7 weeks ago I bought a bike frame via eBay. The seller had 67 positive feedbacks and was registered with Paypal, which means their bank account had been verified, and took Paypal in payment for the frame.
On Monday, a Police officer knocked on my front door, asked to see the bike, verified the serial number, confirmed it was in fact stolen goods and 'seized' it (i.e. I willingly handed it over). It is now on its way back to its rightful owner.
However, both eBay and Paypal are fobbing me off saying they will do absolutely nothing to help. They say that there's a 45 day time limit for raising a 'dispute' and as it was 53 days after the purchase they are point blank refusing to do anything.
It strikes me that I'm also a victim here... OK, not as big a victim as the poor guy who's bike got nicked, but I bought it via eBay and paid via Paypal. As an eBay customer I'd (wrongly it transpires) assumed eBay would do something (anything?) to assist me...
Has anyone got any suggestions about what, if anything, I might do to get my money back?
PS - All this bollox eBay and Paypal spout about "buyer protection" is exactly that - complete bollox.
Has the seller got anything to say?
They are unresponsive...
If all else fail lodge a claim in the Small Claims Courts
christ thats a tough break, you 100% it was the police??
Thats shit ebay not doing anything can the police not do something about handling stolen goods.
You really need to speak at someone at paypal or your CC if that funds your paypal.
If not my last choice would be to confront the seller if you can get his address through paypal and demand money or violence.
weren't the police interested in where you bought the bike?
Sure the Police were interested and I gave them printouts of the eBay auction listing, the seller's details and the Paypal transaction with the seller's email address, Paypal ID. I also got the seller's phone number and gave that to the Police.
As the police came knocking on your door, it's fairly certain that they've already ID'd the seller
You'd presume that the guy who's bike it is saw it on eBay & put things in motion
*note to self*
Dont bid on my own stolen bike to get it back, let someone else buy it then report them to the fuzz for recieving stolen goods.
Does your Paypal account get charged to your credit card? If so, doesn't that offer some kind of protection?
No, credit cards only indemnify you if used for the original transaction between you and the seller. PayPal nullifies this. Basically, Paypal is a total and utter con.
Bad news!
Sorry I have nothing to say to definitely help but I would try the following for advice if you dont get anywhere with Paypal
Ask the police what they think
Try the Citizens advice bureau
Speak to your credit card company
Post your original question on an ebay forum
The question is did your seller know the bike was dodgy?
If so then if you get nowhere you should have his contact details and I would politely take it from there
Good luck
>The police seemed to be around your house pdq,
What, 7 weeks after purchase ?
Persist with ebay - I bought some (as it transpires) non existant tickets on ebay. Seller had loads of +ve feedback and tickets were at face value (only just sold out and a long way in advance of gig). ANYWAY, Similar situation, realised it was a con after the 30 days had passed (it was around 65 days I think, had been repeatedly fobbed off with "tickets not released yet"), no joy with Paypal or cc for reasons you described, spoke to someone at ebay and was told to file complaint via the link on the website (the one which says that something might happen up to 2 years after you report the scam, depending on whether other people report the same seller). Had absolutely no optimism of positive result but within a couple of weeks had a full refund from ebay.
mike_p - Member
No, credit cards only indemnify you if used for the original transaction between you and the seller. PayPal nullifies this. Basically, Paypal is a total and utter con.
Mike, not arguing with on this one, but if you pay the PP bill with a CC, isn't there a contract for a service there? (that is a question and not a statement:-)
Digger, how much are you in for is it more like £400 than £40?
As you've got the address of the seller I'd send a recorded delivery letter telling him you want your money with in 7 days. On the 8th day you need to good to the Small Claims court, CAB can help with this.
Who was the seller? I'm sure we can screw up any attempt to flog anithing else on ebay.
UPDATE:
I requested seller contact details from eBay yesterday, they sent me the seller's email address and phone number, so I called them this evening.
I spoke to the seller's spouse. He denied the bike was stolen, saying they'd owned the bike for 18 months. They had not been contacted by the Police, eBay, Paypal or anyone other than me about the matter.
Obviously, he was not going to accept what I was saying at this point, and would not refund my money.
