I shouldn't have clicked on that Kona link, the new Shonky looks ace 😎
– tensioner. Nope. I want a SS not an unreliable bodge. They just don’t work as well as proper dropouts.
I rode SS exclusively for nearly 2.5 years with a sprung rolhoff tensioner and it never missed a beat. Unlike my sliding drop out chums, who were either faffing about with the correct chain tension, dropping chains due to incorrect chain tension or slipping dropouts, or desperately trying to orient each side of the hub so the wheel wasn't on the squiff and rubbing the rear disc brake.
Leffeboy, an EBB is a different size shell, and the bottom bracket expands to clamp inside the shell at the correct location.
EBB means what it says - eccentric bottom bracket, where the spindle is off-centre, allowing chain tension to be set by rotating the BB. Some might be held in place by lock bolts, some by expanders, and some, like the Sanderson below, by lock rings. Older designs required a specific bespoke frame, but the arrival of pressfit BBs has allowed EBBs to be made that will fit in any frame with the larger diameter that pressfit requires.
I rode SS exclusively for nearly 2.5 years with a sprung rolhoff tensioner and it never missed a beat. Unlike my sliding drop out chums, who were either faffing about with the correct chain tension, dropping chains due to incorrect chain tension or slipping dropouts, or desperately trying to orient each side of the hub so the wheel wasn’t on the squiff and rubbing the rear disc brake.
🙂
I must say as somewhat of a diehard SS fan the thought of using a tensioner does not appeal.
That said I ran a Rohloff one years ago and have just gone back to one on a build and must agree with the above that of all my current SS builds the Rohloff is the least “faffy” in wheel fitting and correcting chain growth - the spring is also frightening strong - watch your fingers kids!
That all said I’m going with a custom SS frame at the moment and that will have an EBB but one similar to a Niner rather than the likes of my Singular with two pinch bolts
Bushnell had a similar (and compattible?) One that had bolts running axially through the BB that drove an expanding wedge, a bit like an old quill stem. Dunno if they were all Bushnell or if companies just copied them.
My Cannondale 1FG had one of these. Was a pain to release (required a hammer) but once set it didn't budge at all.
ISCG doofer as a tensioner on my bike-
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It's loads easier to drop the wheel out if I want/need to. Slotted dropouts are a PITA.
Slotted dropouts are a PITA.
I agree, I don’t want those!
I get there are some tensioners that are probably ok, but better than a tensioner is no tensioner. Current frame (voodoo Bokor from 8 years ago) has sliders that also move the disk mount, never any bother at all ever. Easy to remove the wheel, takes about 20 seconds to tweak the tension to adjust for chain wear when needed, and 10 of those are flipping the bike.
What you want is s Stooge.
If the current Mk4 isn’t what your after then a second hand one will be the right tool for the job. Yes they are rigid but my MK3 has a tapered head tube so can run modern suspension forks. I ran mine with 120mm bounce, it was far more capable than me, until I went to the rigid forks.
If you are spendy then Mr Andy Stooge will build you a custom Ti one with your exact requirements.
The EEB on my Stooge hasn’t creaked, groaned or slipped. Same as the one on the Sanderson Soloist I had before. Nearly every issue with EBB is user error.
https://www.bikeperfect.com/news/pivot-revives-the-carbon-singlespeed-hardtail/blockquote >
Lovely, but how much!?!
Beard & sandals alive & well here.
SIR.9 with the Niner biocentric EBB.
Puffin with the Singular pinch bolt EBB.
Of the two, the Singular has been rock solid, never creaked or moved.
The Niner has creaked & clicked from day one, wether greased, dry, talcum powdered (yes!!), carbon assembly grease seems to work though.
It is the earlier biocentric though, I gather the latter double bolt version is better.
What you want is s Stooge
Nah, i want spanky fast rather than “capable” and also “one size fits all” will never be right for me - I’m in the 99th percentile for height. From a quick look at the geo chart I’d be on a stem the wrong side of 100mm to make that fit right I reckon, and suspect end up sat somewhere odd with a long enough post.
Thanks to those clearing up EBB confusion, I though EBB was a standard but it sounds like it covers a range of methods to allow an bottom bracket to move 🙂
I’ve got a Pivot Les. Really nice xc bike which I’ll be racing tomorrow actually. The Swinger dropout system is beautifully made and the really cool thing about it is that there is enough adjustment that I can run a 15T to 22T sprocket on the back without having to change the chain length. With a 38T chainring I can easily choose a nice gear for the occasion with the sprocket change taking a couple of mins.
Picked up a whole bike for £1200 secondhand which is good as it’s a pricy frame.
Picked up a whole bike for £1200 secondhand which is good as it’s a pricy frame.
Yep. £2300 for a carbon hardtail frame is certainly that.
I like to see these SS threads popping up from time to time, good to know some interest is still alive.
