This is a better one..
Titus 3:10
As for a person who stirs up division, after warning him once and then twice, have nothing more to do with him,
The tossers are everywhere, some do it for giggles I reckon.
This is part of the problem though. I definitely reckon with the flat earth stuff there was so much trolling going on on both sides, but now lots of people actually do believe it - or at least don't care if it's true or not but find it fun to say they do, which is pretty much the same thing.
Is there anything in any bible type handy pocket guide to life thing that actually transcends the level of "Ensure food is thoroughly cooked and piping hot"?
Anything?
At all?
The merits are you don’t spread it to anyone else
And the vaccine stops this happening?
I am also not talking about merits, I gave an example of rational I could use personally for not wanting the vaccine. Are my concerns over long term and unknown affects for no personal benefit to me not valid?
None of the virus makers have made any claim to the fact it will stop you spreading the virus, only it will protect you from getting ill. If it’s proven to stop the spread of the virus, then that changes the equation.
That was one of my thoughts - but as I understand it the vaccine will dull the virus enough to stop you shedding it as you go about your daily business and hence reduce infection rates.
I might be wrong though...
The merits are you don’t spread it to anyone else, your family, or anyone elses. As an added bonus the more people that are vaccinated the quick we get rid of restrictions, lock downs and the massive international financial burden.
That depends on the efficacy of the vaccine and I am not sure all the results are out yet to determine this. Some vaccines lessen the effect of being ill but you can still be contagious, others make you immune and thus unable to spread it.
Further it is unclear at this stage whether the vaccine will be a one off like say TB or whether it will need to be an annual program, whether the virus will mutate and necessitate further developments with the vaccine etc.
It is too simplistic at this stage to state that if everyone gets vaccinated we are out of the woods.
Nailing my colours to a mast; I am very pro-vaccine but I would like a few people to have this one before me, just to be sure 🙂
I genuinely believe that around 20% of humans are unable to look past their own insignificant bubble. They can't quantify who large the earth is, or the solar system, universe. Can't visualise what 7.5 billion people is, and the realise that they are only one of them, less than .000000000133%
Climate change deniers can't seem to fathom that their own contribution to climate change is relevent, and if you were to multiply it by 7.5billion it becomes significantly larger problem.
Antivaxers are the similarly enclosed in their own bubble. Worried about their own skin, unaware of how and why vaccines work. Sad thing is the antivax people I know are genuinely nice caring people, but only at a small social level.
It is too simplistic at this stage to state that if everyone gets vaccinated we are out of the woods
Completely agree with what you've said. I have to write quick posts between work, so I tend to generalise.
I'll just say that as a healthy 40+yr old, I bet I've more chance of catching and dieing of Covid than getting a serious long term health condition from almost any vaccination, add into that my parents & wife who are at significantly highter risk.
I know, it’s a waste of time, but I can’t help myself.
Its worse than a waste of time - you can be unwittingly just as active in reinforcing these belief systems through argument as the people who's view your challenging - you're both repeating the same messages whether you're arguing for or against it.
Theres are genuine civic duty we all have to try not to let these kinds of falsehoods propagate. But being right and telling people they are wrong doesn't work. I mean - it obviously and persistently consistently doesn't work and yet clever people still do it. "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." as Einstein didn't say.
If you're going to put time into arguing with with antivaxxers, flat earthers or whatever maybe first put the time into learning how to confront these people in a way that doesn't strengthen their resolve and amplify their message.
Well there is the massive red alarm bell, anyone quoting something from the Bible ain’t gonna be rational.
Yeah you don't want that millstone around your neck. The writing is on the wall for anyone who thinks a leopard can change their spots. Its the blind leading the blinds really - no point arguing, you're just casting pearls before swine. You'll be at your wits end.
I'm pretty sure I convinced a couple of people. Whether it sticks I don't know. TBH I just like arguing with people, I tend to come out of it a bit more informed regardless of whether the other person moves an inch but I reckon there's a lot of marginal anti vax people just now, who're worried about testing/safety and have read some stuff about Bill Gates etc but who haven't quite made the conversion over to Actual Lunatic, and there's plenty of people doing their best to push them the rest of the way. Maybe the right word at the right time can nudge someone back into the reality-based community.
TBH I reckon most people who're "skeptics" (ie believe random stuff on the internet but not scientists) will change their tune once the vaccine's out and about and they see people confidently and safely going about their business. By the time more people can have it, more people will want it, and while the paranoia is at its highest there won't be enough to go around anyway so it's probably a little bit of a moot point.
@P-Jay link for stats:
https://fullfact.org/health/covid-ifr-more-01//blockquote >
Thanks, his figure were based on more data, factoring in his age, BMI, level of fitness etc. I've looked into it as much as you can with 15 mins spare and no more than Google, I can't claim he's not right.
