That fork thing is quite insane, but it probably doesn't exclude as many purchases as we imagine. I only know a few riders that would be comfortable with removing and refitting forks compared to all of the riders I know (even though it is a relatively trivial piece of work)
Im guessing ian@giant is now ex ian@giant as he costs them thousands in sales 😀
Giant not coming out of this very well. :-/
I wouldn't touch them with a shitty stick after this.
#Message_typed_whilst_wearing_very_nice_trousers
I wonder if the fork removal message is just the same CS guy making shit up because he realised he had to follow on from the bullshit reason they rejected it in the first place. I mean his response is the logical conclusion to the policy so he kinda had to make it up. I realise this puts actual Giant policy in a better light, but it might just be some entrenched always rightism of the individual rather than a reasonable response.
That fork thing is quite insane, but it probably doesn’t exclude as many purchases as we imagine. I only know a few riders that would be comfortable with removing and refitting forks compared to all of the riders I know
What about a wheel, or related to the OPs case, a seatpost?
leffeboy
That fork thing is quite insane, but it probably doesn’t exclude as many purchases as we imagine. I only know a few riders that would be comfortable with removing and refitting forks compared to all of the riders I know (even though it is a relatively trivial piece of work)
By the same logic, you need to go to a dealer to change a puncture
Has anyone tried popping into a Giant dealership and asking about the Warranty. Do I need to bring it in drop the forks out? Etc
Aye Giant is crying into its millions right now 😉
Has anyone tried popping into a Giant dealership and asking about the Warranty. Do I need to bring it in drop the forks out? Etc
There are so many conflicting explanations from Giant, their employees, their partners and previous warranty customers that the waters are going to be muddied further. Ian@giant has had a first pass at explaining the situation, and he's the top Giant guy in the UK apparently, so presumably his word is gospel, although I don't really think it's the immutable truth- I would be really surprised if things don't change dramatically over the next few days, and it'll probably take Giant a few more goes to put out something that sounds coherent, thought through and reasonable rather than the utter garbage that has been pushed out so far.
It's threads like these that remind me why I love this forum. Everyone gets a chance to join the pile-on, some idiot turns up with an ill-advised defence, then we all go back to wondering what colour anodised bits would go well on our fantasy frame.
Perhaps Ian at Giant would like to explain in his best corporate-doublespeak whether inserting/removing/adjusting the height of a seatpost is something that should only be done by an authorised Giant dealer as a "service" item. After all, this is something that:
Everyone on here would consider trivially easy
Might be something you do regularly - just to transport your bike
Is presumably something that you'd still need to do if you ordered on-line and your bike was delivered "assembled" by your local Giant dealer
Appears (based on what we know from this discussion) to be at the crux of why Wysiwyg's warranty claim won't be entertained.
So we can't run the three chains to prolong drivetrain, we can't change tyres, replace brake pads. What about putting lights on? All need to be done by a giant authorised mechanic?
vinnyeh
Ian@giant has had a first pass at explaining the situation, and he’s the top Giant guy in the UK apparently, so presumably his word is gospel
His words are pretty much worthless, given the fact that the people actually dealing with warranties don't have the same interpretation
Going back to my Whyte warranty experience, due to the original supplying shop's inability to see me due to their covid policies at the time I went to another Whyte dealer and they did the wheel strip/rebuild for a fee, but gave me a receipt to send to the original retailer for a refund.
I wonder if this is the scenario the OP's LBS recreated but without telling the OP about the refund?
Either way, good luck OP, given that the large bike shop that supplied the bike in the first place did a really poor job of setting it up I too will stick to doing my own servicing and rely on Whyte continuing to be reasonable should I need them in the future.
So not bothered that forks are serviced by TF, are they a Giant retailer then?
Theres a lot of stuff in this thread that has me shaking my head but the thing thats currently puzzling me most is how the hell did that Ian chap get the top job at Giant UK ? I still hold the opinion that submitting a small claims court claim would sort this out PDQ but I know first hand from a cultural perspective Giants executive team back at HQ would be very embarrassed and disappointed the matter was not resolved long before this thread became such a saga. I think this thread should be brought to their attention.
So not bothered that forks are serviced by TF, are they a Giant retailer then?
Presumably the Fox forks wouldn't be warranted by Giant. Is it Silverfish for Fox in the UK?
Presumably the Fox forks wouldn’t be warranted by Giant. Is it Silverfish for Fox in the UK?
Presume nothing with Giant it seems
Oh come on @ian@giant, it's an open goal, make up some 'special circumstances in this situation, considering the disassembly was performed by a qualified mechanic' bollocks and send the guy a new frame. It's getting silly.
