MegaSack DRAW - This year's winner is user - rgwb
We will be in touch
I know STWers love "what car?" threads so here goes:
I want a decent, comfy, quick(ish), well-equipped, spacious, reliable and economical estate do do 20-25k p.a. on mainly country roads so it needs to handle well too.
I've only got £2-2.5k to spend so the RS6 Avant is crossed off already. 🙁 I guess I'm looking at 02-05 plated high-milers
In days of yore diesels seemed to be the way to go for high miles but doing research recently it seems that modern common rail jobs don't seem as reliable as petrols in the long haul. Ijectors, clutches and flywheels seem to give trouble.
Been looking at:
Mondeo 130 TDCi Ghia X - great car if someone else is paying for the clutch and injectors. Maybe an auto?
Mazda6 TS2 2.0 TD - On the early cars, engines blow up. Late ones, engines blow up. Find one right in the middle you're OK?
Primera 2.2 Di/DCi - All the toys and cam chain but DCis eat turbos and try finding one.
Then I started looking at LPG cars and found some nice Volvo V70s but the fuel figures seem really poor for LPG (23mpg against 29mpg on petrol)so even with the cheap cost of fuel it doesn't beat a similar diesel and you have the inconvenience of finding a filling place. I saw a LOVELY A8 4.2 Quattro LPG that I managed to resist purely coz you can't shut your dog in the boot - I checked with the RSPCA.
In true STW style I shall ignore all useful suggestions and even pour scorn on some well intentioned advice 😉
My 02 Mondeo estate (I think it's a Zetec and 2L) is on 150K, clutch is still fine and no injector failure. Only a scare with the fuel injection system, but twas only a broken wire, which was causing a fuel injection system failure message. Thankfully, only a £100 bill to strip the injection system and repair the wire, not the £900 they originally warned me it might be for a full replacement, phew.
Anyway, been very happy with it, no major malfunctions inside or out and will probably get another.
Passat all the way. 1.9TDi engine good for 200k without breaking wind.
M
ondeo
you'll be unlikely to get a CR engine for your budget i'd have thought.
I'd have been all over the Mondeo, except that it'd have been too big for my drive... so got a Focus instead which, incidentally, might belong on your list unless you need a vast estate not just a surprisingly big one. Both are boringly ubiquitous, for very good reasons.
you'll be unlikely to get a CR engine for your budget i'd have thought.
Plenty of common rails for around £2k - problem is finding one that'll last.
Passat/Octavia 1.9 TDi - good shout. I'll have a look.
Yeah Focus might do - they certainly handle well. Bit smaller but could live with it though is it just me or do you get fewer high spec ones available?
I'd choose a 406 2.0HDi estate or a Mondeo or a Passat. Diesel over petrol unless it's a sporty car.
I'd recommend somthing like a Chrysler or an old Daewoo or similar. Maybe a Toyota or Nissan. Don't get sucked into buying a mainstream brand, they're not what they're cracked up to be.
namastebuzz - Memberthough is it just me or do you get fewer high spec ones available?
Aye, I think that's true, and they tend to command a bit of a price premium over the competition.
I have a mazda 6 sport for sale at work atm! Its a 2.3petrol 4wd estate on a 03 plate ! Nice car drives nice and goes well i'll try and get some more details later if your interested ? Ohh and i'm in Aylesbury Bucks !
Mark - nice car but too heavy on the juice I'm afraid.
Hairychested - yeah flirted with the idea of the 406 110 HDi but it's a bit underpowered is it not?
A roadie mate from Berkshire has been driving his 110bhp one for yonks with bikes inside and outside and had no problems. It's relaxed and economical, very large inside too.
There's a 2.2 HDi too if you want more oomph but I believe it's more complicated than the 2.0 HDi.
BTW Mondeo or Passat will be faster, 406 cheaper to insure.
The mazda's that blow up share engines with the fords (IIRC?) as the 6 is basicaly a mondeo.
Yes the 2.2HDi has the dreaded DPF so I'd give that a swerve.
You get quite a bit for your cash with the Pugs if you get an Executive - nice one 🙂
The mazda's that blow up share engines with the fords (IIRC?) as the 6 is basicaly a mondeo.
