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Well said LMRT. Enjoy the dram.
Absolutely agree as above - agree with MRTs views on this.
Not been involved in any call outs but plenty folk I know have been in rescue situations. Always followed by direct contributions at the least.
My dad’s will specified a donation to Torridon MRT, and mum had a corresponding one to Cairngorm.
Nice pic above.
Prob best to close this thread now, after that.
Kudo's to the MRT. I couldnt do it,I wouldn't be able to keep my trap shut.
I hear it said that people like this are putting the MRT at risk - but I cannot think of any actual incidents of MRT members being kiled or injured on rescues. Anyone?
Since page 1 the fud and fanny quotient has dropped off dramatically.
I’m all tot heeded now!
That MRT post is spot on. They are truly amazing
One or two tj but have to go a long way back. Police sergeant on Ben More from Killin when helicopter crashed. But can’t think of any direct MRT casualties.
Ta
I think the people in this event would be dead if it wasn’t for their mobiles (specifically the app What3Words).
That bit stood out for me; I’ve seen comments made by various rescue organisations about installing and using this app for emergencies, because it doesn’t rely on the user having any particular map using skills, in particular OS grid references or Lat/Long, which most people really aren’t familiar with, whereas what3words is really easy for anyone to understand and use.
I’d like to see it integrated into a lot more satnav apps and systems, like Google and Apple Maps, TomTom, CoPilot, etc. HereWeGo, formerly just Here uses it, and for some time, I’d noticed when getting locations on my satnav when driving that there were these three random words kept appearing, but I never understood what they meant; I’d never even heard of the system, this was around four years ago, but I can’t help but think if more people were made aware of it, and how easy to use it is, so it becomes fairly ubiquitous it would help resolve situations like this one far more rapidly.
Having just come back to this, I'm man enough to hold my hand up and admit the added dimension of them being naive tourist visitors from abroad has altered my view somewhat (In all honesty, this added scenario did actually occur to me as a possible answer to understand an act of gross stupidity). I'm not sure it completely absolves them from getting a dressing down (seems the MRT are happy to cut them some slack so fair enough), but gives at least some understanding of what, why and how. BTW I'm another who er...studied under John Barry (Alpine Climbing by John Barry, wasn't aware he did other books so will seek that out)
studied under John Barry (Alpine Climbing by John Barry, wasn’t aware he did other books so will seek that out)
The Snow and Ice climbing one will be pretty out of date in some ways now! It's got some nice photos and nice stories though.
I hear it said that people like this are putting the MRT at risk – but I cannot think of any actual incidents of MRT members being kiled or injured on rescues. Anyone?
You get daft ones in the detailed call out reports. Eg Call out to woman with broken ankle after slipping on wet grass. Call out MRT member slips on wet grass and breaks ankle during rescue.
From memory - wasn't there a team of climbers - French possibly - that set out to climb Ben Nevis a couple of years ago in poor avalanche conditions and perished? Again that's at leats partly unaware of the prevailing local conditions - and how you impart that to folk setting out on the hills.
That was part of the MRT post to be fair, and worth investigating further.
but I cannot think of any actual incidents of MRT members being kiled or injured on rescues. Anyone
I volunteer with Harry's son still. He just went back up and painted the cross again this year with Harry's grandson.
Don't you dare suggest the MRT don't risk things. I've some more incidents if you want, including a couple of acquaintances that have some injuries from MRT work over the years.
Go and read Cairngorm John.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-16821872
I hear it said that people like this are putting the MRT at risk – but I cannot think of any actual incidents of MRT members being killed or injured on rescues. Anyone?
The only one I can think of wasn't on a rescue but a training exercise - the Cockermouth MRT were practicing lowering a casualty down a crag when the belays failed and a couple were killed. Page 8 of this PDF
Re: the whatthreewords app/system. This is somewhat contentious as it's a closed, proprietary system and the company have a very aggressive legal team. There are also standard systems built in to emergency calls (999, 911, etc.) where the location is automatically sent with the call - Advanced Mobile Location. Android phones have had this since 2016, Apple phones have had it since iOS 11.2 - 2018 or thereabouts.
Specific to the UK (as far as I know) is SARLoc - MRT send you a text, click on the link in the text and your mobile responds with your exact location - again no app required. There's also OSLocate which is an app - I've not used this one so can't comment on how effective or otherwise it is.
Edit: there was a thread about the w3w system a few months ago.
but I can’t help but think if more people were made aware of it, and how easy to use it is, so it becomes fairly ubiquitous it would help resolve situations like this one far more rapidly.
