[Closed] UK framebuilders specialising in or willing to build a modern MTB frame?

robin mather and some shand block in scotland but your talking ££££, also 18 bikes i believe. curtis are good get one.

Guy I used to ride with had a lovely Robin Mather. Looked on his site a few weeks ago and seemed to be having a rest - [url= http://www.robinmathercycles.co.uk/ ]Robin Mather[/url]

Enigma had a stunning steel MTB at the London Cycle Show. £900 mind so not cheap and the one displayed I would describe as retro. Same sort of money as RM I guess.

Thanks chaps. Pretty sure most of the Enigma frames are built in Taiwan but I may be wrong.

Mmmm...Robin Mather. I'd looked at his website a while back and there was the 'i'm having a rest' message but after reading another post on here apparently he's now taking orders again.

His website gallery has a lovely looking Bushnell EBB frame in orange that obviously has mystical powers, as it appears to be levitating in the pictures!

Got a feeling it'll be very, very expensive somehow...

Thanks for the suggestion about 18 bikes. That rings a bell. Top blokes as well, which is always nice.

Aren't 18 bikes in Hope setting up a custom build service? Some friends of mine have his and hers matching Curtis racelites and they are lovely.

have you had a look here http://www.burls.co.uk/index.php
seem to be ok

lee dixon (?) used to make solitude frames, which are/were very nice. think he still does things himself (not too sure thats his name, sorry!)

shand look nice imo.

Lee cooper used to build solitude:

[url= http://customcycleframes.blogspot.com/ ]Lee Cooper blog[/url]

I think you can still go to him direct with a spec for what you want and he will build it for you.

I designed a hardtail last winter and from me handing him the drawings to me having my finished painted 853 frame was around 6 weeks. I was chuffed to bits with it!

Thanks again chaps.
Burls.. Well, I left him an answerphone message around a month ago and haven't heard anything, so not the best start. He's pretty close to me as well.
Shand is a completely new one on me. I'll chase that up. I have heard of Lee Cooper and no, not just the jeans! Sounds like a good recommendation.
Cheers.

come the new year, we should be good to roll. CEN test to sort (find another custom builder willing to do that) along with details on paint/decals. hoping to offer as much custom as we can, not just in terms of the steel bits. We'll certainly have more geometry options than some of the others mentioned too.

pricing should be around £1k in 853 with some nice touches, as a finished, painted frame.

shout an email if you'd like me to keep you posted.

shand is a lovely chap if you're in more of a rush

Cheers,
Si

This is probably going to sound harsher (in text) than its meant too, but when I think of the word 'modern', I tend to think of either aluminium or carbon ( maybe Ti at the fringes). My respect for UK framebuilders diminishes when I hear virtually all of them still dismissing the former two materials as unsuitable, prefering steel( and often lugged/ brazed steel at that)
Its a shame there isnt one that is able to build a frame using said metal/composite as well as the average 19yr old Taiwanese worker.
If there was I'd be considering it.

I had a good look at the 18bikes effort at the cycle show. Looked pretty good, with some real nice design touches. Can't remember what it was called now - named after Si's granny or similar...

Or Demon frameworks? They were also at the Cycle show and had a lovely DJ bike.

This is probably going to sound harsher (in text) than its meant too, but when I think of the word 'modern', I tend to think of either aluminium or carbon ( maybe Ti at the fringes). My respect for UK framebuilders diminishes when I hear virtually all of them still dismissing the former two materials as unsuitable, prefering steel( and often lugged/ brazed steel at that)

Probably because steel is the best material for frames and easiest to work with and it also lasts forever.

Buying an expensive alu custom frame seems like a waste cos you'll have to replace it every year or so which would cost loads. Plus its probably harder to repair. If you crack a steel frame you can just get another tube welded in no problems and its as good as new.

Give Curtis a ring, Gary has a phenomenal amount of experience in bike building, the frame he made for me convinced me to get rid of my FS bike, worth every single penny of what I paid.

West Kipper, couldn't agree more. When some-one comes up with a 140mm capable carbon hardtail, I'll be first in the queue

I had a Solitude built by Lee Cooper which was nicked. By this time Alex had wound up Solitude but told me Lee was working for the Coventry Cycle Centre. I got in touch and Lee built me a replacement frame, including a modification to the cable routing I wanted.

Pics here: [url= http://www.bendingtherules.co.uk/Bob%27s%20Bikes/Qubic.html ]Qubic[/url]

PS Forgot to add – I got the Solitude back!!