Except for the engines - they are mazda's own - whereas ford use Peugeot for the 1.6, Renault for the 2.2 - the 2.0 is their own.
I know this will be ignored but what about MG/Rover ZT-T/75? some with the BMW engines, some with the hyper reliable L-series with 130bhp
All the bells and whistles and dirt cheap.
Rover 75 is lovely too, smaller though.
I had a 52 plate mondeo est TDCi. I bought it second hand 18 months old with 23000 miles. 50000 miles later it needed a new fuel pump and 3 injectors. Wasnt worth the repair so i traded it.Luckly trader didnt even start it, he just walked round it and offered me a very good price. Anyhow ill not be bothering uncle henry for a car again. On a more positive note the avensis i now have is excellent.
I know this will be ignored but what about MG/Rover ZT-T/75? some with the BMW engines, some with the hyper reliable L-series with 130bhp
Not at all - I had cast my eye over a few ZT-Ts but I expected anything linked with Rover to be filthy cheap, not just dirt cheap. BMW engines make sense though.
And will the Mazda 6 have the DCS problems? £800 fix.
Mondeo on my second. Very reliable, some problems with clutch (dual mass flywheel causes problems with many manufacturers)and injectors (most diesels inc BMW) reported but since it's the biggest selling fleet car not surprising. Cheap as chips to run.
Mazda 6 has a different engine but is still a very good estate, won estate of the year a few times.
Passat and Octavia good but so dull to drive.
I took my 307SW into the garage when a sheared (due to pothole) coil went through the tyre last week.
Mark (the mech bloke) seemed intent on telling me to get rid ASAP.
Im torn
on the one side:
307s came pretty close to the bottom when it comes to reliability
its got all the classic failures in it (dual mass flywheel, a million and one fuel pumps etc)
on the other, its a post facelift 307, which was SUPPOSED to have had all the probs sorted (though it didnt recover the brand number, so it faded out a year or 2 later)
Its comfy
its quick (enough for me, 110bhp)
its a cracking drive
its good looking (again, IMO)
for the money i would get for it, i could swap it for a 2.0L 206HDi SW, which i used to have (and loved)
its a "downgrade",is slower and smaller, but its to a simpler, more reliable car.
that or a high mileage Golf/Passat.
Incidently Marks list entailed:
Go for VAG, or OLD Peugeot (pre HDi)
Avoid like the plague, post 2000 french, Ford and Mazdas.
Interestingly, my bosses Mazda 6 has been faultless, though is now collapsing all at once at 100k
Recently had the same conundrum.
The only answer? Unsurprisingly, a VW Passat.
Yes for £2k you're looking at an older car Vs a Mondeo or Mazda, but if you're after the reliability, this is the trade off.
The thing is with Passats, and VW diesels in general, is that they will have problems in time, but most of them are easily fixable yourself. Not so with many other makes.
I recently bought an immaculate, 2 Previous owner with FSH and every receipt, T plate (so 1999 car) 110bhp TDi Passat Estate with 125k on the clock, for £1900. Now for the age of car that's not cheap, but you buy these cars on condition, and in many respects it was like new! It had recently had the suspension fully rebushed, the cambelt changed at 120k, new discs and pads all round. In many respects it was like buying a new car such was the condition!
Also, if you can, buy an older 110bhp model over the newer PD engines (100, 115 and 130). They're more reliable, and easier to fix if anything goes wrong. With the PD engines, when something goes wrong, it's often an injector (MEGA expensive on those engines). The older engines will also run on bio-diesel pretty well should you wish to further lower your fuel bills...
If you want any more advice, pointers or the like on buying Passats (should you go that way), please get in touch. I'm on my second now, and 3rd VW with a 1.9TDi in. I've got a fair knowledge of them, and I've also learnt heavily from those in the know on the VWAudi forum (very useful guys).
Our old Passat was eventually written off due to electrical senility at about 100000 miles, which was a real shame as it was otherwise going strong. But once it started setting the alarm off while driving, or unlocking and locking all the doors every 20 minutes, among other interesting foibles, we got a little tired of it. Come to think of it, every fault it ever had was electrical. Still it was a good car and we got a good price for the corpse.
but I expected anything linked with Rover to be filthy cheap, not just dirt cheap
That's just inverse badge snobbery though - 2K will get you a excellent condition car with 100k miles on the clock that will go and go. Low emissions, decent performance (great handling on the ZT-T) or you can get a VW with an extra 50-100K miles on the clock for the same cash.
