I have spoken to many folk who swear by x fuel being higher octane therefore better.
I'll stick with the cheapest ta.
I do use supermarket fuel sometimes but I also use BP and Shell as well. Just depends when I need diesel and where I’m passing.
Never noticed a difference between any of them.
For those about to state supermarket fuel as a myth. It isn't.
Both my cars run crap on it. I've spoken to people who test the fuel at mira who agree.
I've no idea if it's true or not. All I know is several mechanics who service our cars tell us not to use supermarket fuel. They say its got too much crap in it that makes engines run dirty.
When my van failed its emmisions they told me to put the performance diesel in and redex about a month before the next mot was due and boot it on a long run.
When my van failed its emmisions they told me to put the performance diesel in and redex about a month before the next mot was due and boot it on a long run.
So if you did all those and it passed, was it definitely the previous fuel causing the issue?
Redex, another snake oil.
The only difference between supermarket and premium will be the additives. If there was "crap" in it then your filters and pumps would suffer long before it even got to the exhaust. There are standards for a reason, it is refined to that standard and then distributed to the market.
your old MOT is still valid for 6 more months. The bangernomics route is to do nothing till then, it might blow up spectacularly in the mean time
The bangernomics formula I use to sell current car is-
Sale price of current car + reasonable quote to fix > cost of new car + £1000 for any repairs that might be needed.
I’d keep you car and fix it. It looks like it’s had most consumables done recently and should be an easy fix.
@5lab. I asked the garage on that and they said because it’s failed I can’t drive it. The 6 months thing comes with the caveat that you have to make sure the car is safe and mine demonstrably, by the standards of the MOT test, isn’t.
That said the fail shows on the online checking system but it allay shows it still holds a valid cert. Because I pay my tax monthly if the tax renews I’ll take that as ok to drive. If DVLA write to be and tell me they’re not renewing the tax then that’ll be that.
Needs sorting one way or the other and better get it done now whilst I don’t really need it than in 6 months time when I really do.
I’ll reassess after the full service etc 🙂
So where is this dirt that is supposed to be in supermarket fuel coming from? Who's adding it? Seems supermarkets are going to extraordinary lengths and at great expense to degrade the fuel they sell you at a cheaper price. Oil refineries are extremely expensive facilities to build and operate. As such all oil extracted by all the oil companies is refined in a small number of refineries around the world to exactly the same quality standards and all petrol that comes out of all the pumps comes from the same base stock that could end up at a Sainsburys pump or a Shell pump - it's all governed by the same quality standards. The big branded companies will then add the additives and bump up the prices. Supermarkets will then just take the base stock and sell it on.
I'm not saying that the fuel from the big branded petrol companies isn't better than supermarket fuel due to the additives they put in, but to say that supermarket fuel is dirty and bad for your engine is utter nonsense. Also over half of the fuel sold in the Uk comes from supermarket pumps....if that fuel is so dirty and causes so many problems with cars then why are not half the cars on the road breaking down left right and centre due to cokes up engines? It just doesn't back up the claim (conspiracy) of 'dirty supermarket fuel'. And a mechanic is in no better position than anyone else to make this claim after all they only see cars with problems and not all cars, so have nothing to compare against and I'm sure they've not been conducting detailed forensic analysis of fuel in the labs they have in the back of their garages. They're more likely to be getting their duff gossip from their mate, Gaz, down the pub over a pint of carling or three (sorry to stereotype car mechanics).
If your engine is coked up and having emissions problems its more likely to be due to the way cars are driven rather than the fuel. Diesels, especially older ones, don't like short journeys and that is what most cars do in the UK...relatively short journeys. So much so more modern diesel engines have specific technology incorporated to combat the effects of short journeys on the engine like the regen process and other technologies. I think that is far more telling than rumours and conspiracies about dirty supermarket fuel.
My PD engine failed emissions last year. Ran some injector cleaner through it and went for a spirited Italian tune up before the MOT at a different place and it passed. I don't do a lot of mileage in it so benefits from a blow out occasionally. HAs yours been standing for a while?
Mate of mine who runs and fully maintains his rally car reckons Asda fuel blocked up his old van. He went from using a local garages fuel to the cheap Asda stuff near work until the van conked out. Then stopped using it and never had the problem again.
No idea if it was the fuel but he knows his way around an engine and reckons it was. We only have Morrisons and Tesco fuel in town and I've never had a problem.
And that's just it... It's always 'a mate this' or 'a friends mechanic that'.... Not trying to be rude but we're always just a bit short on empirical evidence on this subject...
