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I've never ridden any but Chris Boardman says they do.
must be true then..... ❓
i think the issue is that the brakes aren't as good.
If you haven't ridden in the tour you cannot comment.
I have and carbon rims are ghey, as are tubeless tyres and compact frames.
He's trying to justify why his bike range don't have any models with them on 😆
They should use discs.
Dunno, never even seen any let alone ridden them
but ............. 🙂
Could it be that they're so stiff that the traction breaks before normal rims do?
Discs on the road in the wet are scary, my Boardman hybrid taught me that!
Mine are fine on my tripster whatever the weather. Anyway, its this idea of carbon rims causing roadies to fall off that interests me.
FTFYmuddydwarf - Member
[s]Discs on the road[/s] Idiots that can't control their braking in the in the wet are scary, my Boardman hybrid taught me that!
Chris Boardman also says during the intro "I always wondered what the second and third place steps were for on the podium".
He's stood there often enough, you'd think he'd have worked it out by now.
I have and carbon rims are ghey,
homophobic post reported.
[i]I have and carbon rims are ghey,[/i]
[i]homophobic post reported.[/i]
Is it homophobic to mis-spell grey?
And i've just been taught that some people called druidh tend to be pillocks...
Carbon rims don't offer as much friction as aluminium I think, and they're a bit unpredictable under braking too.
So poo for rim brakes but OK for discs ?
carbon rims can snatch or fade more than alu ones.
seems like a reasonable explanation.
Braking is less consistent and predictable than with alloy rimmed wheels. That, along with rim overheating and tub glue melting, is a good reason why we should and will see disc brakes on road bikes in the not too distant future.
we should and will see disc brakes
on road bikes in the not too distant future.
you never heard of the UCI, Sam? 🙂
tub glue melting, how often do you see that? As for disc brakes, hmm. Spinergies were banned on safety grounds from mass start stages, and having seen what a hot disc can do to someone i am not sure the UCI are going to be overly happy with them in the peleton.
The other problem would of course be the bikes, a complete redesign of frames and forks to take the calipers. Then a complete redesign of the shifters to cope with the the new calipers.
And finally, you don't actually need that much power on a road brake to work to the needed level. Most of the crashes are about the road surface rather than anything else.
homophobic post reported.
See now if you'd read it in context you'd have understood that my comments were meant to lampoon chris boardman's hardman act. Perhaps you could report yourself, Thus creating a perfect circle?
bigsi - Member
He's trying to justify why his bike range don't have any models with them
Isn't there always a unbranded board man bike to the right of their commentary booth with a set or carbon Zipps on them,I admit it might not be a production model though.
Regards disc brakes ,as said previously they don't seem to be struggling to lock the wheels moreover a lack of grip from the tyres due to the tiny contact patch they have,they might be better off with some form of ABS to stop back wheel lock ups, and get rid of French tv crew drivers.
Carbon rims in the wet are pretty bloody scary to be honest! Don't envy them doing wet mountain descents.
In terms of melting glue, look at Beloki's TdF crash in 2003(?), a clincher may have reacted better. Not that I think they should run clinchers, but glue melting on tubs is a real issue. Haven't Conti just done a new stronger tub glue to that end.
i was under the impression that Beloki's crash was wet tar and the tub was ripped off in the crash.
Clinchers wouldn't help, more load on the rim so more chance of failure, and i have ripped a clincher off so gut feeling not the best way to go if your worried about tyres coming off.
A wet high speed descent with a wicked corner at the bottom ridden with triathletes for company all using carbon rims was a sphincter tightening highlight for me when I was racing!
Tufo used to (might still do) have two ranges of tub tape because of the heat issue - one for road where heat is an issue and one for track where obviously it is not.
imo improved braking surface finishes to carbon rims will be the solution not disc brakes.
Beloki's crash in 2003 - the one where st Lance the pure rode over the field and still didn't win the stage - that wasn't because his tub glue failed, the tarmac melted and his wheel washed out
discs would be great but it would need to be standardised size and position because the neutral service cars would have a nightmare, the UCI are extremely cautious about changes so I don't think it'll happen soon..
Why dont they swap wheels/tyres for some super tackies for the downhill bits? They would surely make the time up easily and be safer too.
