[Closed] Another "what car" thread: Golf, Astra or Focus

Not as busted as you are by BMW front wheel drive man ..

Mike - the Scirocco is pretty much the same car as the TT I believe (same chassis/engine etc but slightly detuned). But yeah, as you, the TT is preferable - got mine for another year then, when the lease is up, it is sensible family car time.

I like those Ford Focus RS chav chariot efforts, but I only ever see used ones in Bug Puss Orange or Toxic Waste Green (I'm sure Ford have different names for these colours).

If I could find one in white I'd be very tempted indeed. To hell with my credibility, I never had any to begin with!

Inbred456 - Member
The JD Power survey is filled in by middle aged men who buy cars as status symbols. I've just spent a shed load of cash on this car and its simply perfect in every way.

You could also argue it's filled in by loads of people who want to justify why they bought a cheaper car/less prestigious brand, but big it up to make themselves feel better/make their cars look good. Kinda like those people who buy an On-One Inbred and go around saying there's no way a Cotic Soul is worth 3 times more.

There's also the element of can someone who is in a position to buy a Lexus or a Merc be arsed to fill in a survey. It'd be interesting to know how many responses for each manufacturer they had. Surely Ford/Vauxhall owners will outnumber Lexus/Mercedes owners simply because they shift more units. But if only 50 Lexus owners respond but they all respond glowingly, but 10000 Ford owners respond across the spectrum of satisfaction, surely that will skew the results?

If I had bought a Lexus and found it crap, then had a chance to make my voice heard I wouldn't pretend to be happy just to justify buying it!

So a survey based on actual claims compared to an owner stating an opinion about the car they have bought is some how inferior or less accurate. If I had just spent say 25 k on an A3 and it's been poor. Would I then slag it off in a customer survey thus indicating what a plonker I have been or say nothing, hope everybody else said nothing and then sell the thing.
Anyone using WD is a plonker because the data is flawed or because they don't pay out?
Don't the Top Gear lot use the JDP Survey.

I'll leave you lot to argue over your JD vs WD stats ... in the meantime, I'll be booking some test drives.

TVM to the wisdom of the masses.

Mastiles, yeah, I know they're based on the same platform/engine, but the Scirocco isn't as nice to look at (personal opinion), it's less practical to get a bike in/out of and is also slightly slower off the mark and mid-range. Scirocco is supposed to be more involving to drive than the TT, but the TT handles well enough for me (track day capabilities aren't high on my list of priorities for a road car). It just ticked more boxes for me/my requirements than the Scirocco, Golf and BMWs I looked at.

What kind of people can be bothered with surveys?

I'm more likely to complete a survey if I've had exceptionally good service or if I'm pi$$ed off about something. If I was just satisfied, I'd probably not bother.

Mastiles, yeah, I know they're based on the same platform/engine, but the Scirocco isn't as nice to look at (personal opinion), it's less practical to get a bike in/out of and is also slightly slower off the mark and mid-range. Scirocco is supposed to be more involving to drive than the TT, but the TT handles well enough for me (track day capabilities aren't high on my list of priorities for a road car). It just ticked more boxes for me/my requirements than the Scirocco, Golf and BMWs I looked at.

I only use WD ,JDP , What Car, Parker's etc to get an overview and a feel for how reliable a car is. I don't only use one site. Then armed with as much info as I can get, I'll choose some models to test drive and take it from there. Remember to take into account the service intervals and cost, tyre costs and tax etc. My Golf has never got anywhere near it's maximum mileage on its variable service schedule, 9000 to 20000 miles, service light always comes on at approx 9050 miles.

Having said all of the above the best car as a family we have had was a Bog Rover 216si s reg. Universally slated in every survey it's been in!

Inbred, you might want to check your service indicator is set to the variable mode rather than fixed mode if your light comes on close to 9000 every time. But it could just be that the majority of your driving is urban/extra urban rather than motorway, which will degrade the oil quicker so the engine thinks it needs a service sooner.

Of course, neither might be the case - just trying to be helpful.

Do people really care that much about what they, or other people drive?
How strange. I've found that friends who moan about my car when they're being given a lift get 2 options -
1. stop talking
2. get out and walk if you don't like it

My dad's got a 55 Zetec Focus, seems very nice, well enough appointed for the price and drives well, and it's never done anything but work. Decent paint quality and suchlike. Nothing very inspiring about it but it's a nice place to be. Bit of a dad car and inevitably it's silver like every other focus in the world so he has to try 6 or 7 cars in Tescos before he finds his own.

Mike have now switched it to fixed service and change oil every 9000 using the standard PD oil VAG recommends not the mega expensive variable service stuff at 10 quid a litre +vat.

My best experience of owning VAG cars was during the 80's and early 90's.I would say their golden era. Audi 80 sport(red)loved that car, MK II Scirocco with the smoked lights. Audi coupe 5cyl. They were light years then ahead of Ford and Vauxhall. Now I guess the other manufacturers have caught up. Still think the 1.9TDI engine is one of the all time great engines.

I've got a service next week - on 27k miles so I reckon it could be pricey on the stealth bomber.