@5lab. I asked the garage on that and they said because it’s failed I can’t drive it. The 6 months thing comes with the caveat that you have to make sure the car is safe and mine demonstrably, by the standards of the MOT test, isn’t.
they're trying to pressurise you into sending cash their way. There are two types of MOT failure, dangerous and major. If its dangerous (ie bald tyres, brakes not working, serious fault in the steering) you can not drive it (even, iirc, to a garage - it must be towed), if its just major (as I'm sure your emissions are), you are fine to keep using it. The fail sheet will specify whether your failure is major or dangerous.
If its just smoke then I would try an italian tune up before anything else. If you drive conservatively there's simply a load of soot built up in the exhaust that gets blown out when they run the engine against the govener for 10 seconds
Diesels, especially older ones, don’t like short journeys and that is what most cars do in the UK…
You don't really mean older do you.
My old diesel will happily do short journeys all day. I wouldn't do it preferentially as it's not good for any engine but I suspect what you mean is early common rail and emissions controled diesels don't like short journeys -so circa 2005 onwards depending on your vehicle.
Similarly 2005-2010 vehicles seemed to have injection pumps that seemed suceptable to the higher fame content in supermarket fuels at the time which propagated fears of crap fuel....really it was just that fuel was changed and the car was t ready for it.
-we had a 2008 transit that would hunt like buggery on Morrisons or Tesco fuel without fail. We stopped using it unless absolutely necessary to avoid running out and only ever had hunting issues with it when we were forced to run their fuel. -seemed a common complaint at the time with those injection pumps.
That’s man math justification for your car assumes 1500 every year. Next year might be 20 quid.
Your Octavia will be 2500 quid till eternity …
You didn’t sell that well to me anyway
+1
Also there the argument that he could buy the 3yr old ex-lease car and might have had 11 years of faff free motoring for less than 3 years of PCP.
The OH's Fiesta has had a few "it'll cost more to fix than it's worth" MOT's, most have been subsequently fixed on the driveway and generally it's gone through the next years MOT without a hitch.
The OH’s Fiesta has had a few “it’ll cost more to fix than it’s worth” MOT’s
This is a fallacy. Just because the cost of a fix is more than the market value doesn't mean it's not 'worth it' because a car is not an asset in which you are investing.
If the ONLY value of a car was its resale value they yes, it would not be worth spending more on it than it's worth. But for cars, their true value is hassle-free transport, and that in itself has value. If you bin your £1000 car because it needs £1000 of stuff on it, then you buy another £1000 car - you've still spent £1000 either way, but you have no idea what's about to fail on the new car you just bought.
Car maintenance is operational expenditure and is based on probabilities of failure and the likely cost of that failure.
Octane rating for petrol matters for knock prevention
Cetane rating for diesel is of a greater importance.
I am a bangernomics veteran and no wsy would i dpend any cash servicing an mot failure. What if it turns out that smoke is piston rings.
Find fix service.
Bit of petrol in thr tank, get it hot, give it a real good hard drive, refill with premium derv and re test
I am a bangernomics veteran and no wsy would i dpend any cash servicing an mot failure. What if it turns out that smoke is piston rings.
Find fix service.
conversely what if it turns out its a dirty air filter ? been there got that t-shirt- actually it had gotten wet and become fairly well plugged.
@5lab - No it's got a 'Don't drive on the road' fail and the garage have said they can't even begin to work on it and to take it elsewhere to get it fixed so it's not a cash thing. Decent lot at the national Tyres I go to - one of the few garages I trust.
They have also said then when I take it down for the re-test they will check the smoke first before doing it officially and that way it won't show as a double fail and I will still get the free proper re-test when it's sorted (assuming it's inside the 10 days of course).
They have also said then when I take it down for the re-test they will check the smoke first before doing it officially and that way it won’t show as a double fail and I will still get the free proper re-test when it’s sorted (assuming it’s inside the 10 days of course).
In that case, change the filters, put some revive (or similar) through it (not sure if they do multiple products or if this is the right video but gives you an idea of what I mean)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pAJSOsIbqyc
Put some decent fuel in and some redex (if you don't think its snake oil) and take it for a brisk ride. (don't go too far or you might get in trouble)
Go for the re test, see if it passes the emissions. If it doesn't then you know its probably something more sinister!
They cant ransom your vehicle.
Take it out of there and as above change filters I'd even drop the oil as well bang some Redex etc in it
I'd then go n take it up a dual carriage way in 3rd get it red hot n try it on the smoke test again.
If that value is that far out o doubt it's got anything seriously wrong with it.
Testing as per plate data is a bit of a farce.
A station can only test what's presented. They cant even pull gaffer tape of that plate if you choose to do that
No it’s got a ‘Don’t drive on the road’ fail
Have I missed it, but what is the fail item that renders the vehicle unsafe to drive?
