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My cholesterol was 5.6
Doctor offered me statins. I refused after a conversation with a mate who is a coronary nurse.
I now take a good quality olive oil as a drink daily. My level is down to 5.0
2008 I was super fit. Did triathlons and cycled home 40k each day. But a routine test revealed that it hovered around 8.5. It was genetic, so statins for life or a stroke/heart attack, so the Swiss medical service told me at the time. Safe levels now. I’d seriously rather not be dependent on them but heyho.
I went for a holiday vaccine and the practitioner offered a BP check while I was there. It was quite high and so prompted a series of sessions with the nurse practitioner at my GPs. I get white coat syndrome but a month or two of home monitoring showed it was still borderline high. Cue a series of checks all of which showed I would benefit from losing a bit of weight (which I did) exercise a bit more,(which I now do) and take a low dose of Amlodipine (10mg). Family history of heart disease means I tend to stick to this sort of advice! I also take Allupurinol as I have a history of arthritis which occasionally flares into gout. The GP who did the prescriptions threw Atorvastatin in as a "you might as well, it'll probably do you good even though your cholesterol is about where it should be".I'm 61. As a couple Mrs Scape and I tend to eat few carbs, no processed foods, so our salt and sugar intakes are pretty low to start with, and we both weigh considerably less than we used to.
Doctor offered me statins. I refused after a conversation with a mate who is a coronary nurse.
Ah so you took the advise of a less qualified person over a more qualified 😳
but if you are in a certain risk profile then the benefits far outweigh the issues.
But you have been advised you have a form of heart disease ! Also what are the issues everyone gets that Are detrimental to your health? That’s an illogical approach
I read (from a credible source, nhs advice etc...) that a handful of nuts a day can reduce cholesterol ratio as much as a low dose statin (the right sort of nuts, not the Kp..) - so now I have a very expensive nut habit... alongside doing everything else possible diet and exercise related to avoid having to take statins. I don't prescribe to pill popping as the easy solution to everything either. Familial high cholesterol.... just keeping it below the level where I'll have to do what I'm told.
Yes. Because my Dr is a bit of a guesser.
When my heart went into AF he told me it would settle down. He didn't send me for a ECG. I went to A&E and told them it resulted in open heart surgery.
My friend works in coronary care at LGI.
I reckon he knows enough.
My GP has been trying to push statins and last time I was in Boots they ambushed me with a "quick blood pressure check while you're here" and pushed the same line. It's like the Blackadder episode where the quack recommends a course of leeches for everything.
swamp boy - the thing with statins is the evidence is very clear. those who take them live longer. Some of the "why" I believe is not fully understood but they seem to have a protective effect beyond just reducing cholesterol. Some medics believe everyone should take them over a certain age
Those that take them, did you notice any decrease in exercise performance, loss of muscle power or extra achiness post? I don't want to have to buy an ebike, not yet... I suspect both are coming my way either way eventually...
Please supply evidence to support that cholesterol is the devils dark mark.
I'm neutral on the issue. All I've asked is that you supply some evidence to support your argument, so I can make an informed decision. The fact that you have (so far) provide no evidence to back up your position, makes me wonder if you have any evidence?
I guess my question is if my cholesterol is fairly low and I have no other risk factors other than my age, should I just bang them down every day for the rest of my life 'as a precaution'?
Hospitalisation - probably biggest NHS ticket item. If hospitalisations can be prevented, money can be saved.
Mass screening (and treatment) campaigns are inherently for (££) prevention... probably not intended to increase life expectancy, but it's an added benefit I suppose.
It's all about risk vs cost vs benefit. Who do we treat to get the best cost-benefit balance? What about the risk of side effects?
Statins were far more expensive 20 years ago. Nowadays they're available generically and cheaply. Perhaps the cost-benefit conversation has changed as a result, and maybe now they're willing to prescribe them to more people.
Risk factors = high blood pressure, high cholesterol, high blood sugar and the like. Multiple risk factors are more than additive.
So if you don't tick any of the risk factor boxes - the question is whether or not you'll see a benefit vs. the risk of side effects (like muscle pain for example).
Sometimes they get things wrong (so they end up spending more)... daily Aspirin for example - can lead to GI side effects, which led to an increase in PPI prescriptions. Taking a PPI (long term) is itself a risk factor in bone health. So now what? Let's give people chalk and sunshine (chewable calcium+vitamin D tablets).
Its good to see the way we appreciate humans just coming down to a cost benefit analysis...
Those that take them, did you notice any decrease in exercise performance, loss of muscle power or extra achiness post? I don't want to have to buy an ebike, not yet... I suspect both are coming my way either way eventually...
No - I thought I might have, stopped taking them and no difference. the actual incidence of side effects is low - much lower than many folk think
Please supply evidence to support that cholesterol is the devils dark mark.
I'm neutral on the issue. All I've asked is that you supply some evidence to support your argument, so I can make an informed decision. The fact that you have (so far) provide no evidence to back up your position, makes me wonder if you have any evidence?
You might get some youtube vids. There is zero real evidence of a diet like lambchops doing any good and lots that it does real harm.
Anyone get acute muscle aches with the statins?
Please supply evidence to support that cholesterol is the devils dark mark.
