i accept it would require dedicated rims
would it be better?
❓
[sits back] slurps tea [/sits back]
Dunno. Would they be more likely to roll off the rims than road-sized tubs?
You can get MTB tubulars, if that's what you mean by 'TUBs'
[[url= http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4136/4909632649_d06a35b1bc.jp g" target="_blank">
They roll very fast, offer great grip and allow you to use very light rims, but in case of puncture you are pretty much screwed. I guess that's why they don't really get used outside of racing.
Ooh. Those Dugasts are rather lovely.
And rims
http://www.wheelbuilder.com/store/edge-composites-26-xc-tubular-mtb-rim.html
They are light but expensive and hard to fix on the trail.
It was tried out in the early 90s too IIRC (& bombed).
As you say probably a lot to do with requiring a big change in rims rather than allowing people a ghetto option. Tyres would likely cost more and they're more of a pain to repair. I'm assuming you're talking about tubs with sealant in them to? If so if would depend on how long the sealant lasts, would need to be a long time for most people as presumably you couldn't replace the sealant so would be new tub time.
[img] http://www.flickr.com/photos/singularcycles/4909632649/sizes/m/in/photostream/ [/img]
cool
ok, so they are available - all be it in bling format
whats the pro's / cons against tubeless
and why hasn't the industry taken this path mainstream?
Just this second I emailed Chipps a review of the Reynolds MNT-T wheels for the next issue:-)
Tubs are available for CX aren't they ?
It wouldn't be too much of a leap of technology to go from a heavyweight, wide CX rim & tyre to a lightweight, narrow 29er XC rim & tyre.
and why hasn't the industry taken this path mainstream?
They're not *that* mainstream in the world of roadbikes, really only finding themselves on race bikes. I certainly would ride tubs on a training ride - easier to change a tube than put a spare tub on.
I rode on Sunday over "those 3 hills" on tubs. No punctures, plenty of grip and feel - shame I'm not very fast. I used Tufo Flexus Cubus tubs with one scoop of Stans in each on Ambrosio Nemesis rims on Record hubs. The wheels are noticeably lighter than the Neutrons with Crossblasters I used last year.
Tufo make 26" tubs for mtb so it's quite do-able.
[url= http://www.tufo.com/ ]Tufo[/url], [url= http://www.a-dugast.com/ ]Dugast[/url], [url= http://www.geax.com/en/products/?cat=2&prod=1 ]Geax[/url], [url= http://www.fm-boyaux.fr/ ]FMB[/url], [url= http://www.challengetech.it/home.php ]Challenge[/url]. Plus I've seen prototypes from Schwalbe and Continental. They are definitely becoming more popular.
Tubs are pretty old had. Been around for years on the road and fell out of favour in the early 80's. Because people had to carry spare tyres around. they were messy to repair (lots of sticky tape or glue.
They are expensive to repair (needing a needle and thread).
If the tub rolls off the rim it hurts on tarmac and isn't much better for off road.
I can think of 2 good reasons to have them - weight (negated by need to carry a couple of spare tyres) and rolling sweetly.
Punctures, rolloff, messy, expensive, impractical are the reasons not to bother.
I thought the 'evidence' for them rolling faster was mostly heresay anyway.
nickc - Member
I thought the 'evidence' for them rolling faster was mostly heresay anyway.
Depends what you are comparing. On a like for like comparison across modern road tyres it's true there is little difference, and there is also a constant effect of glue increasing rolling resistance. However high thread count clincher mtb tyres simply don't exist. The highest TPI I've ever seen for an MTB tyre is 120. Most tubless rated tyres are 60. Tubulars are usually around 300. This does make a noticeable difference. To the best of my knowledge no empirical test has be done comparing rolling resistance over rough terrain between tubeless mtb tyres and tubulars. However my personal experience on a subjective level is that they feel noticeably faster.
Tubs didn't do too well at the worlds this year though. Lots of top names punctured.
A well glued tub won't roll off a rim. My aching thumbs on saturday after spending an hour removing 2 cyclocross tubs can attest to this....
In fact, one of the reasons cyclocross riders and trackies use tubs is that the tub stays stuck to the rim in the event of a puncture and is rideable just enough to get you out of trouble. It is almost impossible to ride a punctured clincher as the bead flops out so you are more likely to crash with a blowout
perhaps because MTBers like to change their tyres a lot? Having to re glue tubs every week because the conditions have changed is not going to be fun.
It will be interesting to see how well road tubeless takes off in the next few years. The tubeless system seems to be the best compromise of ease of use and puncture resistance etc.
For comparison, how many cars on the roads run tubs and how many are on the equivalent of UST? (i must admit i know nothing about motorbikes though, which would be the best comparison)
anyone using a reflec tub rim offroad? set of hubs im interested in are attached to reflex rims and initially I said i just wanted the hubs but now im kind of tempted to try them (guy has grifo tyres too)
fontmoss, for CX? they're great and very popular
Reflex rims are fine offroad. I use 28s for racing with no bother.
ok now im properly tempted 🙂
Do NOT use Reflex rims with MTB tubulars - anyone got that pic from SSEC?
it'd be grifos - i remember seeing your wheel at SSEC, was that a reflex?
matthewlhome - Member
"Perhaps because MTBers like to change their tyres a lot? Having to re glue tubs every week because the conditions have changed is not going to be fun."
Makes sense, even changing with tubeless is enough of a pain in the baws.
Bontrager are working on a system too apparently...
it'd be grifos - i remember seeing your wheel at SSEC, was that a reflex?
Yep...
does any one want to buy some TUBULAR mtb wheels ?? im selling a brand new set of Reynolds, carbon fibre tub wheels....never used still in the box....2010 model ?
£1100 in shops. i want £550 o.n.o..
07530192197
billy whenman
whyte racing
try the classifieds.
[i]For comparison, how many cars on the roads run tubs and how many are on the equivalent of UST? (i must admit i know nothing about motorbikes though, which would be the best comparison) [/i]
The vast majority of motorbikes are 'UST', with only some off-road and/or little ones running tubes.