Do not drive until repaired (dangerous defects) - Exhaust emits excessive smoke or vapour likely to obscure the vision of other road users.
I don't think it's nearly that bad but hey. But, as per my comments above the garage that MOT'd it have no interest in fixing it so there's no financial incentive for them to fail it on this. I know the garage well, been using them for at least 5 years and they've always been dead straight - have carried out minor repairs and checks for free on occasions.
Crikey, there must have been an impressive amount of smoke at the test centre then. Did they actually get a reading from the smoke test machine? I know the older machines would shut down if the smoke was excessive on the first or second full throttle.
So you've been driving around with no rear view mirror as well* - I assume that was on the fail sheet?
*Tongue in cheek, attempt at humour.
@Marko. That’s the thing. It’s below the default level of 3 (ave of 2.02 across 6 readings) but the plate value is 1.3.
We’ll see what a good service and engine flush does for the old girl 🙂
I still think you've been done. They may not be doing the work themselves but they may be in cahoots with someone else.
@molgrips - who? They didn’t recommend anyone! Just told be to get it sorted and bring it back and they’d give it the once over before retesting the emissions.
Honestly, I’ve used these guys for years and they have been dead straight. Bought a tyre from tyre-shopper (like Black Circle) once for my wife’s car. All paid for and everything.
Took the car in, they had a look and said the tyre didn’t need changing. They refused to fit the new one, refunded me directly and then sorted the rest out with tyre-shopper themselves.
Took my old car there once as it was making a hideous noise. Heat shield thing was loose. Fixed for no charge.
Engine warning light on my Audi. Read the fault, couldn’t fix it as it was the crankshaft position sensor which they don’t do. Again didn’t charge me for reading the fault. Most places would want at least £40-50 for plugging it into the computer.
I even offered them money and they wouldn’t take it.
Not the actions of a dodgy garage.
Just can’t see what they’ve got to gain from failing it. I’ve got the emission sheet as well-they are not going to forge that. Surely they’d fail it on something they could charge me to fix?
A station can only test what’s presented. They cant even pull gaffer tape of that plate if you choose to do that
The tester at my local kwikfit helpfully pointed out (after I'd take the aforementioned fiesta back after cutting out the rear middle seatbelt as it was jammed) that it I'd kicked the windscreen out he could have passed that too as it wouldn't have been chipped 🤣
TBH if the reading is 2, the plate says 1.3 and the age related limit is 3, I'd do as others suggest, oil and air filter, new oil (to the minimum line to be safe) and an Italian tune up. And if it's still a 2, cover the plate (and I'm usually quite environmentally conscious).
Honestly, I’ve used these guys for years and they have been dead straight.
Rip off garages don't rip you off all the time - they do nice things for you to build up trust then they sneak stuff in. I'm not saying that's what's happening here mind, but it might be.
Anyway. If you drove it around without noticing smoke, then they give it a dangerous fail on so much smoke that another driver wouldn't be able to see - that's bobbins.
@molgrips. They’re the worst rip off merchants going then by failing me in something that can’t fix and can’t charge me money for and yet refuse my money when I offer it them for stuff they have done :D.
I imagine he means "emissions exceed manufacturers specified limits" which is a major fail.
And then when you read what a major fail is classified as -that'll be where he gets the dangerous defect do not drive thing from.
Ergo his car is deemed not safe. And thus the 6 month thing doesn't apply.....had he not tested it on other hand
@trail_rat. No I have both an immediate ‘must not drive’ due to excessive smoke / vapour (8.2.2.2C) AND a major defect due to emissions exceeding manufacturers limits (8.2.2.2A).
Well the good news is that, after a good fettle; new filters, clean oil, engine flush and a can of EGR cleaner, it has now passed the smoke test with an average plate value of 1.28 - not bad for a big old beast.
Drop link sorted as well and hopefully I have sufficiently secured the headlight so back for a re-test tomorrow to sign everything off. Fingers crossed...
Finally after a bit of toing and froing the old girl has passed. Took her for the re-test and they weren't happy with the headlight but she would have passed the smoke test.
Took her back this morning for the proper re-test and they called to say they had hooked her up tot the smoke tester and she was going to fail.
Asked them to take her for a quick Italian job which they were happy to do and she 'quick passed' with a smoke reading of 0.47 so a huge difference to pre-service. Can ignore it for another year now 🙂
good work , amazing what a service and a bit of heat can do.
a lot of emission failures are insufficient heat related.
especially if they are cold started then left idling on the mot ramp whilst the tests ongoing.
good news on the result.