I was on SS exclusively from 2008 to around 2012. It was a combination of factors for me:
- I was a poor student
- I hated front derailleurs to my guts
- I tried a 29er and loved it
- xc/trailish suspension forks back then were, imo, cr@p
Circa '08 or '09, if you shared any of these conditions and spent too much time at the MTBR forums there was only one type of bike to have, a 29er SS steel rigid.
This fad was interesting as it arose from enthusiast interest rather than marketing.
I built myself a nice Singular Swift, one of the very first blue SS specific ones. It was a beautiful, elegant, efficient and comfortable bike. Back then fun for me was more akin to cram 2000m of gain in 50km than doing some road gap or hitting that rock garden at 40m/h.
The biggest issue for me with SS is that in order for it to be fun I needed to stay in great shape. I started back then to do other competitive sports and going back on the bike became a chore.
Fast forward to the last couple of years and 1x drivetrains are worlds better. And forks are unbelievable good. And now you have what's essentially a shorter travel DH bike that's reliable, comfortable and fun up and down. And along the definition of MTB fun shifts with it.
Sometimes I miss riding SS, but can't really see the point anymore.
Talking to other people I heard this pattern several times. I guess SS was somewhat of a "protest" against the crappy bikes and components we were offered back then
No protest for me. Made sense to have one gear 20 years ago and still makes sense today. The places I ride haven't changed.
I generalised a bit because that's a story I heard several times.
But I'm sure it's still making plenty of people happy
Didn’t someone make an EBB for normal threaded BB shells? Probably spendy though, and if memory serves it needed a half link in the chain.
Edit: These
I loved my Mk2 Scandal and I'm sure the new Mk3 (?) would be fab.
I went for a Stache frame in the end as Stif had sold out of Chameleons. I'm very happy with my Stache, but would probably be just as happy with the Chameleon. Another one worth a look is the Specialized Fuze / Fuse, which looks really well executed. Bear in mind these are all a bit mainstream if you've got a real singlespeed niche thing going on. 😉
I've owned a Singular Hummingbird in the past (I'm too little to fit one of Sam's Swifts) and it is / was a simply perfect frame if you want to go 26" wheels.
It's probably worth bearing in mind that the current geo thinking probably works really well for singlespeed use, so don't discount something that takes longer forks at the front; I'm running 130mm Fox 34s on the Stache and it's an absolute hoot; I have a pair of Genesis carbon rigids in the shed that need a bit of a tweak before they'll fit, but would turn it into a really stupid XC pain machine that'll likely kill off my blobby old fat bloke a**e these days. Looking at what you're asking for, I suspect the Chameleon might actually be quite a fun option - it's quite a bit longerer for each size than the equivalent Stache. There's a crabon option too, I think.
I built up a cheap single speed with bits and pieces that I had in the garage. I bought a second hand Voodoo Bizango 29 frame and stuck all the bits on it .
I love riding it as it makes you fitter and faster. I hold my PB’s on Twrch (54 mins) and Cafall (1hr 1 min) on this bike , it’s quicker than my old Stumpjumper and my Signal Ti. On the ups anyway! Oh and it has sliding drop outs. If you don’t care about the image it’s a great bike.
, I suspect the Chameleon might actually be quite a fun option
They come in big enough sizes, but it’s not an XC bike really. I’m sure I’d like how it rides well enough but it’s not what I want for my SS. I like something a bit fast and dangerous that feels like it might have me if I’m not paying attention. Doesn’t need to be “capable” for big rough stuff etc, it’s for hacking round the woods.
If you don’t care about the image it’s a great bike.
For sure, my current frame is a voodoo, but it’s had a lot of use over many years and is getting pretty tired. Already had the bottle bosses come loose three times and next stage will require drilling them out to attempt to replace them which might end in tears, hence looking at options.
Surly Tensioner all day long...
had a Cannondale 29er SS & from day one the BB creaked, tried everything. Ended up locktite into place... & then surly tensioner, never missed a beat (just had to buy a new dropout (eBay) no more creaks... but it was a Cannondale I suppose.
Not all EBBs are the same. Yes a Cannondale EBB can be a bit creaky, but a Bushnell isn't.
I would rather spend the money on a Bushnell than have a chain tensioner personally as part of the appeal of single speed to me is the clean looking bike. A tensioner just looks like a bodge to me (however well they work)
The simplest solution is track ends but they admittedly become a pain when using discs.
My mate has built a Tarn up SS this winter and he's enjoying the challenge.
I would have another if I had more space for an extra bike, because it felt like a big BMX and made me smile. But there was no getting away from the fact that round here in Calderdale it wasn't great for group riding. As the only SS rider the climbs were a lonely place where everybody else chatted and I heaved.
