more straw clutching News organisations going to report on the press releases they are sent from the Arch dicks office.
A committee of privy counsellors will arrange the event.
I love the fact we still have officials whose role originated from those hanging about the monarch while he took a shit.
The Royal wipers
I'll pledge allegiance if non-adherence means I lose my extra bank holiday. Otherwise - nah, you're alright, ta.
At least we get an extra day off as a result of all this tosh.
Its all good as Ant and Dec will be attending, high brow tv personalities that they are.
I have worked closely with a lot of ex-military and have attended Shrivenham on a staff course.
Ooh, you must be a badass. Sounds a lot like 'some of my best friends are {insert demographic to validate point}'.
Doing a staff course at Shrivenham is in no way shape or form impressive, officers routinely get rinsed when any of their dits start with 'when I was at Sandhurst/Staff College'.
You want people to potentially give their lives for their country? Then you need instill a certain amount of blind allegiance in them.
You're just as bad. What utter shite.
All the risks i've been exposed to over the course of my career were never for the country, they were for my friends and colleagues who were also at risk in those moments. The crown and country bit is added in retrospect by the MOD and media, lets people feel better about the loss or some shit.
I'll take my 24 years of actual experience, not some weak-ass attempt at association. Trying to validate a point with some pretty thin, if not made up associations is pretty pathetic.
I'd suggest you lay off reading Commando comics or hanging out with officers if you want to have any chance at understanding the military and how the pointy-end works.
More importantly
Its a big welcome back to MidlandTrailQuestGraham who was a very regular poster. Been awsy on a sabbatical for a couple of years. Nice to see you again
It's almost a century since any other European royalty had a coronation service - King Zog of Albania in 1928.
Cost of living crisis crime
they were for my friends and colleagues who were also at risk in those moments.
I was under the impression(according to a mate who was 'in') that it was all about the testing bonuses, the beery post exercise nights and the fact you get to throw hand grenades.
Ooh, you must be a badass. Sounds a lot like ‘some of my best friends are {insert demographic to validate point}’.
Doing a staff course at Shrivenham is in no way shape or form impressive, officers routinely get rinsed when any of their dits start with ‘when I was at Sandhurst/Staff College’.
Shrivenham was interesting, looking in from the outside at how the military mindset works. The majority very right wing, closed minds, would refuse to take any criticism of their organisations from various speakers.
The only really cynical military people I met, were on their way out and were quite scathing of the whole thing.
All the risks i’ve been exposed to over the course of my career were never for the country, they were for my friends and colleagues who were also at risk in those moments.
I bet they were. That's the "trick". You have been taught to feel like that.
I don't doubt the bravery or the skill of the UKs armed forces but to think that some kind of "conditioning" is not involved is nonsense.
As for the Crown, why do the military have so many portraits of the Queen/King everywhere?
Why are all the lesser royals always dressed up in military costume?
officers routinely get rinsed when any of their dits start with ‘when I was at Sandhurst/Staff College’.
I think there may be some military jargon involved and I am basically guessing at the meaning of "rinse" and "dit" here.
As for the Crown, why do the military have so many portraits of the Queen/King everywhere?
Isn't the monarch notionally the top top brass, though the PM is in practice the overall commander?
Essentially yes. Monarch, but delegated to the government.
Tradition is a bit thing in the military. I can understand it, but was never really fully at ease with it. It's probably a good thing I left the country.
would refuse to take any criticism of their organisations from various speakers.
As an organisation; the British Army is, y'know, pretty good at what it does. And it's been pretty good at what it does since oooohhh about 1707. I think it can probably get away with shrugging off some criticism
Shrivenham was interesting, looking in from the outside at how the military mindset works.
Attending a few lectures at Shrivenham as a civilian and thinking you have some insight into 'the military mindset' puts you in the same category as walting airsofters and COD players thinking the same.
'Military mindset' because, yes everyone serving is incapable of independent thought and are all one homogenous group who think the same. Like Muslims? Scots? scousers? Football supporters?