That's just inverse badge snobbery though - 2K will get you a excellent condition car with 100k miles on the clock that will go and go. Low emissions, decent performance (great handling on the ZT-T) or you can get a VW with an extra 50-100K miles on the clock for the same cash.
Well it was more to do with the fact that there are no dealers/spare parts.
You've got me thinking though. I'm currently leafing through hordes of Passats but I'll have a look at ZT-Ts. The idea of great handling is appealing 🙂
Ah, you're thinking wrong - on a £2K car you avoid the dealers and go to the scrappers for spare parts. There is nothing particularly rare/complicated on the 75 platform (I'll admit I don't know about the bmw specific engine) so any old garage (or yourself tbf) can work on it.
Look out for an X-power ZT-T, had the factory fitted optional bhp increase to 130 as it doesn't effect your insurance as it's not classed as an aftermarket/dealer mod.
No I was thinking th elack of dealers/spares would put other folks off and lower prices even more. Sometimes though there are certain parts that you may have to go to a dealer for.
I guess a lot of Rover 75 parts will fit.
That's all good info Saccades - cheers 🙂
Volvo 850 or V70 all the way. Built like tanks and go on and on and on. Nice to drive and handle pretty well for a big car too. Buy a TDi with F.S.H. and it's difficult to go wrong.
Forget the Passat. Too many people I know have had lots of problems with them. VW's are not quite as reliable as people seem to believe. Plus Passat's are possibly the most dull and un-involving car to drive on the planet - like automotive porridge (if you care about that sort of thing).
Forget Renault too - too many problems with their Tdci engines, particularly the 1.9's. Ford Mondeo of Focus worth a look though.
Golf MK4 Est 1.8 Turbo
Have managed 43mpg driving like a nun. Plenty of go,reasonable in the corners,better when loaded.
No probs, I just change the oil twice a year.
DON'T get a Volvo 850. One of the most unreliable cars we've ever owned and stupidly expensive when they go wrong.
Ran a passat from 100k to 200k and it didn't miss a beat. Great cars.
Ha ha slightly differing views on Volvos there!
Actually I've had good experiences of 850s over the years but they're a little long in the tooth now. Always fancied a V70 T5 - there's an LPG high miler on Ebay just now, very tempting. I've never driven a T5 but I've sat in the back of several being read my rights.....
Thanks for the Golf idea Basil, now I've got a vision of a sweaty, hairy bloke driving a Golf dressed as a nun 😯
lol, yes, we had a T5-R estate and whilst a great car it was in the garage as much as it was on the road. The main issue was electrics, to the point where they pretty much had to rip the entire guts out of it and start again. Engine was pretty solid, exhaust and CAT went prematurely, wheel bearings the same. All of the issues we had were under warranty but if I had the choice of a second hand one with no warranty I would walk the other way.
Just bear in mind that the Octavia is based on a Golf platform and not a Passat, and is therefore not quite the load swallowing leviathon that the STW Skoda crew would sometimes suggest.
(Very happy owner of a 1.9 TdI Octavia estate, btw!)
Why are most private hire taxis either Skoda Octavias or VW Passat's?
Cos they're cheap to run, comfortable and relatively reliable.
People generally have problems with passat's if they're under used. Ones that do 100 miles a day, and never miss a service, will go on for ever! Any problems with a passat are "relatively" easy to fix too...
Volvos are bigger, heavier, more expensive to run, and most older ones use a VW TDi engine anyway... Generally the 2.4 5 pot out of the T4 vans...
Renault laguna's are very nice cars. Problem is, there's all sorts of expensive problems waiting to happen with one! You can buy a "good" one for 1500 quid, with maybe 80k miles on. It'll cost the purchase price of the car to keep it on the road pretty much every year thereafter though!
Mondeos similar story to the laguna, though not as extreme...
Passat may not be the most inspiring drive (though mine with sport suspension, and 17" wheels) is a LOT better to drive than one with comfort suspension and 15" wheels (225 wide tyres vs 195!). But passat's are certainly a refined, comfortable place to spend a lot of time in, and as I usually average 25-30k miles per year, that was a major consideration for me too...