Kona Raijin? Spendy, but very nice. Has your preferred dropouts, non-Boost spacing and traditional XC geo:
https://shop.bikesandbuddies.co.uk/kona-explosif-ti-frame.html?id=87980210&quantity=1
https://2017.konaworld.com/raijin_frame.cfm
Ah wrong link in my last post: https://shop.bikesandbuddies.co.uk/kona-raijin-ti-frame.html
My first SS
Having received the Onion back after its extended loan, I thought I'd try to make some use of it.
Cheapo ring and SS kit and I have a gadabout. Still want some rigid forks for it, and probably flatter bars.
I have some Ice tyres ready to fit fior the forthcoming snowpocalypse too.
Chain tensioner works for me. Had to cut a notch out to clear the drop outs on my Titus fire line. I've run this set up for a couple of years now without issues.
Love riding ss in the winter mud. Low maintenance don't have to worry about mech getting torn off etc. Need to maintain fitness to get up the steeper hills around here but great for messing around in the woods.
Tried an ebb on a payoff and didnt have much luck. It kept slipping so I switched to a modified tensioner. There are no bolts on the shell to clamp it in place. I get the best results from the gusset tensioners.
Scotroutes I forgot all about your tensioner!
I do have some carbon onone forks though alloy crown jobs.
Scotroutes I forgot all about your tensioner!
I do have some carbon onone forks though alloy crown jobs.
Nae probs. This is a cheapie off Amazon.
Forks - do you think for one moment I'd put a set of On One forks near my precious?
Arranged the EBB on my Swift when it was SS, so that any slippage moves the axis of the BB away from the rear wheel - so increasing chain tension as it tries to revolve. You can put it between 9-12 or 3-6 position. I like a low BB and a high STA so put it 3-6 position as you look at it side on non drive side. Can't say I ever had any movement, creek or trouble with, though I did take it out, clean it all and smear it with that blue Mobil grease before I ever used it in anger. I think its a Phill Wood one in there that Singular uses. Also used it with Race Face Atlas cranks which with a heat treated steel axle were mighty stiff in the BB like I've never felt before or since. Maybe that helped. Certainly helped with the mashing uphill!
Forks – do you think for one moment I’d put a set of On One forks near my precious?
I did think that for a second but I did notice you were looking on bear bones and they're basically exotics with removable stickers 😀
Did you check the sizing for the large Stooge mk3? I think the mk3 came in two sizes, and it's also the only one that would also take a tapered 100m fork (mk 1 and 2 are 1 1/8 I think, and mk3 has non-sus corrected forks).
You're right, it's not light, but I can't think of much else that would suit otherwise, unless you move on the dropouts: Soma Juice? And the Pace frames have adjustable dropouts too I think?
Dropouts are probably the one thing I don’t want to shift on!
The juice looks good.
So far I think the list looks like:
- Soma Juice
- Brother Big Bro
- Pivot Les
I've been toying with the idea of a single speed to replace my fixie. Wife has said no though currently as the small people both need new bikes plus some nonsense about needing a holiday.
What I have never figured out is why all the single speeds I've seen on eBay seem to be up north in very hilly areas or Cornwall. No one seems to ride single speed round Anglia were it's flat and ideal for a single speed!
That’ll be cos flat is the most annoying terrain for SS.
Going downhill you spin out then can cruise, going up hill you crank harder, get up faster - it’s fine. Long flat stretches you either go real slow (and fall behind on group rides) or maintain a punishing high cadence that kills you.
Aye, long flat rides are worst on SS.
Nothing to add to this except I have a Broken Road and a Stanton Sherpa. Both XL and in Berkshire if you want to try them. The Sherpa is the best steel hardtail I have ridden for fit and ride quality. Sadly its a mk1 so vertical drop outs only and I cant abide tensioners personally and havent used a tensioner for over 10 years. Shame as if it was a mk2 I would run it singlespeed. I'd not let a couple of chain tugs get in the way of a better riding bike than most. I did mull over getting sliding drop outs fitted but will revive my old Ti29er if need a singlespeed again.
Agree with last couple of comments, singlespeed is great as long as you are not riding up cliffs (or the North face of the South Downs) but I would only ride it on a 'flat' ride if it was mainly wiggly singletrack. Flat bridleways and especially road sections are hell on a low geared singlespeed, and I think sustained high cadence light load is also the worst for starting to get knee pain.
P.S remember to look at PF30 frames if you are happy using the problem solvers/wheel components/niner biocentric 30 BB's, not heard any bad reports.
I nearly bought a secondhand Production Privee OKA which might be worth looking at, until I realised the seller had it down as the wrong size (lesson, always send off the frame number to the manufacturer!)
Singlespeeds are fine on the flat if the whole area is flat as you just run a higher gear. When geared for hills the gearing is so low that it becomes a chore on the flat bits.
So far I think the list looks like:
– Soma Juice
– Brother Big Bro
– Pivot Les
The dropouts on the Soma are smart, better design than the generic type many bikes use that put a fair bit of leverage on the SS and CS join. Whole frame looks good actually.