Can vouch for the Curtis frames, very nice to ride and very well built, had mine (T45 FR)since mid 06 and still chuffed with it. Thinking of ordering another at the moment (smaller with a 69 deg head angle rather than the 71 deg Gary recommends).

travellingman,
the orange Mather is mine(though pale grey now)worth the wait(6months ISTR)

I tried Shand a few months back but he wasn't taking any more orders for the meantime.

So I got more welding gear and tubes and am going to build my own.
I'll build you one too if you want but it will be a few months before I do a couple for myself and thrash them soundly to make sure my building skills are up to scratch.

Most of the custom makers weren't really custom enough for what I was after.
I wanted a bit more than a head angle tweak and custom top tube length 🙂

that qubic looks very good.

i don't suppose any of them do titanium?

Dave Yates. Can't believe nobody's mentioned him!

I have a Mather. It's brilliant. 5 years old now.

Wait was around 4 months and it was not as expensive as you may think. Especially considering the amount of work involved. Nice Guy and great process.

Also Curtis look ace as do Shand.

[url= http://www.roadcyclinguk.com/gear-news/cliff-shrubb-framebuilding/3985.html ]Cliff Shrubb[/url] has been making fantastic frames for years for some of the best riders (roadies) in the world. He's also built a race BMX and a fair few MTB frames. If you know what you're looking for with dimensions, angles etc he can build whatever you want. Probably a bit cheaper than the full-timers.
Pic of of my trackbike to show workmanship below. He also brazed track ends onto an MTB frame of mine years ago that are still going strong.
[img] [/img][

[img] [/img]

[url= http://demonframeworks.com/ ] Demon Frameworks[/url]

Good friend of mine working out of a little workshop in southampton.

Very very nice guy and does everything by hand. Turns out beautiful frames. Custom sizing and geometry etc etc.

I rode the dirt frame the other day and it wass perfect - got aon it and it rode like i'd been riding it for years. Just awesome.

but when I think of the word 'modern', I tend to think of either aluminium or carbon ( maybe Ti at the fringes)

What you think is up to you, but the success of Cotic, Dialled, On-one, Pipedream, Singular etec etc all working in steel suggests that "old" materials do have some merits...

Outside of a pure XC race machine, I would never even begin to consider carbon for a frame, and both steel and ti suit my riding needs/style far better than any ally hardtail frame.

That Demon jump frame is a perfect example of how "old" techniques like lugged construction can be used in a relevant, up to date, way.

Bob, the Qubic looks nice - what did the frame weigh (and size)?

Is that demon made with propper luggs, or with bits of oversized tubing cut and fillet brazed to look like lugs?

Wouldn't have thought it was cost effective to cast lugs strong enough and with angles suited to dirt jump bikes.

that head angle looks pretty roadie-like (as it should be on a DJ) to me TINAS so standard OS lugs will be fine. No lugs at seat/top junction, probably because that angle might be hard to find in a lug catalogue.

b r Didn't weight just the frame, but built up with all the bit (and a Rohloff) it's about 26.5lbs.

The tubing is columbus which does 'dink' fairly easily.

Measurements were same as the Solitude:
http://www.bendingtherules.co.uk/Bob%27s%20Bikes/Solitude.html

Dave Yates will build anything you want too.

[url= http://www.shandcycles.com/gallery/ ]Steve Shand[/url] seems to be putting out some really lovely no-nonsense frames.

Spoke to the guy behind Demon at the Cycle show and he's definitely putting together some very tasty work as well - less experienced in mtb's though I think.

If you are truly considering a custom frame the best approach is to get a short list of builders, call them, talk to them about what you are after. I'm sure you'll very quickly get an idea of who you'd most like to work with - getting the perfect custom frame is very much a collaborative effort.

Sorry if I upset anyone, I know how popular steel is.
It does often make good bikes, and its use by UK builders is indeed because its easy to work with, but that doesn't always make it the best choice ( of the only frames Ive broken out of twenty five or so, two were 853 - the other was ti- Ive never broken an alu bike)
It would be great if a UK frame builder could make something to rival a Klein or Cannondale, or even a Kinesis ,but most seem hostile to move away from 'how their forefathers did things.'

ts a shame there isnt one that is able to build a frame using said metal/composite as well as the average 19yr old Taiwanese worker.

