[Closed] You're riding along and a dog runs out and wipes you out - whose fault is it?

The dog owners fault if the dog isn't under control obviously.

you can guess the rest.

I can't.

Holy smokes! That almost seems like a police matter.

Police 101

Holy smokes! That almost seems like a police matter.

I have clearly changed or it would have been a police matter. 😉 I didn't even swear or raise my voice. I did however push all of the correct buttons and finished with "Son, that's what an idiot looks like."

Hope your lads OK and that you're recovering well from your beating.* 😛

*first bit's sincere

The dog owner

@ neal He used his TKD skills to axe kick him to death then he turned on the dog*- I dont condone it but many folk would have done the same and no need to grab your son.

Very few folk will blame your son [ even on STW] but shared spaces are shared. I warn my kids not to spook dogs mainly because they are an unpredictable part of some riding environments but STILL NOT HIS /YOUR FAULT

As a dog owner myself I'd say it would be my fault if one of ours knocked somebody off a bike.

But I'm sure there will be at least 5 pages of arguments and it'll end up being his fault for not being observant enough to predict the dog running into him 😆

[url= https://www.gov.uk/control-dog-public/overview ]It's a fairly straight forward piece of legislation.[/url]

[i]TKD skills[/i]

C30-C60-C90 GO!

At least it didnt happen in a Zoo.

shoot the dog!

just thought id get that in there 🙂

Cannae shoot the dog. I like dogs. Can we shoot the owner?

hang on, he grabbed your 8 year old and tried to shake him and you didn't even swear?
f...! i'd have torn him a new one. guy needs locking up.

Sounds like the dog owner is at fault. Most genuinely don't seem to realise they have any responsibility for the behaviour of their animal.

Owners have successfully been sued for dogs out of control causing riders to fall off - although obviously it depends on the specific circumstances etc. - I've had numerous instances of dogs running out onto paths from thick undergrowth in which they were invisible, some resulting in minor collisions (never anything worse than a bit of oil on the dog's back) and it amazes me the number of people that think this is a good idea on a path that is heavily used by cyclists (and relatively near to various open spaces off limits to cyclists).

hang on, he grabbed your 8 year old and tried to shake him and you didn't even swear?
f...! i'd have torn him a new one. guy needs locking up.

I knew that I could easily kick them into the middle to next week if I wanted to. Doing so would have given me no satisfaction. I try not to swear in front of the kids and try to set as good an example to them as I can.

If a stranger used their dog to get my child to stop cycling and stay still, then tried to kidnap my child who was shaking about as he struggled to escape, I'd have been most upset.

[IMG] [/IMG]

My meeting with an out of control dog ended up with an off and this.

[url= http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/knocked-off-on-cycle-path-by-dog-injured-what-to-do ]Now you can both swap doggy incident tales![/url]

Enquired about this last summer when a Sheep dog bolted out of the back of a landrover parked outside a house on the driveway, I was going downhill at a decent speed, it missed my mate somehow but broadsided my front wheel bringing me down with a bang.

minor damage to bike, cosmetic only thankfully. Large portion of skin off my hip and shorts torn to shreds. Owner got in the landrover and drove away to look for his dog and never returned.

I was told that I would have to prove the dog had a history of this to prove that the animal wasn't under control. As you will know from previous threads on such topics, under control doesn't have to mean on a lead apparently. I just sucked it up and let it go. I still b*tch about it constantly.

Its DOGS will.

If a dog had knocked my son off his bike I would be havin words with its owner if dog owner shock my son then talking would be low down on my list of things to do and he would be looking for a dentist 👿

No kicking the dog in the throat?
*is disappoint*
*TJ would be disappointed too*

where did this happen ? On the road or in a park. On the road deff the dog owners fault, in a park there might be an expectation of dogs running around so perhaps not so clear cut. Nothing excuses what sounds like an assault on your son. probably best not to involve the law if you robustly showed him the error of his ways. 😉

I was told that I would have to prove the dog had a history of this to prove that the animal wasn't under control

Maybe it's no-ones fault, just an accident? (Not condoning the dog owners reaction)

Maybe it was an accident but shaking an 8yr old is assault

Wasd your child trained to cyucle on the road or dedicated cycle path, footway cycling is illigal,

was your child wearing a helmet,

did you have proper control of your child and was he kept in sight at all times for a child of his age,

was your child wearing relevant hi viz clothing.

all questions an insurance jobsworth will ask to try and put you off claiming, thats if the dog owner had any insurance to defend.