I'm neutral on the issue. All I've asked is that you supply some evidence to support your argument, so I can make an informed decision. The fact that you have (so far) provide no evidence to back up your position, makes me wonder if you have any evidence?
You might get some youtube vids. There is zero real evidence of a diet like lambchops doing any good and lots that it does real harm.
Okay guys I’m out. Not going to comment on nutrition based threads again. If I have a heart attack or stroke and survive I’ll let you know. Until then I’m carrying on eating meat from ruminant animals, salt, butter, ferments and feeling great.
Have fun on your medications.
A fascinating read is "Doctoring Data" by Dr Malcolm Kendrick, subtitled "how to sort out medical advice from medical nonsense". He's also written "The Great Cholesterol Con". He was an NHS GP by the way.
I am one who didn't get along with statins. Was first prescribed them in my early 30s, 62 now. Dad died at 44 with furred up arteries, high cholesterol on both sides of the familly, my own being around 8 despite being vegetarian at the time with a very healthy diet.
The statins never really had much of a lowering effect and I experienced muscle aches, weakness and fatigue whilst taking them. But I continued taking them for many years with the odd break and then coming back to a different type to see if they suited but none did.
Around fifteen years ago I started to get muscle atrophy in my left thigh and was advised to stop the statins while it was investigated and haven't been back on them since. The muscle atrophy was eventually attributed to nerve damage.
Recently a new GP at our local practice noticed my cholesterol levels and contacted me to say I should be on statins again. I'm currently mulling it over.
Its good to see the way we appreciate humans just coming down to a cost benefit analysis...
Just to clarify - cost/benefit analysis is an organisational thing. They have a budget, and they need to make it work.
NICE will advise the NHS on whether a new medicine is 'cost effective'. Depending on the disease area, the NHS may then look at the population as a whole - decide who is 'at risk' and who to treat.
A personal example: I'm entitled to a free Flu jab, but not a Covid jab. Their data may suggest that I'm at greater risk of being hospitalised from Flu...
...OR that the Covid jab costs more, so the group or people receiving it is smaller (but is at higher risk).
There are so many threads to it - you have immunisation to prevent the spread of disease (for public health reasons), as well as immunisation to prevent hospitalisations (and deaths)... then you have general health screening to prevent hospitalisations (and deaths).
It's not all bean counting, but you can appreciate there's a lot to it. Services are seriously stretched, and they need to find ways to keep moving (even if they only have three good wheels still rolling).
To the questions about muscle aches and weakness, I do get an occasional pain in my calf that only really started around the same time as I took statins, however I don't know if it's just coincidence. Anyway, it's not exactly a bad pain just minor and it quickly pasases.
No problems with muscle weakness or physical performance at all on them, for me.
Dr Malcolm Kendrick A proven quack
You can do better than that tj!
Other people have done the work that proves him a quack. read the link.
Having seen the affects of a stroke on my late father, I am quite happy to take statins if it lowers the chances that I have a stroke.
Anyone get acute muscle aches with the statins?
I'm on 20mg Atorvastatin with no side effects. The issue with asking these questions is that you will always find somebody who gets the side effects. It doesn't really give you any idea of the chances of it happening to you. One of the issues with statins is that they are a very widely prescribed drug & people seem to associate it with problems. I went for my annual health check at the GP & the practice nurse asked me what drugs I took daily (Tamsulosin for prostate & loratadine during the hay fever season) as well as the statin. The nurse asked if I had any side effects from the statin, she didn't ask me about the other two drugs despite the fact that they too can have side effects. As far as I am concerned statins just have some very bad PR. Cardiologists of my acquaintance think they are fantastic.
I got really bad knee pain on statins. I stopped and started them three times and it came back each time. Now on Ezitembe instead. No idea if its working as I've not had a cholesterol test since.
Doc said statins cause msucle pain rather than joint pain, but then the treatment for knee pain involves building up the muscles, so it must all be related. And the studies showed a number of people quitting statins specifically due to knee pain.
I also had the "statins are nonsense" talk from my physio, but he reference the above quackery doctor Malcom Kendrick et al so I ignored it.
I'm 46, cholesterol ratio was 8.6, LDL 6.41. Blood pressure is around 110/70. QRISK3 is 3.4%
20 mg of Atorvastatin. Genetically high cholesterol as its with both parents. Diet didn't make any difference. Was just a bit high. Been on them around 10 years. No side effects at all so a no brainer really.
Interestingly with statins there is a clear nocebo effect where people taking statins over report side effects ( this is not to say that folk on here reporting side effects are making it up) Its a really weird finding. Its the opposite of placebo effect whereby people get better even taking placebo pills.
https://imperialbrc.nihr.ac.uk/2017/10/11/statins-and-the-nocebo-effect/
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCOUTCOMES.120.007480
I went from 20-40-80mg of Atorvastatin over the period of about 10 years and I've just reduced down to 40mg as my cholesterol is now under the threshold. Interestingly, statins are also being studied for their potential to improve outcomes in the blood cancer I have (CLL) so I'm happy to keep taking them.
I was on Atorvastatin and starting getting really bad pain in the arches of both feet. Gp told me it was "classic plantar fasciitis". I stopped the statins for 2 weeks and the pain went away....came back when I restarted. I'm now on rosuvastatin with no ill effects. (genetically high cholesterol and BP)