So, I'm going to contact the Police tomorrow and ask what the hell they're doing about it. It was Monday they visited me, today is Weds. Fer Chrissakes, you'd think Plod would've gone round to the seller's house and asked a few questions wouldn't you? They have the name, address and tel no of the seller, and the same for the original owner who reported it stolen.
I sense this saga may run and run....
I paid £200 for the frame. It was an older Turner 5 Spot and was 'naked' - no shock, no bushes, no hardware, no seat clamp etc. Having bought all that stuff for £250 it cost me a total of £450... which is pretty much the going market rate for a well used 2005 HL Turner 5 Spot frame.
It's a lesson in just how unhelpful eBay and Paypal can be...
All this crap they spout about Buyer Protection this, Buyer Protection that... fuggin crap!
Not aimed at the OP, but I think most of the people on here know that ebay is a ripoff, they just happen to be the biggest auction site in the world, so when the biggest auction site in the world wants to make more money it created paypal.
FFS, don't become a verified user, it allows them to take what they want from your bank account without asking first.
Some people are just to greedy to bother to read the small print, so buyer beware.
It certainly has soured me on eBay and Paypal.
.
As somneone else asked, are you 100% sure it was a genuine Police man who took the frame away?
(Serious question) are you covered by your house insurance? After all the bike was stolen...
not that its any use now but that frame was on here in one of those "this is on ebay and looks a bit suspect threads"
[url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/is-this-a-scam-ebay-content#post-570809 ]clicky for STW post, about halfway down[/url]
[url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/stolen-today#post-573894 ]and the original thread from the guy who had it nicke in leeds[/url]
That's bloody terrible.
Can't stand the place though myself though I have peek every now and then.
I can't help think that far from just being an outlet for stolen bikes amongst other things, that it's also responsible for the thefts in the first place.
I looked at two items recently. An Uncle John frame well used and marked go for £37 and postage more than Planet X was doing them brand new, £212 as opposed to £175. Then a seat post go for about £3 less than new, and that's after waiting all week faffing about with bids.
STW classifieds have been briliant though.
did you take the shock, hardware and seat clamp off before you gave the bike back
if you didn't contact the police and ask for them back there not stolen parts so still belong to you
not great but at least its something
thisisnotaspoon - thank you. I had not seen that and will contact the owner.
Wish I'd checked here before buying it... but I thought a seller who's sold quite a few items on eBay, has lots of positive feedback, is registered (and verified) by Paypal.. and these companies claim to be hot on 'buyer protection', well, how much checking should one do these days?
I will call the Police tomorrow and will contact the original owner.
Yes, I removed all of my parts from the bike before the Police took it away - and yes, I'm 100% sure it was a genuine Police officer.
Does anyone know 'rsvktm'?
I have posted a 'Paging rsvktm' post and replied to his original thread about the Turner being stolen. There is no email addy in his Profile though.
I have also sent a copy of his original 'Stolen' post to the Sussex Police.
Since rsvktm is in Tadcaster and the person I bought it from is in Leeds, he might like to go visit them(!) 😉
Go to your local paper, get an article in the press about your bad experience and ebay/paypals complete lack of help. Might make them do something about it
If you used a credit card then raise a dispute with the credit card company - it only costs you a phone call. You have 6 months to do so and whilst the dispute is active the funds will be removed from the Paypal account of the seller at least.
See [url= https://www.paypal.com/chargeback ]paypal chargeback[/url]
You should have a police receipt stating the frame was stolen so it is very unlikely the seller can counter your dispute. Paypal as the 'payment services provider' cannot escape the credit card scheme requirements over this issue as far as I'm aware.
Edit
Sellers who accept credit card payments run the risk of receiving chargebacks. Most sellers factor potential chargeback losses into the cost of doing business.
Why have you sent it to Sussex Police?? Tadcaster is 10 miles from Leeds.
Because I live in Sussex... doh!
Digger - I saw that Turner for sale and to me it was obviuosly nicked. Yes he did have decent feedback etc, etc but if you looked back at what he sold it was about 30 crappy £60 MTB's and loads of bits of gold (all probably nicked). To be honest mate you should have been more careful, no such thing as a bargain especially if you're talking about a Turner frame.