Inbred - the 1.9TDI unit was briefly ahead but the froggies and GM soon overtook it with smoother engines that had much wider powerbands. The 150PD in the VWs may have been pokey but it was VERY agricultural. It was also put in the mk4 Golf and the Bora - both of which were the worst handling cars of their era. The Focus handles 3434534535 times better which is why VW nicked the Ford chassis engineer and made a much better job of the mk5 Golf.

Latest TT is much better than the old one - I quite like it whereas the old one made me angry.

All except the RS are left for dust by the stealth bomber though 😉

Honda Civic CTDI company car: great engine, not terribly well put together, numerous niggles and initially appalling dealer, but improving recently
Mazda 3 petrol: reliable though a bit bland

All except the RS are left for dust by the stealth bomber though

What pray tell is the stealth bomber? Is it matt black? I have to agree the Golf MK4 was/is a terrible handling car, the Focus probably the best handling front wheel drive standard production car I have driven.

Self confessed Honda mentalist here , love the 2.2 diesel , economy and power without tractor like vag engines
I hate the focus interior and engines , vauxhalls not bad , good roadholding , damping. Suspention is the civic weak link , it's quite rough , ESP with 17 inch alloys , got a 2.2 es with the glass roof , wouldn't buy without it ever again !!

Hth

What pray tell is the stealth bomber?

Black 335d Touring but SE spec so it looks pretty subtle (as intended). I like not much show but plenty of go. I can't stand the other way around. Vast sunroof is probably the nicest extra on it.

MF - I have no qualms about nice cars - they usually go faster, are comfier, they handle better, are often safer, etc. But a "designer" pram/buggy does no more (in fact often less) than others yet is bought to look good. The baby doesn't benefit at all as they all comply with the same safety standards.

I still say go for the Golf to the OP - I've had three (mk2 Gti, mk3 GTi 16v, mk4 R32) and loved them all. My immediate family has had a total of 11 over the years.

My final choices were 123D M-Sport -v- TT S-Line SE. In the end I chose the TT cos it swallows a bike easier.

Always liked the 3 series Touring right back to my favourite the E21. Bit small for my needs, Lab and luggage. Never took to the 5 series as much although a great car by all accounts. When I was considerably younger I had the chance to buy a E21 325i Touring with a Hartge conversion. Bottled it and have regretted it ever since, it went like stink and would wipe the floor with most things back then.

I tell you what, if Honda made a car that looked good and handled well, they would completely clean up the hatchback market because their engines are second to none. Furthermore, their customer service is fantastic. I took my Accord in for a service, it came back washed and valeted, fully serviced for 150 quid, they gave me proper coffee while I was waiting for them to sort out the paperwork and the woman on reception (who was an extremely sexy middle aged bombshell), noticed that my wife was sat outside in her car so she went out and brought her inside, gave her a drink and then chatted away to her about Avon stuff while we waited.

I'm sold and next time I get a new car (which will be a while because my car is superb), I'll be getting another Accord. Powerful, very well built, BMW quality, extremely comfortable and great on the motorway, looks a bit like a nice Merc. As I say, it's only problem is it looks old fashioned and handles like a barge.

Maybe the OP should ask Paul the psychic octopus....

Drove a Focus auto on holiday a couple of weeks ago, 2 days 6oomls. Needed some massage to remove stiff/sezed neck/shoulders. Confirmed something I already knew about the Focus. I hate `em, horrible cars.

Wife has asked her hire company not to send her any Vaux cars(as have others according to them). Not driven any recently so cannot commet.

VW for me.

Bit like a bike, pair of shoes, dress, jeans etc. Try before you(she)buys.

I'd avoid VW and go for a Honda Civic.

Golfs look 'nice' but I was completely unimpressed with the MKV GT TDI that I had. The paint seem to flake off, the door card fabric pilled too easily.

Awful dull and monotonous dash etc. Plus there are the reliability issues and the VW dealers to have to deal with.

On the mkIV- agree. It wasn't a great drive (I drove 3 versions of the mkIV)

MF - I have no qualms about nice cars - they usually go faster, are comfier, they handle better, are often safer, etc. But a "designer" pram/buggy does no more (in fact often less) than others yet is bought to look good. The baby doesn't benefit at all as they all comply with the same safety standards.

There are a million variables and in-depth questions to be asked before anyone can reach a good, solid conclusion. But that takes time so:

Golf V diesel DSG everytime. I agree with Loddrick.

We have astras and focuses as hire cars at work. I nevet ever want the astras i always want the focuses ( estate or hatch) the astra us bogging inside, horrible to drive and the diesel is gutless. The focis interior is not the best but is better and the tdci engine is ace. Ive driven these cars up amd down the country the astra is flipping awful. I have had a mkiv golf hire car albeit a manual and i was underwhelmed i would sooner get the focus personally. Btw i own an octy vrs and a vw polo so i am not a ford man.

