Brucewee- Have you actually seen the features in the flesh, or are you basing your opinion on TV images?
No, getting there isn't really practical from where I'm living these days.
But yeah, I'm well aware of jumps and drops being considerably larger in real life. I remember spending a few days in Glentress trying to improve my jumping. By the end I'd cleared pretty much everything and it felt like I was going huge. Then Earthed 4 came out with a segment on the exact jumps I had been practicing on and, lets just say, my monster jumps were actually kiddies playthings for decent riders.
I'm watching the XC on GCN and I think they've found particularly poor camera angles for the big features though. They look much smaller than they do in the onboard lap on the other thread.
If they put something in the gaps you could probably clear them?
Unlikely, I'd just ride round it or get off and push.
OK, my assessment of the "features", being based locally and having walked them recently.
- Orders of magnitude more difficult that anything in the old freeride area (in your video). If it takes you days of practice to clear the jumps there, then you are a long long way from attempting the XC features.
- More than the difficulty level is the degree of intimidation and exposure.
- The rock drop section in the Go Ape carpark requires massive commitment as you pretty much need to hop into it.
- The gap is big but relatively simple, consequences of not making it are massive though.
The gap is big but relatively simple, consequences of not making it are massive though.
See the Instagram post I linked to earlier!
Edit: here it is again.
If it takes you days of practice to clear the jumps there, then you are a long long way from attempting the XC features.
Well, it took me a couple of days to clear everything back in 2006.
What improved my jumping way more than any amount of trying things out in GT was doing a my first DH race. The gaps were there and had to be done so I did them (had to defend that 3rd to last place). Taking the time to get the technique down and then being forced by into overcoming the mental block of gaps by racing meant jumping stuff I never thought to attempt before was very doable.
What do you mean by 'Orders of magnitude more difficult'. I see a tricky entry into the salmon ladder, but at the same time so long as you at least have some momentum you can keep rolling. Apart from that I'm not seeing tricky entries or landings to the features but not being there I may be missing something.
If, as you say, the main problem is the intimidation and exposure then that's another thing. And of course the consequences.
My original comment all those moons ago that dragged me into this particular circle of hell was that most STWers could manage the features.
I should, of course, have explicitly caveated this by saying that this statement assumed the STWer in question had:
a. Ridden a mountain bike before.
b. Learned and practiced to some extent how to intentionally allow their wheels to leave the ground.
c. Had time to practice the features on their favourite bike wearing whatever protective gear they felt they needed.
All I was trying to say was that most mountain bikers (who ride mountain bikes and who have at some point learned how to intentionally let their wheels leave the ground) could manage these features from a technical perspective. Overcoming the mental blocks of the gaps and exposure and doing it when your blowing out your arse is a different matter.
If we accept that most mountain bikers (given the caveats above) could manage the features (given the caveats above) then I don't think it's too much of a stretch that a highly talented fulltime pro athlete could learn to also manage the features in a relatively short period of time. And given the assumption they could learn to manage the features they could probably do well in an XC race given that XC races are primarily won in the climbs.
That's it. That's what I meant with that stupid ****ing 'most STWers...' comment.
I could be entirely wrong in many of my assumptions and my statement could have therefore been entirely bollocks. I'm extrapolating from my own experience of normal mountain bikers and I 100% accept that others will have very different opinions of the skill level of normal mountain bikers.
Cool, for what its worth I'm happy to ride pretty much everything in the Tweed Valley, Fort Bill DH (with the exception of the biggest features), Dunkeld, etc.
The rock drop is a hard no. Simple as. Its an awkward entry around large rocks and you need enough speed to be effectively jumping into it to avoid hinging up on the lip. But not too much so you would land at the bottom. It would likely be deemed too much for a national level enduro.
The gap jump is probably of a similar size to the Hazzard Hoofer at Fort William.
Just for reference
And the chicken line for the gap jump - which wasn’t quite a roll though.
The rock drop is a hard no
Is that the one they're calling the Salmon Ladder (igm's second picture up there)?
If so that's quite surprising as that's one that I would have put down as intimidating but probably not too bad once you're on the way down. I was watching the relay race earlier and saw an Austrian woman (I think) stall coming in and then bail out down the B-line. Right after came a Swiss woman (I think) who stalled but did a dab right at the top and then managed to roll into it safely. Not something I would have had the balls to do, I am absolutely certain.
The entry does look very awkward and it has the potential to be carnage if riders are tightly packed coming into it.
Right after came a Swiss woman (I think) who stalled but did a dab right at the top and then managed to roll into it safely. Not something I would have had the balls to do, I am absolutely certain.
Whilst clipping back in - total respect to her.
Has anyone been round the event village at Glentress this week? Just wondering what it’s like in terms of getting a bite to eat between races, or whether to ride out to Peebles/Innerleithen with kids in tow.
There are plenty of food truck options in the event village. Most congregated around the Peel Building (big square wooden building at the highest point of the village) and some on the way up from the Alpine Bikes shop.
Was there yesterday and it was pretty good, even the e-bikes. Despite having a motor, you could see they were still giving it full gas up the main climb, and there were some very awkward additions to the climb to make the most of having a motor. It's still bike racing, still exciting to watch.
The features look great. Saw a Honduran rider come off the Salmon Drop - he got substantial cheers every lap thereafter. A lot of the features are going to be tricky with multiple riders coming to them together. I suspect riders will practice a couple of lines in case they get forced wide or stuck queueing for the main line. I think the difficulty of the features isn't super high, but the consequences of getting them wrong are very high. That will surely come into play after a few laps when your legs are burning and heart rate is through the roof.