That’s the “trick”. You have been taught to feel like that.
No, it's comradeship and loyalty. A bond forged by shared experience of danger. Something you've clearly never experienced if you think 'it's a trick'.
As for the Crown, why do the military have so many portraits of the Queen/King everywhere?
Err.. because he/she is the commander in chief of the armed forces?
Why are all the lesser royals always dressed up in military costume?
Some are honorary colonels in chief. Many have served, often in operational theatres. They are entitled to wear it. Refering to military uniform as 'costume' betrays your true attitude to the military. You've as much insight into the military as I have into Grand Prix driving, because I went on the dodgems once.
As an organisation; the British Army is, y’know, pretty good at what it does. And it’s been pretty good at what it does since oooohhh about 1707. I think it can probably get away with shrugging off some criticism
I'd agree, although it is a slow and ungainly beast in regards to change. It gets there eventually, painfully slow as it can be. But there are reasons for that.
This is mostly because change is pushed upon by people who've attended a staff course as a civilian and think they understand...
They are entitled to wear it. Refering to military uniform as ‘costume’ betrays your true attitude to the military.
I'd disagree. I'm not aware of a member of the royal family that wears the rank they earned on their own merit from the time they served. They also flip between uniforms of the different services - I'm assuming in their honorary capacity. To that end I can see the costume analogy.
* I served. Actually 'shared' a desk with Andrew on 815 Squadron (I say shared - I was a young midshipman on holdover and in need of place to work and let's just say his desk was rarely used).
More broadly the services are a broad church like the society they are drawn from. Well, arguably a bit narrower. Within that broad church there will be a fair number of vocal and visible 'traditionists' who have a certain stereotypical view of queen(now king) and country. Also a certain predisposition to to share Britain first posts, largely because the BF hooked them with some of their simple narratives. But that is only a fraction of the services - don't tar all of us/them with the same brush.
Also a certain predisposition to to share Britain first posts, largely because the BF hooked them with some of their simple narratives. But that is only a fraction of the services – don’t tar all with the same brush.
Not all but much more than a fraction.
There's many who serve and who are very much an empty uniform, I get more bent out of shape about those sorts than a Royal acting as Colonel-in-Chief.
Not all but much more than a fraction.
You cannot say that with any confidence. Unless it's the confidence of an idiot.
@convert of course (and thinking of Andrew in particular) having served doesn't remove any innate bellendery. That's the thing, there are idiots and good lasses/fellas, right wing 'traditionalists' and plenty of a more progressive mindset in the forces. Clever/thick, funny/boring. All sorts. Just ordinary people and as you say, a reflection of the society they are recruited from. It's just the lazy thinking which paints all members of the forces into one identical stereotype that boils my piss. Especially when it's done by people who would rightly complain when the same thinking was applied to any other group.
It's all 'hey diddle diddle, straight up the middle' for a bunch of thicko racists and bigots following some plumby, privately educated gentry in the Army. Didn't you get the memo?
it is a slow and ungainly beast in regards to change. It gets there eventually, painfully slow as it can be.
Agreed, but then show me an organisation that is 80,000-100,000 strong that isn't resistant to and slow to accept change?
Agreed, but then show me an organisation that is 80,000-100,000 strong that isn’t resistant to and slow to accept change?
Exactly that.
Not all but much more than a fraction.
You cannot say that with any confidence. Unless it’s the confidence of an idiot.
You are calling me an idiot because you think that there isn't a significant number of bigots and racists in the armed forces?
Can you explain why there would be people wearing spurs when going to dinner at 7.00pm on a Wednesday but don't have a horse? Apart from it being absolute brain washing cultist BS?
Apols RM - '@prolapsed_mandy' was a retort to 'blokeupthemiddle'😜
why there would be people wearing spurs when going to dinner at 7.00pm on a Wednesday but don’t have a horse?