Dont worry Three words are burning through a lot of cash on a very aggressive advertising campaign to get people aware of it. They will then need to recoup that expenditure of course hence why their db is proprietary unlike grid coordinates etc.
To add to the list of MRT members injured whilst involved in rescues - 2003 a member of Kendal MRT has just been winched to a craggy location on the Langdale Pikes when the aircraft rotors struck the crag. As the aircraft pulled away to make an emergency landing in the valley, the team member was knocked over by the winch wire. He fell, and suffered significant injuries.
I did ten years as an MRT member, mostly in a busy team, and four years as a Search Dog Handler. I am struggling to think of more than a handful of incidents where, when you consider the casualties starting point in terms of knowledge and experience, I could honestly think of them as idiots. We all make mistakes in the hills, especially when starting out. Mostly we get away with it, and learn. If you are unlucky, you do not get away with it. In my book, you are only an idiot if you do not learn from your mistakes.
WRT charging for rescue - this really is Daily Mail logic. Most rescues are low down, think "going for a stroll in the countryside" territory. Should we expect everyone who leaves the roadside to be insured? When an incident occurs higher up, do we want casualties to delay calling for help because of the potential bill? The first time (and the would be a first time) someone died as a result of calling for help, the would, quite rightly, be an outcry.
Matt
I didn't mean to minimise the risk. I was just thinking I could not remember any incident and wondered about how often they come to harm
Of course I understand that they are at risk.
From experience tj, there's a lot of skill, judgement, kit and good fortune that goes into avoiding accidents.
Minor ones happen all the time (bumps, bruises getting cold etc) it seems.
Major ones, thankfully less so, but all the kit and preparation in the world won't prevent something major again. We had a SeaKing have an emergency over Tarmachan in 2011(?) with full load of team on board, they basically pointed the thing downhill and *just* made a field in Killin. A very close call. There was no circling, they just got the thing on the ground until repair crew fixed it by the next morning.
MRT guy fell from a sea king helicopter when a rotor struck a crag during a rescue in the Langdales (we saw the damaged helicopter afterwards waiting to be picked up) don't know what the final outcome was re the guy, but it was very serious, obviously.
Edit : just seen the past above
You cant speak to him like that, he lives in the Highlands don’t you know!?
Yeah yeah I know, think he's also climbed a couple of Munroes. Might have been three.
Just kidding lol
Since page 1 the fud and fanny quotient has dropped off dramatically.
I’m all tot heeded now!
Watch out, the Scots are marauding again!
As a lighter-hearted flip side to those none-of-the-gear and no-idea lads:
I used to live at the bottom of Arthur's Seat in Edinburgh and we'd often go for a Sunday stroll up it to get some air. Just normal clothes, jeans, trainers whatever. Sometimes we'd take a wee picnic.
And we'd often have a chuckle at the Serious Walkers in Serious Walking Gear: big Goretex jackets, backpacks, walking poles, flasks, stern faces etc which would probably have been quite at home on Nevis in February but looked a bit odd on a wee inner city hill, with paved paths, in June. 😃
Do any of the major outdoor brands,ie those that are popular on the high street contribute to MRT?
Serious Walkers in Serious Walking Gear
Cotswolds in Stirling a staff member had a go at mrs_oab buying approach shoes not *proper* boots for going up Dumyat.
Best not tell him we do more Munro's in trainers than boots these days.
Not sure. Tiso I think have some input - they support the John Muir Trust and the path building programmes from memory - or used to.
MRT is an odd one in itself isn't it? Overall Mountain Rescue gets some public cash I think, which may go to individual MRT outfits, but they raise their own cash as well.
SMR is around 20% funded by the Scottish Govt.
https://www.scottishmountainrescue.org/how-we-are-funded/
That wee hill in Edinburgh if you tried walking up it today up one of the West side tracks with your new balance pumps with slippy soles you probably would be arse over tit with a possible break, and the temperature up there today maybe 3° but with severe wind-chill , but the views North would be great all the big hills are white
Cotswolds in Stirling a staff member had a go at mrs_oab buying approach shoes not *proper* boots for going up Dumyat.
Gawd, that's embarrassing!
Best not tell him we do more Munro’s in trainers than boots these days.
Yip, I only ever wear the boots now if it's gonna be a boggy one, or Crampons are required.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2872455579548089&id=330175067109499
Tweed valley mrt called out to an IP .
No IP found
believed IP found their way off the hil and didn't follow up with a call to stand down.
That's an inexcusable dick move and - that should be charged for. That's not charging for rescue that's charging for wreckless wasting of resources.