Hi
Does anyone know to what extenet the Justice trail at the Jedforest is waymarked? Cheers!
Badly!, was down recently and got lost 3 times trying to find the trail head then got lost again on the way round. On meeting another group of riders at the end, the general consensus was that the trails are pretty crap and it was a wasted day. There are better place to ride in that area imo
Right -someone else said something similar! Thanks -may give it a miss then.
I did it a couple of years ago and didn't have any problems with the route at all. I did have an OS Map with me though. It's not a trail centre route, so you shouldn't need to rely too heavily on the signs, just normal navigation...
Edited to add - I quite enjoyed it, even though it was the muddiest ride I've ever done (it was winter IIRC) - I would do it again.
Hi bigdugsbaws,
Sorry to hear you got lost on the way round, can you let me know whereabouts? We're always trying to improve signage so am interested where this was.
Also when was it you were down? We've had new signage put up from the main carpark, which is the start, (there isn't a trailhead as such) to lead riders outwards from there to where the trail (wooden) waymarkers start.
Hey, Swello, glad you enjoyed the trails.
Cheers,
From what I remember from a few years ago, the waymarking philosophy on the Justice Trail tends to be that turns off the path you're on are marked. Unlike, say, the 7 Stanes, you don't get a signpost to tell you to stay on the current path if there's another one leading off to one side or the other.
Hi ChrisL,
Yep, that's about right, although we've now added confirmational waymarkers on some of the longer stretches e.g. when following the Abbey Ways when returning to Jed.
We are always trying to improve things hence my question to the OP...
Was discussing this trail at the weekend with someone - I quite enjoyed it - tho it did need a map when I did it - same as ChrisL says - in fact I think I rode it with him and MTB Scotland 😕
Felt like some of the VTT trails I have been on in Vosges - not trail centre - not big mountain - but old routes linked together and a bit of fun added in. I tdoes seem to be a bovril trail - Make a day trip to Jedburgh and decide to enjoy 🙂
Maybe our expectations are too high and we dont appreciate all the other good riding out there
We were directed the wrong way by the young girl at the tourist info office and the tiny photocopied maps supplied didnt give much clue how to get back on track (no map was taken as the guidebook states that the route is clearly waymarked!!). Again after the radio mast the trail petered away and it was not clear at all which way to go. There were some nice bits on the trail (very short) but on the whole it seemed that they were linked by huge fireroad sections making the whole experience pretty unmemorable - like Glentrool minus the scenery.
Stravaiger, it was me you were talking to about that trail at the weekend!
bigdug, thanks for coming back to this and telling me what happened, it is much appreciated. I can't help what the girl in the tourist told you, we have tried in the past to explain\engage with them but to no avail, it is only recently I was made aware they didn't have any maps and were making photocopies - I know it doesn't help you but they now have the leaflets with full colour maps.
Obviously it doesn't absolve me of the responsibility for the waymarking, we have had feedback in general that it's okay, although some bits need attention. That bit from the mast is meant to be waymarked but I think cattle stock in the fields have a habit of rubbing themselves off on the posts and pushing them over... I'll be getting that bit sorted asap.
Out of interest what guidebook are you refering too?
I'm glad you found some nice bits.
Done it twice now and enjoyed it for the most part. We downloaded the map iirc and only made a couple of small errors but it is a good effort and should be supported rather than slagged off!
Guidebook was Bike Scotland Trails Guide 2nd ed. The route has potential dont get me wrong, but is far from the flowery description in the guide. (The other group we met on the trail had visited due to the same guide and felt the same disappointment).
it was me you were talking to about that trail at the weekend!
oops - sorry - too many new faces to put names to 😕
[i]Guidebook was Bike Scotland Trails Guide 2nd ed. [/i]
Many thanks for the info, I'll check out that guide.
i second what bigdugsbaws say, mainly for the reason i was with him that day(and every other bloody cycling day). We (3 of us,plus 6 lasses we met at the end), thought it was poorly signposted at the beginning where we spend 45 minutes riding before we even found the trail( originally going the wrong way around the trail by the castle). The worst part was by the mast when you head towards the gate. The sign says go across the field, so we did and judging by the amount of tyre trails so did loads of others, but we should of headed down the wall ( only realising this after we seen a sign a mile after the gate). From there on back it was not bad signposted though. The thing that got us was if we didn't get lost it would of been forgettable(easily), and there was no real parts of the trail that stood out, Everything seemed to be a slog.We all agreed we wouldn't return there..........ever, the way the trail is just now
Hi radoggair,
Thanks for the specific location of signage problems from the mast, we do have waymarkers up there which have in the past been pushed over by cattle I guess this is what has happenend; I know it doesn't help you now (or ever) but this I'll be sorting asap.