Stop posting full fact articles - currently having a discussion on Twitter with an ex-Brexit Party Candidate & *checks notes* Full Fact tell lies.
https://twitter.com/rdevitoboutin/status/1331220768412282880
I think it was because the vaccine would make us all believe that the only acceptable car was a Qashqai
I don't want this to get lost in all the background chatter on this thread. This is some serious shit!
i love the idea that vaccines will turn us into complacent worker drones doing the state’s bidding. or, perhaps i prefer the notion that folk think they that they aren’t going to work and following the rules.
I tend to post a link to FullFact
Well that's just part of the big conspiracy!! It's says so somewhere in the Bible.
I have a friend who is otherwise very sensible, a successful businessman and generally very pleasant to speak to.
However, he is a massive anti-establishment consipiracist, believes everything that David Icke says, and is rabidly anti-vax and a huge Brexiteer.
We just steer completely away from any potential contentious topic of conversation and we're both happier. Still think he's batshit crazy though.
As for Facebook, well, your first mistake was actually being on Facebook.
Oh god, that comment in the Twitter link up there ^^
BTW, please research fullfact - its funders are not impartial
This is cherry picking - you find a lot of these people claim to want data and facts and information and statistics. They don't. They want information that backs up THEIR point of view.
Any other info is rubbished: It's not impartial. It's out of date. It's flawed (they never actually say HOW it's flawed...). It's biased. It's commissioned by [one of them]. It's written by [one of them]. It's left-wing.
Even in less obvious areas - the implementation of LTNs for example is falling into the same sort of rabbit hole where a story in the Daily Mail of a fire engine blocked by a planter gets posted and quoted ad infintum. The comment from London Fire Brigade rubbishing the whole story and saying it wasn't the case, they're in favour of LTNs and so on gets trashed as being fake, left-wing, published on a biased cycling website, the evil council must have paid the Fire Brigade to say that...
You just can't win.
The merits are you don’t spread it to anyone else, your family, or anyone elses. As an added bonus the more people that are vaccinated the quick we get rid of restrictions, lock downs and the massive international financial burden.
I've been getting busy with the old Google-Fu during my lunch break, in answer to the question "does the vaccine stop the spread of the virus, or just stop you getting ill" the only answer you'll get from a reputable source I can see is "we don't know yet".
Knowing little bit about how it's transmitted (don't we all now), I suspected it probably would simply because you're less likely to be coughing or have a fever that's going to leave your sweat on everything you touch, but it's said that 50% of transmissions come from asymptomatic carriers.
It hasn't changed my mind, if I'm offered one (which is slightly more likely than most as my Wife is clinical NHS) I'll certainly have it, and hope it stops transmission. I doubt my Mate will change his mind either. As far as he's concerned it's a very low-risk virus for him personally and unless they can 'prove' it stops transmission it won't pass his own personal risk/reward test.
Perhaps @tpbiker they thought you were looking for a fight and didn’t want to make your day?
Nope..
I was genuinely interested in why people who have zero knowledge of the subject can be so against it, when those who do know something about it are all for it.
Without any forthcoming explanation, it very much appears any justification is irrational..
I think it was because the vaccine would make us all believe that the only acceptable car was a Qashqai
At least it prevents Corollavirus
At least it prevents Corollavirus
And with that PP wins the thread and it can cease 😀
I keep on following one school friend on FB who is anti EU and thinks Clinton is last of some conspiracy. I occasionally go on a MD argue but it's relatively pointless, I continue to follow him as I find it good to keep track of what BS is currently spreading around.
That corolla one is awful..... Even worse than the thought a vaccine might make you like a quashqai.
I have been talking to various friends about the vaccine and their main question with knowing my background is would I have it. When I reply yes, they seem to be a bit more open to the idea.
Has Josh bryceland popped up yet to tell us we're all wrong, and Bill gates is trying to take over the world?
Is there any data suggesting having covid once means you will respond the same way if you got it again?
What is powering these vaccine microchips??
My phone battery barely lasts a day
Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired
said Swift...probably
chap in my office told me yesterday, that one of the ingredients in this new vaccine is.....
a small amount of lung sample, from a 14 week foetus.
Which firstly is a horrible thought, but secondly, who knew these pharmaceutical company's stocked such thing. Does a foetus even have lungs at 14 weeks?! I have no clue!
Needless to say I ripped the urine for a while, thankfully he realised what the internet told him might not be accurate.
One of the COVID vaccines does have “porcine” elements included in its manufacture. I’m pretty sure it’s a negligible amount and I think most sensible Imams and Rabbis have advised that it’s OK ( there’s no alternative and it’s an emergency) but I will guarantee it will feature in a conspiracy coming to you soon...
I ripped the urine
He probably drunk it. If you can stomach it look for all the urine therapy groups on Facebook and the like.
As for the aborted foetus this; some vaccines do have stem cells that were grown originally from an aborted foetus from many years ago but they are essentially just a lab product these days so like any conspiracy there is a foundation of truth in it.
