[Closed] Any runners on here, why do my legs hurt??

if the pain is down the front of the shin then i had similar and was told that i wasn't moving my foot properly, i needed to push though the step with my toes and stretch the front of the shin. i did that and it stopped

if the pain isn't down the front of the shin then its proabaly nothing to do with everything i've just said.

Sounds like you may be going into it a bit hard - even though the distances are relatively small running can be immensely hard on you if you're not used to it.

Keep doing it but cut back a bit (IMO) - do 3 lots of 2k maybe? then increase over time.

Runners knee?
Knee pain is a tricky one to diagnose. And is often a manifestation from a problem elsewhere. What is your running gait like? Heel striker or mid-foot?
Do you have a stretching routine away from exercise sessions?

4 weeks of running is not enough to introduce a session of interval training. Even the best runners only do 1 session of very hard speedwork a week.

You need to have been running more than 10 k total per week for 4 weeks to introduce speedwork into a training routine.

Try stopping the speed session and doing 1 of your 5k's at a varied pace aka fartlek. Turn your spped session into a gentle recovary run. Re-evaluate after 1 more month.

PLEASE SLOW DOWN, hurting yourself isn't worth it. Running is far harder on your legs than cycling, i used to run marathons but due to the fact i thought i was a 'girl' if i didn't run through pain, i now only run 1/2 hour at a time.

Take a couple of weeks off and then build up VERY slowly.

Shin splints?

I'd hazard that perhaps you need better shoes. Consider gait analasys at a running shop.

Also, cool down properly.

how old are you? - your age will affect how quickly you adapt to exercise.

don't run as far, and do it slower.

try 1k - seriously - and see how you feel over the next 2 days.

increase your distance/speed as your body allows you to.

Anyway, 2stone in 11weeks! - bloody hell that's impressive!

I had similar and was advised that the thin muscle sheet was not supple enough. Are you supple or stiff as a board like me? Good quality calf stretching and that one where you look like you're having a poo on an invisible toilet were prescribed by the physio and so far so good.

Pain in your calf is probably a pulled muscle, rest up, take a week off the running and then see how it's doing. Just below the knee pain could* be ITBS (Iliotibial Band Syndrome) maybe overuse irritation. a rest and shorter distances will help. think about gait analysis, but RICE is your best bet I reckon.

shorter distances, slower. Rest.

*I ain't no doctor.

Possibly shin splints, try running off-road.

Read the book born to run. It might go some way to helping. Or look for the thread on here about barefoot running. You may well be doing too much too early too fast

barefoot running is not the be all and end all of curing running problems. In fact I'd go as far to say you'll end up ****ed if you try it right now...

Sorry, I may well be confused here - are you saying that you ONLY run on a treadmill?

CG running off road is pretty hard if you're just starting running. Your legs need time to TTFU (if you see what i mean) it's uneven , your ankles knees, hips all need to be very flexible and used to the surface, it's softer for sure, but in lots of ways it's harder than tread-mils (which are pretty cushioned) or even the road (harder surface, but even)

I'd never recommend a new runner to go straight off road, it's a recipe for injury.

nick - yes I appreciate what you are saying. My concern is (I ran for 10 years up to off-road marathon distance) with running on a treadmill, the gait may well not be a natural one. One has to concentrate obviously but it's easy to run in an unrelaxed way.

Obviously follows that shoulders and arms may not be relaxed either. Plus there is the added distraction of MTV with its scantily dressed ladies too!

Aye, CG. Good point.

treadmills are weird to run on...

I should point out that my views stem from getting serious shin splints that took ages to clear. Running 6 days a week, sometimes twice a day, did not help. 😳

I switched to off-road, got sucked into stupid off-road events then eventually had to give up cos my body was knackered due to a pre-existing non-running problem.

Mtb is my running substitute!!

I get leg pain when I run on the treadmill. Never had a serious problem when running outside, whether it be road, grass, or fell.

Build up slowly running outside. Make sure you have a day of doing something else in between each run to start.

New trainers may also help.

Barefoot running ifdone properly (in yhos case slowly) is probably more likely to provide a natural solution. If you can cope there is another book i have been recommended called the lore of running. I havent read it ye.i reckon it'll take a year or more to read!