Had a similar incident last week with an out of control dog, the dog owner starteds creaming abuse, i just rode on and pointed out to the numerous witnesses the dog was out of control and so was the ownner and to avoid him, this made him more angry as i rode off and his dog ran the other way.

Dog owner clearly at fault. Please tell me despite you keeping your cool you've reported said matter to the police or if not at least made sure he has to visit a dentist for shaking your son, unless of course your son is some 6'5" freak of nature at 8 years old and he sorted out the dentistry work 😀

Section 2 of the Dangerous Dogs Act** iirc - dogs must be under close control* at all times in a public space.

* not necessarily on a lead BTW

** if not, I shouted the wrong legislation at the owner of the collie that used my foot as a teething ring the other night.

And the dog owner assaulted your son. That's a Police matter on its own, never mind the dog.

Really hope your son is ok, and that you have informed the police about this. If similar had happened to one of my boys, I'm not honestly sure what my reaction would have been, but it would probably have involved drop-kicking the dog (and probably the dog owner) into a nearby bush.

If you take the bike out of the situation - your son is moving down a track, and is knocked over by a domestic animal, which[i] by law is required to be under control at all times[/i]. Your son is then assaulted by the owner, who is not only negligent in his duty to keep his dog under control, but is now assaulting a minor.

Call the police.

So, a while ago, I was riding in the Chiltern's and a deer jumped across my path..had I been a second earlier it would have hot me (possibly)...had that happened (yeah, right) should I have sued the landowner (or the deer)? Again, not condoning dog owners behavior, but then I don't understand what "I have clearly changed it" means.

There isn't always someone at fault.

you can guess the rest

?

[img] [/img]

No one is legally required to keep a deer - or other wild animal - under close control in a public space.

Hence the difference.

Hoof the dog in the slats and stick your finger up the owners bum..

No wait.. Something like that anyway

No where does the OP say it was a public space. But really you're missing the point ....shit happens, politely called accidents.

I have no issues with the dog. The lad learned a good lesson by getting taken out by it. It's the complete lack of responsibility by the owner that stinks.

It happened in a park. A park that has lots and lots of signs about how to exercise your dog responsibly which includes information about having it under control at all times.

Go back on a heavier bike and run over the owner of the dog...

Doing so would have given me no satisfaction.

Well that's boring. 😀

If it was in a park there's a pretty good chance it will have a byelaw restricting cycling - quite a lot of parks were originally common ground and made available for grazing livestock back in the day, so the regulations for many often still reflect this.

This really sucks. I can understand that accidents happen, but the owners attitude will have them hung out to dry when you have them in court.

You do have their details? They assaulted your son, they need to have a bad day in court, or at least on the front page of the local rag.

If it was in a park there's a pretty good chance it will have a byelaw restricting cycling - quite a lot of parks were originally common ground and made available for grazing livestock back in the day, so the regulations for many often still reflect this.

It's Scotland and he's 8 - what's you point? 😀

Hope your son's OK and this hasn't put him off cycling. And nothing excuses the actions of the dog owner. But sometimes accidents happen. To use the STW clich?, what if it had been a child that had run out in front of him? The other child's parent could equally argue that your son was out of control given that he couldn't stop safely

I ride (legally) where a lot of people go out with their dogs. I would say around 75% do not have them in control and around 10% of the dogs run after me, lunge at me etc,.

At no point do I blame the dog though.

The only time it is any fun is when I can get a dog to follow me for 2 miles giving the owner a faster/further walk than they may have intended

In the OP case the grabbing/shaking of child should definitely be reported as others have said. What would the guy have done if you weren't there, where would he have stopped?