Can you let me know when it was you were down? I ask as we have recently had new signage put up from the carpark and it would help to know if you were down before this or not to gauage it's effectiveness.
Many thanks,
Has the route been extended now to its original plan? Last time I was there was a couple of years ago, and we tagged on the planned route up to the viewpoint and back down through the woods. Thought that bit would have been really fun if there had been a proper trail to follow!
We did it when it was mostly bone dry, and therefore not much of a slog, but given that I've not even considered going back shows that once was enough I'm afraid. (Although I'm glad that there are still locals committed to maintaining and improving the route.)
[i]Has the route been extended now to its original plan?[/i]
Yep we did that quite a while ago now and have boardwalked up the climb where you turn of the road to make it a little easier, still not easy though, in fact a bit of a barsteward otherwise known as a challenge. The trails through the wood need another go at maintainence and we've just started using a local company to help us out so hopefully we'll get that bit sorted.
taken from the web site
The Justice Trail
Please note as these trails are ‘natural’ and not armoured in their entirety, then depending on the weather, there may well be wet and muddy sections; fair weather trails - as described in a mountain bike article.
Jedforest Trails is a group made up of volunteers from the local community who came together to develop a multi user path network around Jedburgh for walkers, cyclists and horse riders
TIC and tourist board have been as helpfull as a stick in your front wheel
Every horse rider in the area seems to think its ok to trash the trails
Local community have not seen the potential and some are down right negative
frankly im just amazed by the dedication of others who persist in keeping the project alive and arrange everything from signage to drainage to maps etc
i lost the faith long ago but in my opinion its just the spoon fed generation that dont get it !
its not a trail centre and never ever wanted to be 😯
other than that i rode most of it yesterday and it was IMHO great ride
somewhere between a ride in the cheviots and having the security of never being far from town .
maybe we have created a niche thats not required or others just dont get ?
Me and my dog Zack seem to get the benefit though 😉
p.s if your in the area st cuthbers way is worth a wee look at wink wink
p.s if you ask the tourist board
you are only actually supposed to cycle at the tweed valley
bit of a rant but very true
go on call them and ask where you can MTB in the scottish borders
getting lost does seem to be an issue
i had one guy from a website doing a review looking at a map outside my house which is other side of the valley about 2 miles off track .
maybe some more directional arrows ao this map would be of help
MOD: Link removed due to malware
think the original plan was to encourage people to pick up free trail maps at TIC and decide for them self what way or how much they wanted to ride
Then we discovered they dont open weekends in the winter FFS !
there was also the land owner who keeps pullling signs down
the landowner who built a house on a permissive path
blah blah rant rant
etc etc etc
I was with bigdug and raddogair that day. Have to say, if I hadn't been just generally happy to be on the bike due to the fine weather and the fact I hadn't ridden in so long, I would have been a lot more peeved at the end of the day.
I wasn't and don't expect trail centre trails everywhere I ride and its totally commendable that the effort has been made to get this trail together. But the description in the guide book is far out from the reality and thats what led to disappointment. There is absolutely no thrilling element to the ride, its a slog up hills followed by a dawdle down with the purpose of losing altitude and getting from a-to-b rather than extract any fun from the process. I'm not complaining about the trail as such. Certainly its not for me but if you like being out on the bike for being-out-the-bike's sake, i.e. fresh air, exercise, countryside views etc, then why not? But a more realistic description would be fairer on those making the trip to ride there.
As for directions, a clearer direction from the car park is needed and the map could do with directional arrows on. And the section after the 'shore' climb from the road could do with being clearer.
We were there about a month ago btw.
all very good points jimmy
i remember for instance MBR article was a bit of a cut and paste job
at least WMB actually came and got a guide round the trails .
there several "review" that i have read that i can tell straight away they have not ever ridden all the route if any!
i have to take resposibility for the description on the leaflets as i came up with the first description.its my type of riding and maybe it was through rose tinted glasses .
What dissapoints me is that none of the mags picked up on the fact the project was a multi user pathway group in scotland and not long after the land reform act. permissions given for waymarking by over a dozen land owners etc. probably even a bigger article in there now after all that tony and susan have come up against.
Mbr reported more on my local knowledge
WMB done a pretty fair article and pointed out it could be wet ,muddy and over grown
bike fax gave a fair review
the new trail centre book put us in but were not a trail centre!