What if I want to go on holiday with my bike? To preserve the warranty, do I need to take it to a Giant retailer to pack it into a bike bag, and then take it to another Giant retailer on the other side to reassemble it?
Perhaps Ian at Giant would like to explain in his best corporate-doublespeak whether inserting/removing/adjusting the height of a seatpost is something that should only be done by an authorised Giant dealer as a “service” item. After all, this is something that:
Everyone on here would consider trivially easy
Might be something you do regularly – just to transport your bike
Is presumably something that you’d still need to do if you ordered on-line and your bike was delivered “assembled” by your local Giant dealer
Appears (based on what we know from this discussion) to be at the crux of why Wysiwyg’s warranty claim won’t be entertained.
I would also love to hear someone from Giant explain this one, with the final point being the key bit.
Oh come on @ian@giant, it’s an open goal, make up some ‘special circumstances in this situation, considering the disassembly was performed by a qualified mechanic’ bollocks and send the guy a new frame. It’s getting silly.
That's nowhere near good enough any more imo.
If I were to ever consider buying a Giant again in the future, I'd want some sort of assurance that the warranty was actually worth something.
Giant introducing their new so called direct to consumer option seems to suggest it's for people who live a considerable distant from an authorised dealer, (otherwise what's the point) so how are those customers supposed to adhere to their ridiculous terms, and as already alluded to, what would be the waiting time to book your bike in if every customer adhered to the draconian irrational rules, and surely they'd be sick of the sight of you even if they're taking your money on a regular basis, and when you buy a giant off the shop floor do they come home with you in your car to put the front wheel back on before you give them a lift back to the shop, seems time consuming 😀
make up some ‘special circumstances in this situation, considering the disassembly was performed by a qualified mechanic’ bollocks
Only remotely useful for those of the rest of us who also hold a proper ticket
Wow, not much to add except this has resulted in me never looking at Giant for a bike again, shame as I've owned two in the past.
Not only the initial denial but then doubling down - that's not a company that cares at all about what its customers think.
In my experience, it's more common for manufacturers to not cover shipping / admin (which can take a lot of time in terms of online form filling / emails etc), and labour unless it's a recurring issue or recall. Kudos to the companies that do!
In this day and age, sending parts back is a bit of a joke unless it's a weird issue. Where I am, Trek, Norco and Transition has just accepted the dealers word along with photographic proof along with serial number and photo of the complete bike where relevant.
I used to work for one of the larger brands (not Giant) and we hardly ever asked for full bikes for inspection unless it was a bit unusual - we'd just go by photos uploaded by the dealers.
Giant will be fully aware if this frame is prone to cracking in this way. If it's a known thing just send out a new frame job done.
If it was an unusal failure I'd have thought they would show a little more interest and not be so hard nosed about it!
I think it was mentioned above but it sounds like an order has come down from HQ to save as much as possible on warranty spend.
Can I just say how shocked I am that most mental thread of the year so far is actually centered around bikes.
the thing thats currently puzzling me most is how the hell did that Ian chap get the top job at Giant UK ?
Without Ian Giant would be GT.
Oh dear giant. Wish I’d seen this before getting a TCR 12 months ago. Looks like it’ll be my first and last giant. Shame as they make nice bikes and I was looking at getting an xc bike soon. I think Ian needs to get back on and try to sort things. Sure this thread won’t break giant, but suspect it’ll lose them a few sales and if the more people know how hilariously crap giant’s warranty policy is the better. Hope then OP gets this sorted.
Thing is, at least they're being honest, and it's obvious they never intend to stand by their warranty.
They could have easily said "we've inspected it and we believe the damage to be caused by an improperly installed seatpost". That might be questionable, but it wouldn't necessarily mean a future boycott of all Giant bikes.
Without Ian Giant would be GT.
Outstanding.
FWIW, I've never really thought about buying a Giant as they're mostly ugly gates, but this thread had done nothing to make me less uninterested in them.
Without Ian Giant would be GT.
Chapeau.
Without Ian Giant would be GT.
👏👏👏
STW comment of 2023 (so far)
Serial Giant owner here. Just reading this and it seems is have swiftly invalidated the warranty on every Giant I have owned. starting with fitting an early model contact switch dropper to a 26' trance, after I had bought them both in a Giant dealer at the same time!
Giant will be fully aware if this frame is prone to cracking in this way. If it’s a known thing just send out a new frame job done.
If it was an unusual failure I’d have thought they would show a little more interest and not be so hard nosed about it!