The dog issue is secondary. The shaking of a child is an assault! The child part makes it far far worse. Get it reported to the police right away. He should have gone for you not the kid! He needs having a serious word with about controlling himself let alone the dog.

I've been knocked off my bike by a dog on two occasions. Each time it was my completely my fault. Not because the dog was out of control - it was just being a dog and didn't know what would happen if it hit my front wheel with it's rear while running across my path. I wasn't riding recklessly either - i could see the dog coming but foolishly assumed it wouldn't be that dumb, but guess what? It's a dog, and although probably fairly smart as dogs go, but not all that clever in grand scheme of things. Knowing this didn't stop me from being angry at the dog at the time, but it was my fault - 100%. Maybe 200% as it was my own dog 😀

So in the OPs case, i blame the rider not the dog. However, the crazy person dog owner should not have shouted or handled your child. I'd have had more than words if it was my 8yr old.

Wow. Just the idea of someone grabbing my son has got me shaking a bit. I do get quite anxious about the idea of conflict though, possibly because anytime I've found myself with someone who is being verbally aggressive it has often turned physical.

I am quite small so people probably reckon they're fairly safe.

Definately the dog owners fault, I had a similar incident and the owner took full responsibility, there were not children involved and the dog sadly came off much worse. I was cycling along a disused line saw a guy with his jack Russell, alerted him to my presence and slowed down, he got hold of his dog, but just as I was cycling past he let go of it, why I don't know, the dog bolted and ran straight in front of my bike and I went over the top of it. The dog clearly had a broken back and was in a bad way, I stopped and helped him take it back to his car, despite been really upset, man I was gutted, he was really apologetic and kept asking if I was ok. Don't know if it survived. As for grabbing your kid, if that was mine and I'd seen it, I would have lamped him.

Crazy person proceeded to grab my 8yr old son who was in tears and try to shake him

Assault, ignore the dog issue report him to the police.

So in the OPs case, i blame the rider not the dog.

Idiot.

Wow that is out of order. Shaking a child = assault in this day and age. And even then, shaking someone else's crying child who has just had an accident on their pushbike? WTF!

There really are some utter t***s in the world. Pet owners who put the safety of their ball of mange above that of other humans rank up there for sure.

Needs a good talking to.

There really are some utter t***s in the world. Pet owners who put the safety of their ball of mange above that of other humans rank up there for sure

Yes but dogs are way better than humans.

If you believe in karma its entirely possible the dog was just doing his bit to restore the balance.

If you believe in karma its entirely possible the dog was just doing his bit to restore the balance.

Care to explain what an 8yr old kid might have done to need his karma rebalanced by being knocked off his bike and assaulted?

I wasnt exactly being serious 😕

I haven't seen an answer to this question or I may have missed it but were the police informed of this assault?

The dog owner should be in control of their dog. If not they are liable. That is one of the responsibilities of dog ownership.

But the real issue is the fact that the owner assaulted your son.
This is a matter for the police.
At a minimum it should be made clear to this guy that he needs to address his behaviour.
If there is a hint of previous then........
After all thats why we have DBS checks and the like.

Care to explain what an 8yr old kid might have done to need his karma rebalanced by being knocked off his bike and assaulted?

Not tidying a bedroom?

Not eating all his broccoli?

Not washing his hands before dinner?

These seem to be our kids common misdemeanours but I could see how they could add up.

Dog owner fault and sounds like a tool, bombers and shoe based wee attack!

If a dog had knocked my son off his bike I would be havin words with its owner if dog owner shock my son then talking would be low down on my list of things to do and he would be looking for a dentist.

That about covers it.

I have a dog and although it's soft it is also numb. I let it off the lead when I can but if it did something like this I would take full responsibility.

there was a dog walker in one of our local parks that had a cycle route through it that was deliberately setting up incidents - using one of those long ball throwing stick things to aim the ball so dog ran in front of cyclists...first time saw it thought it was accidental but seemed odd on the section of path as not really a lot of room - second time I was sat back waiting for some stragglers as other kids rode on ahead and presumably the guy was blind as well a nuts as saw him do it with two different kids - I pointed out that I'd seen what he was doing and got an anti-cycling rant - mad people in parks don't you love them

mad people in parks don't you love them

I think I might set up an incident where said nut job gets absolutely flattened by a bike.