Humans aren't rational. No, not even you - the difference is that people vary where they apply their irrationality.
Anti vaxxers are making an emotive argument dressed up as rational, without realising it. They can be manipulated by appealing to their emotions.
One of the COVID vaccines does have “porcine” elements included in its manufacture. I’m pretty sure it’s a negligible amount and I think most sensible Imams and Rabbis have advised that it’s OK ( there’s no alternative and it’s an emergency) but I will guarantee it will feature in a conspiracy coming to you soon…
In much the same way that the new £5 note used tallow (a form of animal fat) in it's manufacture and all the vegans promptly got outraged and the trashier papers were screaming about bank notes containing ANIMAL FAT and how vegans were preparing to bring a LANDMARK LEGAL CASE.
In amongst all the OUTRAGE! was a lovely article about how much tallow was actually required to produce the roughly 329 million £5 notes in circulation across their expected lifespan. About half of one cow.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/dp3eyq/a-very-precise-calculation-of-exactly-how-many-cows-are-being-murdered-for-the-new-fivers
Even worse than the thought a vaccine might make you like a quashqai.
I though severe disease led to a Juke brochure?
And Rule 1 innit
https://www.veganfriendly.org.uk/health-fitness/vaccines/
CHO cells are Chinese Hamster Ovary cells. Most antibodies are manufactured using them, some subunit vaccines too. They aren't vegan friendly. But Rule 1 applies here.
In an ideal world, animals would not be tested on at all. But the world is far from ideal at the moment. And given the possible and practicable section of the definition allows for scenarios such as this, we think it is not a contradiction for vegans to receive the Covid-19 vaccine, or indeed any other that is likely to stop them (or others) getting seriously ill or possibly even facing death.
So what vaccine is everyone taking?
Moderna
Pfizer
Astra Zeneca
They all work in different ways with varying efficacy...
Sadly most of the arguments I see on both sides re pro / anti are mostly uninformed and poorly debated.
Next question - Anyone buying shares in any of the above so we can start another investment thread 😂
Next question – Anyone buying shares in any of the above so we can start another investment thread
Avoid AZ in that case. When they announced they would be selling their vaccine at cost whilst the pandemic was still rife their share price dropped 4%. The market is brutal like that but fair play on them for their stance.
So what vaccine is everyone taking?
You won't get a choice. If I did, I'd take the sub-unit Sanofi/GSK spike protein next year. Might get it through work (We get the flu vaccine annually). I already have shares.
AZ shares fell on the news - an issue with dose and ad-hoc data dredging might find the vaccine isn't approved in the US.
Is there anything in any bible type handy pocket guide to life thing that actually transcends the level of “Ensure food is thoroughly cooked and piping hot”?
Anything?
At all?
about half way through it stops being "smite it furiously with fire and floods" and goes a bit "be excellent to one another", which was the point at which the authors discovered raw mushrooms were a bit more potent than cooked ones
Moderna
Pfizer
Astra Zeneca
All sound like funky new pizza types.. maybe that's how Gates/Soros will be serving their mind-altering vaccines... Pizza, with a chemtrail topping. All served in tinfoil cooked with 5G.
You couldn't make it up... ask Tommy Robinson. He speaks the truth, I saw it on Fox and Friends.
Next question – Anyone buying shares in any of the above so we can start another investment thread
I'm hoping my pension provider invested heavily as soon as those companies started working on vaccines.
Is there anything in any bible type handy pocket guide to life thing that actually transcends the level of “Ensure food is thoroughly cooked and piping hot”?
There's a bit somewhere that says don't be a dick. I may be paraphrasing there.
Don't fornicate your neighbour's wife, I think it said. Or was it don't fornicate with your neighbour's cow? Everyone had a cow in those days. And if you didn't, you probably wanted one, or at least to borrow one.
Amazing that it had to be spelled out like that, now I come to think of it.
Also, it did say mums and dads were ace, so don't kill them or steal their junk.
My mrs has a pal that's totally gone off the deep end with this conspiracy stuff. An otherwise previously normal girl who is now convinced by every conspiracy going. Every buzzword and phrase thrown about - plandemic, scamdemic, the great reset etc.
She bombards my mrs with non stop messages about this guff so she "knows what's going on". My mrs is getting quite upset with it all. She tried to say she didn't believe any of this nonsense and the pal just doubled down on everything.
Utterly insane and sadly a growing movement.
I'm going to have to Google "The Great Reset" now.
Is there anything in any bible type handy pocket guide to life thing that actually transcends the level of “Ensure food is thoroughly cooked and piping hot”?
Fashion tips maybe? "Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material." Leviticus 19:19 - So polycotton is out.
And a strict door policy. "No one whose testicles are crushed or whose penis is cut off shall be admitted to the assembly of the LORD". Deuteronomy 23:1 NRSV