Honda Stream 2.0L SE 156bhp take the 3rd row of seats out like I have and the boot is Massive ! and it looks like a normal estate car with Honda reliability
http://cdn.carsource.co.uk/d/used-photos/27440/400x/0/0/RN54WVR.jp g" target="_blank">
tbh I'd go petrol.
Current car E39 535i 😆
Yes its heavy on fuel, but boy is it a nice place to be in - and you can pick the E39 Touring version up reasonably cheap.
Had a '53 plate Mazda 6 TS2 2.0l (138bhp iirc) CRD that didn't miss a beat, which was returned (end of lease) at around 90k and a '56 plate 2.0l (140bhp) TDI Passat which did around the same mileage and didn't miss a beat either - felt a little more solid than the Mazda after 3 years though.
Mazda was better on fuel by about 5mpg iirc and a more involving drive. Passat was comfier, felt classier and was my preference.
Oh, btw - I ragged them both.
Skoda Octavia Mk. 1
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Saab 9-5 estate - loadsa room, comfy, good to drive IMO and cheap as chips. Avoid the 2 litre and 2.3 light pressure petrol turbos - bit slothful, not v economic, and prone to engine breather problems. Go for either the petrol Aero (sh*t off a shovel) or the 2.2 TiD (noisy but pokey enough and v reliable engine - I have a 9-3 TiD @ 155K and the only cost has been a replacement turbo @145K.) 2.2 TiD better than later 1.9 TiD, which is less reliable.
[url= http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2531907.htm ]LPG Audi A6 Avante[/url]
[url= http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/list.asp?s=705 ]Loads more here[/url] including BMWs, Fords, Skodas, Land Rovers.
Rover 75/ MG ZT-T +1
I've got the 75 tourer it's plenty big enough, full leather ,heated seats,climate control , cruise, all the toys , driven very sensibly(below 70mph on the motorway) I've had over 54mpg out of it fully loaded that's measured properly not going on the trip computer.have got nearly 40mpg on short journeys over winter.
there's plenty of spares about for them , rear windows for some saloons are thin on the ground and 1 or 2 other bits that can be salvaged from scrappers easily.
The diesels have a couple of things to look out for. Clutches are quite expensive (circa £900 for replacement) so anything over 100K check it's been replaced , in tank fuel pump on earlier models (you should be able to hear it prime when the ignition is turned on ,listen at driver side rear seat) and the MAF sensor starts to go out of spec dramatically after 50K.
I paid 5K for mine 4 years ago and have only needed to replace wear and tear parts (front wishbones/bushes, rear coil springs ect), it's a nice place to be on a long journey.
I think it's often the case of what we want to use it for. Bike trips? A van. Family trips - a Mondeo. Trips with a dog - an Octavia. There are few cars that are utter junk nowadays, it's your luck and access to spares that should dictate what you buy.
Don't forget whatever you go for we'll slaughter you for it. Enjoy!
BTW If a Volvo 850 was younger I'd be looking at one.
Dekadanse - I'd love a Saab 9-5 Aero. I had 3x 900 T-16S and 2x 9000 Aero/Carlsson and loved 'em. Also had a 9-3 2.2TiD which though ultra reliable I hated coz I thought the engine was crap in terms of driveability. Problem with the 9-5 is that most of the engines are unreliable and the 3.0 TD is the worst. For an economical one you'd need an Aero running LPG - which don't crop up too often.
Ox - ta for the heads up. Interesting.
Carlosg - more useful info. Cheers.
Hairychested - Well luckily I have a van for MTBing and a VW Camper for trips. This'll be for work related mileage, dogs, shopping, family visits etc.
I'll probably end up buying something no-one's mentioned - like an Alfa 156 Sportwagon (!) - and get slaughtered for sure 🙂
Whatever you do don't buy a Prius. Alfa on the other hand, or a Lancia...
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I turned up to by a (ahem!) road bike at some bloke's house a few weeks ago and he had one very similar to the pic in his garage - it was totally mint.
I spent far more time looking at the car than I did checking the bike.
Clarkson always goes on about how everyone should own an Alfa at least once and I never have 🙁
Well - got one.