The dog owner should be in control of their dog. If not they are liable. That is one of the responsibilities of dog ownership.

the dog is always under control until the unique incident because as we all know "it's never done that before"

I dont mind dogs at all. In fact, I love animals on the whole.

However when I commute on the canal, dogs that arent on leads and running everywhere are becoming a pain. Whilst their owners are on their phones no doubt on FB posting pictures of dogs & cats 'reading' newspapers etc.

Hope the lads ok anyways.

I was knocked off my bike by a sheep once.

There was no farmer there to complain to and the animal ran off and hid in the flock where I had no chance of singling it out.

It was a frustrating experience all round.

Re the dog bit and ignoring any legal complications.
We have the responsibility, moral if not legal, to be able to stop. Yes I know that many people would say you can't ride around at a speed and awareness that makes this possible 100 % of the time but on a bike why not? Our pleasure at speed is less important than anyones safety.
If that means when driving a car,you annoy the drivers behind, you are correct and they are wrong.
So, unless laws say that the dog/owner was wrong, it could be the lads fault. Even if by law the dog shouldn't have been loose contributory negligenc could be said to have occurred.
Just playing devils advocate.
Re the other character handling the lad. FFS! Police. Now

Fell off yesterday because of a dog running around my front wheel. steeply downhill at the time. I guess it's a 50/50 call, I should be in control, but so should the dog(owner). I do get a bit fed up with bad dog owners who seem happy to abdicate their responsibility.

I was a bit sweary 😳

wanmankylung - Member
Idiot.

Thanks!

A lot of talk about dogs not being under control in this thread. But OP fails to control his 'pet' in this occasion too. In fact the dog owner was first on the scene and was walking (which we all know is a lot slower than cycling), so just how [i]unsupervised[/i] was his child. We all know that that dog could easily have been a couple of dwarf peado's in disguise! I change my plea and enter a revised plea of bad parenting!

Better to say nothing, rather than carry on and prove beyond all doubt that you are indeed an idiot.

A lot of talk about dogs not being under control in this thread.

The dog injured someone - the law defines that as the dog being dangerously out of control.

But OP fails to control his 'pet' in this occasion too. In fact the dog owner was first on the scene and was walking (which we all know is a lot slower than cycling), so just how unsupervised was his child.
We all know that that dog could easily have been a couple of dwarf peado's in disguise! I change my plea and enter a revised plea of bad parenting!

Show me the law that says children must be kept under close control at all times.

Idiot troll.

Just to add to the Moronic dog person theme.....

Out riding my normal trails this weekend. Slowed down to walking pace to pass a dog person who was knelt down with arms smothered around a small ball of dog shaped fluff in a protective embrace. I rolled slowly past on the flat wide path while chatting to a friend and was shouted at by the dog woman in a hysterical voice. I cant remember the exact words but the gist of the tirade was that I should keep my distance. I replied in a confused voice "But I'm nowhere near it". The mad dog woman then stopped another member of our group and said "Can you please tell that man not to refer to my dog as it". Or words to that effect.

I now know that before referring to a dog I need to stop and check its sex first.

On a slightly related note, who's fault would it be if I run over a dog on my bike and seriously hurt the dog ?

When it comes to smaller dogs, it's much more likely the dog will get hurt than the rider in a collision.

Many times I've slammed by brakes on my 29er to avoid running over small dogs.

[quote=wanmankylung ]Crazy person proceeded to grab my 8yr old son who was in tears and try to shake him - you can guess the rest.

You put him on his backside? 😈

Seriously though I'm with the choir - no way I wouldn't report that to the police, and it's the sort of thing they might actually take seriously.

So when this aggressive bloke grabbed your son how did you react anyway? Using appropriate physical force can be used in such circumstances right?

Also would have got a photo for future reference - assuming I hadn't gone a bit far with thee physical force bit of course.

on my 29er to avoid running over small dogs.

Is the wheel size relevant to the running over of dogs 😕

Does it make the tails come alive ?