MBR was more of a local knowledge article
p.s if i sound off its as im disapointed it did not reach its potential .certainly not having a go at any of the comments above in fact i agree with most of them .
Theres so much riding around here ,totally legal , great views and land owners who are "mostly" supportive. it begs the question did we need a waymarked trail? for experienced riders that look at a map NO as its so easy to look at a map and link up st cuthberts way,dere street , drove roads and rights of way.
from a pull up and ride point of view yes its a good idea especially when as many riders are passing through the area.
maybe im just a tad eccentric enjoying that type of ride over theme park rides?
DTD - your comment sums up what I was going to put but didn't want to rubbish the whole scheme;
it begs the question did we need a waymarked trail? for experienced riders that look at a map NO as its so easy to look at a map
Thats exactly it. There is probably an assumption that, given Jedburgh's location, the Justice Trail is part of the 7Stanes and combined with the description people will expect that kind of riding. Ultimately its just a local route with waymarkers which doesn't do justice (ha, the irony) to the level of exposure it has had.
Sorry for your disappointment. If you enjoy it, though, keep it quiet and its all yours 🙂
I've been following this one with some interest. I've been around the JT once - it was [i]very[/i] muddy, but I look forward to doing it again. I guess I'm one of those folk who just like being outdoors on the bike, and the idea of a pre-planned route, put together with local input, seems great. I also recall that the FCS were looking at [i]exactly[/i] this sort of thing a couple of years back as a way of weening folk away from "trail centres" and on to more old-school stuff. I think they were calling them Epic routes.
Anyroadup - hats off to everyone involved in the venture (past and present).
Yep Im with druidh on this one,I did it a couple of years ago and at the time felt dissapointed after such glowing reviews in the bike mags.
It is a credit to the locals who have worked hard to build it in the first place though,but its a shame its not quite good enough to draw some of us back to it.
I've not done the whole loop in a oner so sounds like I've maybe not run into the tricky bits where a map comes in handy but have done a couple of sections.
The Lanton loop was ideal for going round with kids and I had a comedy/faintly ridiculous evening last summer in the Swinney Plantation where I was ploughing through thick bracken over head height for what seemed like miles!
But I've got to agree with the positive points above and I'm impressed with the persistance keeping it going. Obviously this kind of thing can be done from a map, but Ordinance Survey only tells half the story - a marked route just makes it easier 😉
The problem with not signposting stuff is for us riders that dont live there its difficult to find routes, mainly for the fact you dont want to ride down a path only for it to be crap or not lead anywhere. Its like me saying, do innerleithen there's hundreds of trails there, but if you have never been before, would you veer of waymarked routes or follow the signposts??
Back to Justice trails, what you need to do is look at it from an outsiders perspective, or take along a rider who's never been before and ask him to lead the ride. Everytme he/she asks 'where now' you know you need to signpost.
We originally headed 3 ways, but then after coming down from the castle and straight through the high street we cut off left down by the river path(because thats where signs with bikes led us). That took us to the main road where the river goes under and crosses the road. From there we got puzzled but crossed the road and headed up the road where we 'joined' the trail rather than 'being' on it.From there to the mast it was o.k. but from mast it was badly posted. The trails were good natural stuff but the problem was the climbs were not rewarded with a good descent or anything technical, as Jimmy said, a way to get from A to B. Also, apart from 2 sections the trails did not flow well and were not really fast. They seemed to be a constant pedalling trail rather than any fun involved. I'm not asking for trail centre stuff here, we have trail centres for that, but i was looking for a rewarding trail. This was not one of those. Think the trail needs to be revised or redesigned. Although the way it stands i will not be back, i do wish you good luck in the future
[url= http://jedartjusticetrailpicturesandviews.fotopic.net/p24655041.html ][/url]my efforts are now all put in to strimming and clearing all the deer track around the estate where i live to make it rideable.
forgot to add that i know have 7km of trail on my door stepand theres loads of other good stuff around here that was not possible to put on a map of waymark for several reasons.
so i would like offer my services if anyone is coming to the town and fancys seeing the best of the trails 😆
please feel free t mail me (email in profile) i will glady show the STW masses around my local trails .
p.s my bark is worse than my bite (this offer does come with government health warning as this fellow trail dweller may try to pee on you saddle ) 😯
http://jedartjusticetrailpicturesandviews.fotopic.net/p24655041.html
[url= http://jedartjusticetrailpicturesandviews.fotopic.net/p24655041.html ][/url]