks in class either. The HSE exception for schools seems legally sound (if perhaps lacking in logic).
OH's school teachers are allowed masks, kids not
Jnr's school no masks in class but allowed outside (so long as they are the correct colour - not white or blue)
Weird. I know they believed it wasn’t necessary due to the bubbles but I didn’t realise it was actually being prevented. I know Bojo sad it wasn’t necessary and you couldn’t teach or learn with your face covered ( except for niqabs).
Defies all logic... of course non of the kids have siblings or live with grandparents or other vulnerable family members.
On a par with paying for people to go to pubs.
The HSE exception for schools seems legally sound (if perhaps lacking in logic).
Exactly my point of my post.... i.e. people following the rules are spreading the virus, not just those that break the rules.
The BIGGER picture is when you do this what do people follow.
6 kids and parents in fancy dress seems inconsequential if the kids are in the same bubble.
Our local parks are jammed after school with the kids all mixing anyway.
Schools complaining parents dropping/picking up kids are not wearing masks outdoors then jam the kids into a crowded classroom and prevent them wearing masks...???
People's mental health is definitely affected by the pandemic throwing the triviality of their entire lives into sharp relief. Not being able to go on holiday or have a laugh with your pals in the pub means dealing with a major existential crisis 24 hours a day.
Certainly all secondary schools in Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire seem to be on full masks. Not sure if primary is the same.
know of several schools were the kids aren’t allowed masks in class either. The HSE exception for schools seems legally sound
I think that is absolutely ****ing scandalous.
Utterly unbelievable.
31 people
Inside
In a small space
For seven hours
Day after day after day
And people are upset at 3 old biddies going for a walk together outside.
Or people going for a bike ride together.
This country is run by the criminally insane.
I do like all the 'you never done a WAR!' people.
hopefully a global pandemic is the worst people will have to face in their lives.
Wonder what those schools would do if someone insisted on wearing one in class.
It doesn't even get to that point.
There's such a pressure on the kids to comply that they won't refuse.
My two would do absolutely anything for me, but if I asked either of them to be the only one in a class of thirty to break the rules and wear a mask they'd struggle to get through the school gate without tears. 😭
I do like all the ‘you never done a WAR!’ people.
Anyone who 'done a war' must be over 80 to even vaguely remember done-ing a war.
Hmmmm, I think a lot of this "during the war...." stuff is just poorly articulated, and therefore easily misinterpreted.
One of the things that I've found quite stark is how people from very safe, stable, prosperous regions are responding to even the slightest infringements on their "liberties" - juxtaposed with how people in other parts of the world live day-in, day-out.
hopefully a global pandemic is the worst people will have to face in their lives.
Agreed. One only needs to have a passing interest in history to understand that many of us have lived through an absolutely unprecedented period of peace and prosperity. I certainly think that some people (not directed at anyone on here) need to get a ****ing grip, and check their privilege. If you've still got a job, and are not worried about getting evicted/feeding your kids, then you are better off than many.
In other (not) lockdown news..... here in NSW we are piloting a "eat-out-to-help-out" type scheme, launching in time to support businesses through the post Christmas slump: 4x $25 vouchers to spend in your local cafe.... noice! Interesting as chain cafes/restaurants don't really exist in Australia - pretty much everywhere is an independent.
“two weeks in benidorm” or whatever can look pretty inconsequential from outside, yet might carry a large portion of someone’s reason for existence. My mental health is tied to my ability to ride, a fact pretty common on here. For an outsider, that would sound ridiculous,
I want to sincerely thank you for posting this, because I've tried several times to say something similar and deleted it each time because it sounded pathetic. So, eh, here goes.
I miss escape rooms.
No, wait, come back.
In February 2017, my wife abruptly left me and my world imploded. For a good six months the only time I ventured outside was to go to work or buy food. I was Not Well. And I tried, I did, I tried so hard. I'd arrange to meet up with friends and then bail at the 11th hour because I couldn't face going out of the door.
Then I (re)discovered escape rooms, having played one with work a year previous, and it turned out to be my salvation. I could arrange something fun to do with a small group of close friends, it was something I couldn't readily cancel an hour beforehand, and a "talk" wasn't expected. I threw myself bodily into the community, more recent games I've played have been about 50:50 "have you played before?" and "hello Alan, we've been looking forward to hosting you."
And it sounds ridiculous even typing this, but this little niche hobby genuinely, absolutely saved my mental health. It helped me turned a corner in my life, it dragged me out of a very dark funk of a place and back into the Real World, and essentially delivered me a new family along the way. I say with no intentional melodrama that I'm not entirely convinced I'd have survived 2017-18 if I hadn't found something like this that I could seize with both hands and find solace in.
I'm sure that on paper, people complaining that they miss the pub or the cinema or a fortnight in Benidorm seems trite when others haven't seen their daughter or grandfather in months. "You can't do an escape room, boo hoo." But each and every one of us have whatever it is that we need to wake up tomorrow, and if that is forcibly removed then it hurts and we perhaps shouldn't be judging others too harshly for their bemoaning of pains however trivial their chosen poison happens to appear.
Not that I'm advocating jetting off for a holiday in the sun; rather that it's perhaps a bigger kick in the bollocks that one can't do so right now than might first appear.