The rock drop is a hard no
The entrance to this is mossy and rooty, and from the saddle the rock seems vertical. There's a gap that requires a wee pull up on the bars as your front wheel hits the rock, and it's nothing like as long as the salmon ladder, but given that this is natural, and the salmon ladder is made to be ridden, I don't think I'd have any worries.
I agree with @BruceWee though, the thing that improves these sorts of skills is being "forced" to do them.
[humblebrag] I've been lucky enough to spend a few days in Whistler a couple of times, and first ride even the "tamer" trails seem huge. There's a jump at the end of a blue called "heart of darkness" that's pretty wide and tall, at first it seems ridiculous, by end of day two I was trying to work out where to gain speed on the run up, as I was certain I could clear it...[/humblebrag]
@nickc I think the one on the Glentress XC is considerably steeper. Watching it yesterday everyone’s bum was a lot higher than their shoulders. In your shot they are roughly level. Look at the photo I posted above for example.
And the salmon ladder (if that’s what we’re calling it) goes straight into a 90 right then a decent sized drop.
If it helps the drop you’ve pictured is probably closer to the chicken line difficulty level. (The salmon ladder chicken line is particularly entertaining)
Could I ride the one on the XC course? Probably
Could I race it? Different question
Race it on an XC race bike? That would be a no
Race it on an XC race bike?
Looking at the bikes from the relay race, they look more Downcountry than what I would have thought of as X-country.
Nino Schurter's handlebars being the exception. I don't know what you'd call them.
Nino Schurter’s handlebars being the exception. I don’t know what you’d call them.
Upside down risers?
Slightly off topic perhaps but I've been impressed with ScotRail. Used them extensively this week to get between Edinburgh, Glasgow city centre and the velodrome. Frequent trains, lots of capacity.
Nice one
(Hope I'm not jinxing it too soon as we still have a few trips planned yet)
Has anyone used the park and rides around Peebles yet? I appreciate that it'll be loads busier tomorrow and particularly Saturday, but just curious to know if the buses are working ok.
<p>It may have been done earlier in the thread, but am alone in being mildly tickled by the fact there is a French C2 competitor called Chapeau…? Chapeau Chapeau</p>
Bit of a shame the Junior XCO is not being broadcast at all... Women out on track currently.
Hopefully the Junior XCO will be on iPlayer later.
And most impressive that Charlie Aldridge got fastest lap out of everyone yesterday, which hopefully bodes well for the U23 race. 16 seconds faster than Nino, who can't have been holding too much back as he had Sarrou chasing him down.
I think the one on the Glentress XC is considerably steeper.
Yeah, I don't doubt it, it looks plenty steep. But the technique is the same, once you can roll into a rock drop, you can roll into all of them. I reckon most folks could do it (whether they think they could or not) with just a bit of coaching.
Mathieu van der Poel x Matt Stephens | First interview as Road Race World Champion
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once you can roll into a rock drop, you can roll into all of them.
Sounds so easy when not sat at the top of something pearing over the edge.😉
Nah, just go, if you're peering over the edge you might have time to think about all the things that could go wrong... 🤣
Oh man, living in Calderdale moved my riding on so much since then. (that's where that picture's from) 👍
Cool.
Can't beat constant exposure to harder trails to up your skills.
Back on topic.
We're off to watch the short course later this avo.
Got some free tickets for being local.😂
Like slowing down after it or not falling off the exposed switchback after it
Yeah saw that clip, nightmare for the rider, This is going to be the place to watch the race on the first lap, for sure.
Can’t beat constant exposure to harder trails to up your skills.
Or ride with folks who know what they're doing and help you along 👍
Mathieu van der Poel x Matt Stephens | First interview as Road Race World Champion
That's a great video. Thanks for sharing.
That’s a great video.
"Woffer biscwit"
Really hope the short course is on the iPlayer later. Men's field is stacked!
5.30pm for mens short track, womens after. Definitely on TV - cant wait!
🔴L I V E ~ 2023 UCI CYCLING WORLD CHAMPIONSHIPS - MOUNTAIN BIKE CROSS-COUNTRY - Livestream - YouTube
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Puck Pieter's is awesome!
Really hope the short course is on the iPlayer later. Men’s field is stacked!
I could be wrong but sure I recall hearing that MVdP has never lost a world cup short course.
Just when you think the discussion has finally come to an end......
The Junior men XCO winner also won the road race!
For those who struggle to manual..
BMX flatland is on IPlayer.
If you like Puck Pieterse
https://www.youtube.com/@puckpieterse02/videos
Just when you think the discussion has finally come to an end……
The Junior men XCO winner also won the road race!
Have you seen our potholes around Stirling and Perthshire? 😉😜
I really do hope that the xco camera angles and positions are better than yesterday's relay. Too many long distance over head drone shots and not enough track side action imo. Fingers cross.
Ignore, broadcast has finally started
Where is the short course being shown?
Eurosport 1 says it's on but it's not what's being broadcast
Discovery Plus says it's on live but it's just a holding screen
BBC doesnt appear to have it?
It's on discovery they were jsut waiting for the world feed.
Iplayer too
Cycling World Championships, 2023: Bike Cross-Country Short Track Finals: www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m001plzh via @bbciplayer