Back in Feb I was faced with a similar choice. £8 to £9k to spend on a mid sized hatch.
Astra - hatch looks too narrow to easily get a bike into.
Golf - if I want to pay a £1 - £1.5k premium for the same car or take a hit on mileage or spec.
Civic - as in Golf.
Focus ticked the boxes for me. £8.2k for an 07 2.0 tdci ghia with 27k.
I've not had it long bu not problems so far and it does everything I want. Handles well. Quick when I want it to be and 48 to 51 mpg. Oh, and easy to get a bike into 🙂

Have owned both Focus and Golf Diesel variants from this era. Not sure on auto boxes but I think Fords TDCi engine is superior in most ways to the old TDi VW engine (quieter, smoother etc)

Also disagree with the build quality thing - maybe 5-7 years ago Ford were lagging behind VW in terms of build quaility but not anymore - really solidly built car. Also the 'control blade' suspension set up on the Focus is great - they just handle a lot better than the Golf IMO.

I own a Golf at the min but am seriously considering moving back to a 2.0 TDCi Focus for my next car, you just get so much more bang for your buck.

Golf overrated IMO

Sorry meant the E30 model not the E21.

out of interest, have you looked at the other options? C30 would be nice if you don't need the space, the c4 is an interesting option as is the 147..

MF - you have just crossed a line with that last post, a line that you have to be pretty messed up to cross. What is it with you? Let's face it, you're a geek that thinks he's made it and bang on and on about money. We don't care and the fact some have a much nicer car than you clearly grates your nerdy self worth. I seriously advise
you never to make such insulting statements about how we bring up our boy again. After all, your poor offspring have to try and fit in daddys pretend sports car rather than a proper vehicle. So nicely hypocritical too.

Got to agree with Matt on this one. Reckon you owe an apology m_f...

Behave you lot! Its a difference of opinion (from both sides) thats allowed. No one offended someones family honour (child).

FFS, are you lot Sicilian today? 🙄

Ahem, if I may just intervene (on my own ****ing post) between those in the blue corner and those in the red corner ...

... Got a very good deal on a mint 07 Focus (Zetec + climate pack) with only 25000 miles this afternoon. Missus is happy, which is important seeing as it's "essentially" going to be her car.

Also had a good time at ante-natal class today - all in all: happy days 😀

MF - you have just crossed a line with that last post, a line that you have to be pretty messed up to cross. What is it with you? Let's face it, you're a geek that thinks he's made it and bang on and on about money. We don't care and the fact some have a much nicer car than you clearly grates your nerdy self worth. I seriously advise
you never to make such insulting statements about how we bring up our boy again. After all, your poor offspring have to try and fit in daddys pretend sports car rather than a proper vehicle. So nicely hypocritical too.

Ooh, this got ugly over the weekend!

yeeesss...

I'm appalled at you MF - did you study research into car seats? Did you find out that rear facing 2nd seats (over 1 year) are 5 times safer than front facing ones? Have you got rear facing seats for yours? Did you import one from overseas because they don't sell them here yet? Did you speak to loads of researchers? Did you wonder why they aren't sold (properly) in the UK yet?

A £1000 buggy is NO safer than a £200 one - they all comply with the same safety/quality standards unlike car seats. You are spending money on a label with no benefit to the kid(s). We spend money where it matters - on stuff you can't show off in the local park or high street.

Your accusation is utterly ****ed up. Having lost a little one at 37.5 weeks (true knot tightened in his cord as he grew and that was it) you'd struggle to find a more protective/safety minded parent so do NOT suggest anything like you did above again.

As for getting on - yes we did but the sort of post you made makes me seriously doubt whether you are worth talking to.

Hey - might sound crazy but you could do a thing called apologise - because I seriously doubt you meant what you posted. If you did, then there's no help for you.

Civic is excellent (I'm very happy with mine) but it's only recently they've offered a "proper" auto - before it was Honda's much-derided i-Shift.

Not sure I'd want to run a DSG Golf out of warranty - lots of potential for expensive problems.

Of the Astra and Focus in auto forms, I'd take the Astra any day.

Mat - I apologise if I offended you. I don't apologise for what I said - I stand by it 100%.

The reason I kicked out at you was your continued posts on that other thread about people buying buggies just to show off their wealth which was (IMO) utter nonsense - every person who buys a buggy has their own reasons yet you insisted they were just buying them (Bugaboos in particular IIRC) simply to impress people and not because they have any kind of benefit to them, their child, their circumstances etc etc etc. And this coming from the person who is so proud of his car seemed somewhat like double-standards - just consider that other people may have gone through as much in the way of research as you clearly have done but simply come to another conclusion.

And I am genuinely sorry to hear you have lost a child - no-one deserves that.

you insisted they were just buying them (Bugaboos in particular IIRC) simply to impress people

Yeah, Mat does have a tendency to be dismissive of other people that way which is a little annoying. Since according to him I'd be some kind of image obsessed poseur which is about as far wrong as you can be!

Likewise MF, you do have a tendency to be insensitive (which you appear to acknowledge).

I am not whiter than white - I totally agree!

I was just trying (somewhat insensitively it appears) to illustrate that Matt was being very unfair in his blanket accusation that people buy expensive pushchairs just to impress people (especially when he has such an expensive car which, it could be argued, is a similar trinket to show one's wealth).

Ahh well, best move on.