The other problem would of course be the bikes, a complete redesign of frames and forks to take the calipers. Then a complete redesign of the shifters to cope with the the new calipers.
My avid road disks didn't need any of that, just tabs on the frame and disk hubs...
Why dont they swap wheels/tyres for some super tackies for the downhill bits? They would surely make the time up easily and be safer too.
Bernard Hinault did pretty much that in one of the individual time trials in the 1984 or 1985 tour. He switched between a low profile bike and a regular bike on a TT that had a long hill section at the start and a flat run to the finish. Low profile machines were only just making their entry at the time along with Look clip less pedals.
tree-magnet, how much does your frame weigh, i am assuming it is not a 850gram carbon frame with a 350 gram carbon fork? The current frames are designed to work in a certain way and be kitted out in a certain way. Disc brakes mean different forces and a review of the bikes.
That, along with rim overheating and tub glue melting, is a good reason why we should and will see disc brakes on road bikes in the not too distant future.
I'm pretty sure pro teams don't want heavier bikes.
I thought there was a minimum weight limit set for these bikes which they could easily reach. Adding a bit of strength for better braking shouldn't be that much of an issue.
and alloy discs, and calipers. theres only a couple of road bikes in the pro peleton that need weights to bring them within uci limits
The UCI has a minimum weight limit which manufacturers can easily get under so I don't think the pros would end up with heavier bikes.
EDIT : beaten to it not once but twice!
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Htc rider finds wormhole...it's sucked the bottom half into another dimension
and there is talk of the UCI ditching the limit.
As for adding weight, more a case of redesigning the bikes, it would also need shimano, sram and campag to come on board to bring disk brakes into the pro peleton. After all pros ride what they are told to ride, if the sponsors don't make it they won't be riding it.
And fundamentally, what are the advantages of disc brakes in a race environment. Do they allow rims to be made any lighter, do they offer any aerodynamic gain, do they make locking brakes less likely, do they weigh less than the calipers they replace, are they going to cause problems for neutral service, what about wheel changes. etc.
I can see some benefits for the non racing commuter type cyclist, but i am really not so sure about on a race bike.
Is is Cav in the 2010 Tour de Suisse stage 4.
Okay, why not just give them their aluminium rims back?
Okay, why not just give them their aluminium rims back?
weight, light wheels climb better.
Beloki's tub rolled pretty easily in 2003, the hot road caused the skid, but I'm fairly confident if he'd come off the brakes on a clincher it would've straightened up. Fairly irrelevant, because we don't know how he'd have reacted anyway, and generally tubs will handle flats far better, but that's my £0.02.
Carbon rims can be so much lighter/more aero than alu rims that crap braking is an acceptable risk - same boat for everyone after all! They're fine in the dry, just the wet it's a bit hairy IME.
I agree with convert. I think the solution is to bond a super hard resin strip to the braking surface of the rim, ground to a plane and with design characteristics that deliver predictable frictional performance. Perhaps with a custom brake block.
Id also love to see super lightweight, one-piece injected carbon resin (like the new magura lever bodies) calipers designed for 100-120mm rotors on carbon road forks.
It's all to do with heat dissipation. Aluminium is a good heat conductor, carbon isn't so good. Since brakes rely on converting kinetic energy into heat energy, relying on carbon instead of aluminium isn't a great idea on long descents. The way the rim surface varys in heat dissipation / build-up means breaking is variable = grabbed brake on damp road and slid out.
Sam's right, if this year's Tour crashes don't hurry along road disc developments nothing will. Shimano already have the basic mechanism designed in the dual-control.
Am I alone in finding the modern Carbon roadbikes to be really skittish at speed? I just don't have the confidence that I have with my alu bike. I have had the bars jerked right out of my hands over a fast downhill bump on my Madone. It's awesome on the climbs, but really sketchy on the fast descents in my experience.
Am I alone in finding the modern Carbon roadbikes to be really skittish at speed? I just don't have the confidence that I have with my alu bike. I have had the bars jerked right out of my hands over a fast downhill bump on my Madone. It's awesome on the climbs, but really sketchy on the fast descents in my experience.
Just wondering what the weight of the madone is compared to the alu bikes of the past. I find my c20lb steel road bike can be a bit of a handful in cross winds and do wonder if i put a set of light wheels, currently open pros, on it whether it would get worse.