They're presumably working with tooling/ovens/etc which cost a bit more than a set of bottles and a jig though 😕

I think it is a cost thing,, I used to design bikes for a well known company and we wanted to do a small number of aluminium frames in the uk
I went to Harris performance ( used to work there as well) who build very nice motorbikes in aluminium and steel , but the prices were way too much ,,

the main problem with aluminium is you either use 7000 series alumium which doesnt need heat treatment ( if i remeber rightly) or 6000 series which requires expensive heat treatment and jigs
the problem is 7000 has limited stock sizes

carbon requires v expensive tooling for each size , and an even more epensive autoclave ( big pressurized oven) to cure the carbon pre preg
( woven carbon material impregnated with the correct amount of resin)
you can of course use a wet layup carbon where you brush on the resin like doing glass fiber and cook it in a normal oven or even a fan heater but that makes for very heavy and reduced strength

so to some it up you have a jig a tig welder , brazing torch and some bits of tube and a hacksaw , then you can build a steel bike it's not rocket science

i may have not remembered stuff correctly but I am sure , no certain someone will put me right

After getting home from work I thought I'd check the post for a link to Lee Cooper's blog so I could send him an email, only to find all these other posts.

I'm blown away by the response. Thankyou all very much!! Sam you're advice is spot on and i'm in the process of getting my shortlist together right now. Thanks also Si from 18 bikes, I will indeed send you an email so you can keep me posted!

Cheers everybody.

All of Enigma's steel bikes are built in the UK as are their higher end 2010 Ti models. Not really a strong reputation for MTBs though. When I spoke to them they can pretty much build what you want/choice of materials etc.

the enigma steel is completely uk built.

www.enigmasteel.com

everything they build in steel is produced in sussex.
same with their custom Ti

i know i sound like a bad advert but i ride their Ti hardtail and its beautiful

Yup, you're absolutely right there about Enigma. Your link seems to be to a different website to the regular one. All the frames seem to be road bike though, which is no bad thing but I can't afford two bikes!!

To be honest, I get a little lost with all this internet stuff and the digital age in general. Show me something mechanical and i'm happy! The ideal being an old MV Agusta racebike but that's another matter altogether....

Changing the subject a little but has anyone else seen the dropouts from Black Cat Bicycles in California? They're made to design by Super Rat Machine Works.

Black Cat Bicycles is run by a chap by the name of Todd Ingermanson. His frames look sublime. If you're into single speed or gear hubs this set up seems like a viable alternative to Paragon or an EBB. Also, is it me or do the Americans have a subtlety and sophistication that UK framebuilders seem to lack? I'm not trying to be provocative here!!

Changing the subject a little but has anyone else seen the dropouts from Black Cat Bicycles in California? They're made to design by Super Rat Machine Works.

Black Cat Bicycles is run by a chap by the name of Todd Ingermanson. His frames look sublime. If you're into single speed or gear hubs this set up seems like a viable alternative to Paragon or an EBB.

Seen them? I designed them! Well not quite but I did some drawings for a very similar construct a few years ago.

[url= http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2120/2262555961_893195d4a3.jp g" target="_blank">http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2120/2262555961_893195d4a3.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Dec. 2004 to be precise. Anyhow, there are a number of reasons I never follwed through with such a design for my frames and think an ebb is a better solution in every way. Lots of moving parts, lots of bolts which need loosening/tightening to adjust chain tension, braking forces through the pivot, probably heavier, expensive to produce...

Also, is it me or do the Americans have a subtlety and sophistication that UK framebuilders seem to lack? I'm not trying to be provacative here!!

Now [i]there[/i] is an assertion.... I think it is simply the case that it is a much bigger industry in the US, therefore there is a greater chance of seeing something which suits your taste. Especially if you start talking about some of the classic UK builders I think there's little in it.

Sam, that's very,very interesting indeed. Well knock me down with a feather!! What's your background or aren't you willing to divulge in public, so's to speak!

I agree wholeheartedly with you about EBBs but have been put off a little by reports of slipping and creaking. Maybe the latest Bushnell pretty much solves this? I agree, on all levels with you about EBBs from an engineering 'solution' point of view. It's never going to be 100% but they're a much more sophisticated alternative to sliding/swinging/pivoting dropouts etc.

I've also reflected on the fact that the USA is a much bigger country with a lot more people, all hopefully, thinking in slightly different ways! Maybe it's just that California funkiness that feeds into their thinking, probably derived from their climate?

I like the dropouts from these guys.

http://www.2soulscycles.com/

Not a UK framebuilder though.

messiah - that's what matt's putting on my next rohloff frame. they are nice, decent people too