For the same reason that sailors who've yet to cross the equator get welcomed by Neptune and the shellbacks, and the same reason why in some messes, if you've not celebrated Minden Day you get a rose to eat.
For the same reason that sailors who’ve yet to cross the equator get welcomed by Neptune and the shellbacks, and the same reason why in some messes, if you’ve not celebrated Minden Day you get a rose to eat.
Which is "absolute brain washing cultist BS".
Tradition.
Not saying it is not BS, but it helps bring people together.
it helps bring people together.
Well that absolutely proves my point.
I'd be careful using anything I say as proof of something. I am not a reliable source of verifiable information.
Can you explain why there would be people wearing spurs when going to dinner at 7.00pm on a Wednesday but don’t have a horse? Apart from it being absolute brain washing cultist BS?
It's OK because we take the spurs off after dinner to play mess rugby with a cabbage. What? Nowt wrong with that! 😉 As @nickc has already explained. Is a Scots soldier wearing trews or a kilt, or an Irish soldier a caubeen doing it because it's 'absolute brain washing cultist BS'?
Which is “absolute brain washing cultist BS”
If you're going to ask that people literally put their lives on the line, then the indulgence of a few harmless traditions to bind folks to a common cause isn't really cultish behaviour. You probably have family traditions that make perfect sense to you, or are funny or irreverent, that look odd to "others".
as BUTR suggests; the Army is who it recruits from, and that's the UK as a whole, and reflects the UK as a whole.
There's a level of brain washed bullshit in some of these posts, and it's not coming from who they think it is....
Is a Scots soldier wearing trews or a kilt, or an Irish soldier a caubeen doing it because it’s ‘absolute brain washing cultist BS’?
Partly but not quite as extreme. Uniforms are all part of it. The spurs are turning it up to 11.
I bet the officers mess in those cavalry regiments is full of free thinking, open minded people, who reflect the broad make up of our society.
oh please “Invited” is softer sounding than “asked”, straws being clutched for there. Does it sound soft when invited to help police with their inquiries ?
It's all semantics. You can't be forced to make any sort of pledge, so regardless of how the invitation is phrased, it's simply that. Honestly, if people want to make some sort of meaningless personal pledge to the royal family, it's their own call.
If they want to inflict it on other people, that's a different matter. If they're going to do it in public spaces - down the pub for example - they'll probably cop some light-hearted abuse.
The only thing that's really clear is that it's a huge PR howler that posts up a huge virtual billboard saying look at us, we're a ridiculous anachronistic institution, so mired in the past that we can't actually see how stupid and outdated this whole thing looks.
On the plus side, it may make more people think a little harder about what monarchy is. Hint: from the lovely people who also brought you an anachronistic rights of way system based on a culture of toadying deference to things that no longer make any sense.
the Army is who it recruits from, and that’s the UK as a whole, and reflects the UK as a whole.
Bit of a stretch there with the last bit; the Army is overwhelmingly white (10% in non-commissioned ranks and 2% of officers are BAME and a large proportion of these aren’t UK nationals) and male,Sandhurst takes a massively high proportion of public school entrants, 49%.
Not really a reflection of wider society.
Apols RM – ‘@prolapsed_mandy’ was a retort to ‘blokeupthemiddle
Can we have our usernames changed? 🤣
A lot more regiments/corps wear spurs with mess dress than just cavalry.
But, we are straying a little off track from the topic of the new king. I'm not sure this was supposed to be a thread about military traditions in the modern age.
I bet the officers mess in those cavalry regiments is full of free thinking, open minded people, who reflect the broad make up of our society.
A quick google suggests that 'nearly 50%' of army officers went to public school, compared to less than 10% of the general population. It's also possible that cavalry regiments actually have a higher percentage of privately educated officers than the army as a whole, given that they tend to be traditionally, erm, posher than some other parts of the army. Of course that doesn't mean they're not free-thinking, open-minded people, but it doesn't really 'reflect the broad make-up of our society'. And let's not even talk about ethnic make-up etc.