(Nearly bought an Immaculate 51 plate Passat Sport TDi 130, Leather FSH One owner, 88k and £3k but someone beat me to it. Thanks for the info mboy)
Anyway, took the suggestion of Rover75/MG ZT-T seriously and got a 54 plate MG ZT-T CDTi+ 135 with 75k for just over my £2.5k limit. It's in Monogram Chagalle (blue to you and me) with full leather, Satnav/TV, Harmon Kardon Audio, Xenon Lights, 18" Alloys, Climate and - get this - a Webasto Diesel Heater that you program to come on in the morning so it's toasty when you get in!
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I was buying it from a distance so got a bod from the Rover75/MG ZT forums, Jezza, to go and take a look. (Jezza has TEN Rover 75s!) I knew he was a spotter when he called me up after looking at pics in the ad and said, "Well the car clearly doesn't have the original rear mudflaps, those obviously aren't OEM."
He kindly took time from his busy Friday night and went to inspect the car and managed to e-mail me a full dossier that night for my bedtime reading. THe following morning I spoke to Jezza and an expert MG/Rover mechanic (who happened to be with him)about the car and ZTs in general. Next, did a deal with the seller over the phone and I'm flying down south to pick it up soon (and dropping in on Jezza on the way home with a case of wine).
Good things I've learned about MG ZTs:
They're heavily influenced by BMW.
The BMW Engine/Gearbox is pretty strong.
There's not too much that goes wrong.
THey handle.
THere's a HUGE and enthusiastic body of knowledge on the web about keeping them going/getting bits.
THey get good MPG.
You can improve the CDTis with a Synergy Tuning Box and MAF compensator + EGR bypass.
The paint is ridiculously expensive. (OK, not a good thing)
They're quite cheap coz the company is no more and people fear the Rover name.
They look quite good (IMO).
So thanks one and all for your input - had I not come on here I'd probably be buying something a lot more boring.
hah, that's made my day....
good work fella!
Now that's how to buy a motor, well done, hope all turns out good.
that looks like a quality bus how huge is it in the back?
That's an amazing amount of car for around £2.5k, good choice.
I want my car to have a pre-heat program for the mornings now!
Good to hear feedback from a what..... thread too (not that I contributed but would've if I'd seen it first time round).
Enjoy when you get it.
Sweet work...
Having been on the look out for a good tourer for over 6 months that is a brilliant find - that was not listed on the 75 owners club forum where usually the best cars pop up so you did very well to find it. That definitly is the most car you can get for the money, great find!!!! 
Saccades - Memberhah, that's made my day....
Well you put me on to the idea first so cheers for that. It also means I'll blame you ENTIRELY if anything ever goes wrong with it 😀
parkesie - Memberthat looks like a quality bus how huge is it in the back?
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Actually they're not quite as big inside as they appear from the outside. Rover employed some sort of "reverse tardis" engineering methinks. Still sizeable though.
stevemtb - MemberI want my car to have a pre-heat program for the mornings now!
Yeah it's funny - lots of the MG Zts/75s have the Webastos fitted to just come on when you turn on the ignition if the temp is below 5C but only a few had them timer or remote controlled. (I sound like an anorak already.)
mundiesmiester - Member...the 75 owners club forum where usually the best cars pop up
Well it's not perfect, there's a scratch on one door and a few rattles etc. Plus those non-OEM mudflaps off course! There was an amazing, immaculate, ZT-T on the forums end Jan for £2450 with all the stuff mine has plus a Synergy 2 but never saw it 'til after. I'm not an MG buff so wasn't too worried about it not being pristine - just quick, comfy, reliable, economical transport that's also fun to drive.
(Hopefully it won't blow up on the M6 on the way home.)
SaccadesI know this will be ignored but what about MG/Rover ZT-T/75?
Hah! I just remembered that bit 😆
Hairychested and carlosg were also 75/ZT fans - I'll blame them too.
carlosg - MemberThe diesels have a couple of things to look out for. Clutches are quite expensive (circa £900 for replacement) so anything over 100K check it's been replaced.......... MAF sensor starts to go out of spec dramatically after 50K.
The car's had a new clutch in the past 6 months (which was a strong buying point) and I'll fit a Synergy 2a at some point which can compensate for a dodgy MAF and also allow use of a cheaper Pierburg MAF (£50) - as well as boosting power and torque. 😀