The 'lore of running' is a classic, doesnt throw up any surprises though, it just covers the whole spectrum of running, very well!

so in the past 11 weeks ive dropped over 2 stone by doing lots of none impact cardio and weights, although i will do a bit of running if its part of a circuit that im doing.

so i feel great and have loads more energy and thought i would have a go at starting to run again.

over the last 4 weeks ive built up to doing a 5 k run on a treadmill 2 times a week and also 1 interval session too

congrats on the [i]over[/i] 2 stone that is (non patronising) impressive
you don't say what you weigh but 3 sessions a week on a treadmill plus what ever else is going to put a lot of pressure on muscles and joints if starting from scratch - i'd ask someone at the gym to look at your program (you don't usually need a personal trainer for this - just ask whoever did yr induction or the person bored at the desk) unless you are intent on running in some sort of race and are going to accept long term damage as part of the price try swopping the treadmill for cycling or striding or rowing - using a heart rate monitor or the machines energy output (usually joules) to maintain similar work levels and good luck

I find cycling far more problematic for my knees, I can run all day and my shins/knees are ok, but when I finish a ride my knees often ache. Horses for courses I guess.

Raise your saddle?

You're maybe right, but it's always happened whatever height my saddle is, I don't use spuds either.

Just out of interest OP - did you have a fasciotomy?

How well did the operation go?

It doesnt sound like runners knee or ITB imo. Both of those would exhibit pain around a specific area and are easier to diagnose.
Sounds more like shin splints which is a typical problem when building mileage.
Take a bit of time off and then resume slowly but get off the treadmill! run on grass if possible.

Theres a lot of rubbish talked on this thread as well. for example

Even the best runners only do 1 session of very hard speedwork a week.

Barefoot running ifdone properly (in yhos case slowly) is probably more likely to provide a natural solution

Ignore this and just build slowly on grass and make sure your shoes are reasonably good and have good cushioning. Just keep your lower legs supple and stretch post run, ice them if they are tender and take anti inflammatories if you can. Dont continue to run through this pain as it will only get worse and may even fracture.

Excuse me Mr Sufer, I am a former top level county standard runner, and RAF cross country champion, with a marathon pb of 2:35. I have trained regularly with some of the countries best distance distance runners including steeplechase and 400m hurdles olympians, therefore I would class myself as quite knowledgeable on the subject of running.

What I said was not rubbish, please define why it was rubbish What are your credentials for stating that my point was rubbish!

Oh yeah forgot to add, UKA level 2 coach as well! Although to be honest this has lapsed, as I grew tired of a lifetime of being force fed running, I could not be bothered to keep it current!

Its a shame Surfer is so quick to dismiss other peoples advice because his final paragraph is very good advice.

read the books and do a google search for the harvard bare foot running website. Keep an open mind and i swear it'll change your life IF you are patient and keep things slow, building up over a long period of time.

You don't need to be blowing chunks for a run to be effective!

Can I suggest also going to see a good quality physio who can identify the problem and help you to recover.

I ended up with pain just below the knee and it turned out to be a Pes Anserine Bursa by going to hard after a short lay off once. Have a rest then ease in slowly and can I suggest running on flat grass to ease the impact.

Agree about last paragraph, the trouble is that people read Runners world every month, and then think they are experts!

Top level distance runners often run several interval sessions per week even 5 and 10k runners. Shorter distance runners often do little but interval running as its proven as the most time and effort efficient way to improve performance.
I can point to almost every top UK distance runner and I will gurantee a large portion of their weekly training is either interval or multi tiered/fartlek based. From Gordon Pirie to Seb Coe. Coe's training was so interval based he barely counted his steady running. I'm surprised that if you are a coach you didnt already know this.
I've never read runnersworld so I cant comment my experience is similar to yours and based on around 25 years of running, also against some top runners.
Barefoot running is still a fad and until I see top level athletes using the method consitently then I stand by what I said.

RAF cross country champion

What year where you RAF champion?

definetely Shin splints

Im not getting into an internet forum slanging match, I have better things to do. I was purely trying to respond to the OP's question. Obvioulsy he should have just emailed you directly, being the expert who likes to dismiss other peoples advice and comments.

Im going out for a run 🙂

Still interested in when you were RAF champion?

I lived in Lincoln for 2 years and ran against a lot of RAF guys, always jealous that they got loads of time off to train and compete.

Surfer have you read any of the stuff i mentioned?