This ^^.
Bike companies can learn a lot from a failure and it's usually fairly easy to tell if it's from manufacturing error or rider error.
We once sent a Kona back - it was obvious the guy had ridden it into a wall or done a hard nose landing off a jump but we had to make it look good cos he was being an arse. However we also made it very clear to Kona exactly what we thought.
They sent back a hilarious letter to the guy - one of those that manages to be devastatingly rude while sounding polite. But they were still interested in seeing their frame to assess how it had stood up to what was clearly crash damage.
The known failure ones, we'd just replace the part with no issues - did some swingarms on an early suspension bike once where they were cracking at the pivot. Known failure. New swingarm. No problems, it was never even questioned.
Given the breadth of bikes and likely consumers a manufacturer like Giant has, versus say Transition (and therefore, likely competence and mechanical sympathy) you’d reasonably suggest that the bigger, broader brands might need at least two warranty policies depending on the product.
Equally, given the warranty applies to everything from suspension and wheels to frames, you could imagine why the the conditions and terms for accepting a warranty claim on a serviceable item like a set of forks or wheels could/should be much more restrictive than a frame.
One warranty policy to cover all clearly is flawed, which means really you’re relying (as are the manufacturer) on your dealer to support your claim where appropriate, and not submit claims where obviously not valid…
I’d have thought at the very least, you’d have been asked or thought to leave the seat post in when you dropped it off, it’s the only component likely to validate the claim. Hard to point your finger at the shop without knowing full circumstances, or the capability of the one person you spoke to, but I think that’s where I’d point my frustration - they should have told you stripping it yourself would likely invalidate the claim.
I can’t imagine the warranty terms for any of the big brands are much different - does anybody know?
Without Ian Giant would be GT.
Top work there.
Given the breadth of bikes and likely consumers a manufacturer like Giant has, versus say Transition (and therefore, likely competence and mechanical sympathy) you’d reasonably suggest that the bigger, broader brands might need at least two warranty policies depending on the product.
Talking about Transition, if you want a bike with painless warranty support, I would highly recommend them.
Just make sure to Ridewrap / Invisiframe from new because the paint is crap. Definitely not a brand for the OCD rider who needs their bike to look showroom new.
Thing is, at least they’re being honest, and it’s obvious they never intend to stand by their warranty.
They could have easily said “we’ve inspected it and we believe the damage to be caused by an improperly installed seatpost”. That might be questionable, but it wouldn’t necessarily mean a future boycott of all Giant bikes.
It's not the warranty claim rejection which is the main contention now; rather the stated admission and revelation that owners can't work on their own bikes without requiring an Authorised Giant Dealer to do it.
You're right, they are being honest, especially in regarding that their warranty is meaningless and impractical to adhere to for owners.
In the event of a frame failure and in rejection of a claim under warranty, under UK law you can very cheaply bring a claim against the retailer and given the unfair terms evidenced here one would be very unlikely to lose the depreciation from the settlement too.
Transition are indeed excellent. I wrote to them asking for advice about drilling a hole in a frame. They wrote back with really good information and confirmed that warranty would exclude damage due to the hole (obvs!!!), however any other area on the frame would still be covered. I have it in writing that I can drill a hole in my frame, myself, and still get support.
I bought another Transition partly based on that. I had an issue and the fix is to fit a shorter bolt. New bolts arrived in the post within a week with instructions to DIY or an offer to wait and have them do it. I chose DIY.
Giant now off my shortlist of road bikes.
I can only speak of personal experience - but Whyte/ATB-Sales sent a courier to collect a suspension linkage; inspected it and had a replacement back with me in time for a weekend ride. I didn't have to ask to strip it down to the part with the issue; they told me to !
10/10 would buy again - the vast majority of my other bikes are built up from frame + parts sourced separately; the only thing I've used a bike shop for in terms of maintenance in 10 years or so was to get an emergency spoke repair whilst I was at work and riding that evening. Not being able to self service would be an absolute deal breaker for me.
Giant failure
In the event of a frame failure and in rejection of a claim under warranty, under UK law you can very cheaply bring a claim against the retailer
Are you confusing legal rights under consumer legislation and warranty which is over and above this at the discretion of the manufacturer?
Are you confusing legal rights under consumer legislation and warranty which is over and above this at the discretion of the manufacturer
surely if a product is sold with a warranty that any reasonable person can see is not worth the paper it’s written on then that falls under the category of being miss sold, so you would be protected by consumer legislation?
I maybe talking bollocks though here, but that sounds like a reasonable take to me
