We had overpayments of Tax Credits in 13-14 and 14-15. A further mistaken overpayment was made April 2017. We weren't told of the overpayments until May 2016, and we noticed the mistake on 2017 ourselves.
We're in an agreement paying back HMRC the overpayment, since October 2017. It took until October 2017 for HMRC to agree with their own figures (!), As they have written to us each summer since 2014 with totally different figures from reality or the previous year (and the debt only ever goes up...).
Today I receive letter from debt collection company, demanding the accidental April 2017 payment back.
I've spent over an hour on phone to-ing and fro-ing as HMRC will not speak to me about debt collection or direct to debt company and debt company won't speak to HMRC....
I'm p*ss*d off. I'm paying my (unexpected and delayed explanation debts off) and to my knowledge all is OK. HMRC have sent all my and my families personal data (names, dob, address, contact info etc) to private company needlessly. The private company have just let slip a few folk this morning are on same complaint - and private company are suggesting HMRC have made a mistake...
I'm happy to pay my tax and my tax credit overpayments. I'm not happy with HMRC's behaviour.
Apart from drinking excessive water and finding out where the HMRC shoes are kept, what can or should I do?
Send them the letter template from
That should get the debt people off your back and puts the onus back on HMRC to sort their act out.
Complain.
Get your facts together, complete timeline with an honest description of where each side could have done better. Point out how much time, effort, stress and expense this has cost you. Request that they confirm that recovery action will cease until the complaint is fully resolved.
Summarise with what you expect them to do next, including a 'reasonable' time to pay proposal from you.
will take time, had much same problem with varying figures, as above I'd complain and get your MP involved pronto as well.
Sadly, you're not going to be able to much about it via 'Data Protection' - these sleazy debt collection firms tip-toe close to the line of legality, but rarely over it (they lie through their teeth though).
You're understandability angry, the wording they use, especially in in initial contacts is very aggressive, it does tend to tone down the longer you ignore it, almost to a plead in the end. Things they cannot do:
Damage your credit rating (as is was never a credit agreement) unless they take you to court first.
Send 'Bailiffs' unless they take you to court first.
Although they'll usually warn as much, hiding behind terms like "may" and "possibly".
Personally, IF you acknowledge you owe the money, and IF you want an easy life - negotiate a repayment schedule - basically offer them a pittance a month and they'll accept it. Do all of this via post - never speak to them on the phone, never offer them any financial information to 'prove' you can afford anything - give them nothing.
If you don't want to pay - then ignore them until you see a letter from a court, not a letter from them that looks official, but something directly from a court, then offer them a pittance a month.
If the repayments your making with HMRC now are affordable, speak to them, say "I've agreed to pay you £x a month, but now, via a 3rd party you want a repayment for 2017 - I can't afford any more - I'd like to reduce the payment I make to you by £x and in turn, pay the 3rd party that amount" It's daft, but that how it works sometimes.
The debt recovery industry is crooked and messy to say the least.
@P-jay - the point is we *have* repayment plan and we *have* done everything we think 'right'.
HMRC still then refer us accidently.
<p style="padding: 0px; border: 0px; outline: 0px; font-size: 12px; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: initial; background-position: initial; background-size: initial; background-repeat: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; line-height: 1.2em; color: #444444; margin: 1rem 0px !important;">Send them the letter template from</p>
<p style="padding: 0px; border: 0px; outline: 0px; font-size: 12px; vertical-align: baseline; background-image: initial; background-position: initial; background-size: initial; background-repeat: initial; background-attachment: initial; background-origin: initial; background-clip: initial; line-height: 1.2em; color: #444444; margin: 1rem 0px !important;">https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/sampleletters/Pages/Complaining-to-debt-collection-agencies-that-you-do-not-owe-the-debt-%28sole-name%29.aspx
/a></p>
Except OP does owe the debt. The problem is that the debt collectors have been called in while there is an agreed payment plan in place. That the left hand doesn't know what the right is doing is commonplace. We went through endless updates to our tax credits - every time the fixed one thing on the claim, they broke another.
Unless the debt has been sold, they are simply doing the leg work for HMRC, you still owe HMRC and HMRC can fix all of this. Put in a complaint to them as above and ignore the debt collectors until and unless you receive court proceedings.
Absolutely - I know it's daft, but in this case it seems HMRC are treating the 2017 over-payment as a separate debt to the original debt. It's not right, but it's how it works sometimes.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that's there a right way, and a wrong way - you've done the right thing.
But also there's an easy way and a hard way - the hard way would be to a) get the debt recovery firm to return the debt to HMRC - it would be easier to spit the atom with a hammer and chisel and then get HMRC to re-draw the repayment agreement, the easy way would be to just pay them a bit each.
As above, it's daft to the point of stupid - but sometimes its better to take the easy option.
HMRC should only supply personal data to the debt collection company that is needed for the debt collection company to do their job. If you think that they have failed and are ignoring you, then your next port of call is the ICO (Information Commissioners Office) ico.org.uk. The role of the ICO is to ensure that data protection for personal data is taken seriously.
As the debt is against you, they should have not passed any personal data to the debt collection agency of children as that information should not be needed to collect the debt. You can make a subject access request to the debt collection agency, which will cost you about £10 and they have 40 days to reply. You can ask them for ALL data held by them on you. You can be nice and tell them what data you are after. You can also ask them where they got the data.
The ICO has big powers and has been known to use them.
In addition. Book a surgery appointment with your MP (and MSP?). It’s half term so they are all off at Westminster too