Btw i have nothing for or against interval running. Other than to mention one of the athletes mentioned in born to run seemed to use it very effectivly.

No, i've dismissed it and although myself and Deep river can discuss our differences, (I didnt mean to dismiss his comments out of hand as I did)
Yours on the other hand are snake oil as far as I am concerned and I haven't read much about astrology either but I would put that in the same category

I apologise for coming across so rude but this is poor advice on any level and the op needs good advice. If you want to run barefoot then great but its bordering on reckless to advocate this to an inexperienced runner in my opinion.

That's interesting you say that to DrDomRob surfer as I see your comments,

"Ignore this and just build slowly on grass and make sure your shoes are reasonably good and have good cushioning...and stretch post run, ice them if they are tender and take anti inflammatories if you can..

can be very damaging. Also suggesting the Op follows training like "top distance runners" when he is only a few weeks in to running is hardly helpful, especially as the query was about an injury.

Whenever a question regarding running is posted on STW you do have a habit of saying all other advice is crap except yours, as you know best, but at the same time suggest unreasonable and at times old-fashioned suggestions.
I certainly hope you are still not coaching.

I did read that some trainers are getting to cushioned and causing problems? Whats the collective thoughts about that? iirc it might of been in Runners world 😳 But I was reading it in Tesco while browsing the mags 😀

Surfer as roper says suggesting someone who at best is returning from 8 year
s off trains like an olympic athlete is daft. until you are willing to look at the evidence i have nothing more to say to you.

My shins hurt so bad when I run, they just feel so tight and I also get little lumps on both shins like blood vessels or tendons. Nasty, I tried lots of stretching and some new trainers but i've decided to give up for now!

Surfer as roper says suggesting someone who at best is returning from 8 year
s off trains like an olympic athlete is daft. until you are willing to look at the evidence i have nothing more to say to you

Bit of a reading fail. I didnt recommend any training other than the final part of my original post, certainly not advocating hard training. Can you point to where I did?
I responded to another post about the number of interval sessions top athletes complete and the regularity not that the op should be doing interval sessions at all.
Roper if you have anything to add to the op then go ahead, stalking me doesnt contribute much.

I certainly hope you are still not coaching.

When did I ever coach? or are you making this up as you go along Roper?

Whenever a question regarding running is posted on STW you do have a habit of saying all other advice is crap except yours, as you know best, but at the same time suggest unreasonable and at times old-fashioned suggestions.

I didnt say it was all crap but that pretty much summarises my position with regard to barefoot running. As a student of running I am more than interested in entering a debate about running as it is a passion of mine. To such an extent I want the op to be running pain free etc rather than using him as a test case for evangelist like yourself.

When did I ever coach? or are you making this up as you go along Roper?

I understand you want the OP to be running pain free, I'd imagine most of the other posters you dismissed also want the same, which is why they have given a good selection advice. However your own advice was not the best and could cause the OP more problems.

....rather than using him as a test case for evangelist like yourself.

One of you lot dropped this
[img] [/img]

+1 for giving the barefoot a go. Hey what have you got to loose? Somemore reading for you, the barefoot book - kindof explains about footware and why you don't really need it etc. Enjoy 🙂

Hey what have you got to loose?

Skin?

Especially as you were so vague with details.

Not my intention to be vague I'm just someone who has run at club level for around 20 + years I have no coaching qualifications or background at all. Not that that disqualifies me from having an opinion.
You seem more concerned with things I have said on other threads and your claim

Also suggesting the Op follows training like "top distance runners" when he is only a few weeks in to running is hardly helpful, especially as the query was about an injury.

Hello everyone and thanks for the replies so far, quite a lot to read through.

Anyway , basically as im down the falklands with the RAF at the moment i thought i would get fit and drop some weight, the gym is excellent and the treadmills are brilliant.

