[Closed] Wheel builders - Advise me on spokes please

At your weight you could easily get away with ultralight DT revolution/sapim laser spokes but they require a degree of experience to manage twist during build so I wouldn't.

Conventional double butted sapim race/DT competition give a bit away in weight but are much easier to manage twist on. I usually get sapim race from the cycle clinic - £16 for 32, 50p a spoke incl nipples is about as good as it gets

Bladed spokes are expensive and lightweight (sapim cxray) but easy to manage twist with something to grip the blade

Plain gauge spokes only advantage is price

Use nipple washers on non-eyelet rims. Eyelet rims don't really need them.

Built many sets of wheels for myself and friends.. Never used washers as never seen the need.
I prefer double butted spokes as they give a slightly different(comfier) ride to the plain guage variety..most come with brass nipples when you order anyway.
I tend to use sapim as they normally pop up cheap but have used aci as well although they do leave a residue(lube maybe?) on my hands after use.
Follow Sheldon Browns way to build and you won't go far wrong.. Enjoy

edit: keir wins the typing race.

The washers reduce the chance of the spoke hole cracking on non-eyeleted rims, which probably won't be a big problem with your weight and spoke count. Some rims are more prone to it however, I know several Velocity Blunt SSs that have cracked under light riders, for example, so it depends. If using washres the spokes will need to be longer by their thickness.

Thicker spokes are cheaper and easier to build, as they dont twist as much when tightening. Bladed spokes are easiest, since you can keep them straight with a tool, but they are also the most expensive. Straight gauge to moderately butted would probably be the best bet.

edit2: Not really common, but I built up a set of wheels with Newmen rims recently, and their warranty is only effective if the wheels are built with their own washers.

Excellent, thanks guys.

Reliability and ease of maintenance are more important than weight on this build.

The rims don't have eyelets so I may add nipple washers just to be safe. It sounds like Sapim Race are what I am looking for in terms of weight/cost/performance.

Check the washers you get. I made the mistake of getting the sampin ones last time which are too big to fit through the hole in the inner rim, they only need to be slightly bigger than the nipple itself.

If you’re just thinking about decent double butted spokes then Sapim/ DT Swiss Competition / ACI double butted are all ok. Every time I’ve looked I’ve found aci (from Cycle Basket) are the cheapest as they come with brass nipples in the price quoted on their website. DT Swiss aren’t much more expensive from Rose Bikes but you have to add the cost of nipples to them (although if you get fancy DT Swiss rims they may well come with spokes and phr nipple washers (my XM481 mtb rims did).

If you’re new to building wheels then I’d suggest when lacing them up you take your time. I found sitting down with a couple of pints of cider and Sheldon Brown’s website on a tablet was best 😃

I then started the tensioning process another day and on the 2nd set of wheels I built I bought a park tools spoke tension meter. Used that on subsequent sets of wheels and so far they’ve all stayed taught and true.

Cheers TINAS, I hadn't even considered the washer size.

Thanks Joe, you've given me a few things to think about there. I'll check out Cycle Basket for prices.

It's my first time building wheels, I've trued wheels before but nothing more. I was planning on copying the lacing pattern from the existing wheels on that bike. I'll probably do as you did and spread the process over a few days.

I wouldn't bother with washers unless they are silly light rims (Like Alpha 340s).

sdeals used to do ACI spokes at a good price.

Nipple washers seem to be making a come-back lately. I didn't see any for years but they are coming with some carbon and DT rims in particular.

Personally as this is your first build and if you are buying rims that don't come with them, I wouldn't bother. No offence but they are a minor pain in the butt and as you've not built a wheel before there's a chance that you'd forget one or two, install one or two the wrong way around or more realistically install some stuck together. They are so thin that it's easy to pick 'one' up and install it without noticing that there's more than one stuck together.
They are so thin that I wouldn't worry about the spoke calc though, unless you are already trying to use a spoke length that is border-line wrong anyway (i.e. the spoke calc says 271.5 not including washers and you are wanting to use 270 because you have them rather than 272).

I’ve been building my own wheels for almost 10 years and have never used nor had need of nipple washers. I’ve built everything from road bike to fat bike wheels on both Carbon and aluminium rims.

My go-to spoke these days are Sapim D-lights. They only give away a few grams to lightweight DT revolution, are cheaper and far less flexible/twisty.

As far as I'm concerned, nipple washers only if the manufacturer insists, in which case, bollocks to that, use a different rim that doesn't need all that pissing about. There's no shortage of good rims without the embuggerment.

DT Competition Race has always seemed like a pretty ideal allround spoke, except for the fact it's basically impossible to buy them online because every single hit will be for normal comps. It's the worst idea for a name since the band A.

Never had any issues with Lasers winding up personally, and I'm definitely pretty much a half-competent knobber. Maybe depends if you're using locking nipples and the like, I just use plain + oil. I think Sapim still say not to use them for MTB use? But I built my first wheels with them before I knew that, and they're still going strong so I just ignored it completely for later ones.

Thanks all. Based on the above I'll probably avoid the washers and the assocaited faff.

I was planning on using some WTB KOM road/cx rims. I've read that they're soft but I don't have a track record for trashing rims so was considering giving them a try. They're also cheap as they're an older model so if I do damage them I won't have wasted too much cash.

ACI double butted spokes seem reasonable at 45p each for black or 28p each for silver. I'm tempted to go silver due to price, but I do think black look better so will probably pay the extra for them. I've no plans to use any fancy locking nipples or anything, I was planning on reliability and easy spares availability more than anything.