Its too windy/raining/snowing outside and the ground is quite rocky/rough which is why im sticking to the tredmill.

about 2002time i had an operation on both of my lower legs for compartment syndrome(fasciotomies) as i was getting major pain in my legs due to marching about etc in my boots.

since the op ive moved camps a fair bit and as such never really had good advice from any one particular physio which has eneded up with me not being able to run properly for years.

initally i thought the op hadnt worked as i was still getting pain in my lower legs, but it seesm this was down to me being a fatty (i was 19 stone)

since ive been down here ive slowly progressed in the last 11 weeks from running for 10 mins upto now being able to do 5k runs in 33 mins(not great but its a start)i run/jog at between 9kph and 10.5 kph

the interval training i do is not fast at all it goes like this ...2 ins at 10kph, 2mins at 8kph, 2mins at 10.2 kph etc etc upto 2 mins at 12kph.

im also doing a lot of non impact cardio to for example swimming, cross trainer and bike.

im also doing a good strecth routine for my legs too.

the pain im getting is literally right below my knee at the top of the bone at the front of my leg,it doesnt feel like bone pain though? i get it more on my right leg than the left.

my left calf always cramps when im running and ive noticed that if i look down at my feet when they strike the floor my left foot splays out more than the right??

any ideas??

cheers

steve

holy tits! after only a few weeks training you can run 5k in 33mins, and you weigh 17 stone?

i stand by my earlier suggestion that you could try slowing down a bit...

it's possible that your lower legs are the 'weak link' in your running fitness, and as such it will be up to them how quickly you progress.

right now they're telling to take it easy, and the numbers agree with them (17stone, 4 weeks training, 5k, 33mins)

(+ there's a weird phenomenon whereby running at Xkph on a treadmill is harder than Xkph out in the real world, i nearly die after a few minutes at 13kph on a treadmill, but a 45min 10k outside is pretty easy)

i thought that was a bit slow to be fair!!!

oh and im 16 stone 11 now

[i]The iliotibial band is a fibrous band of tissue that runs down the outer thigh, from the hip (ilium) to just below the knee, inserting into the shinbone (tibia). It helps provide stability to the outer side of the knee joint, particularly during running. Iliotibial band syndrome is irritation / inflammation of the iliotibial band (the inflammation is usually not visible) that causes lateral knee pain. This condition is most common in long-distance runners and cyclists. Though the pain usually occurs on the outer side of the knee just above the knee joint, it may also occur over the entire iliotibial band or just below the knee, where the iliotibial band inserts into the shinbone (tibia). The pain usually sets in slowly, often after running for several minutes. It is relieved by resting and aggravated by activity - running, cycling, or walking. [/i]

depite what others have suggested, I still think it's ITBS, but hey, I'm no coach, and I don't run barefoot, and I have no coaching quals or whatever, so you know... feel free to ignore all this.

Oh, and slow up a bit on the treadmill. In fact, stop timing yourself all together, just do nice steady runs, lope along, y'know? there's plenty of time for PB's and clock chasing, just take it easy.

I've only flicked through the thread, but have in the past had similar problems to you.

My opinion is in line with several others here, that you are trying to run too fast. Run slower for longer until you have got a good few hundred miles under your belt, then see how upping the speed goes.

I agree with what the previous two guys said. Slow down! Go for a time period rather than distance. I would stop the interval training until you are pain free. I still think going natural a the same time might help in the long run, but only if you listen to your body when it says its time to slow down or stop.

I've been runing with a guy from the office who.is fit but new to running for the last few months on and off,we've only just got the pace down to 30min 5km's. I've been judging the pace by talking to him during the runs if he can't run and talk we'fe going to fast.

It's kept him injury free and he is still motivated to do it,although he also doesn't believe in th bare foot philosophy - but i think that's more to do with the cost! The vibram stuff is stupi expensive,i am sure there are other alternatives but can't point you in an direction i'm afraid. What do you run in now? If its th good old silvershadows then you're pretty much running barefoot anyway.

45min 10k outside is pretty easy

that's a pace of a sub 7 minute mile (over 6.5 miles) which is not all that easy.

[shrugs/] It be pee'd off if any of my 10k runs were over 45mins.

You are Surf Mat and I claim my £5

thanks for all the replies.

i still think that at 9kph im barley breaking out of a jog .!!

you should see some of the army lads running they are running at speeds of 13- 14 kph !!

cheers

steve

When you're running, the force going through your landing leg is up to three times your bodyweight. It takes your legs a bit of time to get used to this, hence people saying 'start slowly'.

There are mixed opinions in the scientific literature about technique, shoes and where on your foot to land and it gets very polarised and squabbly, just like this thread!

Be sensible and listen to your legs. If it hurts, slow down. If it still hurts, stop for a while, start slower and build up steadily.

Oh, and even when it's rocky, cold and windy, it's beautiful outside. Go and get stuck in!